Interesting Article on Rondo as Possible Trade.

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Interesting Article on Rondo as Possible Trade.

Post by tardust on Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:37 am

Some of this I definitely agree with.

Yet again, Rajon Rondo has been brought up as possible trade bait and maybe it's time to strongly consider moving him.

In a chat on espn.com Wednesday, NBA writer Chad Ford said this about the Celtics making a trade:

Yes I would put them up there with the Rockets, Grizzlies and Lakers as the most active teams right now. I'd be shocked if they didn't get something done. May or may not include Rondo, but the Celtics are looking for a youngish player to fill out their front line.

Now Ford did not say the Celtics are shopping Rondo or have included him in any trade proposals and “may or may not” is not very strong language. But Ford does have his finger on the pulse of the league and this is not the first time Rondo has been the subject of trade rumors.

Yes the Celtics have won four straight, including three against top competition, but as all the fans were gushing about the team now being on the right track, they forgot one important point. Teams, unless they are very desperate, won't trade struggling players because their value is not there.

Win a few games against good teams and show what the players can really do and the value goes back up. Courtney Lee looks much more valuable now than he did two weeks ago and Jared Sullinger looks like a legit future starter.

That's the problem for fans, the players show their value and, in turn, the fans value them. But if you don't believe this team, as currently constructed, can win the title, which seems to be the case since the Celtics are linked to so many trade rumors meaning Danny Ainge is at least not completely sold on this squad, then you need to do something about it. Kevin Garnett and Paul Pierce are on a very short timetable and they certainly won't be traded.

The most valuable pieces the Celtics have are Rondo, Avery Bradley and Sullinger. The Celtics seem hesitant to trade Bradley, but if they are looking for a front court player, then that means Sullinger may (there's that word again) be on the move.

Given both players value right now, a package based around Rondo and Sullinger should pull in top talent. Be that Josh Smith, DeMarcus Cousins (please no) or another “youngish” big.

Here are some reasons to entertain the idea of letting Rondo go:

Rondo's defense has fallen this season. According to Basketball Reference, Rondo is right at his career average of 1.9 steals per game, but his defensive rating is tied for the worst of his career at 103 points allowed per 100 possessions.

Rondo's defensive win share, an estimate of the number of wins contributed by a player due to his defense is 1.4 this season. His next worse defensive win share season? His rookie campaign at 2.6.

If Bradley were playing all year, then you could make the argument that Rondo didn't have to do as much defensively. But the Bradley/Rondo combo has only played together for four games so far this year.

Rondo's defense just doesn't pass the eye test this year either. He isn't as engaged defensively and is more prone to reach for the steal and pick up a foul or let the guy drive by then keep the man in front of him. Rondo is almost as talented defensively as Bradley, part of the reason Celtics fans drool at the possibility of the two being in the back court for the foreseeable future, but defense just doesn't seem to be a top priority for Rondo anymore.

Rondo has not taken the next step to be a superstar or franchise player in the league. He doesn't take the team on his shoulders and carry them when everyone else is having an off night. The most telling instance was when CSNNE's analyst Donny Marshall said it was “impossible” for Rondo to be great every night. Really? I'm pretty sure LeBron James, Chris Paul and Kevin Durant are great every night or at least 90 percent of nights.

The same can't be said for Rondo. His jumper hasn't improved enough for opposing defenses to worry about, he still can't shoot free throws (63% this year) and now his defense is slipping. This guy is in his seventh season. How long are we supposed to wait until he takes the leap to number one guy?



Then there is the attitude and composure. Rondo just came back from his fourth suspension in the past year. While this recent suspension is itself suspect, he and Doc Rivers have both admitted Rondo has a reputation with the league and that will follow him the rest of his career. The guy just doesn't keep his head.

The bigger point in all of this is simple: point guards don't win championships. Think about it. When was the last time an elite point guard won the title? The last time the point guard was best player on a championship team was Detroit in 2004 with Chauncey Billups and even that is arguable since that squad was the definition of team with every starter being key to the team's success.

The key to today's NBA is wings and bigs. You have Durant, James, Dwyane Wade, Kobe Bryant, Shaq, Dirk Nowitzki, Tim Duncan, etc. Then you have a legit chance to win it all. (side note: Russell Westbrook could keep Durant from winning a title since he needs the ball so much. See last year.)

The proof is in the pudding. Is it simple coincidence that Paul, Deron Williams, Steve Nash, Jason Kidd (in his prime, not a role player on Dallas) and Allen Iverson have a combined Zero championships? Now that this is “Rondo's team” you can expect much of the same.

Rondo's put up great numbers in the playoffs and he is truly a great player, but not all great players win championships. Ask yourself, would you rather have John Stockton (hall of famer, no rings) or trade for a big of equal talent to Rondo and have a lesser point guard like Derek Fisher (five rings).

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Re: Interesting Article on Rondo as Possible Trade.

Post by sinus007 on Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:13 am

Hi,
Sure, you can entertain the idea of trading RR. After all, the only untradeable player is KG (no-trade clause).
OTOH, before we start on this enjoyful ride let's ask who can Celtics get in exchange for RR+whoever. Don't forget - the only constant in this equation is X+Y>RR+A(or B, or C, or...) otherwise there's no point breaking the team. Also, the X or Y have to be franchise players you can build around. Frankly, I don't see anyone (or combination) meeting those conditions.

As for RR, sure he has 1001 flaws that we can argue about all day and all night, but one thing is for sure - in crunch time, aka playoffs, he plays as if there's no tomorrow. I'll take that over a star or a super-star.

just my $0.02

AK

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Re: Interesting Article on Rondo as Possible Trade.

Post by mrkleen09 on Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:34 am

RR isnt going anywhere. He is the future of this team, and I wish all of this talk would just cease as it relates to him.


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Re: Interesting Article on Rondo as Possible Trade.

Post by mulcogiseng on Fri Jan 11, 2013 1:03 pm

Sure there are trade rumors. This is not the team that Danny visioned. That team had a surplus of back up bigs led by Darko. DA's not afraid to talk. And just because KG has a no trade clause doesn't mean a deal can't be worked out. But don't expect that. This core team has a solid chance to go deep in the playoffs. so what is needed is a big and possibly a guard. There are a lot of chips available to make a deal work. Danny will not give up the opportunity he has just to make a deal. He has shown that in the past despite his gunslinger rep. IMO, the biggest image problem that RR has is that he doesn't dominate a game offensively. That has always been the #1 knock on him. He continues to improve his game cuz he knows he's not where he wants to be. He will get there as assuredly as #18 will one day be hung.

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Re: Interesting Article on Rondo as Possible Trade.

Post by sam on Fri Jan 11, 2013 1:31 pm

To answer Ford's question about the last elite PG to win the title, I'd guess it was Tony Parker, who was not only part of the Spurs team that won the 2007 championship but also was the MVP of those finals.

So here's my question to Mr. Ford. When's the last time a team with legitimate championship aspirations at the beginning of the season finally started playing the kind of ball that could potentially lead them in that direction and yet—in mid-season—traded away their league-leading assist guy? The last time the Celtics traded away a key player in mid-season, he was a combination center/role player, and I'm not sure the team ever fully recovered psychologically and operationally from that loss that season (although I liked the trade long-term and still do). What effect would trading away the team's catalyst, even for a good big man, have?

I don't know what Chad Ford's credentials are, but this article appears to be one seeking to make waves by trying to create controversy. Ford seems to be all about the individual. For instance, he doesn't believe Rondo and his teammates could be swept along by the momentum of the recently improved team defense in which they're both sweepERS annd sweepEES.

He doesn't seem to consider the fact that point guards (at least pass-first PGs) are catalysts who have greater influence than any other position on the play of every teammate on the floor. Sure, why not bring in Derek Fisher to replace Rondo and see what happens to the Celtics chemistry, which finally seems to be improving?

Yup, Mr. Ford, they're all tin soldiers out there. Just replace one with another and everything will go smoothly. I'm sure guys like Terry and Pierce would love watching Fisher hoist threes (1.1 make per 25 minutes this season) and (at the age of 38) average his lifetime 3.1 assists per game while Jason and Paul are playing solitaire on the perimeter. Just when the team is showing signs of mounting a more consistently dynamic fast break, let's throw Derek in there to sustain the transition game.

Hey Chad, I'm shocked—shocked, I tell you—that the idea of trading Rondo for Andrew Bogut never occurred to you. After all, the salaries work, and I have it on good authority that the Warriors would throw in a lifetime membership to a medical clinic.

In a more serious vein, if the Celtics were ever to trade Rajon Rondo, it would almost have to be between seasons. He's far to integral piece of the Celtics dynamic to be dispensed with during the season.

Sorry, Mr. Ford. On this topic, you have the 2013 credibility of a Model T.

Sam

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Re: Interesting Article on Rondo as Possible Trade.

Post by dboss on Fri Jan 11, 2013 1:51 pm

Ho hum

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Re: Interesting Article on Rondo as Possible Trade.

Post by worcester on Sat Jan 12, 2013 10:51 pm

Chad Ford has used the power of his power to establish his first rate credentials as an idiot. No point guards led or were instrumental to championship teams? How about Bob Cousy in the 50's and 60's, Tiny and Walt Frazier in the 70's, Dj, Magic, Johnson and Isaiah Thomas in the 80s, Chauncey Billups, Parker, and oh yes Rondo in the 2000's?

Apparently Ford doesn't read his own writing. He disses Rondo and then calls him a truly great point guard at the end of his article. He gushes over Chris Paul (who unlike Rondo has never won an NBA championship) and Parker but he neglects to observe that Rondo has done quite well overall against both Paul and Parker and EVERY OTHER PG in the NBA in their head to head matchups.

As Sam points out, Ford completely ignores the importance of continuity on a team such as the Celics which depends upon playing TEAM ball to win. Then Ford bashes Rondo for not being a good enough defender. Come on, please. When playoffs roll around or the game is important, Rajon plays D with the best of them. Throw in his assists, rebounds and determinaton to win, and you have a great PG in Rondo. A huge asset to this team.

One thing is for sure, Rondo is a much more valuable to his team than Chris Ford is to his.


Last edited by worcester on Sat Jan 12, 2013 10:55 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : sp)

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