Karma IS a bitch

Hi,
Sorry, I know it's a Celtics forum but I couldn't help it.
LeSchmuck, formerly known as LeBron, ate his foot again: lost to the lowly Clips. The very next day after talking karma trying to rub it in to his former team mates after they lost to LA.

AK

Man child cannot keep from being an idiot!

The clippers? duh...............( but really they have a couple of good players )

Not only the loss but I heard that the mouth also sprained his ankle late in the game. Double bad karma if so.

Here is the bit about the ankle

From the start, the Clippers repelled all of Miami’s threats, the most dramatic coming with 6:37 to play.

James sprained his left ankle on a drive to the basket when he got blocked and his momentum carried him out of bounds past the baseline. He hobbled back onto the court wincing while the Heat still had the ball and sank a 3-pointer from the left corner, drawing them within two. After a timeout, James returned to the game.

“There’s no damage, I got an X-ray after the game,” James said. “The doctor told me it’s day-to-day so I’ll see how I feel tomorrow. I don’t have to be a hero in the regular season if I’m not close to 100 percent.”



beat

According to reports, MRIs revealed nothing other than an ankle sprain. LeDouche says he's "day-to-day". Day-to-day what? Flirting with delusions of Godhood?

In other LeBoring news, "The Boy who would be King", Eric Spoelstra, is saying LeBoob may play some center, since they don't really have one.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2011-01-11/lebron-james-could-see-increased-time-at-center

On offense, sure, he'll run away from any center in the league. On defense? Call him "LePancake".

If he doesn't pick up a couple of fouls just when he's playing 5, then the referreeing in this league will really look foolish. That, or every legitimate center in the league needs to check themselves in for rehab at Pete Newell's Big Man Camp.

bob

.

Man if during the Cleve/San Antone finals a few years back someone from the future (lets say Bobheck) would have pulled me aside and deeply explained how this kid and his situation were going to turn out I would never never have believed it.

What a circus.

As someone who actually follows the Clippers (I know, I know), I thought I'd chime in.

I know the Clippers are the league's longest running joke, but they've won eight of 11 after a dreadful start (they were 1-13 at one point) and are a merely bad 13-24 now. Everyone knows Griffin is a beast, but Eric Gordon is playing at an elite level (23.6 pts, 4.5 ast, 3.3 reb, 1.2 stl), and this kid DeAndre Jordan didn't have great stats last night, but he's starting to "get it" and is a factor at center -- these are his stats from the four games prior to the Miami game:

Pts Reb Blk
14 5 7
6 12 6
14 20 6
9 13 3

Those are eye-popping numbers for a kid who in two prior seasons specialized in fouls. He's benefited tremendously from playing time since Kaman's been out. He's using his physical gifts well and playing with confidence.

They're not deep and have been dealing with injuries, but if they can get healthy and get production out of Baron Davis, they're a dangerous team.

During the "big 3" era, the Celtics are 2-2 versus the Clips, so I'm not sure how much folks should get on the Heat for losing to them, but the timing after LeBron's "karma" tweet is certainly delicious.

Outside

Looks Like Blake can flat play.

Whats yer take on the "king" outside?

Jeb,

LeBron? What's my take on him?? As a basketball player from a skills and/or team perspective? Tweeter? Image builder? Decision-maker? Give me a little direction, or I might overload the forum's blather filter.

Outside

Sorry to leave my fellow board member hanging. I miss my dogs.

1. As a basketball player within his current team.
2. As a brand within the nba (from last years playoffs til now)
3. As a young black man and a human being within his country, profession and world.

Very interested to hear your take cuz you are I feel fair fair fair.

Jeb

Jeb,

I'll give it some thought and put something together. Say what you like, he is an interesting topic, in moderation at least.

Aren't dogs great?

As a basketball player, I cannot deny that he is a powerful, talented guy.
As the face of the NBA he is a disgrace. A selfish young man who thinks mostly of himself than anyone else. The way he left his teammates in Cleveland shows his true being. He had every right to leave Cleveland, however, the way he did it was so wrong. As a young, black man.........if I had a youngster, he is not the person I would want my son to look up to. I would hand him a book, and tell him to read about how it was years ago, when, in the l960's the players had so much to deal with. What would he have done? Russell makes him look like a fool.

So...for the most part, I will admit that I am glad LeBaby is not representing my team and is not the face of the Boston Celtics. He would never last here in Boston, we are too smart to put up with his garbage.

Outside wrote:Jeb,

I'll give it some thought and put something together. Say what you like, he is an interesting topic, in moderation at least.

Aren't dogs great?

I think dogs are great, and my two are rooting for Jeb! The guy on the left has had some serious health issues, but he is back to being in good health and thriving.

Outside wrote:As someone who actually follows the Clippers (I know, I know), I thought I'd chime in.

I know the Clippers are the league's longest running joke, but they've won eight of 11 after a dreadful start (they were 1-13 at one point) and are a merely bad 13-24 now. Everyone knows Griffin is a beast, but Eric Gordon is playing at an elite level (23.6 pts, 4.5 ast, 3.3 reb, 1.2 stl), and this kid DeAndre Jordan didn't have great stats last night, but he's starting to "get it" and is a factor at center -- these are his stats from the four games prior to the Miami game:

Pts Reb Blk
14 5 7
6 12 6
14 20 6
9 13 3

Those are eye-popping numbers for a kid who in two prior seasons specialized in fouls. He's benefited tremendously from playing time since Kaman's been out. He's using his physical gifts well and playing with confidence.

They're not deep and have been dealing with injuries, but if they can get healthy and get production out of Baron Davis, they're a dangerous team.

During the "big 3" era, the Celtics are 2-2 versus the Clips, so I'm not sure how much folks should get on the Heat for losing to them, but the timing after LeBron's "karma" tweet is certainly delicious.

Outside

I've liked this kid since first hearing about him his rookie year,was one of Dannys big mistakes passing up this kid for JR Giddens,if we had drafted him,playing with KG and Perk he'd be even better.

cowens/oldschool wrote:I've liked this kid since first hearing about him his rookie year,was one of Dannys big mistakes passing up this kid for JR Giddens,if we had drafted him,playing with KG and Perk he'd be even better.

Cow,

That's a tough one. It would look like the better choice now, but it's not a sure thing yet that Jordan will play consistently well or continue to improve, although the signs are very good. He was considered a risk at the time he was drafted because of a questionable attitude, and before this season, he would've qualified as a bust. The most encouraging signs are that I believe he's developed a work ethic and he now acts like he belongs in the NBA. Add that to the physical gifts, and it can be fun to watch. But you're right -- assuming he would've developed on a similar track if drafted by the Celtics, he would be paying nice dividends now.

Outside

Jeb,

Here it comes, ready or not -- my thoughts on LeBron.

jeb wrote:1. As a basketball player within his current team.

He's still a work in progress. Despite all the me-ball that he specialized in at Cleveland and the beginning of this season, I do think he can be a team player. In that regard, going to Miami with Wade and Bosh could wind up being the best thing for him. The difference I see is that there wasn't anyone in Cleveland -- player, coach, management, or owner -- that he respected as an equal, so he constantly reverted to me-ball because there was no one else to rely on, no one else he respected as an equal.

In Miami, he respects Wade and even Bosh as players (I know Bosh isn't at the same level as Wade and LeBron, but he's better than anyone LeBron had in Cleveland). He respects Riley. I think, after the rough early start, that he probably has a growing respect for Spoelstra. All that means that he could become a player with a team mindset instead of thinking that he's the only guy who can really do anything when it counts. If he, Wade, and Bosh can become supremely talented role players within a team concept, Miami could be awfully good.

I see signs that may be possible, but it's too early to tell. It's not easy, but if you can, look past the circus surrounding his move to Miami and stupid stuff that gets said or tweeted or whatever by him or his friends, and solely look at him as a basketball player and them as a team. I've seen signs, especially on defense, that they can commit to playing as a unit. Early in the season, when they struggled, it seemed to be alternating isolations for LeBron and Wade, and the defense was Keystone Kops at times followed by frustration, but I don't see a lot of that now. I see a lot of player and ball movement on offense. I see confident passes between the three stars and from them to the other players (confident, in that the passer has confidence that the recipient can make a play).

I can't back any of this up with statistics. I looked at their assists during the losing streak and then after, and they are basically identical (over 19 a game, which is a little under the league average). It's just the impression I have in the portions of games I've watched them. It's not like I expect them to turn into the most unselfish team in the league, because that would to some degree be wasting their talents, their ability to use two players to individually overwhelm their defender. For Miami to become the best team they can be, they need to find a balance between the two -- playing team ball and exploiting the advantage they have individually with Wade and LeBron. If they get to the point that the defense doesn't know which they're doing and Wade and Lebron adapt on the fly to how the defense reacts, they could be an exceptional team.

But that's a lot of ifs. I've seen signs of this, not a convincing, sustained demonstration that they can do it. Although they look less vulnerable than they did at the start of the season, they still have weaknesses. They are as dependent as anyone, perhaps even more than most, on their key players staying healthy. And their ability to become that truly good team is highly dependent on LeBron becoming that supremely talented role player rather than "the king." Is he up to it? Can they do it? Let's see what happens when the rubber hits the road in the playoffs. Even then, I never expected them to win this year or even next; I always thought their best opportunity was in their third or fourth season together. (It is so rare for it all to come together in the first year like it did for the Celts in 2008.) We shall see.

jeb wrote:2. As a brand within the nba (from last years playoffs til now)

This one is easy. He's a disaster.

He didn't have to be. He could've handled it so much better. An elite athlete like LeBron can earn far more money in endorsements and other income than he earns in salary as a player, but the success of that extra income is dependent on building the right brand. He needed a professional team with experience and resources to guide him, and instead, he hired his buddy, Maverick Carter, an amateur. You see the results.

Although he'd made some questionable choices earlier, "The Decision," was by far the biggest blow to his effort to build a positive brand. Henry Schafer, executive vice president of The Q Scores Company, said that "The Decision” was one of the most detrimental acts – not related to any anti-social behavior – by a sports personality since Q Scores were developed 45 years ago. LeBron is the sixth most disliked sports personality, behind Michael Vick, Tiger Woods, Terrell Owens, Chad Ochocinco, and Kobe Bryant. (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ys-cnbclebronq091410)

Maverick Carter followed that up by alleging that racism was a primary reason for the backlash after "The Decision." Apparently, one bad decision by his manager deserves another.

I suppose it's possible that his brand will recover, and he'll make boatloads of money either way, but he's made himself unpopular in the US. (I don't know how he's viewed overseas.) Michael Jordan had a nice smile, but from what I can tell, he's not a particularly likeable person, yet he managed to develop a powerful brand. The league will use LeBron's athletic exploits as a marketing asset, and they can even use his unpopularity as a marketing asset, because they have lots of professional people who are good at it. On LeBron's side, he probably doesn't have anywhere to go but up, but as long as he selects his management team from his childhood circle of friends, I expect him to fumble along from a PR/brand standpoint.

jeb wrote:3. As a young black man and a human being within his country, profession and world.

As a middle-class white man, I don't have a lot in common with LeBron, but I'll give it a shot.

I can't begin to speak to what it means to be in his position as a black man in America. This is not the 1960's or '70's, so I don't expect him to put himself regularly in the news using his position as a sports figure to shed light on social issues. But at this point, he's a cipher. He hasn't done exceptional charity work that I'm aware of, compared to other NBA stars. I'm not aware of him being a voice in the black community. I'm not aware of him in this area at all. I've heard from multiple sports journalists that he's actually likable on a personal level, so I hope that some day he can step out of his cloistered world and become part of the larger community, particularly the black community.

Starting with Michael Jordan, I've seen black athletes become sanitized corporate images rather than human beings. I understand it -- it's a necessary part of building that brand and getting all that extra income -- but I think it's a shame. I held Bill Russell in the highest esteem as a basketball player from a young age, but learning how he handled racial and social issues and the ways he made principled stands made me admire him as an American. And he did it his way, frequently on a thoughtful, personal level rather than in a splashy, look-at-me way.

Times are different, and I don't expect LeBron or any elite black athlete to do what athletes did back then, but it does seem that they're not taking advantage of their opportunity (some might say responsibility) to raise awareness about issues affecting black communities or make a principled stand on any sort of issue. They'd lose some endorsements, but how many millions do they truly need? As former US Senator and NY Knick Bill Bradley said, "You have to decide what it is you want to use your celebrity for. It’s conceivable that some people will choose to never do it, in which case it’s unfortunate. There are bigger lives that can be led.” I firmly believe LeBron can find balance between what it takes to build a brand and using his celebrity as a positive force within society.

One factor is that these kids grow up as coddled athletes surrounded by people who talk of basketball glory and millions, and from an early age, they are apart, separate from the communities where they live. If from the time you are 13 you are surrounded by adults who talk about nothing but basketball this and NBA that, you probably don't become the grounded person who would eventually decide to do something about issues. These athletes are probably still like kids in that regard, and I see some of that in LeBron in particular. He wants to be liked, he feels hurt by criticism, and he lashes out or has little tantrums when things don't go his way. A person like that probably isn't mature enough to step to the forefront of a serious issue.

In 2008, before the Beijing Olympics, James was asked to sign an open letter by Cleveland teammate Ira Newble condemning China’s government for contributing to the genocide in Darfur. Most teammates signed it, except for LeBron and Damon Jones. Nobody particularly cares why Damon Jones didn't sign it, because he's just another NBA journeyman, but LeBron was asked why he didn't sign. His response at that time was that he didn't know enough about the issue. That was a poor choice because either a) he was ignorant about the issue and didn't take the opportunity to educate himself; or b) he knew about it but didn't want to offend Nike, which does business in China, or the Chinese themselves before the Olympics, and if that was the case, he's doubly gutless for saying he didn't know about the issue. LeBron eventually had some nuanced things to say about Darfur, but no one remembered that; all they remembered was his initial refusal to sign the letter. Opportunities to make a stand, to demonstrate the kind of person you really are, come along during a person's life, sometimes in a relatively small way like when a teammate asks you to sign an open letter. Attempting to duck the issue was a missed opportunity for him, and no amount of attempting to say the right things at some later date makes up for that missed opportunity. I hope he learned from that and doesn't duck other opportunities that come his way.

All of this is supposition on my part, based on what I've seen and read. I don't live in LeBron's world, as a black person, elite athlete, or moneymaking venture, so take my opinions for what they are.

Outside

Outside

Well I can only speak for myself but I found your writing to be wonderful and I feel you took a helluva stab at a damn complex situation. I sort of hold the belief myself that the reason CELTICS true blue guys dont like Labron was for stylistic reasons. I know that i found his early game to be as close as we have seen to Larry and Magic but sort of watched in horror as me became essentially a hero baller who lacked court sense and better yet court vision with which to throw perfect passes to his teammates which he clearly later at Cleve either did not understand or more likely did not fully trust.

Watching "the decision" I think us Celtic guys were jus aghast at the LOOK AT ME nature of the whole thing which existed at all within an espn "highlight" culture that I think Celtics fans find more and more distateful and beyond thatr increasingly see as an enemy because those aspects of the "sporting press" dont much really see nor care about the Celtics anyway. It's always going to be Phil and the shiny shiny Lakers or "king" james with all his various horseshit mantras and mottoes.

In resisting these things I think Celtics fans feel good. More thowback and less attactched at the hip to the giant downhill money train that has just eaten all of our fav team sports.

I think we all know on some gut level that the 60's c's would not have been anywhere near "shiny" enough for "center" either.

Outside that was a great piece you wrote and I sure did enjoy reading it. So thank you for taking the time.

I am at home now and my scars are healing and I am feeling rested and very hopeful. More chemo wednesday of next week.

Best to all.

JEB

bobc

Your dogs are so CUTE! Mine wont leave my side. Boy did i miss them and do i love them.

I am glad your dog is getn through his health prollems.

Jeb

Jeb,

Welcome home. Pets sense when you need them and want to be there for you. Great medicine.

As you well know, I enjoy writing stuff like this and enjoy even more interacting with others who have additional points or different views on the subject. I've only seen a few Heat games, so I expect others to have additional insights about LeBron individually and them as a team. Your questions were not simple but were straightforward, and that encouraged me to cut through my "I intensely dislike LeBron" bias to look at him and the Heat as objectively as possible. I hadn't really thought about the whole situation around question 1 until you asked, so it will be interesting to continue watching them to see if they move in that direction or if I see confirmation about what I wrote. On one hand, it would be good to see great players play team ball, but on the other hand, that would mean the Heat might become a dominant team, and I'd hate to see all the shenanigans from last summer rewarded with a title. But what I want is irrelevant; they will boom or bust regardless of what I think. Anyway, thanks for asking the questions. It was a pleasure putting together my responses.

Outside