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POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by 112288 on Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:43 pm

Celtics Wrap: Boston Drops Third Straight, Fall To Clippers 129-119

NESN by Logan Mullen on Wed, Feb 14, 2018

The Boston Celtics will be heading into the All-Star break with a bad taste in their mouth. The C’s dropped their third straight game as they fell to the visiting Los Angeles Clippers 129-119 at TD Garden on Wednesday night. Kyrie Irving scored a game-high 33 points, and was one of six Celtics in double figures. DeAndre Jordan was one of seven Clippers that scored in double digits, posting a career- and team-high 30 points. The Celtics fall to 40-19 with the loss, while the Clippers climb to 30-26. Here’s how it all went down:

STARTING FIVE PG: Kyrie Irving SG: Jaylen Brown SF: Jayson Tatum PF: Al Horford C: Aron Baynes

LACKLUSTER FIRST Los Angeles used a 6-0 run over 35 seconds near the midway point of the first to build a small cushion in what was an underwhelming period for the Celtics. And though Boston kept things close, the Clippers opened up a 12-0 run over 2:39 to give themselves a 28-15 lead with just over two minutes to play. However, the Celtics chipped away at the 13-point advantage to end the period down 34-25.

UGLY, THEN BETTER Much like Sunday, the Celtics’ offense to begin the game was nothing short of downright dreadful. They shot 10-for-35 from the field through the first 15 minutes of the game, but slowly started to cut into the lead after that. They pulled within as few as six on a couple occasions, but each time the Clippers answered and opened the lead back up. The Celtics finally broke through a bit when they pulled within four thanks to a quick 6-0 run over 1:27, which forced the Clippers into a timeout with 5:17 to play. The Clippers went back up by 14 on the other side of the timeout, but the Celtics went into the half with a bang. Having cut the lead to 10 with 53 seconds to play, the Celtics cashed in on a two-for-one. Irving nailed a 3-pointer with 33 seconds left, then Horford came up with a block on the other end, followed by Rozier hitting a buzzer-beating trey as he fell to the ground. The quick six points capped off a 12-2 run to end the half, putting the Celtics down just 61-57 at the break. Irving and DeAndre Jordan each had a game-high 14 first-half points.

BACK-AND-FORTH THIRD After a largely underwhelming first half, the Celtics tied the game for the first time just 44 seconds into the third quarter and proceeded to take their first lead at 10:22. From then on, both sides spent the quarter trading chances, with neither team building a lead any bigger than five throughout. After a first half where the Celtics never found themselves tied nor leading, the third quarter alone featured six ties and 12 lead changes. Behind Irving’s 15 points, the Celts outscored the Clippers 34-32 and went into the final quarter down just 93-91.

CLIPS CLOSE THE DOOR Within the first two minutes of the final quarter the Celtics built a four-point lead — their biggest of the game — but the Clippers had plenty of fight left. Over the ensuing 2:40, the Clips went on a 12-2 run to go up 108-101 with seven minutes to play. From there, L.A. continued to maintain the lead and keep the Celtics from pulling within striking distance. The Clippers continued to bury the Celtics late, sealing the deal by outscoring Boston 36-28 in the final quarter, earning the 10-point, 129-119 win.

HIGHLIGHT OF THE NIGHT Right in Avery Bradley’s face.

UP NEXT The Celtics will have some time to rest up over the All-Star break before they return to action Friday, Feb. 23 on the road against the Detroit Pistons. Tip from Little Caesars Arena is set for 7 p.m. ET.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by 112288 on Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:45 pm

THIS ONE IS ON NO ANSWERS BRAD!

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by jrleftfoot on Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:57 pm

I don`t have as much basketball expertise as some of you guys (lady). Do any of you think we switch too  much on D and get killed in the resulting matchups?
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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by 112288 on Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:19 pm

JRLEFTFOOt

I think it goes beyond that.

I think the whole team is messed up due in large part to the defensive and offense scheme's by the coaching staff and the buck stops with Brad.

You have guys flying in from the top of the key with ally oops ..........and the Celtics have no answers on how to stop it.   I swear to the basketball god's....Doc was running the same offensive scheme's as he did while the coach of the 2008 - 2012 teams!

It is as if the teams morale has been broken..........or, and I hope it is not true.........Brad has lost the team.

As for the offense..............they went back to hanging at the perimeter and running iso plays with who ever had the ball.............complete joke!

The definition of insanity is doing something over and over again and getting the same results..................that's Brad............he knows we are not shooting the ball well.......we are a streaky shooting team...............what does he do differently when we are putting up brick 3's.............Yep keep shooting the 3's!!

ALL I CAN SAY IS BOOOOOOOOOOO!

112288


Last edited by 112288 on Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by worcester on Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:35 pm

sad
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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by jrleftfoot on Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:23 am

112288 wrote:JRLEFTFOOt

I think it goes beyond that.

I think the whole team is messed up due in large part to the defensive and offense scheme's by the coaching staff and the buck stops with Brad.

You have guys flying in from the top of the key with ally oops ..........and the Celtics have no answers on how to stop it.   I swear to the basketball god's....Doc was running the same offensive scheme's as he did while the coach of the 2008 - 2012 teams!

It is as if the teams morale has been broken..........or, and I hope it is not true.........Brad has lost the team.

As for the offense..............they went back to hanging at the perimeter and running iso plays with who ever had the ball.............complete joke!

The definition of insanity is doing something over and over again and getting the same results..................that's Brad............he knows we are not shooting the ball well.......we are a streaky shooting team...............what does he do differently when we are putting up brick 3's.............Yep keep shooting the 3's!!

ALL I CAN SAY IS BOOOOOOOOOOO!

112288

They have 3 ISO  guys, Kyrie, Morris and Tatum. Unfortunately , they have a bunch of guys who can`t score at all. Their defense has fallen apart. Come on all star break. I think they need to fight through screens instead of switching every PNR. Tatum reeeally need to get stronger.
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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by k_j_88 on Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:19 am

They did nothing to disrupt Jordan freely running to the lane and the clips had every open shot they wanted... I don't think Stevens lost the team but I do think this team forgot its defensive intensity.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by kdp59 on Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:27 am

last few games probably made Smart some extra money.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by sinus007 on Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:43 am

112288,
I’m with you. Something is not right with the team. I wish I could put my finger on it. Let’s see what happens after the break.

AK
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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by wideclyde on Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:44 am

AK,

Team toughness has been lost over time since the LA trip, and toughness leads to confidence, playing harder, playing smarter and playing much more team ball. The Cs, fight now, are not the same team that we had prior to the LA road trip.

Sometimes, one guy can be the toughness factor on any team, and I will leave it at that.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by bobheckler on Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:16 am

So, does anybody still think there's nothing to be worried about?  

We gave up a season high 121 points to the freshly-minted Cavaliers on Sunday and then blew past that last night vs the even worse Clippers.  The Clips are averaging 108ppg, we gave up 129.  They average 46.5% from the field, we gave up 50%.  The team that used to throttle every offense that stepped on the floor against us can't even hold them to their season average anymore.  What happened to our defense?  Is it Marcus Smart and Shane Larkin?  If that's the case then Danny needs to pull his head out of his ass and sign both of those guys to longterm contracts because the drop off is ear-popping without them.  Is that it?

Smart punched out a picture after the Laker game, 1/23.  Today is 2/15, so it's about 3 1/2 weeks now.  Since the Laker game we are 6-5, not that good BUT we averaged 105.3ppg during those 11 games and gave up 105.6ppg.  So, not surprisingly, we have a mediocre 6-5 record with mediocre offensive and defensive ratings and a mediocre differential of -.3ppg.  However, one of those games was the 103-73 blow out of the hapless Knicks.  Take that one out and we're 5-5 and our numbers look much worse, don't they?

Our defense, season-to-date, gives up 99.6ppg.  That includes the crappy defense of the past month, which gives you an idea of just how bad giving up 105.6ppg is for us.

In short, to state the painfully obvious, we have sucked on both ends of the court for a while now.  We can't just point to shooting, or lack thereof.  We are not getting stops anymore.

Tatum with another weak game.  4-13.  He is really struggling.  We've had off since Sunday, so the "rookie wall"/fatigue excuse doesn't work anymore.

Brown with a weak game too.  4-12.  We see Marcus Smart throw up these kind of numbers and we beat on him like a drum.  Well, it's not just "next man up", it's "next two men up".  Smart was out so both our young'uns became awful shooters.  Their inconsistency is making it hard for us.  Brown will have a great first quarter and then mostly disappear for the rest of the game.  Tatum will not show up for the first half but might put on a bit of a spurt in the 2nd half.  Neither of them power through the game for 4 quarters.

I'm feeling crazy and loose today, so I'm going to make a prediction (somewhere, up there, Sam is looking down and shaking his head "no, no").  My prediction is that either Jayson Tatum and/or Jaylen Brown will be benched and Terry Rozier and/or Marcus Morris start instead.  

Rozier with 13 points on 5-12, 2-5 from 3 (including an "in your face, Avery!" buzzer beater.  Should have gotten a whistle too) and, very important here, 7 assists and 0 TOs.  I believe we need a floor general.  Irving had 8 assists last night but that is somewhat unusual for him.  We need someone else to feed shooters and Jaylen Brown is definitely not him.

I also wouldn't be surprised if, at some point although I think not real soon, Greg Monroe gets the start over Baynes.  Baynes gets whistled for just looking hard at players (and Brad can NOT be happy with that braindead foul he committed on Gallinari at the arc) and Monroe has been playing decent defense. Monroe is also an offensive facilitating big, another Al Horford.

We lost to the WC 9th place LA Clippers and Brad only went 9 deep after 3 days of rest and practice.  NOT good.  We get blown out by a team that isn't even in the playoffs and we played using a shortened playoff-bench squad?

DeAndre Jordan with a career high 30 points.  He can't do anything except dunk but he's scoring 30 on us?  He hit his fritos, ok, that's weird, but he was 11-14.  How TF does he get 14 fgas?  Because our perimeter defense sucked, that's why.  Guys were coming around picks with their man trailing them and that forced our big (Horford/Baynes) to pick them up and Jordan would just roll for the alley oop.  Brown and Tatum did that a lot.  They weren't trying to beat their man to the screen, they just followed them over it with the aforementioned results.

We commit A LOT of dumb fouls.  Unnecessary fouls.  Unthinking fouls.  Avoidable fouls which put us in the penalty early if not getting them to the line right away and that's not just true of this game.

http://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400975604



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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by dboss on Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:14 pm

No need to throw your hands up in the air.  There are several defensive tactics and schemes that the Celtics could use at different times during the game. Let's explore some of them as I welcome feedback from the group.

Stretch the defense to the full 94 feet.  The Celtics are giving their opponents 47 feet or more of free space to run their offense.  With that in mind Boston needs to implement a pressing defense.  They do not have to press the entire game but they can turn it on and off as needed.  The purpose of the press is to create turnovers but more importantly take a few extra seconds off the 24 second shot clock.  This would throw the opponents offense out of rhythm.

Take away the opponents half-court offense by utilizing some zone variations.  Force the opponents to change their offense and then switch back to man coverage.  Basically keep the opponent off balance.  Teams hate to play against zone defenses. Don't let the opponent get comfortable running their offensive sets.

Implement a two man trap on both the end lines and baselines combined with timely weakside rotations.

On those high screens you have to fight over the top.  If the screen is solid you are going to lose contact with your man and the help defense has to rotate.  Last night we saw multiple plays where this strategy did not work and that is because a second rotation has to be ready to cut off the roller (Jordan)

The other tactic is for the rotation player to bum rush the ball handler that is coming over the top of the screen.  You have to come hard and fast and cut him off and challenge any attempt he makes to pass the ball to the roller.

If the ball handler is not a good outside shooter you could go under the screen.

So there you have it (press, trap, zone and pick and role defensive options)

The Celtics need to continue to switch on defense but they also need to be more mindful of the mismatch situations that it creates. How many times have we seen a center being checked by a guard and no one come over to help? You have to force the center to give up the ball and most centers are not great passers.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by swish on Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:06 pm

dboss

Even with the right game plan - the players still have to execute - and some teams have players that execute better than others.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by beat on Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:21 pm

wideclyde wrote:AK,

Team toughness has been lost over time since the LA trip, and toughness leads to confidence, playing harder, playing smarter and playing much more team ball.  The Cs, fight now, are not the same team that we had prior to the LA road trip.

Sometimes, one guy can be the toughness factor on any team, and I will leave it at that.
Pretty obvious from sitting 15 feet away from the court.........Smart brings something no one else on this team has.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by swish on Thu Feb 15, 2018 2:13 pm

Tough as nails and all that sort of stuff - but in the first 26 games, he missed 2 games - and the team won both.
In the last 33 games - With him,,, and the team was 18-15,,, .545% --- without him,,, 6-5,,,.545%

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by NYCelt on Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:05 pm

dboss wrote:No need to throw your hands up in the air.  There are several defensive tactics and schemes that the Celtics could use at different times during the game. Let's explore some of them as I welcome feedback from the group.

Stretch the defense to the full 94 feet.  The Celtics are giving their opponents 47 feet or more of free space to run their offense.  With that in mind Boston needs to implement a pressing defense.  They do not have to press the entire game but they can turn it on and off as needed.  The purpose of the press is to create turnovers but more importantly take a few extra seconds off the 24 second shot clock.  This would throw the opponents offense out of rhythm.

Take away the opponents half-court offense by utilizing some zone variations.  Force the opponents to change their offense and then switch back to man coverage.  Basically keep the opponent off balance.  Teams hate to play against zone defenses.  Don't let the opponent get comfortable running their offensive sets.

Implement a two man trap on both the end lines and baselines combined with timely weakside rotations.

On those high screens you have to fight over the top.  If the screen is solid you are going to lose contact with your man and the help defense has to rotate.  Last night we saw multiple plays where this strategy did not work and that is because a second rotation has to be ready to cut off the roller (Jordan)

The other tactic is for the rotation player to bum rush the ball handler that is coming over the top of the screen.  You have to come hard and fast and cut him off and challenge any attempt he makes to pass the ball to the roller.

If the ball handler is not a good outside shooter you could go under the screen.

So there you have it (press, trap, zone and pick and role defensive options)

The Celtics need to continue to switch on defense but they also need to be more mindful of the mismatch situations that it creates.  How many times have we seen a center being checked by a guard and no one come over to help?  You have to force the center to give up the ball and most centers are not great passers.

dboss

Or trapping at the top of the key, on the wing, or in the corner against good (3 point) shooting teams.

I do think your point about periodically extending the defense is good too.

Both are designed to create turnover opportunities, and rush shots against a dying clock. That might help restore the defensive mojo.
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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by dboss on Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:31 pm

Swish

Toughness has little value in absence of schemes and tactics.

Every team has 59 game films on the Celtics. Brad and the coaching staff needs to come up with something new.

That is why I came up with some proven defensive schemes that the Celtics may be able to implement. If you have a team with old slow players you are probably not going to defend for 94 feet. Boston has a young and very athletic teams. They also have several excellent on the ball defenders like Rozier, Brown, Smart, Larkin and even Semi.

I do not think that the Celtics defensive issue is just about execution. I think it has as much to do with opposing coaches that have identified several soft spots in the defense.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by bobheckler on Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:04 pm

This is a good example of why Jayson Tatum might lose his starting job.  

https://mobile.twitter.com/Tom_NBA/status/964166037305479168



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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by swish on Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:13 pm

dboss

I'm not about to suggest to Brad as to how this Celtic team should be coached. He's a highly successful basketball coach competing at the highest level. I'm just John Doe fan with zero coaching experience in basketball - so I'll yield to Brad's coaching expertise. A few short weeks ago I had the feeling that many fans on this board had him a "Lock" to be a Hall Of Fame coach. I would suspect that he is totally capable of making adjustments that may be needed while understanding that it's always possible that some present problems may not be correctable right now.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by dboss on Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:17 pm

bobheckler wrote:This is a good example of why Jayson Tatum might lose his starting job.  

https://mobile.twitter.com/Tom_NBA/status/964166037305479168



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Bob he made a mistake and should have stayed home. Not sure that means he losses his starting job.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by dboss on Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:32 pm

swish wrote:dboss

  I'm not about to suggest to Brad as to how this Celtic team should be coached. He's a highly successful basketball coach competing at the highest level. I'm just John Doe fan with zero coaching experience in basketball -  so I'll yield to Brad's coaching expertise. A few short weeks ago I had the feeling that many fans on this board had him a "Lock" to be a Hall Of Fame coach.  I would suspect that he is totally capable of making adjustments that may be needed while understanding that it's always possible that some present problems may not be correctable right now.

       swish

Don't be so modest. You have a deep knowledge of this game that goes way way back.

No one on this board is qualified to coach an NBA team let along a group of YMCA gym rats.

Personally I think Brad Stevens is an excellent coach but he has a lot to learn. Such as implementing a fast break offense.

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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by jrleftfoot on Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:36 am

bobheckler wrote:This is a good example of why Jayson Tatum might lose his starting job.  

https://mobile.twitter.com/Tom_NBA/status/964166037305479168



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wow . that was some dumb shite. Maybe the baby is disturbing his sleep. he shot horribly too
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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by NYCelt on Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:11 am

dboss wrote:
bobheckler wrote:This is a good example of why Jayson Tatum might lose his starting job.  

https://mobile.twitter.com/Tom_NBA/status/964166037305479168



bob


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Bob he made a mistake and should have stayed home.  Not sure that means he losses his starting job.  

dboss

Yeah, just a mix-up with Monroe on the switch.
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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by bobheckler on Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:21 am

NYCelt wrote:
dboss wrote:
bobheckler wrote:This is a good example of why Jayson Tatum might lose his starting job.  

https://mobile.twitter.com/Tom_NBA/status/964166037305479168



bob


.

Bob he made a mistake and should have stayed home.  Not sure that means he losses his starting job.  

dboss

Yeah, just a mix-up with Monroe on the switch.


dboss,

A combination of poor communication by Monroe, not letting Tatum know that he was coming up with his man and court recognition by Tatum that, when he stepped up on the high pnr, his man would be WIDE open because there was no way Monroe or Horford could possibly have gotten there in time anyway.

I'm still sticking with my original thought, either Brown or Tatum or both will be coming off the bench after the All-Star break.


bob


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Re: POST GAME LAC - HOME

Post by dboss on Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:43 am

Bob I see no good reason to nit pick a play here or there and use it as evidentiary material.

Tatum was not supposed to be a starter this year but once Hayward went down Brad had to elevate him into the starting lineup.

So if he losses his starting position or you send Jaylen Brown to the bench who starts in their place?  Who starts at SF?  The black hole?  Who starts at SG? Marcus Smart who can't shoot?

It sounds to me like you are blaming Tatum or Brown for the regression the team has experienced.  

Every single game I watch I see guys missing defensive assignments.  Jordan put up a career high the other night.  Who was the guy mainly responsible for checking him?
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