Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

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Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by bobheckler on Wed May 17, 2017 10:10 am

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-draft-celtics-grab-no-1-overall-pick-and-oh-what-a-summer-it-could-be-in-boston/



NBA Lottery: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston



This all could've gone another way very easily



by Brad Botkin 12h ago • 3 min read




For three years now, the Boston Celtics have been going about their rebuild like Andy Dufresne chipping away at that wall. Slowly. Carefully. A little progress here and there, patiently resisting what has to be an ever-growing urge to speed up the process.
Tuesday night, they got a lot closer to breaking through that wall.

On the eve of facing the Cavaliers in Game 1 of the Eastern Conference finals, the Celtics won the lottery on Tuesday (well, the Nets actually won, but the Celtics get their pick as part of the Garnett/Pierce deal in 2013), and thus secured the No. 1 pick in the upcoming draft. The full draft order is as follows:

Boston Celtics
Los Angeles Lakers
Philadelphia 76ers
Phoenix Suns
Sacramento Kings
Orlando Magic
Minnesota Timberwolves
New York Knicks
Dallas Mavericks
Sacramento Kings (via New Orleans)
Charlotte Hornets
Detroit Pistons
Denver Nuggets
Miami Heat

Quite a 48-hour run for Boston, which eliminated the Wizards in Game 7 on Monday. It's exactly how the Celtics planned it, of course, when they stood pat at February's trade deadline rather than move this pick and/or one of their many assets for a big-name player (there was talk of Jimmy Butler or Carmelo Anthony). It was a real risk. If this pick wouldn't have turned out to be No. 1, they would've lost much of that leverage. Now they have even more. Still, the million-dollar question hasn't changed: What does Boston do?

At the top of just about everyone's board is Markelle Fultz, a big, strong combo guard who would give the Celtics something they're sorely missing -- a second legitimate scorer on the perimeter next to Isaiah Thomas. Even better, he scores efficiently from all levels, at the rim, from mid-range and 3-point. He can defend, too, making it easier to imagine him next to Thomas without creating a defensive crater. Frankly, if the Celtics do keep the pick and take anyone other than Fultz, it would be a surprise ( though our Reid Forgrave has Jayson Tatum going to Boston in his mock draft! ).

The other choice, of course, is to move the pick. They'll have to make the decision whether to do this prior to the opening of the free agency period, but can you imagine if they do keep the pick, take Fultz, renounce their free agents and clear more salary in order to land, say, Gordon Hayward this summer? Suddenly this slow, methodical plan to which Ainge has remained committed in the face of growing skepticism will look pretty damn brilliant. At that point, with Fultz and Hayward on board and probably more than capable of composing an All-Star level backcourt, everything would be on the table, even moving Thomas, who would bring back a serious haul of replenishing assets.

This would be an almost unheard-of scenario -- a conference finals team, at worst, getting the No. 1 pick and a borderline superstar free agent in the same summer. But it's starting to get a lot easier to imagine. The Celtics' entire approach to this rebuild -- if you want to call it that -- has been to keep their options open. And man, do they have options. A package to bring back Paul George, if he's not set on the Lakers (and would commit to a deal), could very reasonably be in play. In the case of Hayward coming to Boston, you could play him at the 3 with Thomas and Fultz and suddenly have A LOT of scoring. Again, it all sounds pretty blue-sky, and hinges heavily on Hayward or another free agent choosing Boston, or the Celtics getting creative with a few of their many attractive, peripheral parts, but oh the possibilities.

However it turns out, Ainge's patience has already been validated by making the conference finals and getting this pick. If only for the optics, that win over the Wizards Monday night was huge. Imagine, now, a scenario in which the Celtics lose that game, prove they are not much more than a bunch of pretty good players masquerading as an elite team, and then don't get the No. 1 pick either. How easily this all could've shifted.

Instead, the balls have really bounced Boston's way these last 48 hours. And they deserve it. Yes, the Nets let them get away with a train heist when they gave them everything but the deed to their arena for an aging Garnett and Pierce, but the Celtics still had to be willing to do that deal. Not so much KG, who wasn't homegrown, but parting with a franchise legend like Pierce was not a no-brainer. It's fair to wonder where the Lakers would be right now had they done the same thing with Kobe Bryant.

The Celtics had a plan, they executed it, and man is it starting to pay off.



bob
MY NOTE:  Yeah, and it isn't summer yet for the Eastern Conference Finals hosting Boston Celtics...


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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by steve3344 on Sun May 21, 2017 6:36 am

From Mike Lupica in the NY Daily News:

I think we can call off the contest line, and declare that the Nets trade for Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett, one that got the Celtics the No. 1 pick this season and gets them another No. 1 next season, is the worst single trade in all of modern sports history.

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by gyso on Sun May 21, 2017 10:03 am

steve3344 wrote:From Mike Lupica in the NY Daily News:

I think we can call off the contest line, and declare that the Nets trade for Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett, one that got the Celtics the No. 1 pick this season and gets them another No. 1 next season, is the worst single trade in all of modern sports history.

Maybe from the Nets perspective.  We've had a couple more "best single trades", from our perspective.  The trade that brought Parrish and McHale, which bore fruit for the next decade, comes to mind.  Russell for a circus. There may be more.

This is another time that writers get caught up in the now, forgot the past and ignores the future results.  We do not know how this actually ends up, which goes a long way towards determining worst of all time.

gyso

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by bobheckler on Sun May 21, 2017 10:42 am

gyso wrote:
steve3344 wrote:From Mike Lupica in the NY Daily News:

I think we can call off the contest line, and declare that the Nets trade for Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett, one that got the Celtics the No. 1 pick this season and gets them another No. 1 next season, is the worst single trade in all of modern sports history.

Maybe from the Nets perspective.  We've had a couple more "best single trades", from our perspective.  The trade that brought Parrish and McHale, which bore fruit for the next decade, comes to mind.  Russell for a circus. There may be more.

This is another time that writers get caught up in the now, forgot the past and ignores the future results.  We do not know how this actually ends up, which goes a long way towards determining worst of all time.

gyso


gyso,

Tommy Heinsohn was the #1 pick in 1956 under a defunct rule called the "Territory Pick"  In order to bolster the popularity of the new NBA teams were allowed first shot at a local star and Tommy went to Holy Cross.  In order to ensure that the Rochester Royals wouldn't use the #2 pick to take Russell Red convinced owner Walter Brown to agree to let the owner of the Rochester Royals, who owned the arena in Rochester, to have a couple of Ice Capades dates in exchange for NOT picking Russell.  The Ice Capades were a big draw back then, Rochester wasn't that big a venue, and Walter Brown was a major owner in the Ice Capades.  The owner of the Royals made a lot of money having the Ice Capades come to Rochester and the NBA, back then, was small potatoes.

So just in the interest of historical accuracy, and I know Sam would have been all over this, Red didn't trade Russell for a circus. He got the Royals to not draft Russell, clearing the way for Red to do it, by offering a couple of gigs of the Ice Capades.  I think this is an even better steal since a circus at least has lions and tigers and bears, oh my!  And where are the Ice Capades?  Went out of business in 1995.

This is the 2nd time the Nets have been royally screwed. The first time was when the NY Knicks demanded a huge payment in exchange for waiving their territorial exclusivity clause and allowing the Long Island Nets of the ABA to join the NBA. The Nets offered Erving to the Knicks in exchange for waiving the payment. The Knicks turned the deal down, wanting the money instead. This might be the worst decision in NY Knick history, especially considering DeBusschere, Jerry Lucas and Willis Reed had just retired. The Nets refused a salary increase they promised Erving and he refused to play. As a result, in order to raise the money and get something for a player who wasn't playing, the Nets traded their star Dr. Julius Erving to Philadelphia for $3M, the same amount as the Nets' franchise fee.

One could argue the Dr. J fiasco wasn't the Nets' fault. Their league was folding and it was either join the NBA, relocate to a city without an existing NBA territory or shut down. None were particularly attractive options. Billy King, God Bless him, rolled the dice for a team that, on paper, looked truly awesome.

KG
Pierce
Lopez
Deron (when Deron was good)
Joe Johnson
JET
AK47
Shaun Livingstone (now of GSW)
Blatchke
CJ Watson
Reggie Evans


bob


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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by gyso on Sun May 21, 2017 11:46 am

Circus or Ice Capades, it doesn't matter to the actual deal. Either event would have had no cost to the Celtics.  It was just the incentive for the other team to make the deal.

There was also a pretty good player that went out with the deal, an All-Star center.  He was an old school plodder, I believe.  Yes, Sam would have provided the details, but still the essence of the deal was:

Old school All-Star player and Ice Capades for Bill Russell.

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by worcester on Sun May 21, 2017 11:58 am

McCauley.

I still think the worst deal was the Vikings trading 8 picks for Herschel Walker, but our Nets deal come close, behind the McHale/Parish for Big Joe swap.
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by mulcogiseng on Sun May 21, 2017 12:23 pm

The No No Nanette trade
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by gyso on Sun May 21, 2017 1:19 pm

mulcogiseng wrote:The No No Nanette trade

Yes, that cost us Babe Ruth.

So that leads to the question; If you had a Hot Tub Time Machine, which trade would you go back in time to stop? That would be an interesting poll.

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by worcester on Sun May 21, 2017 1:50 pm

Being Francais, monsieur, I vould have to say it vould be the Purchase of la Territoire Louisiane from our Gouvernment for the pittance of 7 million francs. Sacre bleu!
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by bobheckler on Sun May 21, 2017 1:51 pm

worcester wrote:Being Francais, monsieur, I vould have to say it vould be the Purchase of la Territoire Louisiane from our Roi for the pittance of 7 million francs. Sacre bleu!


We made that back just on gumbo.


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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by steve3344 on Sun May 21, 2017 2:52 pm

Manhattan for 24 bucks?

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by bobheckler on Sun May 21, 2017 3:00 pm

steve3344 wrote:Manhattan for 24 bucks?


Steve,

That was fraud. The locals didn't realize land was something you could own. They made a deal using their laws but the Dutch enforced it under Dutch laws. Show me where in the contract jurisdiction is named.



bob

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by swish on Sun May 21, 2017 5:33 pm

Isn't it a little early to be celebrating the future greatness of the Celtics? Sure Cleveland figures to start slowing down - as James gets along in years - but there's still the Warriors with there 4 under 30 stars to deal with for another 4 years. Sure the future looks bright for the Celts - but I bet that the fans in Minny, Utah,Denver and Milwaukee have their eyes glued to the future also. There's an awful lot of very young talent spread around the league. Its just a question as to which team takes on that veteran edge first.

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by mulcogiseng on Sun May 21, 2017 6:22 pm

It is NEVER too early to start celebrating the future greatness of the Boston Celtics!
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by Matty on Sun May 21, 2017 6:32 pm

bobheckler wrote:
steve3344 wrote:Manhattan for 24 bucks?


Steve,

That was fraud.  The locals didn't realize land was something you could own.  They made a deal using their laws but the Dutch enforced it under Dutch laws.  Show me where in the contract  jurisdiction is named.



bob

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 How about all of North America  and in exchange we got deseasses, our old murdered, our young stolen from us so they learn the white men's ways..  ect.. our wives raped and bullets to our heads. 


 Not even a Danny Ainge  deal is so one sided.


    Actually the good folks over in Europe brought booze and white women over and I'm particularly  fond of both so I'm content to let bygones be bygones.   cheers
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by dboss on Mon May 22, 2017 1:28 pm

The Nets fleecing is definitely top 5.

It has yielded Brown, probably Fultz and ?

Many people want DA to trade the pick this year and will be calling for the Celtics to trade the 2018 pick.

Danny has reached a realization that free agency presents a more cost effective way to land a top player so I think he will continue to roll the lottery dice and add more young and talented prospects

The Celtics will still need to move some draft picks but I think the Nets picks are probably untouchable.

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by worcester on Mon May 22, 2017 3:41 pm

One benefit of improving through the draft is that these low paid players allow for the cap room to sign Free Agents.
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by dboss on Mon May 22, 2017 9:02 pm

worcester wrote:One benefit of improving through the draft is that these low paid players allow for the cap room to sign Free Agents.

Absolutely agree worcester. Why pay for the milk if you can own the cow.

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by worcester on Mon May 22, 2017 9:18 pm

Gyso, you're our resident capologist. What does next year's salary structure look like with us paying for the #1 pick and signing a max contract for a free agent?
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by fierce on Mon May 22, 2017 9:37 pm

http://www.basketballinsiders.com/boston-celtics-team-salary/
Click the red player name for detailed contract notes
2016-17 Team-By-Team Salary Summary

Quick: Currently under the cap by $1,107,840

Projected Cap Space for 2017-18 ($101 million cap): $29.4 million

Exceptions

Room Exception: $4,328,000
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by fierce on Mon May 22, 2017 9:43 pm

Here's an article that sums up the Celts' cap situation for next season.
http://www.celticsblog.com/2017/3/3/14792150/boston-celtics-max-free-agent-2017

If the Celts are going to go all in for Hayward, Ainge has no choice but to let Bradley or Crowder or both go.
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by worcester on Mon May 22, 2017 9:51 pm

Thanks Fierce. Hate to see Jae go, but he would be quite redundant at the three with Hayward and Jaylen there, although no more so than Avery, Isaiah, Markelle, Marcus, and Terry at the guard positions.
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by gyso on Mon May 22, 2017 9:55 pm

worcester wrote:Gyso, you're our resident capologist. What does next year's salary structure look like with us paying for the #1 pick and signing a max contract for a free agent?

Some members here have said it cannot happen and they have stated their case very well.  The problem with trying to pin down absolutes now is that there are too many possibilities, too many moving parts, to just say it cannot happen.  I believe that if Danny Ainge wants someone, he will move whatever salaries are in the way to make it happen.  He has all summer to get it done.

I think that I have mentioned Gordon Hayward once or twice as a possible target.  It has been reported that Celtics management will go hard after him.  I hope they do.  We'll know in a couple of months.

BTW, there are a few other guys here that seem to know their way around the salary cap.  The new guy, fierce, is knowledgeable, from what I see from reading his posts since he came on board. [I see fierce has posted an answer since I started typing, so there you go. He mentions moving a couple guys out. I think that as well]

gyso

PS: thanks fierce, for the good answer.

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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by fierce on Mon May 22, 2017 10:03 pm

worcester wrote:Thanks Fierce. Hate to see Jae go, but he would be quite redundant at the three with Hayward and Jaylen there, although no more so than Avery, Isaiah, Markelle, Marcus, and Terry at the guard positions.

I really think it's in the best interest of the players and the Celtics to part ways.
If the Celts are getting Fultz and Hayward then that means less playing time for Bradley and Crowder.

With Hayward, that means Crowder loses his starting SF spot.
That means Crowder comes off the bench, but Celts also have Jaylen Brown who's going to play a lot next season.
Clearly Crowder is redundant.

At SG, Fultz is definitely an upgrade over Bradley.
And with Bradley due for a big pay day, around 20m per year, I think Ainge should get something for Bradley, rather than just losing Bradley in free-agency and the Celts end up getting nothing.
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

Post by NYCelt on Mon May 22, 2017 11:51 pm

Just hitting the highlights...

Agree with Worcester.  Herschel Walker trade stands as the most lopsided...so far.  If this year's draft and next year's work out well, I hope we can top that.

Louisiana Purchase was on the cheap, and can't argue with anything that promoted Creole cooking.

If Matty says booze and women from Europe help balance the scales for any historic national misdeeds in his book, we'll go with it.

Bill Russell was not drafted in exchange for the Ice Capades...that's a story Red made up.

As for the rest, I'll wait for the draft before speculating who we might keep or deal...

...Yeah, right.  You know I'll change my mind on that last one.
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Re: Celtics grab No. 1 pick, and oh what a summer it could be in Boston

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