Post Game Thread - vs Golden State Warriors, Home

[gyso]

Stars, studs and duds: Warriors eke one out vs. the C's

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/stars-studs-and-duds-warriors-eke-one-out-vs-cs


BOSTON – No team has pushed Golden State closer to the brink of defeat than the Boston Celtics did on Friday night. But the Celtics are well past moral victories, even if their 124-119 double overtime loss to the Warriors was arguably the best game of the season.

Celtics head coach Brad Stevens was asked if there was such a thing as a great loss.

“No,” he said succinctly. “Not even a good one.”

Those outside the Celtics locker room gave them little if any chance at competing let alone beating the Warriors. But among themselves, there was a confidence brewing that victory would be theirs for the taking on this day.

“You guys probably didn’t know we’d be there (at the end), but we knew,” Crowder said. “We knew we’d make it a game. We knew it would be a good one. It’s frustrating for us because we felt like we were going to win.”

For long stretches, it appeared as though the game’s outcome would play out exactly how the Celtics had scripted it. But the defending champions were able to make the plays required down the stretch to be successful. And the Celtics didn’t.

“We just gotta capitalize on every possession in overtime,” Crowder said. “That’s what it’s all about. We didn’t do that. And it cost us the game.”

Here are the Stars, Studs and Duds from Friday night’s game.

STARS

Draymond Green

When the game mattered most, there was no one tougher at either end of the floor than Green. He finished with 24 points along with 11 rebounds, eight assists, five steals and five blocked shots.

Stephen Curry

It was yet another big night scoring the ball for Curry, but the Celtics made him work harder than usual. He led all scorers with 38 points but did so on 9-for-27 shooting from the field. Curry also grabbed 11 rebounds and dished out eight assists.

Kelly Olynyk

The hot-shooting of Olynyk continues, and making his work on Friday even more impressive was that a decent amount of his scoring came against Draymond Green who is one of the better defenders in the NBA. Olynyk had a season-high 28 points along with six rebounds, three assists and three steals.

STUDS

Isaiah Thomas

He had a double-double of 18 points and 10 assists, but there’s no doubt Thomas is probably stewing over the potential game-winning shots he missed. His play in many ways was symbolic of the Celtics as a whole: good but not good enough to win.

Avery Bradley

Bradley had a strong start to the game in the first quarter, but cooled off considerably for the rest of the game. He finished with 19 points, 12 of which came in the first quarter, before fouling out in the first overtime.

DUDS

Boston’s free throw shooting

The Celtics picked the absolute worst night of the season to have their worst night shooting the ball from the line. On Friday, Boston shot just 56.3 percent from the stripe (9-for-16). The Celtics' previous low this season was 65 percent against Oklahoma City on Nov. 15.



Celtics push champs to the limit but can't quite finish

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/celtics-push-champs-limit-cant-quite-finish


BOSTON – Those rumblings at the TD Garden Friday night?

It wasn’t just the fans on their feet in the final minutes of Boston’s down-to-the-wire battle with the Golden State Warriors.

It was the NBA landscape shifting like a heated glaciers in a way we have not seen all season.

The Warriors were on the ropes, plain and simple. But like true champions, they responded with a slew of tough, grind-it-out plays to escape with a 124-119 double overtime win. A driving lay-up by Draymond Green with 51 seconds to play in the second overtime appeared to be the dagger, only for Boston’s Evan Turner to come back with a lay-up to make it a one-point game again. Green finished with 24 points, 11 rebounds and eight assists.

A Golden State miss was followed by a mad scramble for the loose ball that resulted in Jae Crowder being called for a personal foul with 17.8 seconds to play. Shaun Livingston made both free throws. The Celtics called a time-out, looking to extend the game and their chances at pulling off the biggest upset of the NBA season.

Jae Crowder, who had 15 points, scored on a driving lay-up, only for Stephen Curry to be fouled to stop the game clock. Curry, who led all scorers with 38 points, made both free throws with 13.4 seconds to play. He also had 11 rebounds and eight assists.

Boston called another time-out, but were not as fortunate this time. A 3-point attempt by Crowder was well off the mark. The ball wound up in the hands of Andre Iguodala who iced the game with a pair of free throws with 5.4 seconds remaining.

There were so many moments in the game that jump out and leave a “if only if…” feeling in the mouth of Celtics Nation.

Leading 89-85 in the fourth quarter, Boston's David Lee misses a lay-up. Golden State scores four straight to tie the game up. There were loose balls the Celtics could not get a hold of in overtime, defensive rebound opportunities blown. There were earlier transition scoring opportunities that were broken up by Draymond Green, runner up for Defensive Player of the Year last season and a front-runner for the award this season.

And then there were the free throw misses, the kind of scoring opportunities that can’t be wasted against a team this talented, this strong.

But even with the missed shots and free throws, Boston still found themselves eye-to-eye with the champs in the closing moments.

Well before tip-off, there was a buzz in the TD Garden unlike anything we’ve seen this season. It was more like a Game 7 vibe, with fans throughout the building chanting ‘Let’s Go Cel-tics!’ throughout the fourth quarter, players like Jared Sullinger and Crowder combining to force a turnover that soon led to a 3-pointer by Isaiah Thomas.

Boston was bringing all to the floor in the closing minutes, with their emotions driving them towards what they were hoping would be arguably the most important win in the Brad Stevens era and one of the most significant in regular season NBA history.

But in the end, the Warriors (24-0) made all the plays at both ends of the floor and continue their march towards basketball immortality.



Loss aside, Warriors have plenty of praise for the Celtics

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/loss-aside-warriors-have-plenty-praise-celtics


BOSTON – A victory would have made Friday night’s game against Golden State all that much sweeter for the Boston Celtics.

But short of that, they continue to pile on the credibility credits among their NBA brethren.

The San Antonio Spurs. The Oklahoma City Thunder. The Atlanta Hawks. You can add the Golden State Warriors to the growing list of franchises that know first-hand how much the Celtics are trending towards being one of the better teams in the NBA in the near future.

“They were amazing,” Warriors forward Draymond Green said of the Celtics following Golden State’s 124-119 double overtime win. “They’re a good team, a good ball club, and they’re gonna continue to get better.”

Reigning league MVP Stephen Curry had lots of good stuff to say about the Celtics as well.

“They’re tough, man. Their record is still above .500, but they’ve played better than their record I think,” Curry told reporters. “They’ve got some big wins on the road against some tough teams, OKC, Atlanta. And when they win, they win big. They really show out. So you know they have that punch, that fire power. They provide a couple of matchup problems with some of the bigs that can step out and shoot threes and space the floor. You don’t really know where it’s coming from on a nightly basis, which is tough.”

That said, there are games like Friday’s that serve as a reminder of how far the Celtics still have to go in order to be among the game’s elite.

Friday’s loss was yet another lesson learned for a Celtics squad that’s among the league’s youngest clubs.

Still, there’s no denying that Boston has some talent on its roster that’s just starting to blossom.

And after talent comes the need to develop chemistry which continues to be a work in progress for Boston.

“They mesh really well. Everyone complements each other, which is tough to find the right type of guys in this league,” Golden State’s Andre Iguodala told reporters after the game. “But they complement each other really well. The key in this league is can you sustain a high level of play night-in and night-out for 82 games and like I said we're getting team's best but can they keep that same intensity and level of play 82 times? And that's where it gets tough.

"Maybe you can play at a really high level and execute and you're locked in against two or three elite teams, but the elite teams separate themselves because they play at a high level night-in, night-out."

[beat]

That said, there are games like Friday’s that serve as a reminder of how far the Celtics still have to go in order to be among the game’s elite.


How far??? If we are not there "elite" after this............then we ain't never gonna be there.

Just a friggin regulation FS from winning.

beat

[Berlin-T]

The future looks bright for this team. We had a horrible night shooting TFs and missed a bunch of bunnies. Also IT is going to have to play smarter down the stretch. In spite of all that we damn near took them in double overtime (should of taken them in regulation).

Olynyk is starting to look like the real deal and even James Young did remarkably well considering how he was playing only a few short months ago. With the talent we have coming up - I'm pretty sure Mickey is going to be a baller and RJ most likely also, Rozier in a year or two - and with our draft picks it's going to be interesting seeing in which direction Danny goes - veteran all-star pickup or more youth via the draft?

Either way, buckle down folks, we're off on a thrilling ride.

Berlin-T

[cowens/oldschool]

This game confirms to me how weak the NBA really is, if thats the best team in the NBA, look at us were an improving team, but we have flaws, were not there yet and if not for us missing bunnies and some unbelievable terrible calls and bad execution by us, we had that game and showed we can not only play these guys, we can beat em. I guess I should give Danny and our team more credit, we are definitely built to play in todays NBA of where the league is at, we have great perimeter defense, guarantee Avery Bradley is the best perimeter defender Stephon Curry has ever faced and his FG% proves that, plus AB has had good success against Steph before. This is a match up that I will look forward to going forward as much as I loved seeing Pierce and Kobe go at it. Whats more encouraging for us is one of our best defenders, Smart wasn't even playing and another perimeter defensive stud Rozier isn't ready yet, but he will be. Its only gonna get harder for Steph against us.

The refs, I hope Danny is sending film to the league office cause somebody needs to be suspended for not doing their job!!!! Was a great clean steal by AB on Barbosa on the leftside of court that would have led to easy 2 by AB on a breakaway that was called FOUL on AB....kidding me right? Lee standing there holding his ground on post defense against Ezeli, Ez gives Lee a strong left elbow right into Lee's chest FOUL on Lee....???? WTF right?? Sully drives down the lane on Green, Green places his right forearm right on Sullys left arm and pushes right as Sully is shooting/driving, knocking him down....no call??? At least twice Steph drives down lane and one time Crowder, one time either Turner or AB are on the ball making Steph bobble it and can't get shot off....instead of jump ball or no call, FOUL on us....PATHETIC did these refs have an agenda, its worth asking cause those calls were so clearly WRONG!!! okay I got to vent a little. butt those fockin refs need to be fined or SOMETHING, they can't get away with that too many obvious bad bad boneheaded calls.

Sully after some great games in beast mode disappointed me, he missed so many easy bunnies, Tommy commented at the beginning of game, that shot will be there all night for Sully, well he bricked every wide open mid range shot that was there, if he hits one or two of those, different outcome, then he couldn't even hit a FT so save his life....Sully get your shit together man!!! KO was great, offensively hes playing with smarts and balls, hit alot of big shots when we needed them, he still needs protection as he has moments he gets moved like a ragdoll in the paint and he has trouble rebounding especially in traffic, but hope this clever offense is a regular staple of his game.

AB was great, he battled, carried us early, he gave Curry all he could handle, Curry finished with 38, hes obviously has the green light to shoot, but his FG% was way off because of AB mostly, then Turner came in and played him very tough also. Man by next year with a hopeful healthy Marcus Smart and Rozier's improvement, we will be the best team in the league to defend Curry, the latest big thing that revolutionizing the game. Amir had some great defense, Lee carried us for a stretch. Overall I didn't like IT's game so much, he hit some big shots, but made some/more bad plays, I guess were going with the best we got, but hope Stevens can give him less responsiblity or at least come up with a real end of game play cause him dribbling and dribbling the shot clock down, just to take a challenged 3 IS NOT GONNA WORK!!!

[bobheckler]

This was as good a game as you can have.  Any better and we'd have to win and then it would have been great!

I watched it from Ozumas.  I was told to sit down repeatedly.  The reason why I had to be told that repeatedly is because I kept getting up and pacing and cursing.  What's amusing is that I was being to stop obstructing the TV and not to watch my language.  The announcers were the usual GSW broadcast team of Bob Fitzgerald and Jim Barnett.  Barnett was the Celtics' 1st round pick in 1966 (#8 pick).  He played for us for one year before going on to 6 other teams in a 10 year NBA career.  In a little known piece of basketball trivia, Jim Barnett took a wild long distance shot while playing for the Portland Trailblazers in 1971, which went in, and the announcer got excited and said "Rip City!  All right!".  The announcer has said that he has no idea where he came up with that from, it just came out of him.  As a result of that play call, "Rip City" has become the nickname for the Trailblazers and of Portland, Oregon in general.  Unfortunately for Barnett the 1966-1967 season, the one he played for Boston, was one of the only two years the Russell Celtics did NOT win a championship.  They came back and won next year, but he was already gone to the San Diego Rockets.  Timing really is everything.

Missed bunnies but, more significantly, missed fritos.  9-16 is embarrassing, both in terms of ft% and the number of ftas.  Too many jump shots, not enough slashing.  The only one who looked like he was consistently slashing was

1.  Kelly Olynyk.  He kept making those cuts and got reverse layups or layup attempts that required exceptional defense to stop.  28 points is, I believe, his career high and he did it against a very active, swarming athletic defense.  He was getting guys on his hip and calling for the ball.  At 11-21 he was the ONLY Celtic to shoot OVER 50%.  One of those missed fgas was a missed bunny after doing all the good work of getting the offensive rebound, but that missed 22' fga at the end of regulation with just .7 seconds left that would have won the game outright for us.  Hard to hold that one against him, he wasn't the primary receiver on the inbounds pass to begin with, but it counts in the boxscore as a miss.  On the other hand, with 1:04 left in OT and us down by 3, he hit that big 3 to tie it up and send it into 2OT.  He had 3 steals too.  He had a block which came from being the only man back on a 2-on-1 GSW fast break.  He blocked the first shot, intimidated the 2nd and it was only the hard work of Iggy crashing the board as the 3rd Dub down court that scored the bucket.  What disappointed me about that sequence is that more Warriors were running down to finish that break than Celtics getting back to help Kelly.  Despite that fact that he, and Turner, kept us in this game down the stretch he had a -2 +/- while James Young was a +3.  Shows what that stat is worth, in my opinion.  If Kelly didn't "just show up", but have one of the biggest games of his still-short career to-date this would have been a double-digit blow out.  It's great to see a young player (and Kelly is only 24 years old with just a little more than 2 years experience) suddenly feel like he not only belongs, but he can take over.  Kelly is averaging 18.2ppg in his last 5 games, with the 6 point clunker in San Antonio dragging the average down.  Take that one out and he's averaging 21ppg on 33-57 (58%) and 10-21 (48%) from 3 in 26mpg in 4 of the last 5 games.  Not bad.  I'll take those numbers in 80% of the games going forward.

2.  Turner drove me crazy again.  I've said before that he's gonna drive me to drinkin' if he don't stop with that high, loose dribblin' (credit, as always, to Commander Cody and the Lost Planet Airmen for the inspiration).  Thanks to him I went from my normal 2 large hot sakes to 4 in a twinkling.  He and Thomas were the reasons for me bouncing up and down out of my chair like a Jumping Jack.  It didn't help that I had friends texting me, and one sitting next to me MUCH more drunk than I, needling me on everything we did wrong.  It was almost murder by empty sake bottle, which would have made no sense since we would have lost anyway.  On the other hand, he scored 7 of our 9 points in 2OT (Jae got a layup with an assist from Kelly for the other 2 points).  He made a great recovery block on a Curry shot, which almost certainly would have been 2 points.

3.  We got the bad Isaiah Thomas last night, the ME-baller who gets himself into trouble because he just forgets it's a team game.  He didn't even try to get 6'7" Shaun Livingston back on his heels, he just tried a 3ptr which got blocked by the 10" taller defender.  Shit.  He's a great fantasy player, must be an absolute killer in NBA2k16, but he killed us last night with his untimely turnovers and ME-balling screw ups.  On defense, he was active, even competing for rebounds in the Land of the Giants, but Livingston was posting him up on every chance.

4.  Bradley came out smoking hot on offense and red hot on defense in the 1st quarter.  15 of our first 19 points were his.  Then he cooled off, but that's ok.  It's not his job to score all the team's points.  He did his, by making sure we stayed in the game from the tip off, it was supposed to be everybody else's job to start chipping in later, and hardly anybody except Kelly did.  He played about as good a defense on Curry as possible (and Curry still scored 38, with 32 points in regulation.  So it's not like he really needed the extra 10 minutes to run those numbers up.  32 points is a lot of points!).  Curry is just unreal.  You all saw it, he needs the smallest, tiniest sliver of daylight from anywhere to score.  He was an atrocious 9-27 from the field but a perfect 14-14 from the line.  14-14 from Curry vs 9-16 for the entire Celtics team.  We lost by 5.  Bradley played him about as well as possible, and Curry still scored 32 points in regulation.  

5.  Sully rebounded.  That's about the only nice thing I can say about his game.  1-4 from the line is NOT clutch.  3-11 from the field is NOT clutch.  The anticipated match up between him and Green didn't happen.  Instead, it was Sully vs Bogut and that worked only because Bogut has become totally inept on offense.  If we were counting on Sully's shot to pull Bogut away from the paint (Bogut had 3 blocks this game, and they weren't out at the perimeter) then he didn't get the job done.

6.  It was Amir vs Green and Green showed why he is such a dangerous player.  24 points on 8-20 shooting, 11 rebounds, 8 assists and only 2 TOs, 5 steals and 5 blocks.  Some tactical errors by Amir.  I do not understand why Amir was all the way out on Green late which made it so easy for Green to drive past him, TO HIS RIGHT, and get to the rim.  Force Green to jump shoot, fer Christ's Sake, don't let him drive!  Ugh.  Green was everywhere last night, had his hands in everything.  

7.  David Lee had a short, but effective, 16 minutes last night against his former team.  10 points on 5-8.  I'm sure the best part of the game for him was the hugs he got before and after it from the boys in blue-and-gold.  Bittersweet, considering he left GSW because he wanted more minutes and he's not getting them here and GSW is on track for back-to-back championships.

8.  Jae was 5-14.  He was active, he played hard but his shooting sucked like everybody else's except for Kelly and Lee's and Turner's.  He was 3-6 from 3, I'll give him that but he is still a lousy finisher.  It wasn't a straight up Green vs Crowder comparison, but Green far outplayed Jae Crowder.

9.  James Young's offense looked better.  More relaxed.  He had an open 3 and passed it up to take it inside for a closer shot (he missed, but I like that he attacked and went closer).  His defense started out pretty good and then went downhill.


Watch it again:











Poor finishing hurt us, again.  Poor free throw shooting hurt us, maybe killing us because we may have won in regulation, if a player or two, I don't want to mention any names (Jared Sullinger) had hit theirs.    They did a lot of cutting.  We did a lot of ME-ball.  The only player I saw moving without the ball towards the rim was Kelly.  You cannot score in the paint if you do not move towards the rim, with or without the ball.  Our execution broke down late in the game again and again.  24 second violations or wild heaves at the buzzer to avoid one.  Thomas and Turner ME-balling.  No movement.  Why not?  Well, maybe because they knew Thomas and Turner were going to do it alone?

Well, we took the best team in basketball, the HOTTEST team in basketball, the reigning World Champions, to 2OT.  Before we get too giddy, let's remember they were without two starters, Klay Thompson and Harrison Barnes, but injuries are part of the game (just ask LeBron James and the Cleveland Cavaliers, especially Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love).  And this is a game we could have won with better execution, or even better free throw shooting.  I know that talking about "moral victories" is what you hear from losers, winners talk about "actual victories", but we are showing we have made very significant progress here, in just the early days, of Year 3 of The Rebuild.  This was the toughest game the Dubs have won all year and, so far, they've won them all.

Now, we have to take our tired legs down to the surprisingly good 14-8 Charlotte Hornets and take our frustrations out on them.  This is where we see if Brad Stevens' efforts to get everybody to focus on details and no further than what is right in front of us, is sinking in.  The Warriors game is over, get over it, tonight we're playing the Hornets.  




bob


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[cowens/oldschool]

bob great post.

so what did you think of the refs?

[Matty]

We were to win this by 8.... Obviously there was a disturbance in the force...

[kdp59]

I loved watching the game and 2 OT's was great .

seeing our team just fight and scrap against the best in the NBA, wow.

then I remembered that GS had both Thompson and Barnes sitting out.

we had Smart out.

I think if both teams are full strength we are bit farther behind them...BUT they ARE the defending champs!

good game all around and should give the team a collective confidence boost.

[bobheckler]

bob great post.

so what did you think of the refs?

cow,

I thought there were some questionable calls, the one called on Turner when he went to the floor to tie Curry up comes to mind, but if we hit our fritos it would not have mattered.


bob


.

[bobheckler]

.

[worcester]

Cow, you nailed it with your post. Bad officiating and our poor ft shooting cost us the game. At the end i was left to think, "Where's Paul Pierce when we really need him?" We do so much need a go to guy at the end of game's, and IT is not it. Avery would have been better had he not been fouled out on some bogus calls.

Griping aside, how bout some glimmers?
Glimmer #1 ...we play great team D and hustle.

Glimmer #2...Kelly O has become the player we'd hoped he'd be.

Glimmer #3...folks are talking about GSW being short handed. So were we without Smart on the floor, yet we were still tenacious.

Glimmer #4...Jamws Young played some decent D and made some smart passes. He showed he may very well be worth keeping, and that's without him showing any offense which really should become his strength.

Overall, a superb effort by our guys in Green. So proud to be a Celtic fan, especially now.

[dboss]

I watched the game again as it was on NBA  TV.

The refs made at least 10 very questionable calls against the Celtics.  That did not help them.  Nevertheless, they fought through adversity and had 3 chances to win this thing.

The Celtics played very good basketball but they did not execute very well at the end of regulation and the 2 OT's.

I thought we could have used a timeout before the end of regulation.

This was a game where we missed the defensive mindset of Marcus Smart because despite IT's offensive contribution he remains a big liability at the defensive end.  However add Clay Thompson to the mix along with Harrison Barnes and it is clear that The Golden State warriors are in a league of their own.  Let's not fool ourselves. We remain several players short of competing with the world champion.

Overall, this was an excellent game and probably the best game of the season for both teams.

The Celtics are definitely on the road to success.

dboss

[beat]

dboss wrote.......

This was a game where we missed the defensive mindset of Marcus Smart because despite IT's offensive contribution he remains a big liability at the defensive end.  However add Clay Thompson to the mix along with Harrison Barnes and it is clear that The Golden State warriors are in a league of their own.  Let's not fool ourselves. We remain several players short of competing with the world champion.


dboss..... I have to disagree that we are SEVERAL players away from being there, DAMN we just played them to a tie for 57 minutes. Sure they were missing players so were we, injuries happen. But several players away when the team we have just took um to the 15th round? We need a closer, someone that can and more importantly WANTS to be the guy taking that last shot. Well see how the season moves along but I think we are a lot further down that success road you speak of than you seem to think we are.

beat

[beat]

Cow, you nailed it with your post. Bad officiating and our poor ft shooting cost us the game. At the end i was left to think, "Where's Paul Pierce when we really need him?" We do so much need a go to guy at the end of game's, and IT is not it. Avery would have been better had he not been fouled out on some bogus calls.

Griping aside, how bout some glimmers?
Glimmer #1 ...we play great team D and hustle.

Glimmer #2...Kelly O has become the player we'd hoped he'd be.

Glimmer #3...folks are talking about GSW being short handed. So were we without Smart on the floor, yet we were still tenacious.

Glimmer #4...Jamws Young played some decent D and made some smart passes. He showed he may very well be worth keeping, and that's without him showing any offense which really should become his strength.

Overall, a superb effort by our guys in Green. So proud to be a Celtic fan, especially now.

W

Think one other important factor is Stevens has had some time to ingrain these guys with his system. No big roster turnover in a while. He's getting use to this bunch and they are certainly getting use to him. Still a player or 2 away but we are no longer in the bottom third of the league, or IMHP even in the middle. I think we are among the top third of the teams now and a threat to win every game, as long as we play like we recently have.

beat

[worcester]

Beat, you are so right. Brad has continuity going with this team, something Sam always preached was crucial, and it shows. Danny's plan is coming to fruition, and he has many resources piled up to improve this roster. If the sun keeps rising in the East, we should be ok for years to come.

[beat]

Beat, you are so right. Brad has continuity going with this team, something Sam always preached was crucial, and it shows. Danny's plan is coming to fruition, and he has many resources piled up to improve this roster. If the sun keeps rising in the East, we should be ok for years to come.

Just another thought too. Do we really need that STAR? I know I've said on other threads that we need a closer a go to guy, but in reality how will that mesh with a bunch of "team" first players mentality. Couple games ago we had 8 friggin players in double figures. 8 !!

Sure I realize we are not as talented but I'm getting a little tired of that line too, virtually every player in this league is pretty darn talented, or they would not be here. But to get the five guys playing as a unit on the floor (like Stevens has this bunch doing) is fun to watch. Having a "STAR" would be nice but there are not too many of them and no one is giving theirs away, and would that STAR buy into this as much as a lessor level player.

When the time comes and the inevitable trade comes down, I'll hate to see "whoever" it is, leave.

beat

[bobheckler]

dboss wrote.......

This was a game where we missed the defensive mindset of Marcus Smart because despite IT's offensive contribution he remains a big liability at the defensive end.  However add Clay Thompson to the mix along with Harrison Barnes and it is clear that The Golden State warriors are in a league of their own.  Let's not fool ourselves. We remain several players short of competing with the world champion.


dboss..... I have to disagree that we are SEVERAL players away from being there, DAMN we just played them to a tie for 57 minutes. Sure they were missing players so were we, injuries happen. But several players away when the team we have just took um to the 15th round? We need a closer, someone that can and more importantly WANTS to be the guy taking that last shot. Well see how the season moves along but I think we are a lot further down that success road you speak of than you seem to think we are.

beat

beat, dboss, cowens and worcester,

Klay Thompson played 30 minutes last night vs Milwaukee. It was his first night back, obviously. He was 4-14 from the field 2-7 from 3. In the bigger picture he's dangerous but if his first night back had been against us instead of the Bucks I would have been very happy with a 4-14 night from him. He would NOT have been a difference-maker.

We need another closer. I think we need to stop talking about Paul Pierce as if he would be a viable option. Have you looked at his numbers this season? They stink. He's 38 years old. Saying we need Paul Pierce is like Laker fans saying "we need Kobe Bryant" but be talking about the Kobe of 10 years ago (or, even, 5 years ago). Those trains have pulled out of the station and they aren't coming back.

Here's Pierce's shot stats for this year. Look at his fg% when the clock is down near the end. He's under 40%.

http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/1718/tracking/shots/

If what you guys are saying is "we need a closer like what Pierce was 10 years ago", then yeah, I'm on board with that 100%. But if you think that Danny should have brought him back this year then I'd say "Love ya, Truth, but I'll see you when we raise your number to the rafters".


bob



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[dboss]

Beat I have to respectfully disagree with your disagreement.

It will take more than a closer to close the gap.

The Warriors are clearly in a class by themselves.  The Celtics are playing a very similar style as the Warriors  but the Warriors have GREAT shooters up and down their roster.

They shoot .425% on threes.  That's 10 percentage points better than Boston and a huge difference.  And since the 3 point shot is a major factor in the pace and space game Boston statistically  remains at a clear disadvantage.  The Celtics are a better overall defensive team than Golden State but that is not enough to compete with them.  They are a good measuring stick for where Boston is and where they still need to get to.

We simply need to add several shooters.  Adding a  closer will not be enough. The Warriors simply have better two way players on their team than we do.

I think we both agree that they are on the road to success.  The question is how far down the road are they.  I think they are at least 2-3 players away or as I stated several players away.

dboss

[dboss]

I am less concerned about Boston adding a closer than I am about Boston adding better offensive players that can handle the ball, pass and shoot.

The question appears to be one that is definitive and measurable.

Do the Celtics shoot the ball well enough to win a championship in a league that has decidedly changed from a low post, halfcourt grind it out style to a pace and space style characterized by dribble penetrations and three point shooting?

I think not.

dboss

[bobheckler]

I don't think we need stars, I don't think we need closers, I think we need 'finishers'. We get lots of good looks, open shots, high percentage shots. We're just not staying focused until the ball passes through the twine.


bob



.

[beat]

I am less concerned about Boston adding a closer than I am about Boston adding better offensive players that can handle the ball, pass and shoot.

The question appears to be one that is definitive and measurable.

Do the Celtics shoot the ball well enough to win a championship in a league that has decidedly changed from a low post, halfcourt grind it out style to a pace and space style characterized by dribble penetrations and three point shooting?

I think not.  

dboss

I just think we are a hell of a lot closer than you think we are.........................GS's shooting will come back more to the norm over time, our steady is our defense that is at or near the best as a team.

beat

[worcester]

Bob H, For sure we do not need Paul Pierce in his present form. I was referring to him metaphorically as someone with confidence to drain the 3 ball at over 40% efficiency or who could slash to the basket as needed. Steph is that guy, Lebron is that guy, Kawai is that guy, Kobe was that guy, Dirk was that guy. Paul was that guy...You het the idea.

Re stars needed - how many stars did Nrad have on those butler teams that finished 2nd two years running? He knows how to craft winners playing team bball without stars - but still, we do need a star who is team oriented a la Larry, KG, Hondo, or Russ...

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