Olejeye and Yabusele?

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Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by wideclyde on Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:57 pm

With summer league winding down we have now seen a few games and lots of opinions on these two guys are surfacing.

Thought I'd lump them together for discussion in a separate thread to better isolate folk's thoughts as they may be each
other's major competition for playing time in 2018-19.

I like Olejeye's prospects as becoming a solid rotational player mostly because his weaknesses mostly are on offense. With
that said, he could shoot threes in college at a much better rate than he did last year. He will, with work, get better at this skill.
He also did not drive to the hoop last season even though he has a body that not too many other players will want to get hit
by when he does figure out that he can score by plowing to the hoop. I believe that he is in the process of figuring this situation
in this year's summer games as he has already scored more layups in a few games than he did all of last season.

Obviously, his defense is his calling card and it is strong enough to have earned a decent number of key minutes last season even
though he was basically a non entity on the offense. By mid season, he was certainly not just a 'mop up minutes' player.

He also seems to have figured out how to stay in top condition during the summer months. He does not look like he has gained
even a pound of fat since May.

Yabusele is quite different although he is also a big body guy who is not a center. I am very worried about this guy because
his weaknesses lie at the defensive end, and I am not sure that defensive understanding really comes to anyone in their 20s.
Defensive awareness seems to be something that you have or don't have pretty early on in basketball. Although basic skills can
get better, awareness may never come.

His skill strength is on offense where he passes much better than Olejeye. He also shoots better than Olejeye (at the hoop, mid
range, free throws and outside the arc, but as someone mentioned, he has not done much to impress at the NBA level either in
garbage time or the few times he has played meaningful minutes. Perhaps succeeding against softer competition is his ceiling.
He just is big with a sharp nickname in my eyes so far.

And, speaking of big, he seems to be quite a bit rounder this summer than in the past to the point where he may, unfortunately,
find a way to eat himself out of a chance in the NBA. If this happens (he will not be the first) it will be a shame.

Please add your thoughts in this relatively dead time of the NBA calendar.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by dboss on Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:12 pm

I would rate Semi ahead of Yabusele on both offense and defense.

Both players have some flaws and I think their biggest flaw is the lack of ball handling skills. If they work on their ball handling it will help them become better offensive players.

Semi has an unbelievable physical profile yet he stills does not know how to use his strength on the glass.

Guershon is not particularly athletic but he has length and moves relatively well even though he is dragging a trailer behind him.

I do not see either one of these guys as long term keepers. I expect that either one of them will be included in a trade at some point. I think Semi has more upside than Gueshon.

Danny still has a lot of future picks that he can use to upgrade the bottom of his rotation. I think that Jabari Bird is more talented than either of them because his game is more complete.
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by RosalieTCeltics on Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:24 pm

I love Semi's game, his attitude, his work ethic. He has grown by leaps and bounds from last summer. He is where he belongs, right there on the bench to give a helping hand when need

As far as Yabusele is concerned, I am not over whemed most of the time. But, he is a big body when we need one. Will he be here all year?? who knows, but I would not bet on it. Time will tell.

I will not agree that Bird is above both of these players, Yabusele, yes, Semi, no.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by mrkleen09 on Fri Jul 13, 2018 10:28 pm

RosalieTCeltics wrote:I love Semi's game, his attitude, his work ethic. He has grown by leaps and bounds from last summer. He is where he belongs, right there on the bench to give a helping hand when need

As far as Yabusele is concerned, I am not over whemed most of the time.  But, he is a big body when we need one.  Will he be here all year??   who knows, but I would not bet on it.  Time will tell.

I will not agree that Bird is above both of these players, Yabusele, yes, Semi, no.


Agree on all counts.
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by KyleCleric on Sat Jul 14, 2018 12:27 am

Clearly Ojeleye is well ahead of Bird and Yabusele. He's the one who I can see able to immediately contribute in our rotation. He's a solid defender, extremely switchable. He's probably the best shooter of any of them and perhaps athlete as well for position (though all 3 are tremendous athletes; all 3 are great leapers; Semi and Bird are so fast; Yabusele and Semi are so strong).

Semi can't create his own shot on the dribble but none of them can yet. Bird is limited to guarding guards and small wings. He isn't strong enough yet to face most wing scorers. If Bird can overcome his defensive deficiency, he does play with a lot of energy, hustle, smart basketball plays that helps you win. Yabusele may not have the quickness to guard bigger wings or height against tall bigs yet. He probably has the best instincts to score of the 3 of them. He just needs to speed himself to the game.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by dboss on Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:35 am

KyleCleric wrote:Clearly Ojeleye is well ahead of Bird and Yabusele. He's the one who I can see able to immediately contribute in our rotation. He's a solid defender, extremely switchable. He's probably the best shooter of any of them and perhaps athlete as well for position (though all 3 are tremendous athletes; all 3 are great leapers; Semi and Bird are so fast; Yabusele and Semi are so strong).

Semi can't create his own shot on the dribble but none of them can yet. Bird is limited to guarding guards and small wings. He isn't strong enough yet to face most wing scorers. If Bird can overcome his defensive deficiency, he does play with a lot of energy, hustle, smart basketball plays that helps you win. Yabusele may not have the quickness to guard bigger wings or height against tall bigs yet. He probably has the best instincts to score of the 3 of them. He just needs to speed himself to the game.

Well kyle it may be clear to you and others that Semi is well ahead of both Bird and Yabusele. I must take a contrarian view.

Before the draft last year I was very high on Semi. I did not know anything about Bird.

Semi was an outstanding shooter from behind the arc in college. There was no logical reason to believe that he would not be able to transfer that skill into an NBA environment.

The fact of the matter is that Semi has not been a reliable 3 point shooter. (32% regular season and 27% during the playoffs) Bird shot 43% during the regular season but was not on the playoff roster. To be fair neither player has had a lot of opportunity to play. Their percentages are meaningless given the low volume of attempts. Bird's stroke looks better to me while Semi stroke is too flat (Semi misses short)

Bird appears to be a better finisher at the rim. He has the ability to change his position while in the air. Semi struggles to finish at the rim.

Semi like Crowder is basically a straight line driver to the rim. He has no cross over or ability to change angles when driving the ball. Bird on the other hand has displayed better ball handling skills, makes better use of hesitation moves and can finish at the rim with a variety of shots. Bird can take the ball off the dribble from one end of the court to the other while semi is likely to fumble the ball away because he has a weak handle.

Semi is the better defender because Semi has more strength than Jabari. However Jabari is a good on the ball defender on the perimeter but may be a step slow in reaction time. Semi seems to mirror his assignment better.

I think that Semi is what I call a Tweener. Not agile enough at the 3 and not big enough to play the 4. He does have a lot of value and as he works on his game he should become even better.

Bird needs the opportunity to play. He needs to get stronger and work on all aspects of his game. He is a 6' 6' shooting guard that should be able to swing over to the 3 with added muscle.

I have not mentioned Yabusele. He was a reach and should never have been drafted in the first round.
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by RosalieTCeltics on Sat Jul 14, 2018 2:31 pm

So, what happens to Kadeem Allen and Abdel Nader???

Some look at Nader as a goner, I am not so sure about that. I watched the Summer League game the other night, they had Kadeem Allen as a player looking for a job on any team, not the Celtics. Nader, on the other hand, has been unable to play, and I have not heard
much negativity surrounding him. Tommy seems to like him alot. I think he will end up catching on with someone, somewhere, but not here.
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by beat on Sat Jul 14, 2018 2:39 pm

These guys are all way down on the list. As long as our better players stay healthy I believe only Semi will come closest to getting any meaningful rotation minutes.

But as we all know health is never a given.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by dboss on Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:02 pm

RosalieTCeltics wrote:So, what happens to Kadeem Allen and Abdel Nader???

Some look at Nader as a goner, I am not so sure about that. I watched the Summer League game the other night, they had Kadeem Allen as a player looking for a job on any team, not the Celtics.  Nader, on the other hand, has been unable to play, and I have not heard
much negativity surrounding him. Tommy seems to like him alot.  I think he will end up catching on with someone, somewhere, but not here.

Rosalie, second round picks can turn into really good players but more often than not they have limited skills to impact the game.

Nadar and Allen are two guys that are unlikely to be second string rotation players.  They are 3rd stringers and as such future roster upgrades are likely to push them out of the door.  The Celtics can retain Nader maybe but it all depends on how much Bird will cost and whether or not Boston is able to retain Smart at the QO amount.  Allen can remain on a two-way contract for another year if they want to keep him.

Boston has to make a decision on Nadar soon.  Otherwise his $1,618,250 contract becomes fully guaranteed.  So if Marcus accepts the QO at $6,053,718 and they keep Nader at $1,618,250 the total would be $7,671,968.  According to Spotrac, Boston has $8,620,124 below the tax line.  That leaves $948,156  to sign Bird.

I do not know if that will work.  The question that I have relates to players with 2-way contracts.  If a player played under a 2-way contract for a year does that count to  years of service in the NBA.  If it does than Boston would have to offer a veteran minimum salary of $1,349,383 to Bird based on 1 year of service.  And they do not have enough space to do that and remain under the tax line.  However if his 2-way contract does not count as service he would have zero year and qualify for a vet minimum salary of $838,464.

If Boston cuts Nadar they will have to pay him $450,000,  They would definitely be able to sign Bird if they release Nader.

Everything however is contingent upon Smart signing his QO.
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by gyso on Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:16 pm

We are all playing dominoes and Ainge is playing chess.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by kdp59 on Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:33 pm

Bird should probably get a roster spot over Nader this coming season, IMO.

however that may depend on Danny trying to stay under the tax line one more year.

we are about $8.6 M under the tax line right now

even IF Smart signs the QO at around $6M, there is not going to be anything beyond Minimum for Bird and still stay below the tax line.

unless, Danny can find a team to take on Yabusele and his wide butt (along with his $2.6M salary).

if I were GM right now and I was trying to stay under the tax line:

I would hope that Smart signs the QO.

sign Bird to a 2or 3 years minimum deal

release Nader to get down to 15 players

and try to find some one to take on Yabusles' final year

take us down to 14 players, so we had the room (and about $3.5 M ) to add a vet player late in the year if needed.


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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by dboss on Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:39 pm

gyso wrote:We are all playing dominoes and Ainge is playing chess.

more like checkers.

Do you have any ideas about how years of service for 2-way players is calculated? Just curious as it may help me better understand options for Nader and Bird.

My assumptions are based on a belief that Danny the Chess player does not want his team to be across the tax line.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by dboss on Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:52 pm

[quote="kdp59"]Bird should probably get a roster spot over Nader this coming season, IMO.

AGREE

however that may depend on Danny trying to stay under the tax line one more year.

AGREE

we are about $8.6 M under the tax line right now

AGREE

even IF Smart signs the QO at around $6M, there is not going to be anything beyond Minimum for Bird and still stay below the tax line.

YOU AGREE WITH ME

unless, Danny can find a team to take on Yabusele and his wide butt (along with his $2.6M salary).

DISAGREE THAT CELTICS ARE READY TO MOVE YABU

if I were GM right now and I was trying to stay under the tax line:

AGREE

I would hope that Smart signs the QO.

AGREE

sign Bird to a 2or 3 years minimum deal

AGREE

release Nader to get down to 15 players

AGREE

and try to find some one to take on Yabusles' final year

DISAGREE, WHILE I DO NOT THINK HE IS THAT GOOD HE HAS ONLY PLAYED FOR ONE YEAR. WOULD KEEP HIM AT LEAST FOR ONE MORE YEAR

take us down to 14 players, so we had the room (and about $3.5 M )  to add a vet player late in the year if needed.

WE DO NOT NEED TO ADD A VETERAN PLAYER PER SAY.


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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by dboss on Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:23 pm

Allen to be released. Celts will sign another player to 2-way deal. Likely Martin.
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by dboss on Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:26 pm

https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2018/07/14/report-boston-celtics-to-release-kadeem-allen/
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by dboss on Sun Jul 15, 2018 9:40 pm

Allen has been waived
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by bobheckler on Sun Jul 15, 2018 11:28 pm

Gary Washburn
Gary Washburn @GwashburnGlobe
about 1 hour ago
Semi Ojeleye's contract is guaranteed for next season in another no-brainer move. #Celtics had until today to make any move.



bob


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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by NYCelt on Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:59 am

Just my thoughts/guesses as we get a few nights to sleep in our own beds, before the last two weeks of baseball, and I get a chance to post on something bigger than my phone.

Ojeleye = a reserve who can be counted on for some defense, but isn't going to become quite the 3-point threat he was in college.

Yabusele = A good euro league career ahead of him. He'll do well there.

Bird = Sticking around another year as long-term status of Smart, Rozier, and then Irving are determined.

Nader = Like Yabusele, a nice career overseas awaits.
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by cowens/oldschool on Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:01 am

Been rooting hard for Yabu, but he didn’t show me enough in SL, thought he was underwhelming at best, could not defend or rebound good enough in SL, which is does not bode well for when the real players show up.
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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by KyleCleric on Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:21 am

Height was clearly an issue in the summer league. It was too bad not to see Yabusele/Martin/Uthoff next to Williams.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by wideclyde on Mon Jul 16, 2018 1:58 pm

With summer league now over, I have to agree with Cowens thought on Yabusele. He had an opportunity to impress and was (like Cowens wrote) very underwhelming.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

Post by gyso on Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:38 pm

KyleCleric wrote:Height was clearly an issue in the summer league. It was too bad not to see Yabusele/Martin/Uthoff next to Williams.

Williams was our only player listed as a center. In the last game we started 4 players who were listed as forwards and one guard.

So I agree, height was clearly an issue.

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Re: Olejeye and Yabusele?

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