Tatum is a young Alex English?

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Tatum is a young Alex English? Empty Tatum is a young Alex English?

Post by kdp59 on Thu Oct 26, 2017 11:48 am

https://www.boston.com/sports/sports-q/2017/10/26/which-nba-player-past-or-present-does-jayson-tatum-remind-you-of#comments


Which NBA player past or present does Jayson Tatum remind you of?


By Chad Finn 7:04 AM
Welcome to Boston.com’s Sports Q, our daily conversation, initiated by you and moderated by Chad Finn, about a compelling topic in Boston sports. Here’s how it works: You submit questions to Chad through Twitter, Facebook, email, his Friday chat, and any other outlet you prefer. He’ll pick one each weekdayto answer, then we’ll take the discussion to the comments. Chad will stop by several times per day to navigate. But you drive the conversation.

Question: Which current or former NBA player does Jayson Tatum remind you of?

This one doesn’t come from a reader, but rather from a discussion (a civil one, too!) on Twitter after the Celtics rookie’s 22-point, 4-rebound, 4-steal gem against the Knicks Tuesday night.


It’s pretty easy to get carried away projecting greatness on the 19-year-old out of Duke. He’s averaging 14.8 points per game, and he’s playing with a confidence and poise that suggests a player who has been succeeding in the league for years rather than weeks. His playing style is the embodiment of that John Wooden adage, be quick but don’t hurry.

The last Celtics rookie I remember fitting in so quickly was Joe Johnson in 2001-02, and Tatum is surpassing his performance. Johnson averaged 6.3 points per game with the Celtics – you thought it was more, didn’t you? – before he was traded to the Suns for Tony Delk and Rodney Rogers after 48 games.

Some of the suggested comps for Tatum on Twitter: Jamaal Wilkes (the smoothness is reminiscent, though Tatum’s shooting form is less distinctive than Silk’s behind-the-ear shot), James Worthy (he was longer and more explosive), Alex English (aesthetically, this one fits really well), Carmelo Anthony (more herky-jerky pure-scorer power in Melo’s game), and Paul Pierce (the stepback and the poise are reminiscent, though the young Truth was more physical).

As you can see, the bar is not being set especially low for young Mr. Tatum four games into his NBA career. He does look like a future star, and he’s already showing flashes of being one in the present. But the comps to NBA all-time greats are just a bit premature. They’re also irresistible.


So who do you have? Who does Jayson Tatum remind you of? I’ll stick with the English comp for now, until you guys give me something better. I’ll hear you in the comments.


English sounds pretty good to me!
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Post by bobheckler on Thu Oct 26, 2017 12:10 pm

Based upon what I've seen so far, through 4 games, his defense is already better than English's (not that that is saying much!).  English was, in his defense (no pun intended):  8x All-Star, 3x All-League, 1x NBA Scoring Champion and is in the HOF.  So, yeah kdp, Alex English sounds pretty good to me too (especially if he can do better than him on defense).  He looks LONG like English.

His offense, though, yeah maybe.  Maybe more like English's than Pierce's.


bob


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Post by dboss on Thu Oct 26, 2017 1:19 pm

In my not so humble opinion JT reminds me of Paul Pierce.  Alex English did not score much or play much until his 3rd year in the NBA.  English is not in the conversation as far as I can see.

PP average 34 MPG as a rookie and Tatum is averaging 34 MPG

PP averaged 16.5 PPG, 6.4 rebounds. 2.4 assists, 1 block and 1.7 steals.
JT averaging 14.8 PPG, 7.8 rebounds, 1.8 assists, 1.25 blocks and 1.25 steals

PP shot .439%, .413% on threes and .71% from the line
JT has shot .476%, .455% from threes and .82% from the line.

4 games into the season hardly can be used as a comparison.  Pierce played 48 games in a strike shortened season as a rookie and he was 21 years old.

Before the draft it was suggested that Tatum had similarities with Paul Pierce.  The step away jumper, the same patience in getting to his spot, etc.

Tatum is just 19 years old.  He is mature beyond his years.  Physically he is taller and longer than Piece and will likely add another inch to his height.  They have very similar tempos to their games.

You can see from a statistical standpoint they are very close.

I think that Tatum has all of the mental and physical tools to be as good if not better than Pierce.  Pierce was more extraverted than Tatum yet the competitive fire burns hot in each of them.  Tatum appears to be a silent assassin.  

In the end Jason will make a name for himself and one day he will be the point of comparison.

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Post by fierce on Thu Oct 26, 2017 1:31 pm

What will make Jayson Tatum great is when he becomes an NBA PF in a couple of years.

Right now Tatum is still a little light to be a PF.
When he bulks up and his body becomes NBA ready, watch out!
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Post by KyleCleric on Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:03 pm

Derozan is a better offensive comparison for English today. There aren't a lot of midrange scorers today. Tatum won't be one. Pierce is a good comparison for him. Tatum isn't as strong yet as Pierce and may never be but makes up with length.

In terms of offensive development at this stage of his career and scoring style, a slightly shorter, less long Durant could be an interesting comparison.

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Post by kdp59 on Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:04 pm

maybe I will remind dboss that English is in the hall of fame.

IF Tatum can play up to his level, I would be very happy.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/e/englial01.html


note English's per 36 min averages , even early in his career . Also I was surprised at English's per 36 blocks per game up till he turned 30 YO.

so for me, I agree with the writer.

we have Jayson "Alex English" Tatum

and Dan "bobby Jones" Theis here now.

the late 70-80's are back


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Post by Phil Pressey on Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:25 pm

Tatum looks like Durant for body type. People think he might get taller. Despite his very young age, there is something about him that says top prospect and a sure thing. I don't see any flaws in his game. Smart has yet to prove he can shoot. Avery never got better at point guard. Jaylen Brown looked a bit shaky last year for ball handling, decision making and shooting.

Jayson Tatum seems to be a historic talent and in the perfect spot. Embiid is damaged goods. Fultz and Simmons are lousy at shooting. Brown has made leaps. Perhaps he will be the best player taken from last year. This is all eye test from me. We could have the two best phenoms to emerge in this era.

Durant and LeBron emerged around the same time. We might have the next two transcendent players. Terry Rozier could potentially become a top fifty NBA player.

Those three guys could end up better than Kyrie Irving. I would make that bet on Tatum. Brown is showing signs. My growing affection for Rozier's game could be green-goggled reasoning, but we shall see.
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Post by mrkleen09 on Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:00 pm

Tatum is much more athletic than Alex English, but otherwise I would love an Alex English type career for Jayson.

Alex English was a professional scorer that was efficient and consistent. Alex English not Magic, Bird, or Wilkins—led the decade of the 1980s in scoring. He also holds the distinction of being the first player to score 2,000 points in eight straight seasons.

Historically underrated player, likely because he played on an average Nuggets team.


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Post by worcester on Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:13 pm

"Terry Rozier could potentially become a top fifty NBA player."

Don't be surprised if by February Danny has traded Marcus and decided to keep Terry. Why?

1. Danny can't afford to pay Kyrie, Gordon, Jaylen, Jayson, and Marcus top dollar, and if he gives Marcus a big contract next year it will be that much harder to move Marcus.
2. Although Rozier's D is not as good as Smart's, it is still decent, and Terry is a damn good rebounder and a better shooter than Marcus will ever be.
3. Although Marcus rises to the occasion in the playoffs, so does Marcus.
4. He's a year behind Marcus on the path to big paychecks.

Rozier over Smart? Could happen.
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Post by cowens/oldschool on Thu Oct 26, 2017 6:12 pm

A
mrkleen09 wrote:Tatum is much more athletic than Alex English, but otherwise I would love an Alex English type career for Jayson.

Alex English was a professional scorer that was efficient and consistent.  Alex English not Magic, Bird, or Wilkins—led the decade of the 1980s in scoring. He also holds the distinction of being the first player to score 2,000 points in eight straight seasons.

Historically underrated player, likely because he played on an average Nuggets team.




Alex English was Charmin/Kelly Olynck soft, he could score, couldn't play the other end at all. Tatum is a 2 way player. I see Tatum having much more impact on winning than English, I don't care what AE's stats are.

Looks like KO already lost his starting job, saw a few Heat games, he's the same inconsistent guy with no defense, players get right in his grill and shoot/score over him.
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Post by dboss on Thu Oct 26, 2017 7:02 pm

kdp59 wrote:maybe I will remind dboss that English is in the hall of fame.

IF Tatum can play up to his level, I would be very happy.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/e/englial01.html


note English's per 36 min averages , even early in his career . Also I was surprised at English's per 36 blocks per game up till he turned 30 YO.

so for me, I agree with the writer.

we have Jayson "Alex English" Tatum

and Dan "bobby Jones" Theis here now.

the  late 70-80's are back


No need to remind me.  English was a great offensive player.  But that Hall of fame designation certainly were not helped by his first two years in the NBA.  Go look at his numbers.

I think comparing rookie performance is more relevant.  I guess I should remind you that PP is a future HOF inductee.  

Down the road new comparisons may emerge.  

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Post by bobheckler on Thu Oct 26, 2017 7:44 pm

cowens/oldschool wrote:A
mrkleen09 wrote:Tatum is much more athletic than Alex English, but otherwise I would love an Alex English type career for Jayson.

Alex English was a professional scorer that was efficient and consistent.  Alex English not Magic, Bird, or Wilkins—led the decade of the 1980s in scoring. He also holds the distinction of being the first player to score 2,000 points in eight straight seasons.

Historically underrated player, likely because he played on an average Nuggets team.




Alex English was Charmin/Kelly Olynck soft, he could score, couldn't play the other end at all. Tatum is a 2 way player. I see Tatum having much more impact on winning than English, I don't care what AE's stats are.

Looks like KO already lost his starting job, saw a few Heat games, he's the same inconsistent guy with no defense, players get right in his grill and shoot/score over him.



Cow,

Kelly is playing 22.3mpg, up from 20.5 last year, so not that many more minutes/game.  He's averaging about the same number of points, he's shooting 50.0% vs 51.2% last year but he's also shooting 54.5% from 3 on slightly more 3pt fgas.  So he's doing MUCH better from the arc.  His rebounding is 35% higher this year.  Put another way, he's averaging 10.5 rebs/36mpg this year vs 8.4 rebs/36mpg last year.  That's a big jump up.  His assists/minute and steals/minute are both way up too.

Starting doesn't matter.  Thon Maker starts for Milwaukee, is he better than Monroe?  No.  Last year Jaylen started when Bradley was out.  was Jaylen better than Smart last year?  No.  He started to protect him by surrounding him with veterans and let Smart anchor the bench.  Kelly could be anchoring the Miami bench this year.


bob



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Post by Phil Pressey on Thu Oct 26, 2017 8:10 pm

worcester wrote:"Terry Rozier could potentially become a top fifty NBA player."

Don't be surprised if by February Danny has traded Marcus and decided to keep Terry. Why?

1. Danny can't afford to pay Kyrie, Gordon, Jaylen, Jayson, and Marcus top dollar, and if he gives Marcus a big contract next year it will be that much harder to move Marcus.
2. Although Rozier's D is not as good as Smart's, it is still decent, and Terry is a damn good rebounder and a better shooter than Marcus will ever be.
3. Although Marcus rises to the occasion in the playoffs, so does Marcus.
4. He's a year behind Marcus on the path to big paychecks.

Rozier over Smart? Could happen.

It's been Danny's M.O.. Who is next up to leave?

Kris Humphries - Don't get too comfortable
Bass
Amir

Rozier is showing a young Rondo speed. He is shooting at a top rate. The form looks perfect.

Marcus also worked hard on his shot. He started out slow and then got injured. He gets an incomplete grade.

Thankfully Smart has a restricted contract. It won't be like what happened with Evan Turner. Portland was so stupid to steal him from Danny. I think Ainge resigns Smart no matter what or trades. No way will he walk away for nothing.

I guess this is the obvious and the game is about to start. I hope Marcus becomes amazing and that somehow he starts shooting very well.

Rozier in reality has become much better than the usual #16 picks. He seems to be flying under the radar. The media will drool over Tatum and Brown and perhaps mostly miss that the Celtics are making leaps all over the place with many players at once.
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