Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

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Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by NYCelt on Sun May 28, 2017 3:03 am

Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

WALTHAM, Mass. -- Boston Celtics point guard Isaiah Thomas is eligible for an extension of his current deal this summer but said Friday that he's OK with waiting until he reaches unrestricted free agency in the summer of 2018 if that can help the Celtics improve now.

Read the rest of the story here...

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19473272/isaiah-thomas-okay-boston-celtics-spending-money-free-agency-extension
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by bobheckler on Sun May 28, 2017 3:46 am

What this says to me is that either there is an understanding between IT and Danny that "he'll get his", and/or IT wants to stay here and wants to help build the team, and/or IT doesn't care because he knows he'll get his somewhere else if that's how it is.

From Danny and Celtics fans perspective this is a the perfect answer by IT. He's going to let Danny and Mike Zarren work their magic first.


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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by dboss on Sun May 28, 2017 4:38 am

BULLSHIT
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by bobheckler on Sun May 28, 2017 4:58 am

dboss wrote:BULLSHIT



Dboss,


What does it say to you?


bob


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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by RosalieTCeltics on Sun May 28, 2017 5:08 am

You don't believe this statement, dboss?? why???
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by gyso on Sun May 28, 2017 5:32 am

dboss wrote:BULLSHIT

Really? Please explain, it makes perfect sense to me. Team first, then he gets his.

That is how it will play out this summer anyway, so why wouldn't Isaiah allow himself to look like he is onboard for more team rebuild and wait for the best time to resign for him and the team?

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by RosalieTCeltics on Sun May 28, 2017 5:41 am

I truly believe IT is willing to wait it out and see who the Celtics can attract this summer. Holding off on an extension could be a wink wink nod nod that will guarantee him his money come next year. It is alot like what Belechick does for the Patriots (even though some of you hear hate to hear it!), he has had more quality players reconstruct their contracts and even take pay cuts to ensure that the team is as strong as he can make it.

IT has never indicated that he is all about "him". So why wouldn't you believe this?

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by dboss on Sun May 28, 2017 5:52 am

My apologies.

Here is how I see things.

If Danny waits until the end of the 2017-18 season to resign. IT Danny would lose his leverage.

DA needs to determine how much he wants to spend on IT and make him an offer this summer.  If IT rejects the offer and DA is not willing to meet his salary demands, Danny will have more time to find a trade partner.

If he waits as IT suggests until IT becomes a free agent DA and the Celtics may get screwed.  

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by RosalieTCeltics on Sun May 28, 2017 6:20 am

i see where you are coming from and, really, it makes some sense. My other thinking is that if IT has another year like this one, there is no putting the genie back in the bottle. He will expect Mike Conley money or more (i think more) This is his time for a big contract as he is 28 now.

I just want to believe that this guy wants to be here in a big way, he wants to add to the Celtics history and be remembered as a great Celtic. Maybe that is naive, I will admit I always want to think the best of people.

Good for you dboss, you have started a discussion. it will be interesting to see how others feel about this subject

rosalie
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by dboss on Sun May 28, 2017 8:11 am

RosalieTCeltics wrote:i see where you are coming from and, really, it makes some sense.  My other thinking is that if IT has another year like this one, there is no putting the genie back in the bottle. He will expect Mike Conley money or more (i think more) This is his time for a big contract as he is 28 now.

I just want to believe that this guy wants to be here in a big way, he wants to add to the Celtics history and be remembered as a great Celtic.  Maybe that is naive, I will admit I always want to think the best of people.

Good for you dboss, you have started a discussion. it will be interesting to see how others feel about this subject

rosalie

IT had a historical year.  He was unreal.  I do not think he can duplicate what he did although I am reminded that you should not bet against him.  But my reasoning is not related to his abilities.  I think Boston is looking to diversify their offense and not rely so heavily on his scoring.

I think he will want Conley money or something close to it even if his scoring average goes down next year.  The sooner Danny knows what he is going up against the better.  

If Boston does the expected and drafts the talented PG Fultz it will certainly temper offering a generous contract  to IT.  

What do I think IT is worth?  I think something between $15- $18 million.  He is not an all around player.  He is an oustanding offensive player.  He would probably reject that offer and it would be in the Celtics best interest to move him in a bigger multi-player deal to address other needs.

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by cowens/oldschool on Sun May 28, 2017 8:58 am

I agree with dboss, as great as IT was this season and he was incredible, when was the last time a team won the Finals with an undersized point scoring 30 a game? This team needs to acquire more parts and further develop others to become that championship level team and we are in perfect position to do that.
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by fierce on Sun May 28, 2017 11:36 am

Guys, you have to understand that if IT will agree to an extension this summer, he will only get a 3-year extension that starts at 7.44m .

According to cap rules, IT will get a 3-year extension that starts at 7.44m, +120% of 6.2m.
The 6.2m is what he earns in the final year of his contract.
That's if he goes the extension route.

But if IT will wait next summer, his price will be determined by market value.
Meaning he will most likely get the max if he's still an All-Star playing at a high level.

It's not in the best interest of IT to sign a contract extension because he will be getting less money.

Becoming an UFA is in his best interest.
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by fierce on Sun May 28, 2017 11:43 am

The Celts would also have to use cap space for an extension for IT.

That means the Celts won't be able to go after Hayward.

Here's the article.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2017/05/21/you-wondering-about-isaiah-thomas-contract-situation/XIup9ZOCD58Fvq82iDLvWL/story.html

If the Celtics want to extend two-time All-Star Isaiah Thomas this summer, they would have to use cap space to reach a potential maximum deal. Or Thomas could accept a three-year extension that would start at 120 percent of what he would earn in the final year of his current deal — $6.2 million.

The likely scenario is for Thomas to wait until the end of his deal in 2017-18 and then agree to an extension for potentially the maximum using the team’s Bird Rights.
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by kdp59 on Sun May 28, 2017 9:18 pm

fierce wrote:Guys, you have to understand that if IT will agree to an extension this summer, he will only get a 3-year extension that starts at 7.44m .

According to cap rules, IT will get a 3-year extension that starts at 7.44m, +120% of 6.2m.
The 6.2m is what he earns in the final year of his contract.
That's if he goes the extension route.

But if IT will wait next summer, his price will be determined by market value.
Meaning he will most likely get the max if he's still an All-Star playing at a high level.

It's not in the best interest of IT to sign a contract extension because he will be getting less money.

Becoming an UFA is in his best interest.

i do not think those numbers are correct based on cap rules.

for instance Gobert at Utah signed a max extension that increased his salary from less than $3M this year to over $20M next season.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q60

The salary in the first year of a veteran extension may be any amount up to 107.5% of the player's previous salary5, but no more than the player's maximum salary in that season (i.e., the maximum salary the player can receive if he were to sign a new contract that year as a free agent -- see question numbers 16 and 17).

the wording is weird here and sounds like the max a player can sign is 107.5% of his last salary AND the max salary based on his years in the NBA. Of course it can't be both , the 107.5% is the MINIMUM extension amount.

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by mulcogiseng on Sun May 28, 2017 10:04 pm

I have to admit that I have always held IT's "Brinks truck" statement against him. It's the kind of statement that gets you sent packing from Foxboro.

When all is said and done I think that IT will sign next year for a little less than max. I won't bet against him having an even better season next year, but it will be a more well rounded year. Mahcus and AB need to get paid too. Danny will get it done in such a way that even we will be happy.
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by bobheckler on Sun May 28, 2017 11:39 pm

Here's how I believe it works:

Bird Rights mean that you can go over the cap to re-sign your own players if you hold Bird Rights on them. We will have Bird Rights on IT because he has been with us for 3 years.

So, we can go out and sign a free agent like Hayward and then re-sign IT for more $ even though it puts us over the cap.  We cannot do it the opposite way, we cannot sign IT and then sign someone new unless they are for the veteran's minimum or for the mini or mid-level extension (whichever we qualify for), if it puts ourselves over the cap .

If IT is willing to wait to be signed to his extension until after the free agency moratorium is lifted and the feeding frenzy is past, then that would be doing a big service for the team.

Is my interpretation accurate?  GYSO?


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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by dboss on Mon May 29, 2017 12:12 am

Regarding Hayward do you think he would takes less money to play for the Celtics? Keep in mind that Utah is on a similar trajectory as Boston and they can offer him more.

My guess is that Utah will retain him for a boatload of cash. They simply have to. Celts will not get him.

Back to IT. Danny is not likely to blow this one. IT value may be higher now although the injury is problematic.

This all makes for great drama and speculation.

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by wideclyde on Mon May 29, 2017 12:20 am

Even though all professional athletes can be considered in the category of "overpaid", no one can blame them for accepting (or wanting) as much as they can get.

In IT's spot it clearly behooves him to wait until next summer for his first full free agency. This young man is a very intelligent guy and he certainly understands the financial differences between signing in '17 and signing in '18. I am not sure that he would wait even one second to worry about the team if him waiting until 2018 was also not completely in his best interests.

It has always been my belief that professional athletes clearly and usually (with possibly a very few exceptions) measure their ego/happiness by how much money they are making. So, expect Thomas to pretty much follow through on the "backing up of the Brink's truck" concept when he signs his next contract in either Boston or some other NBA city.

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by dboss on Mon May 29, 2017 1:01 am

I think it is a hard decision on both ends. If IT lets the market set the price he may be disappointed. If DA wants to keep him he needs to have a real sense of what it will cost now.

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by bobheckler on Tue May 30, 2017 2:38 am

Here's a podcast from CLNS that talks about future cap space, the impact of it and how it will affect the Celtics signing free agents and other teams that will be looking at salary cap penalties in the future (the Milwaukee Bucks?!).

Very interesting stuff.  Either these guys are idiots who are just blathering, and I am certainly not knowledgeable enough about the cap to dispute them, or they are spot-on and Mike Zarren knows this too because he's probably the best in the business at salary cap manipulation.


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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by swish on Tue May 30, 2017 5:25 am

Haywood is far from the super elite player that I believe that Danny is looking for (only one honor in his last 5 years - all star this past season ) Be patient - he has the bait - if not this summer - then maybe next year - a repeat of 07-08 is just around the corner.

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by fierce on Tue May 30, 2017 9:16 am

kdp59 wrote:
fierce wrote:Guys, you have to understand that if IT will agree to an extension this summer, he will only get a 3-year extension that starts at 7.44m .

According to cap rules, IT will get a 3-year extension that starts at 7.44m, +120% of 6.2m.
The 6.2m is what he earns in the final year of his contract.
That's if he goes the extension route.

But if IT will wait next summer, his price will be determined by market value.
Meaning he will most likely get the max if he's still an All-Star playing at a high level.

It's not in the best interest of IT to sign a contract extension because he will be getting less money.

Becoming an UFA is in his best interest.

i do not think those numbers are correct based on cap rules.

for instance Gobert at Utah signed a max extension that increased his salary from less than $3M this year to over $20M next season.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q60

The salary in the first year of a veteran extension may be any amount up to 107.5% of the player's previous salary5, but no more than the player's maximum salary in that season (i.e., the maximum salary the player can receive if he were to sign a new contract that year as a free agent -- see question numbers 16 and 17).

the wording is weird here and sounds like the max a player can sign is 107.5% of his last salary AND the max salary based on his years in the NBA. Of course it can't be both , the 107.5% is the MINIMUM extension amount.


That's because Gobert's contract is a rookie scale contract.

IT's contract is not a rookie scale contract.
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by fierce on Tue May 30, 2017 9:19 am

kdp59

Here's the article from the Globe.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2017/05/21/you-wondering-about-isaiah-thomas-contract-situation/XIup9ZOCD58Fvq82iDLvWL/story.html

If the Celtics want to extend two-time All-Star Isaiah Thomas this summer, they would have to use cap space to reach a potential maximum deal. Or Thomas could accept a three-year extension that would start at 120 percent of what he would earn in the final year of his current deal — $6.2 million.
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by fierce on Tue May 30, 2017 9:21 am

From my understanding, Celts would have to use cap space to be able to sign IT the max.

If not then it's 120% of 6.2m for a 3-year extension.
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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

Post by dboss on Tue May 30, 2017 1:00 pm

fierce wrote:kdp59

Here's the article from the Globe.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2017/05/21/you-wondering-about-isaiah-thomas-contract-situation/XIup9ZOCD58Fvq82iDLvWL/story.html

If the Celtics want to extend two-time All-Star Isaiah Thomas this summer, they would have to use cap space to reach a potential maximum deal. Or Thomas could accept a three-year extension that would start at 120 percent of what he would earn in the final year of his current deal — $6.2 million.

You have to use cap space to sign everybody.  There are no exceptions.  

By July 1st  we may start to see some new deals.

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Re: Isaiah Thomas: I'm for signing free agents over contract extension

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