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Post by 112288 Fri Dec 17, 2021 10:28 pm

Celtics Wrap: Despite Impressive Second Half, Shorthanded Boston Falls
The Celtics put their best effort forward


NESN by Patrick McAvoy

BOSTON — The shorthanded Celtics fought hard Friday but came up just short against the top-seeded Golden State Warriors at TD Garden, 111-107.

With the loss the Celtics’ record drops to 14-15, while the Warriors improve to 24-5.

You can check out the full box score here.

ONE BIG TAKEAWAY
The Celtics gave it their best shot Friday but just couldn’t completely get over the hump. Boston built itself a deficit from the jump falling behind 14-3 and had to scratch and claw their way back in it the rest of the night.

The Warriors carried a 14-point lead into half time but the undermanned Celtics looked like a completely different team in the second half and that can be attributed to Jayson Tatum’s impressive play and a massive uptick in the squad’s energy. From drawing charges, to making an extra pass Boston looked like the best version itself in the second half even while missing seven total players — five players due to COVID-19, Dennis Schröder to a non-COVID illness and Romeo Langford to injury.

When they play the way they did in the second half they can compete with anyone and even briefly took a lead in the fourth quarter, but the Warriors were just too much.

STARS OF THE GAME
— Tatum was the best overall player on the court for the Celtics Friday night. Although he had a slow start, he came alive in the second half and finished the night with 27 points, eight rebounds and six assists. Win or loss he was crucial in the second half and even gave Boston a lead early in the fourth.

— Marcus Smart did a little bit of everything for the Celtics against the Warriors. The Boston point guard finished the game with 19 points, eight assists and five rebounds, a steal, a drawn charge and even won a jump ball over Warriors center Kevon Looney which led to an emphatic Tatum slam.

— Curry and Andrew Wiggins both were as advertised against the Celtics. The sharpshooting Warriors point guard finished the night with 30 points but was red-hot early with 16 first quarter points. Wiggins was equally impressive with 27 points of his own along with six rebounds.

WAGER WATCH
Josh Richardson saw extended playing time Friday night against the Warriors and could have made you some cold hard cash. Schröder missed the game to a non-COVID illness and Langford left early with a neck injury and Richardson shined in their place finishing with x points. His over/under for points was set at 11 1/2 with -140 odds to hit the over so if you were to have placed $140 down, you would’ve made $100 according to DraftKings Sportsbook as he finished the night with 15.


UP NEXT
The Celtics return to action right away Saturday night as they welcome the New York Knicks to town with tip-off scheduled for 7 p.m. ET at TD Garden.

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Post by 112288 Fri Dec 17, 2021 10:34 pm

Nice effort! A glimmer of a new way of playing basketball. Despite the loss, I have not seen second, third and fourth passes since 2007-2008.

Bottom line, ya need another dominate star and some good role players.

Who knows if we would have won with a full team. This was the hand that was dealt us December 16, 2021. But I do like the new style of play. It will make Tatum and Brown better overall players if they continue the new style.

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Post by cowens/oldschool Fri Dec 17, 2021 11:24 pm

I thought our defense sucked early, giving Curry and Wiggins too many wide open shots. 2nd half the D tightened up, is it too much to ask for to play hard fundamental defense from the start? FT’s killed us, don’t remember a game where we missed so many of both shots at the line in a long time. Jaylen had way too many bad turnovers driving into traffic and is still shaking off some rust. Would like to see him start taking that mid range foul line jumper more, that shot he can get off on anyone. Obviously Al and Dennis would have helped us and we were out more players.

Someone on the board was saying RWill is gonna get himself killed on one of those lobs, especially as he gets under cut on one of those and can we just get him the ball down low? I saw him attempting a jump hook tonight, it looked awkward at best as he clanked it. Don’t know if it’s a coordination thing or a strength thing, but a shame he can’t finish close range shots around the basket in traffic. Watching KAT right now against the Lakers, in a game IT is playing for the Lakers; boy does KAT look good, going end to end and stronger than AD and also very skilled. Guess they wouldn’t take Smart, JRich and RWill off our hands for KAT?

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Post by dbrown4 Sat Dec 18, 2021 7:53 am

I'll need to watch the game recorded but looking at all the vitals, it may finally appear there is a corner turning in our immediate future. I don't say this lightly as you all know I have been throwing the hammer down for quite some time. With half the team out, no less. I don't want to call this a moral victory as I hate that expression because it implies you lost something to get it, in this case the game, but this is positive despite our bad luck. Yep, free throws are free for a reason. Hit what we're supposed to do and we'd have won this one.

Let's see what happens tonight vs. NYK.

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Post by cowens/oldschool Sat Dec 18, 2021 8:25 am

dbrown4 wrote:I'll need to watch the game recorded but looking at all the vitals, it may finally appear there is a corner turning in our immediate future.  I don't say this lightly as you all know I have been throwing the hammer down for quite some time.  With half the team out, no less.  I don't want to call this a moral victory as I hate that expression because it implies you lost something to get it, in this case the game, but this is positive despite our bad luck.  Yep, free throws are free for a reason.  Hit what we're supposed to do and we'd have won this one.    

Let's see what happens tonight vs. NYK.

db  

True if this is the best team in the league, in a game we clearly could have played so much better, and as off as we were, we were still right there with them at the end. A couple/bunch of missed FT’s and Smart’s brain fart at end of half and we could have pulled this one out…..

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Post by bobheckler Sat Dec 18, 2021 1:14 pm

We were down a bunch of players, but that wasn't enough.  We also lost Romeo during the game.  I thought I saw Damon Stoudemire heading to the locker room to suit up (JK).  Regardless, we showed Pride.  We went down 20 and fought back to take a lead against the best team in the league, and it's really not even close.  Not only is their 24-5 record #1, but their differential is a mindblowing +11.4.  #2 is the Utah Jazz at 11.0, but their record is 20-8, 3 1/2 back.  Imagine if Klay was healthy...

Hell, just imagine if we were healthy.  Our 3rd quarter was magnificent.  Offensively? Ok, 27 points, but defensively?  Magnificent.  We played with great energy and effort.  8 turnovers by GSW in the 3rd.

Gary Washburn @GwashburnGlobe
yesterday
Wiggins and Curry were a combined 2-for-11 FG with 8pts in 3Q. #Celtics #Warriors

I thought our depleted roster started to show signs of fatigue in the 4th.  Our shots were short, suggesting that we weren't getting enough height on our jump shots, and we were settling for long shots because we didn't want to take the contact inside.

Posters were putting Marcus Smart down on the Game On! thread, saying he isn't a good point guard, and begging him to stop shooting.  A game tying high 8 assists (Draymond Green with 8 also) says otherwise.  His 3 turnovers aren't too bad.  Just because some of them looked awful doesn't mean they counted for more than 1.  Like that pass where he threw cross court to Tatum who wasn't able to get within 5' of it despite great effort.  An absolute eyesore.  It went out of bounds, a turnover but somewhat importantly a dead ball turnover.  Over the past month, especially on that brutal road trip, we killed ourselves with live ball turnovers that turned into fast breaks for them.  Aside from dishing out dimes Smart had 19 points on 6-12.  He fouled Steph Curry out with a minute left in the game by taking a charge despite having 5 fouls himself.  That's the Marcus Smart brand.  He played like a Champion out there.  Draymond Green is shooting 27.6% from 3 this year and is a career 31.5% 3pt shooter.  He's shooting 60% from the line this year and only averages 71% career.  Anybody running him down because he can't shoot for shite?  He's averaging 7.3apg and 3.0 TO (2.43:1) in 30.3mpg.  Smart is averaging 5.6 and 1.9 (2.95:1) in 34mpg.  Lower numbers overall for Smart, but more efficient, and Draymond's almost 32 years old and has been the Dub's point forward for years.  Luka Doncic is 8.5apg and 4.6TO.  That's not even 2:1 for Pete's Sake!  And he's The New Golden Boy (he's also only shooting 32.6% from 3.  He drives his numbers up because he takes over 8/game).  

Jaylen had 5 turnovers, at least two of them because of his loose handle.  They also had a couple of their 9 team steals off of Jaylen.  In a battle of wings Andrew Wiggins won in just about every category.

Gary Washburn @GwashburnGlobe
yesterday
Five turnovers for Jaylen and at least three of them are strips. It's becoming a real issue. #Celtics #Warriors



Tatum came alive, after a sleepy first half, but he was 3-10 from 3.  As bad as that sounds consider that he was 9-19 on the night.  That means he was 6-9 from 2.  Simple math.  He was hoisting up unnecessary 3s all night.  They are a small team, we should have gone inside every time.  Easier said than done, though.  What they lack in height they make up for with speed.  They rotate extremely quickly to cut off penetrations and then rotate extremely quickly when the penetrator passes out.  GSW has the #1 defense in the league, giving up only 100.4ppg, and last night we got 107 off them.  They also have the #1 offense in the league with 116.0ppg.  We only gave up 111.  Down a couple of key players (Al and Schroder) and we still outperformed the rest of the league, season-to-date, on both offense and defense.



Who are their bigs?  Kevon Looney?  C'mon.  Tweener Draymond Green?  33 year old Euro softy Nemanja Bjelica?  When you're loaded with shooters up and down the roster you don't need bigs.


Tom Westerholm
@Tom_NBA
Why it's important for Tatum to have floor spacers.
POST GAME GOLDEN STATE - HOME FG3bhv2XsAMgT0G?format=jpg

While I have been bemoaning our smaller toolbox of shooters I have to give credit to reputed "non-shooter" Josh Richardson.  15 points on 4-10, 4-7 from 3 and very, very good defense on Curry in the 2nd half.  Steph had 20 points on 5-8, 3-6 from 3, 2 assists and 3 turnovers at the half.  He ended up with 30 on 8-21, 5-14 from 3, 4 assists and 6 turnovers.  That's a 10 point 2nd half, 3-13, 2-8 from 3, 2 assists and 3 turnovers and I give a lot of the credit to Josh.  Curry is great at giving you a fake, which you must honor, and then taking a quick dribble and launching before you can recover.  Josh was challenging the fake but not so much that he just flew by and couldn't recover.  He was also playing phenomenal deny defense.  Curry was not getting the ball clean and a good look at the rim before Josh was on him.  Very impressed with Richardson's overall game last night.

Nesmith filled in for Romeo, who left with a neck injury (no update on that as of now) had a good 23 minutes.  3-8, 2-6 from 3.  Not great, not phenomenal, but played hard and attacked.

Boston Celtics @celtics
yesterday
AARON NESMITH AND-ONE 😤 pic.twitter.com/8kYN74bWJp
https://twitter.com/celtics/status/1472036544408027138

Chris Forsberg @ChrisForsberg_
yesterday
Marcus Smart enjoying the Crash Nesmith experience. pic.twitter.com/Cw4uMVpP3m
https://twitter.com/ChrisForsberg_/status/1472032225818558468


Jay King @ByJayKing
yesterday
Marcus Smart just called Aaron Nesmith “Crash” which I enjoyed.

Pritchard, on the other hand, looks lost.  Last year he was given the green light to shoot, anytime from anywhere.  This year it looks like he has been told to work on his floor generalship (he was explicitly told that for summer league) and now it looks like he's overthinking and tentative with both.  13 minutes with only 2 fgas, both misses, isn't what a shooter like him should be doing.  His 3 assists and zero turnovers is pretty good but he still needs to shoot more. I'm not talking about throwing the kid out with the bath water but Ime needs to talk to his longtime disciple and tell him shooting will open up the floor for penetrations, cuts and passes.  I'm still on board with Schroder being gone soon, just like just about everybody else, so Pritchard is still our point guard (back up at least) of the future, but he needs to get his head straight.  Attack, be aggressive like Nesmith, and the ball will bounce your way.  That's the fruit of effort.  On defense last night he got tortured.  For reasons I don't understand Ime let him get switched onto Wiggins in the paint and help didn't come.  That's like clubbing a baby harp seal.  He also got beat by Curry on a cut and trailed his man on an out-of-bounds ATO.  Green threw a perfect lob to Pritchard's man on a curl over a stack on top and Fast PP wasn't fast.

Enes with good minutes because they don't have anybody who can stop him down low.  As I said before "Kevon Looney?  C'mon".  I've been watching Looney his entire career in the NBA.  He's adequate, that's it.  He sets picks for their shooters, which works because their shooters are so damn good, but they never run plays for him, never even dump the ball down into him for low post passes, nothing.  He has never averaged 20mpg in any NBA season he has played.  He had 10 rebounds last night in 21 minutes, 5 of them offensive, so he did that well but come on.  Your bigs should be killing Kevon Looney.  Robert Williams didn't.

We lost by 4.  Robert Williams was 1-5 from the line.  Overall we were 20-29 from the line, 69%.  We're the #4 ft% team in the league at 81%.  We shoot our season average and that's 23.5 points from fritos.  Hell, we just not miss 8 fritos in the 2nd half and we're tied.  Round it up or down and we're right there at the end.  Smart's Fart and Ime's T was 4 points.  Ime doesn't lose it and there's that frito point we needed.  Tatum's 3-10 from 3.  It didn't help that Steph went 9-9 from the line.  He's shooting 92.9% from the line, so he even upped that last night. This was a winnable game despite being down 20 at one point.

Here's Smart's foul on Curry to end the half.  A questionable call since Curry launched forward and there really wasn't much contact.  Ime was T'd up for calling it 'bullshite', if my lip reading is any good.  There's our 4 points there.  

Jay King @ByJayKing
yesterday
Ime Udoka thought Stephen Curry jumped forward on the last play of the first half: “It looked like Marcus didn’t jump or contest it.”




https://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore/_/gameId/401360259




Bob


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Post by Ktron Sat Dec 18, 2021 7:08 pm

I repeat. I’m a big fan of Marcus Smart. What he’s Great at is what I love about him and we all know what that is. What he’s not great at is PG. Adequate, yes.
We need more than adequate at that position. The eye test AND the overall numbers( deceiving as they may be) indicate that.
Very good game for him last night but that doesn’t change anything going forward. We need him for what he does better than anyone in this league. PG is not it. Keep looking, we’ll get there.

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Post by cowens/oldschool Sun Dec 19, 2021 10:55 am

Ktron wrote:I repeat. I’m a big fan of Marcus Smart. What he’s Great at is what I love about him and we all know what that is. What he’s not great at is PG. Adequate, yes.
We need more than adequate at that position. The eye test AND the overall numbers( deceiving as they may be) indicate that.
Very good game for him last night but that doesn’t change anything going forward. We need him for what he does better than anyone in this league. PG is not it. Keep looking, we’ll get there.

+1

I’m thinking we can pattern ourselves as the Jordan-Pippen Bulls of this era. Use the strengths of Smart for what he can do well and relieve him of too much point responsibility. Remember Ron Harper? very good do everything 6’6” wing, playing with Jordan and Pippen was a key to their defensive success; between Smart and JRich, they can be that defensive role player type to compliment the 2 J’s. I want to see J’s further grow into their role of running the offense, now we need PP and Nesmith to be our sharpshooters in the Steve Kerr role and we could be a lot further along than we thought we were.

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Post by hawksnestbeach Sun Dec 19, 2021 12:16 pm

If RW can stay on the floor and the 2 Js stay healthy, this team will be dangerous in April and beyond. I like our chances better than any year since KG departed. Brad is where he belongs and Ime, too!

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Post by gyso Sun Dec 19, 2021 12:55 pm

Ktron wrote:I repeat. I’m a big fan of Marcus Smart. What he’s Great at is what I love about him and we all know what that is. What he’s not great at is PG. Adequate, yes.
We need more than adequate at that position. The eye test AND the overall numbers( deceiving as they may be) indicate that.
Very good game for him last night but that doesn’t change anything going forward. We need him for what he does better than anyone in this league. PG is not it. Keep looking, we’ll get there.

I don't get caught up in "positions". I'll make an exception here. What kind of "PG" do you want? A Rondo version or a Kemba version? With either type, that takes the ball out of the 2 Jays hands. Then, what position does Smart play? SG? None of this helps our team, as it is constructed.

None of it. Mike and Scal spoke about this last night. I agree with their take on things.

The 2 Jays instigate the offense most of the time. That ain't changing. They kind of take turns. That ain't changing. They bring up the ball and instigate.

The 2 Jays should not spend their time playing off the ball, doing that does not play to their strengths. The coach will just have to accept this, as will fans.

So let's say Tatum instigates the offense 2/5 of the time, so does Brown. That leaves 1/5 of the time for Smart. He is good enough for that role.

I want Smart starting games, finishing games and on the floor during all the other important times. I want Smart playing against their best players, not stuck on the bench when it counts the most.

You may be throwing out the good for the great, and no matter what you are doing, it doesn't work for this team.

IMO



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Post by dboss Sun Dec 19, 2021 1:33 pm

We witnessed a strong effort in th 4 point loss. No doubt 16 turnovers really hurt but what surprised me the most was out free throw shooting. 20-29 69% is why we lost the game. Free throw shooting is all on the player at the line unlike turnovers that can either be self-inflicted or caused by the opponent.

You hate to let a game like this slip through your fingers.

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Post by dbrown4 Sun Dec 19, 2021 6:32 pm

dboss,

I believe that was just an anomaly on the FT's.  Most games have been 80%+.  But when that becomes the stat that kills the "W", it's hard to sweep it under the rug.  It broadcasts the fragile state this team is in between "W's" and "L's" and as we know the record reflects.  Usually another above average stat category would cover the FT shortage.  Not this time.

Well, if we have a game tomorrow, we'll hopefully see the positive trends continuing!  I think you mentioned this in another thread but you are also right about a steady win streak is needed sooner rather than later.  I don't think there is a better time than now for this to happen.  If in a couple of weeks we are still playing .500+/- for whatever reason(s), then I don't see much of a chance for this to change the rest of the season.  The die will be cast.  

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