WITH ROBINSON A 2 FOR 1.....NOW WE HAVE 2 ROSTER SPOTS OPEN

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Post by 112288 Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:18 pm

If this deal goes down, we will have 2 roster spots open below max with what happened with Hudson. Could this be part of a larger deal Celtic's are planning?

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Post by jeb Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:25 am

all quiet...damn, we gone lose eddie. Stings a bit. Is there more?
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Post by gyso Thu Feb 18, 2010 7:44 am

Jeb,

I posted in another thread that maybe Eddie gets a buyout and returns in 30 days.

Would that relieve any of the sting?

gyso

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Post by bobheckler Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:08 am

gyso wrote:Jeb,

I posted in another thread that maybe Eddie gets a buyout and returns in 30 days.

Would that relieve any of the sting?

gyso

gyso,

If that happens, we'd have one of the shortest second unit backcourts in the league, but at least Nate would have a someone he can pass to on the perimeter that will drain it more times than not.

I'm gonna miss Eddie. #2 Ubuntu guy after Posey.

bob
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Post by jeb Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:18 am

hell yes gyso. it would be perfect!
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Post by bobheckler Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:20 am

So, assuming this deal goes through, our lineups look like this:

Rondo/Nate
Ray/Tony
Paul/Quis/Walker
KG/Davis/Scal/Scal
Perk/Sheed

We need another gunner to replace Eddie @ backup 2. Tony has other value, he's probably the best slasher on the team, but he's not the go-to guy for a long range buzzer beater.

bob
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Post by bobheckler Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:23 am

gyso wrote:Jeb,

I posted in another thread that maybe Eddie gets a buyout and returns in 30 days.

Would that relieve any of the sting?

gyso

gyso,

I wouldn't hold my breath on that. D'Antoni knows Eddie from when he played for him at Phoenix and loves him. What might have been holding this deal up for as long as it had is that D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Danny was trying to negotiate something else.

For what Eddie does, he's cheap. He's a buzzer-beater, and every coach wants more of them on their team.

bob
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Post by gyso Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:28 am

bobheckler wrote:
gyso wrote:Jeb,

I posted in another thread that maybe Eddie gets a buyout and returns in 30 days.

Would that relieve any of the sting?

gyso

gyso,

If that happens, we'd have one of the shortest second unit backcourts in the league, but at least Nate would have a someone he can pass to on the perimeter that will drain it more times than not.

I'm gonna miss Eddie. #2 Ubuntu guy after Posey.

bob

bob,

If we had both Eddie and Nate, that would give us two different looks at backup PG. The big upside to having Nate is for Rondo insurance. If Rondo tweeks an ankle, Nate could fill his role with the starting unit better than Eddie could.

gyso

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Post by jeb Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:38 am

gyso it seems that i am reading d'antoni wants eddie...what makes you think celts may get him back?
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Post by gyso Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:45 am

bobheckler wrote:
gyso wrote:Jeb,

I posted in another thread that maybe Eddie gets a buyout and returns in 30 days.

Would that relieve any of the sting?

gyso

gyso,

I wouldn't hold my breath on that. D'Antoni knows Eddie from when he played for him at Phoenix and loves him. What might have been holding this deal up for as long as it had is that D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Danny was trying to negotiate something else.

For what Eddie does, he's cheap. He's a buzzer-beater, and every coach wants more of them on their team.

bob

bob,

I'll hope for something else:

D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Eddie WANTED to escape from NYC. The holdup was over when D'Antoni agreed to waive Eddie after the transaction. Eddie is in his third year on the Celtics and I think that means full Bird rights. Eddie's last contract was for a single season, so that may give him veto rights on trades. I haven't read this but, look at the fifth bullet:
_____________________________________________________________________________________________
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q87

In addition, teams cannot trade players under the following circumstances:

Without the player's consent when the player is playing under a one-year contract (excluding any option year) and will have Larry Bird or Early Bird rights at the end of the season
_____________________________________________________________________________________________

I think we still need a third team or a vet minimum contract to make it work. I don't think JR's contract can be considered to be vet minimum, so there is more to this than a 2-1 swap.

gyso

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Post by gyso Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:50 am

jeb65 wrote:gyso it seems that i am reading d'antoni wants eddie...what makes you think celts may get him back?

Jeb,

I keep reading that D'Antoni "likes" Eddie. I don't know if that is a quote from D'Antoni or just column filler text from the media.

Please read my prior post to see my thoughts as to why Eddie may have some say in this trade.

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Post by bobheckler Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:03 pm

gyso wrote:
bobheckler wrote:
gyso wrote:Jeb,

I posted in another thread that maybe Eddie gets a buyout and returns in 30 days.

Would that relieve any of the sting?

gyso

gyso,

I wouldn't hold my breath on that. D'Antoni knows Eddie from when he played for him at Phoenix and loves him. What might have been holding this deal up for as long as it had is that D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Danny was trying to negotiate something else.

For what Eddie does, he's cheap. He's a buzzer-beater, and every coach wants more of them on their team.

bob

bob,

I'll hope for something else:

D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Eddie WANTED to escape from NYC. The holdup was over when D'Antoni agreed to waive Eddie after the transaction. Eddie is in his third year on the Celtics and I think that means full Bird rights. Eddie's last contract was for a single season, so that may give him veto rights on trades. I haven't read this but, look at the fifth bullet:
_____________________________________________________________________________________________
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q87

In addition, teams cannot trade players under the following circumstances:

Without the player's consent when the player is playing under a one-year contract (excluding any option year) and will have Larry Bird or Early Bird rights at the end of the season
_____________________________________________________________________________________________

I think we still need a third team or a vet minimum contract to make it work. I don't think JR's contract can be considered to be vet minimum, so there is more to this than a 2-1 swap.

gyso

gyso,

Didn't Eddie sign a TWO year contract at the start of last year?

He came here in '08, on a one-year.

Do Bird rights apply to a player who PLAYS for a team for a total of 3 years or for a player that SIGNS with a team for total of 3 years? If it's just a contractual issue, then Eddie has Bird rights (his first year plus the 2-year contract he signed before last season). If you actually have to be with the team for 3 years, then he's just short.

Trading a player who is about to gain Bird rights is good for the team doing the trading, not so good for the player and the team receiving him.

bob
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Post by gyso Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:38 pm

bobheckler wrote:
gyso wrote:
bobheckler wrote:
gyso wrote:Jeb,

I posted in another thread that maybe Eddie gets a buyout and returns in 30 days.

Would that relieve any of the sting?

gyso

gyso,

I wouldn't hold my breath on that. D'Antoni knows Eddie from when he played for him at Phoenix and loves him. What might have been holding this deal up for as long as it had is that D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Danny was trying to negotiate something else.

For what Eddie does, he's cheap. He's a buzzer-beater, and every coach wants more of them on their team.

bob

bob,

I'll hope for something else:

D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Eddie WANTED to escape from NYC. The holdup was over when D'Antoni agreed to waive Eddie after the transaction. Eddie is in his third year on the Celtics and I think that means full Bird rights. Eddie's last contract was for a single season, so that may give him veto rights on trades. I haven't read this but, look at the fifth bullet:
_____________________________________________________________________________________________
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q87

In addition, teams cannot trade players under the following circumstances:

Without the player's consent when the player is playing under a one-year contract (excluding any option year) and will have Larry Bird or Early Bird rights at the end of the season
_____________________________________________________________________________________________

I think we still need a third team or a vet minimum contract to make it work. I don't think JR's contract can be considered to be vet minimum, so there is more to this than a 2-1 swap.

gyso

gyso,

Didn't Eddie sign a TWO year contract at the start of last year?

He came here in '08, on a one-year.

Do Bird rights apply to a player who PLAYS for a team for a total of 3 years or for a player that SIGNS with a team for total of 3 years? If it's just a contractual issue, then Eddie has Bird rights (his first year plus the 2-year contract he signed before last season). If you actually have to be with the team for 3 years, then he's just short.

Trading a player who is about to gain Bird rights is good for the team doing the trading, not so good for the player and the team receiving him.

bob

bob,

Yup, I had it backwards. Eddie's second contract was for 2 years (2nd year is player option, which he took) Eddie doesn't have trade refusal rights under the rule I quoted. Darn. Sorry if I got anyone's hopes up.

To get Bird rights, the player has to play for a team the entire season in the third year. The first two years can be partial.

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q25

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Post by bobheckler Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:40 pm

gyso wrote:
bobheckler wrote:
gyso wrote:
bobheckler wrote:
gyso wrote:Jeb,

I posted in another thread that maybe Eddie gets a buyout and returns in 30 days.

Would that relieve any of the sting?

gyso

gyso,

I wouldn't hold my breath on that. D'Antoni knows Eddie from when he played for him at Phoenix and loves him. What might have been holding this deal up for as long as it had is that D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Danny was trying to negotiate something else.

For what Eddie does, he's cheap. He's a buzzer-beater, and every coach wants more of them on their team.

bob

bob,

I'll hope for something else:

D'Antoni WANTED Eddie and Eddie WANTED to escape from NYC. The holdup was over when D'Antoni agreed to waive Eddie after the transaction. Eddie is in his third year on the Celtics and I think that means full Bird rights. Eddie's last contract was for a single season, so that may give him veto rights on trades. I haven't read this but, look at the fifth bullet:
_____________________________________________________________________________________________
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q87

In addition, teams cannot trade players under the following circumstances:

Without the player's consent when the player is playing under a one-year contract (excluding any option year) and will have Larry Bird or Early Bird rights at the end of the season
_____________________________________________________________________________________________

I think we still need a third team or a vet minimum contract to make it work. I don't think JR's contract can be considered to be vet minimum, so there is more to this than a 2-1 swap.

gyso

gyso,

Didn't Eddie sign a TWO year contract at the start of last year?

He came here in '08, on a one-year.

Do Bird rights apply to a player who PLAYS for a team for a total of 3 years or for a player that SIGNS with a team for total of 3 years? If it's just a contractual issue, then Eddie has Bird rights (his first year plus the 2-year contract he signed before last season). If you actually have to be with the team for 3 years, then he's just short.

Trading a player who is about to gain Bird rights is good for the team doing the trading, not so good for the player and the team receiving him.

bob

bob,

Yup, I had it backwards. Eddie's second contract was for 2 years (2nd year is player option, which he took) Eddie doesn't have trade refusal rights under the rule I quoted. Darn. Sorry if I got anyone's hopes up.

To get Bird rights, the player has to play for a team the entire season in the third year. The first two years can be partial.

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q25

gyso


gyso,

So that means that Eddie COULD come back here next year (I don't see D'Antoni letting him go this year) without having to worry about the Knicks being able to retain him just by matching our offer.

I'm looking for a silver lining here.

Bob
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Post by gyso Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:55 pm

bob,

Eddie will be an unrestricted free agent at the end of this season no matter what happens.

Restricted free agency:

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q36

Restricted free agency exists only on a limited basis. It is allowed following the fourth year of rookie "scale" contracts for first round draft picks (see question number 41). It is also allowed for all veteran free agents who have been in the league three or fewer seasons.
___________________________________________________________________________

Glen Davis was a restricted free agent because he was at the end of his rookie contract and Danny Ainge made the Qualifying Offer.

Eddie's an old guy, he is way past the end of his rookie contract.

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