My Patience is Wearing Thin-This Year's Team Needs Help........NOW !!!

I have long admired Coach Stevens and his staff for what they have accomplished with the team and with many individuals since their arrival.

The team has improved in each of the years that Stevens has been here, and that can be very objectively seen with continued improvement
in its number of victories.

I have been all for the slow and longer term rebuild that was initiated with the trade of Pierce and Garnett.  And, no, I do not think that this year necessarily
has to be the year for banner #18 whether a trade is made or not at this time.

However, there are some factors to check out regarding this year's team progressing past last year's squad.  In my opinion, this year's team needs help
to be better than last year's team, and if the 2017 team does not improve over 2016 the re-build is being set backwards to some degree which is not
part of what I want to see.  

One (the most important) area to address (and, has been mentioned a thousand times on this board so this is not earth shaking news or even fake news) is rebounding. Our rebounding woes stand out in every game that is a loss and even some times in games that are victories.  It has also been mentioned many times that we need another late game scorer, but I fully believe that we have enough shooters if we could win the battle on the boards most every night.  A lot is wrong when our leading rebounder per game is 6'2" guard, Avery Bradley.  A whole new approach needs to be seen and sometimes one new guy can change everyone's mind on any particular part of the game.  Crowder's addition two years ago almost immediately changed our overall player attitude towards accountability as an example.

It is nice to think that the two Nets picks are going to be a very good and perhaps even great players, but neither one is helping this year's team
right now.  Even the 2017 pick may not even help next year's team as I would think that his ability to start is likely at least not going to happen
until 2018 or 2019.  Obviously, the 2018 pick is even further down the line as being able to help.  With that said, I am still not hoping to see either of
these picks traded for anyone who is not already a "star" player who can help our rebounding issues RIGHT NOW.  Cousins comes to mind, but getting
this guy is not as likely as it may have been last summer.

Also to look at is the concept of being able to sign another max level guy next summer.  The new CBA makes this idea less much likely now than
it did at this time last winter since guys now will have to take a sizable pay reduction to sign with a new team. We would likely not have Horford now if
the CBA had changed last winter.  Add in the pay raises that Thomas, Bradley and Smart will require after next season and I just do not see the Cs going
millions and millions of dollars over whatever the cap will be at that time. Thomas and Bradley are likely to be max or near max guys with Smart getting
over $10 M per year in his next contract.

Perhaps Ainge and the Cs need to look at some smaller ways to salvaging this season while still building for banner #18.  I, for one, would like this season not to continue in the manner that it has gone so far which includes losing to every good team and also to other teams that are "good", but not great (like the Wizards last night).

I think that this year's roster has gotten very stale and some changes are needed to shake things up and especially to get us some more rebounding.  A big, physical guy (or two) in the middle even if he is not an all star quality player may make us a new and improved team over night. A guy who can get us 10+ rebounds and score points in with starter's minutes is not going to get any all star votes, but he could be an all star in that role for us.  Of course, this is a gamble, but what we are doing now and have been doing all year is not working as well as I like either.

There are some guys out there who will not cost us the Nets picks, but using some of the guys at the bottom of the roster and some of the other first round picks that Ainge has to use should get us a Nerlens Noel or someone similar.  Even take back a bad expiring contract by including Amir Johnson to get even a second possible  rebounding banger would help shake us up and give this year's team a chance to break out of its doldrums ASAP.

Faried

wideclyde

3 losses in a row tends to sour one's disposition.

There are some structural and schematic issues that need to be addressed and as you mentioned, rebounding the ball is # 1  Last night the Celts got beat on the glass by 10.

Structurally the Celtics are too small to match up effectively with a lot of teams.  We need a big that can rebound and it is unlikely that one will be available in the 2017 draft although the 2018 draft is well stocked.

If we are looking for a long term solution we must accept the fact that one of our top first round picks must be leveraged.  I would be very reluctant to use the 2017 pick for this purpose because right next to rebounding is a significant lack of scoring off the bench from our guards.  We also need a big off the bench that can score and rebound because the group that we have now are inadequate.

I think one overlooked fact in comparing this team to last years' team is the changes that we made to the roster.  last year Sully grabbed over 8 boards per game and ET turned into a multi-skilled rotation player off the bench.  I think that down the road Brown should be able to account for the scoring, defense and rebounding but the play making abilities falls in the hands of Marcus Smart or Terry Rozier.  None of these options are able or ready to step up.

The other thing that we may have overlooked has to do with other teams.  Guess what?  they added pieces too!

I am just not too concerned when i take a longer view of the situation.  We have assets in both players and picks to round out the roster.

From a schematic point of view we have 1/2 of an offense because Brad pays too much attention to analytics that tells him how many points can be scored taking 3's.  We do not have a viable post game offense.  Part of that is scheme and part of it is ability.   On the defensive side of the ball, the team struggles to limit penetration because of poor man on man cover skills in some instances and a lack of a threat in the paint who can block, alter or dissuade points at the rim.

We are half way through year 4 of a 5 year rebuild so the project is not finished yet and while it does appear at times that we are stuck in the mud, I still see very positive development going on.

I would suggest that we let the process play itself out.  

dboss

Nurkic of Denver.

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2017/01/23/report-nuggets-actively-trying-to-trade-jusuf-nurkic/


Marc Stein of ESPN:

A player who is sure to move between now and the trade deadline?

Denver’s Jusuf Nurkic.

Sources say that the Nuggets, having acknowledged that Nikola Jokic and Nurkic didn’t click as a pairing, are actively working to find Nurkic a new home that would give him the chance he deserves to be a front-line center.

He averages 11.8 rebounds/36mpg and is only 22 years old.  He is also 7'0", 280#.  



Another possibility, Nikola Vucevic of Orlando.  7' 260#, 26 years old.  Averaging 12.5 rebounds/36mpg.  Not the defender Nurkic is, but a better offensive player.  Might play better with Horford than Nurkic because they can both play high and low.

5 days ago – via ESPN
Orlando, according to league sources, recently tried to engage Miami on a Goran Dragic deal in which the Magic were said to be offering center Nikola Vucevic and a future first-round pick.

So, Orlando was willing to give Miami Vucevic AND a 1st rounder for Dragic.


Lastly, Boban Marjanovic of Detroit.  7'3", 290#, 28 years old.  Averaging 16.7 rebounds/36mpg.  A stiff, perhaps, but not an expensive one.  


bob


.

I cant believe that Terrence Jones was signed for $1,050,961.

I'm not sure players like Nurkic and Vucevic  can move well enough on defense to fit Brad's schemes.

He seems to want players who have the ability to switch onto smaller players and most of the NBA's behemoths simply don't. Of course that is the main reason they are dinosaurs in todays NBA as well.

I still think Faried is a better fit ( and under  a good contract for an additional year) for what Brad does here.

But what would you trade for Nurkic?

over at Celtics Blog they have Zeller and the T-wolves early second rounder next year being a deal ( Denver is below the cap by as much as $13M I think).

I don't see how Denver would take that deal myself.

a story at Denver.com says the Nuggets are hot for Milsap from Atlanta. They have Nurkic, Chandler and Barton in a possible trade for MIlsap and Sefolosa. Though to me replacing Chandler with Faried would make more sense for Atlanta.

Faried and Barton would both be nice fits here, IMO.

how to get them is the problem.

Did anyone wear out their patience last night!

I did but not because of the team.  The refs were the absolute worst I have seen.  IT got fouled every time he touched the ball.  Beverly was grabbing, holding clutching, bumping and no fouls were being called.  The NBA needs to look into this.  The one-sided offensive foul calls was appalling.

Nevertheless the Celtics displayed a level of mental toughness that we have not seen but for a few games this year.  This does not negate some holes in the team but it certainly suggests to me that we do need to be more patient and we do need to let the process continue.

If this team had minor draft assets, over the hill players and short money then there would be reason for concerned.  

We can throw names out there of who may fit or not but I think any move must take a long view.  The Celtics are not in the tweaking stage of their development.  

dboss

dboss,

The long term approach to this rebuild has been fine.  I have very much been firmly on board from the start. And, yes last night the Cs were much sharper with their rebounding (check the game totals), but in my opinion, the rebuild goes backwards to at least some degree if this year's squad does not turn out to be better than last year's team.

Not including last night against Houston, the Cs have not played well enough to beat any of the league's better teams and have lost some games against the league's "good" teams (Washington on Monday as an example).  Also, in my opinion, the lack of rebounding that this team shows on an almost nightly basis is their number one problem.

By killing the Rockets on the boards last night their lack of defense was covered up pretty well. Not sure if the Cs made a new vow to rebound better or that Houston rebounded terribly, but when you kill a team on the boards your chances of winning increase dramatically.

Will last night's rebounding numbers hold up?  If they do, we probably will end up with a better record than in 2016.  If they do not hold up over the last 35 games we are not likely to be better than last year.

I am not sure that we can expect Thomas to score 30+ per game but this year's team has shown that it can score a good number of points in almost any game. Our three point shooting percentage has improved greatly over last year to go along with a good shooting percentage on other shots and a very decent free throw percentage (although we do not get to the line often enough) kind of tells me that we do not need more shooters.

But, to repeat from my post yesterday, we have a huge problem when our 6'2" shooting guard leads our team in rebounding.  There are guys out there that I would take a chance on who will not require either of the two Nets picks to acquire who could very likely increase our rebounding right away.

Even though Nerlins Noel will require a decent contract for next year, I just cannot believe that he couldn't come to Boston right now and get us 10-12 rebounds and at least 10 points per game for the rest of the season.  The 76ers games are on TV quite often where I live, and this guy is very athletic and also still very young to the point that I would consider him for a multi year contract next summer.  Not a Nets pick, but a couple of other picks, a player on the roster or two could possibly get him.

The kid from Denver (Nurkic) is also on the trade block. How about the Minnesota pick and some salary fillers to get him.  Faried was mentioned yesterday as well, but he is a smallish power forward where getting a center moves Horford to power forward.  Marjonovic is too far away and is also already 28 years old.

Getting either one would allow Amir to work with the second unit, or getting both of these guys could free up Johnson to become a veteran roster addition another play off team may be interested in trading for.

Getting a star player this summer as a free agent is less likely than in the past as our cap room may be not as much as will be needed especially if Thomas or Bradley get signed this summer.  I am not sure that there is a star player who will address our rebounding need to be traded for this summer without pretty much gutting the core of what we currently have.

AND, none of us know what the ramifications of not out-performing the 2016 team could do to the total rebuild effort.  I would very much like not to experience 'falling back' situation.

The Celtics won last night because of this thread which may have been posted in the locker room. I'm sure of it, mebbe ThanxClyde

wydeclyde

I very much agree with you.  I have posted many times that rebounding is a critical issue for the team.

That issue was not addressed during the off season.  But I think Danny needs to move with caution so that we don't make a move just to sure up things for the rest of the year.  

We are not likely to win the NBA championship this year!  

Guys like Nurkic do not impress me.  Yes he is young and this is his 3rd year but we need a dominant rebounder and rim protector.  He is not that guy.  Beside Danny just drafted him in June.  His name is Zizic. Faried as you mentioned is an undersized PF.  

The point that I am making is that we are going to need to make a big time move.  Not a tweak here or there.  We need real size and real athleticism.  I do not have a problem if we fall back a bit but I doubt that will happen.  Despite shortcomings Boston is still as good or better that 20 teams out there.

Danny will make a deal when the right deal is there to make.  In the meantime we still have a year and a half before the alarm rings to notify us that the 5 year rebuild should be completed.

dboss

Let's take a deep breath. The Celtics have had a little bit of a slump, but otherwise are pretty much where most people expected them to be. We would all like Danny to build a contender, but it isn't easy. My guess is they will break out of the slump and continue to be a little aboce 0.600. We all know their weaknesses. Danny and Brad more than anybody. I'd love to have Embiid or the Greek Freak, but I wouldn't trade our team for Philly or Milwaukee as some writers/pundits/fans said they would gladly do.