It's Time To Wake Up

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It's Time To Wake Up

Post by fierce on Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:39 pm

The Celtics are way too dependent on the 3-point shot.

Against the Pacers, they only shot 9 FTs.

Indy attempted 25 FTs.

This is not healthy.

Clearly the Celts are a flawed team.

When it was crunch time, Hayward was sitting on the bench.

This is what I mean by having too many good players and not enough great ones.

Usually it's Brown or Hayward sitting on the bench in crunch time.
Both Brown and Hayward are very good players.
But only 5 can play at all times.

If the goal is to be playing in June, something has to change.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by fierce on Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:46 pm

Also, Celts had 88 total FG attempts.

Only 42 FGs were from inside the 3pt line.

That means Celts attempted 46 3-pointers.

For a team as loaded and as deep as this Celtics team, they're underachieving.

Every game is a struggle.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by dboss on Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:02 pm

Fierce Hayward was 2-10 and 0-5 from deep.  He was in the game for the last play...the pass that was stolen by Olidipo.  It was one of those mis-direction plays, very difficult to execute a cross court pass.

I agree that the Celtics need to get to the line.  I do not like the volume of 3 point shots.

6-3 is a solid start.  The sky is not falling.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by bobc33 on Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:05 pm

Maybe we should fire Brad Stevens?  Tyronn Lue is available.......

Can I change my screen name to FireBrad?  Matty, any advice here?
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by dboss on Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:18 pm

bobc33 wrote:Maybe we should fire Brad Stevens?  Tyronn Lue is available.......

Can I change my screen name to FireBrad?  Matty, any advice here?

Maybe we need to rebuild again. Why wait for another 73 games. Pitino is looking for work
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by fierce on Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:47 pm

dboss wrote:Fierce Hayward was 2-10 and 0-5 from deep.  He was in the game for the last play...the pass that was stolen by Olidipo.  It was one of those mis-direction plays, very difficult to execute a cross court pass.

I agree that the Celtics need to get to the line.  I do not like the volume of 3 point shots.

6-3 is a solid start.  The sky is not falling.

dboss

How can Hayward and Brown play well when they're not getting consistent minutes?

Right now Morris is the most consistent Celtic.

Brown and Hayward are battling for playing time.
That's not good.
Both players will not get a rhythm because they're always in and out of the game.

Smart is and should be Kyrie's backup.

Rozier wants to be a starter so clearly he'll be gone in the summer.

Since all you guys don't want Jimmy Butler, Celts are better off trading 2 for 1.

We need a true SG like JJ Redick.

Celts are better off trading Rozier and Brown for someone like Redick.

Something has to change.
Celts can't keep going on like this.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by fierce on Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:51 pm

It's called addition by subtraction.

If the Celts are going to shoot a lot of 3s then they're better off with a true SG.

In the playoffs and finals, the star players are going to get 40 or close to 40 minutes per game.

Having 10 very good players will not be an advantage in May or June when the rotation gets shorter.

The earlier the Celts make a move the better because it gives the team more time to gel.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by bobc33 on Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:51 pm

dboss wrote:
bobc33 wrote:Maybe we should fire Brad Stevens?  Tyronn Lue is available.......

Can I change my screen name to FireBrad?  Matty, any advice here?

Maybe we need to rebuild again.  Why wait for another 73 games.  Pitino is looking for work

Pitino would work.  Jason Kidd is out there also I think.  I’m guessing the players have tuned out Brad.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by dboss on Sat Nov 03, 2018 11:15 pm

fierce wrote:
dboss wrote:Fierce Hayward was 2-10 and 0-5 from deep.  He was in the game for the last play...the pass that was stolen by Olidipo.  It was one of those mis-direction plays, very difficult to execute a cross court pass.

I agree that the Celtics need to get to the line.  I do not like the volume of 3 point shots.

6-3 is a solid start.  The sky is not falling.

dboss

How can Hayward and Brown play well when they're not getting consistent minutes?

Right now Morris is the most consistent Celtic.

Brown and Hayward are battling for playing time.
That's not good.
Both players will not get a rhythm because they're always in and out of the game.

Smart is and should be Kyrie's backup.

Rozier wants to be a starter so clearly he'll be gone in the summer.

Since all you guys don't want Jimmy Butler, Celts are better off trading 2 for 1.

We need a true SG like JJ Redick.

Celts are better off trading Rozier and Brown for someone like Redick.

Something has to change.
Celts can't keep going on like this.

Brown is playing around the same minutes as he did last year before he had to play more when the injury bug hit. Hayward is still on a minutes restriction. Get your facts straight.

You just do not understand that it will take some time for the team to find their chemistry. So now you want JJ Redick for Brown and Rozier. What the hell is wrong with you?

Are you a Bot? Stop trying to play GM. It is not a good look for you. Let the team work through things.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by cowens/oldschool on Sun Nov 04, 2018 12:45 am

How old is JJ Redick?
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by kdp59 on Sun Nov 04, 2018 6:53 am

JJ Redick.......

yep, hes the answer.

come one man, I mean I know Rondo's not here to beat on anymore, but the Butler trade stuff is old now.

Look, I WANTED the team to trade for Butler back when he was with Chicago. But once Danny signed Hayward , that was off the table.

you CAN make a valid argument that Butler is better than Hayward for sure. But both won't be playing together any time soon.

Redick...REALY?
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by gyso on Sun Nov 04, 2018 8:10 am

Redick-u-lous.

It's time to let this go . . .

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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by cowens/oldschool on Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:12 am

Maybe we can steal Gail Goodrich?
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by Phil Pressey on Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:17 am

Irving needs to start scoring more points. I said it on the game thread and Tommy said it in the post game.

K.I. is sort of average at best as a traditional point guard. It's a shame he choked on the layup but he was extremely clutch on the other shots. It looked like a win. Sorry if I jinxed it.

Ojeleye and Theis were the odd men out until injuries. Brad is going with basically nine guys. This idea of a roster crunch is overblown. Should Danny consolidate to seven good players instead of eleven, so that when there are more inevitable injuries and the need to pamper guys, losses will pile up?

I agree with the above that the sky is not falling. 6-3 is not too shabby. Give these guys a chance.

Hayward looks great one game and a scrub the next. Kyrie is trying to be the anti-LeBron everyone matters leader but his skills are in scoring. He is a bad player or average at best for everything else. That is what's going on. Once he accepts that he is in the Bradley/Isaiah role to score, he will look better.

They are clearly overdoing it with the threes. Everyone has noticed that and seemingly agree. Tommy was correct to take Kyrie to the woodshed for becoming soft. Maybe he needs to do the same with Brad Stevens and teach him a few things.

The irony is that this team has the legs and depth to pile up a lot of easy layups and attacks at the rim.

Marcus Smart has the right idea. If the ball isn't dropping from three, stop shooting them.

Horford stopped taking them and looked a lot better. Taking this many threes is a stupid strategy.

Rozier can't be traded because he is insurance for Kyrie. And Rozier doesn't have to go anywhere because he is a restricted free agent. Morris has accepted being a backup, so maybe Rozier can too or Kyrie will be the one traded.

Ainge is cold-blooded. Irving has made it difficult for Danny to trade him but I could see Danny doing that. Or just bring them all back and pay a big luxury tax for at least one year. It depends on how the season plays out.

The sample size is too small.

What Fierce is doing is called putting the cart in front of the horse.

Danny is obviously less likely to trade anyone if the team wins.

There is no letter grade yet. If this was education, it would be called an incomplete. If it was a future scheduling decision, it would be phrased as to be determined.

Hayward lost that game. I can't blame Kyrie although he needed to score more points last night. Great minds think alike. Myself and Tommy said the same thing without knowing what the other thought.

I expect a lot more from so-called supermax players. Isaiah was too tiny but at least he could play some Rondo ball in addition to scoring. Kyrie needs to wake up or history shows he will be the one traded. But I think he will, so please don't yell at me for mentioning the possibility. I liked Larkin for backup pg. Smart, Rozier, Brown and Larkin or a Rondo would work as a rotation. The money going to Kyrie could be used to fortify elsewhere. But I want it to work out. I'm just not very happy so far with the Big Three and Two Phenoms, but I don't want to get hysterical too soon like Fierce. There's plenty of season left for all of us to become cranky and bitter. Why rush it? Very Happy

Kyrie to me sometimes seems so pretentious and acts entitled. Sorry, it's called an opinion. It's as if he is saying to everyone look how great I am at being humble. I just see him not doing enough of what his skill set provides and he seems to make really bad turnovers every game.

He got switched out for defense at the end. What supermax players does that happen to? It's not so easy imho to say Rozier is definitely gone and Kyrie stays. Maybe everyone stays. There is not enough information. They haven't even played ten games. Let's see how the C's do for the rest of the road trip. If they win every game or just lose one more, then there are probably no worries. If the C's beat Denver, everything is back on track.

We are supposed to be some of the most old-school knowledgeable fans from any city. Hayward obviously needs time. Horford is not someone to depend on for offense. Obviously Brown and Tatum are having growing pains.

No one likes losses but it is still extremely early in the season.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by Phil Pressey on Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:27 am

I understand Kyrie probably won't be traded because he wouldn't be worth much as a rental. But maybe he could be added to the Sacramento pick and other players. Long-term I don't think he is guaranteed to remain indefinitely. Danny can be unpredictable like that.

I want Kyrie to succeed but I remember how Isaiah Thomas turned out. One never knows is my point. I like how Rozier is safe with the basketball. Smart seems to be better this year. Brown and Tatum looked like they would have huge games last night but it never happened. It was just one game. You can't win them all.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by cowens/oldschool on Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:40 am

Smarts fg% and 3 point% are at record lows for him....
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by Phil Pressey on Sun Nov 04, 2018 11:29 am

cowens/oldschool wrote:Smarts fg% and 3 point% are at record lows for him....

That's true, but he is only averaging 4.8 shots. Some of those were probably half court heaves or otherwise a hail mary. His assists to turnover number is at an all-time best 6.4 to 2.2 with 1.9 steals per 36.

He did shoot around 80% free throws over two years. He had multiple personal issues last year. Morris is in a better place and it shows. I hope Smart can defy odds and become a shooter. He does get cringe-worthy at times but his stats in other areas are impressive.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by dboss on Sun Nov 04, 2018 11:44 am

Phil

Most players come in the box with assembly instructions.

Kyrie Irving has a no assembly required notification.

You say that he needs to score more.  From what i can see that is exactly what he is doing.  He has taken over as our #1 scorer at 17.9 PPG, he is also averaging 5.3 assists and 4.8 rebounds and it looks to me like his shooting is back to what we expect from him.  He is now shooting 38% from deep.  The Celtics are not going to trade Kyrie Irving.  He has already committed to resigning with us and I do not think he will go back on his word.

A few weeks back Kyrie did an interview and discussed the need for him to find a good balance between being a scorer or being a distributor.  He is acutely aware of his responsibilities on this team.  He said the team will figure things out.  I agree with his assessment.

There should be no shame at all if Boston goes through a series of offensive/defensive substitutions down the stretch.  There is no shame in having Marcus Smart come in to check a player.  As a matter of fact that is called good coaching.  This was actually discussed in more detail here on the subject who will be in the game during crunch time.

Too many fans out there trying to micro-analyze an insignificant sample size.

I suggest that fans should sit back and relax and enjoy Celtics basketball.


Last edited by dboss on Sun Nov 04, 2018 1:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by wideclyde on Sun Nov 04, 2018 12:13 pm

If the Cs continue to win 6 out of every 9 games they will finish with 54 wins.

No need to panic just yet as 54 wins will certainly secure a playoff spot. And with 73 games remaining I think we should all trust Coach Stevens to figure out what is working and make adjustments from what might not be working so well.

Plus, it is not the usual problem of finding enough talent or depth, but rather just fitting all the talent together to make the team we all expect. Banner #18

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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by mrkleen09 on Sun Nov 04, 2018 8:54 pm

The league is changing. Some of you a stuck in the past.

At the current rate, this is going to be a LONG SEASON out here. Like the same broken record played over and over, ad nauseum. It is already taking the shine off of this place....something that makes me sad.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by RosalieTCeltics on Mon Nov 05, 2018 2:45 pm

Stick around awhile some of you, you will eat your words that Butler is better than Hayward. I would like to see you come back from an injury like his and jump on the court and be the same guy he was before he got hurt. This whole topic is beginning to wear on me big time. Gordon Hayward is a much better all around ball player, Butler is a team buster.

Did you see that Butler told Minnesota he would let them know when he would play back to back games and took himself out of the lineup. He is a loser, period. If I was Minnesota I would deal him to the worst team in the league and let him prove to the world just how big an ass he is. He will never win anything.

As far as Hayward is concerned, this is what, the 9th game of the season, Brad will deal with this the right way, I have no doubt about that. And NO, we don't want another coach!!!!! Funny guys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by NYCelt on Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:00 pm

RosalieTCeltics wrote:Stick around awhile some of you, you will eat your words that Butler is better than Hayward.  I would like to see you come back from an injury like his and jump on the court and be the same guy he was before he got hurt.  This whole topic is beginning to wear on me big time.  Gordon Hayward is a much better all around ball player, Butler is a team buster.  

Did you see that Butler told Minnesota he would let them know when he would play back to back games and took himself out of the lineup.  He is a loser, period.  If I was Minnesota I would deal him to the worst team in the league and let him prove to the world just how big an ass he is.  He will never win anything.  

As far as Hayward is concerned, this is what, the 9th game of the season, Brad will deal with this the right way, I have no doubt about that.  And NO, we don't want another coach!!!!! Funny guys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think Rosalie is right.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by Phil Pressey on Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:30 pm

Convivial to one person means doublespeak to another.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by fierce on Mon Nov 05, 2018 11:17 pm

How many more losses before you guys realize this Celtics team is flawed?
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

Post by fierce on Mon Nov 05, 2018 11:22 pm

So much for the #1 defense.

Guys, time to wake up.

Today's NBA is about scoring.
Gone are the days where great teams were just averaging 90+ points per game.

If we want to win in today's NBA, we can't be content with just being very good.
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Re: It's Time To Wake Up

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