Is Celtics’ Pursuit Of Anthony Davis Causing Kyrie Irving To Rethink Commitment?

The general consensus seems to be that signing Kyrie and getting AD are linked in a chicken and egg sort of way, i.e. getting AD locked up long term is the key to re-signing Irving, but AD won't commit unless KI is locked up long term. The article below considers another possibility, i.e. that Kyrie wants to be 'the man', and feels slighted by Danny's man-crush on AD. Probably BS, but Kyrie is definitely a different type of dude, with his own way of seeing things; he could have avoided all this rampant hand-waving by simply responding to questions about his commitment by saying something like "I already addressed this so we could just focus on this season"....

Anyway, here is the link and the article:

https://nesn.com/2019/02/is-celtics-pursuit-of-anthony-davis-causing-kyrie-irving-to-rethink-commitment/


Perhaps Kyrie Irving wasn’t lying when he said he “wanted to be the man.”

The star point guard requested a trade from the Cleveland Cavaliers in the summer of 2017 reportedly in order to escape the shadow of LeBron James and be the alpha on his own team, eventually being dealt to the Boston Celtics.

Irving has seemed frustrated in his role of leader during his second season with Boston, as the young Celtics have not lived up to their lofty expectations and the star point guard has been visibly disappointed at the up-and-down nature of the season. The 26-year-old verbally committed to re-sign with the Celtics before the season started, but he has walked back his commitment recently.

While some have speculated Irving’s cold feet stem from his frustration with being a leader, ESPN’s Brian Windhorst has a different theory. It’s been no secret the Celtics are interested in acquiring Anthony Davis from the New Orleans Pelicans, and Windhorst thinks it’s possible Danny Ainge’s infatuation with the star big man has upset Irving, making him believe Boston doesn’t see him as the “A1A player” he views himself as.

The ESPN insider divulged his theory on Jason McIntyre’s FOX Sports Radio show. (Once again, this is just a theory, not a report.)

“The Kyrie that I know – again, he’s a strange guy — he wants to be the A1A alpha dog on a team. And, this is pure speculation, part of the reason why I think he’s backing off of committing to Boston, I suspect it’s because he’s not thrilled that Boston is all excited about Anthony Davis,” Windhorst told McIntyre.

“This is a guy who had a meltdown when he didn’t get the last play of the game called for him a couple of weeks ago. The reason he bolted on LeBron — a team that had just played in three straight Finals and won a championship is because he wanted to be the guy in the center of the universe … One of the things he’s done this year, he’s put himself on a pedestal with the Celtics young players and said listen, ‘I’m up here. You guys are down there.’ He’s even called Lebron and said, ‘now that I’m a star with everyone orbiting around me, I know how hard it is, I feel bad for you.’

“Part of the reason why Kyrie is having a little bit of a freak out right now is because the reality the Celtics wouldn’t consider him the A1AAAA guy. Predicting how he may feel about them is very difficult. The Celtics’ dream is to get Kyrie Irving and Anthony Davis together. They have a relationship and it seems possible … but maybe somebody needs to ask the question: does Kyrie Irving really want to play with Anthony Davis?”

Davis and Irving together would give the Celtics a one-two punch that would be among the best in the league, but it appears the C’s might want to find out what Irving really wants before they try and sell the farm for Davis.

Hi,
Thanks for the article.
A couple things to consider.
First. I doubt that there's a GM in NBA that wouldn't have a man-crash on AD considering:
- AD is the best big in the league
- AD is 25 yo
- you have the best assets to acquire AD
Second. The idea that KI isn't thrilled about AD coming to Boston kind of contradicts the well established trend that all super-stars want to play with a buddy super-star.

AK

Wish we had a filter I could check off and just auto ignore all the crap until July.

IMO
Kyrie isnt going anywhere and will sign a big extension.
Jayson Tatum isnt going anywhere and will be the next Celtics player to have his number retired.
DA will use his draft picks to amass an incredible team that will have a 4-5 year window as big time contenders.

sinus007 wrote:Hi,
Thanks for the article.
A couple things to consider.
First. I doubt that there's a GM in NBA that wouldn't have a man-crash on AD considering:
- AD is the best big in the league
- AD is 25 yo
- you have the best assets to acquire AD
Second. The idea that KI isn't thrilled about AD coming to Boston kind of contradicts the well established trend that all super-stars want to play with a buddy super-star.

AK

Agree on both points....I guess the author is at least partially basing his "hypothesis" on the fact that Kyrie has already shown reluctance to play with one superstar (Lebron) and his stated desire to be "the man"

This only peripherally related, but I saw this article from Ric Bucher where KD explains why superstars might not want to play with Lebron:

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2808589-why-doesnt-anyone-want-to-play-with-lebron-anymore


It had to be Cleveland. That was why LeBron James had to escape the first time to Miami to finally play with two other stars in Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh. Which stars in their primes would have left to join him in Northeast Ohio? No one signs up for that if they have other options. Throw in the fear of being stranded there if LeBron left, and it was simply too much for any top-shelf talent to bear.

LeBron leaving the first time allowed the Cavaliers to reload via the draft with two No. 1 picks. But they traded one of them (for Kevin Love), and the other (Kyrie Irving) decided he didn't want to deal with the LeBron limbo either. Looking at yet another relatively bare cupboard and knowing all too well the bleak prospects of filling it, LeBron bolted for a team and a town that sell themselves.

So now that he's in balmy Los Angeles on a four-year deal—the longest he's signed since he went to Miami—why have we seen and heard about more stars being reluctant to join forces than those eager to ride with the train conductor who has punched tickets to eight consecutive NBA Finals?

As it turns out, based on conversations with more than a dozen players, there are quite a few reasons. Most obvious, perhaps, is the fact that everyone, no matter how accomplished, becomes a role player next to LeBron.

"If you've got LeBron, you've got to make it all about LeBron," Tyson Chandler said a few days before he became LeBron's teammate in early November. "You've got to be able to [coexist] with that and fit with that. Who are you, where are you in your career, and how do you fit in? It's a sacrifice, but it's a sacrifice for winning."

That's perfectly fine for someone such as Chandler, a 36-year-old, rim-protecting veteran who jumped at the chance to escape Phoenix and take his curtain call with his hometown Lakers next to (arguably still) the most physically gifted player in the league, even as he's closing in on his 34th birthday.

When it comes to players in their primes, though, there have been more "no thank yous" than "sign me ups" to this point. Paul George opted to stay in Oklahoma City this summer after previously talking about how much he would love playing for the Lakers. Jimmy Butler, in his trade demand to the Minnesota Timberwolves before he was moved to the Philadelphia 76ers, reportedly had the Knicks, Nets and Clippers on his list—three of the four teams in New York or L.A. with potential maximum-salary cap room next season. Rumors are that Raptors forward Kawhi Leonard, who similarly forced his way out of San Antonio and has allegedly professed a desire to play close to his boyhood home in Riverside, California, is more interested in the Clippers than in the Lakers.

To be fair, when it became evident James intended to leave the Cavaliers a second time this summer, young stars such as 76ers center Joel Embiid posted social media pleas for him to join their teams. Was that Embiid simply being a jester—not for the first time—or showing respect, all the while knowing there wasn't any real chance of LeBron actually responding? Who knows? All that doesn't change the fact that one All-Star (George) who could have joined him didn't and at least one other (Butler) never so much as expressed an interest.

Warriors forward Kevin Durant, who has been more ambiguous about his potential free-agent plans for next summer, said he understands why certain stars might balk at joining forces with LeBron.

"It depends on what kind of player you are," Durant said. "If you're Kyle Korver, then it makes sense. Because Kyle Korver in Atlanta was the bulk of the offense, and he's not a No. 1 option at all, not even close. So his talents benefit more from a guy who can pass and penetrate and get him open.

"If you're a younger player like a Kawhi, trying to pair him with LeBron James doesn't really make sense. Kawhi enjoys having the ball in his hands, controlling the offense, dictating the tempo with his post-ups; it's how he plays the game. A lot of young players are developing that skill. They don't need another guy."

But LeBron may need that at this stage of his career. After Irving forced a trade to the Boston Celtics two summers ago, James dragged the Cavs to the Finals for a fourth straight time but was swept by the Warriors. If he hopes to compete with the Warriors again, it is clear he needs help, especially now being on the Golden State side of the bracket. The challenge of having to knock off a three-time champion, especially if the Warriors can keep their core mostly intact, also muddies the appeal for an incoming star. He would have to sacrifice his exalted status without even reasonable assurance he's going to be in the Finals, much less win a ring.

"If I was a free agent, I would have to consider everything," veteran swingman Trevor Ariza said. "But my role is different than PG and Kawhi. They ask them to do different things than they ask of me. Guys similar to [LeBron], why would they want to play with somebody who does all the same things? I can see why they would want to play elsewhere."

The Lakers structured their salary cap to make sure they would have space next summer for a maximum-salaried player—whether he comes via free agency or trade. League sources say that when James became convinced Irving couldn't be persuaded to stay in Cleveland, he suggested to the Cavs front office that it deal Irving to the Blazers for All-Star point guard Damian Lillard. The Cavs never called the Blazers, but James' interest has led to speculation about the Lakers trading for Lillard.


"I love where I am," Lillard said. "I play for a great organization. I'm not looking for nothing. I think we'd complement each other well, but the only way that ever happens is if my team decides they don't want me no more. I'm trying to build something here."

Whether it's because newly minted stars such as Victor Oladipo and Jayson Tatum took LeBron to seven games or the Warriors swept him, the up-and-coming class of stars doesn't seem intimidated by him. They might respect him, but they don't fear him.

"A lot of people are going back to thinking, 'I can possibly be ... as good as him,'" Spurs veteran small forward Rudy Gay said. "And sometimes when people think of playing with someone like that, they feel it hinders them, maybe, from getting to that point because he takes up so much of [the] opportunities—and rightfully so, because he's been great for so many years."

Leonard has steadfastly refused to discuss what he might do if he becomes a free agent next summer, but he doesn't view James as some sort of measuring stick.

"What else do I have to prove?" he asks. "He beat me in the Finals; we came back and beat him." So you don't have anything else to prove? "Just when we do play him, try to win the game. That's it."

Other players at this point, though, may not be willing to trade their stardom for a chance to win a championship with LeBron because it would also mean winning one for LeBron. As one scout said, "Some stars are looking at it and saying, 'Why do I want to add to his legacy?'"

That is indeed the conundrum. None of the players approached for this story, both stars and supporting cast types, resented that James' stardom "sucks up all the oxygen in the room," as one Eastern Conference vice president put it. But there is little doubt they would have to transform themselves and accept lesser roles than they enjoy now if they joined the Lakers. Bosh and Love were established All-Stars before they hooked up with LeBron, but the perception of them shifted from franchise cornerstones to, at times, weak links in James' quests for another ring. They evolved into stretch 4s with far fewer shots and touches primarily to create space for James to operate. It earned them championships, but the perception remains they were the beneficiaries of being James' teammates.

"Kevin Love, he had to totally change his game to fit, to be a shooter," Durant said. "Which, I think, he deserves way more credit for switching his game. Bosh, same way. LeBron is a player that needs to play with guys that already know how they play the game—and shooters. Like, young players that are still developing, it's always going to be hard because he demands the ball so much, he demands control of the offense and he creates for everybody."

Durant also noted that the suffocating media attention around James doesn't help, either.

"So much hype comes from being around LeBron from other people," Durant said. "He has so many fanboys in the media. Even the beat writers just fawn over him. I'm like, we're playing basketball here, and it's not even about basketball at certain points. So I get why anyone wouldn't want to be in that environment because it's toxic. Especially when the attention is bullshit attention, fluff. It's not LeBron's fault at all; it's just the fact you have so many groupies in the media that love to hang on every word. Just get out of the way and let us play basketball."

What comes with that is the knowledge that if the team wins, it will be credited mostly to James; and if the team loses, it will be blamed on everyone around him.

"It's the LeBron Effect," Raptors guard Kyle Lowry says. "He puts a lot of pressure on you, but he takes a lot of pressure off of you, too. You know what you're getting. He's earned that, but he's human. If you're a strong enough personality, you can handle it."

Ariza had another suggestion: "The media should change the narrative. Make that superstar be a superstar." In other words, don't automatically blame the supporting cast when a team falls short. Sometimes it's the superstar who fell short.

That type of scrutiny is amplified by being in L.A., said Spurs forward Pau Gasol, who won two championships with the Lakers.

"If you succeed with the Lakers, you will be loved forever," Gasol said. "But there's also tension and pressure and drama like nowhere else. There are dozens of media outlets that are constantly looking for a story. It depends on who you are and what you're made of. But if you succeed, it's sweet. There's nothing like it."

If. That seems to be the operative word. If a free-agent star pays the price for a seat on LeBron's coattails, will the ride take him where he wants to go? It's an if that's never been bigger. LeBron is now in the land where dreams come true. Just not all of them.

mrkleen09 wrote:Wish we had a filter I could check off and just auto ignore all the crap until July.

IMO
Kyrie isnt going anywhere and will sign a big extension.
Jayson Tatum isnt going anywhere and will be the next Celtics player to have his number retired.
DA will use his draft picks to amass an incredible team that will have a 4-5 year window as big time contenders.

I agree with points one and two. I will hold off on agreeing with point 3 because I still think Danny could put together the best package for Davis without including Tatum. That being said, if point three is what happens, I am fine with that.

Kyrie wants to play with another superstar period.  If you recall he made comments about Boston needing a veteran because basically young guys are not dependable.  He had to back off those comments because they were counter-productive and did not exemplify the  so-called leadership that he embraced.

Danny is sitting back and waiting for the end of the season to engage in talks with NOLA.  My guess is that a deal will be made before the NBA draft.  Danny does not want to part with Tatum.  No one is mentioning Marcus Smart but at this point in the season he has played better at both ends than any player on this team.  If Boston pushes to keep Tatum then Jaylen Brown will be gone and NOLA will want an extra first round pick to make the deal.

Least we remember that Danny wanted Winslow enough to ante up 3 or 4 first rounders.  In other words Danny will hang off the side of a cliff to get a better view.

One of the interesting by-products of this AD MESS is the devaluation of the Lakers roster.  They missed on George one year and then on Leonard last year so now they are  desperate.  

Offering up the entire (entire) roster of young players and first round picks is going on a fool's errand.

If we bust up this team for a one year two playoffs for one player we better not give up the amount of players the Lakers are offering. What are we going to do if Kyrie keeps taking every other game off?