DOC RIVERS GETS DEFENSIVE AGAINST ACCUSATION THAT HE QUIT ON CELTICS

WEEI


By Jerry Spar

Doc Rivers was part of the dismantling of the Celtics, but he insists his departure for the Clippers was not an indication of him quitting on a rebuilding team, despite the fact that team president Danny Ainge and owner Wyc Grousbeck have said that it was Rivers’ idea to consider a change after nine seasons on the Boston bench.

Asked at Thursday’s NBA draft for a response to ESPN’s Bill Simmons saying he quit on the C’s, Rivers dismissed the comment.

“I would like to call him an idiot, but I’m too classy for that,” Rivers told ESPN’s Shelley Smith. “That’s just his opinion. That didn’t happen. He really needs to know the whole truth, which he doesn’t.”

Responded Simmons, who was part of ESPN’s team at the draft: “The truth keeps changing. I mean, he’s given different quotes about this — he didn’t know, he did know, he kind of knew, he wanted the trade to happen, he was coming back, he needed a year off. When he sticks to his story, I’ll believe the truth.”

Added Simmons: “Just own it. Just admit what you did. The writing was on the wall, the Celtics wanted to rebuild, you didn’t want to be a part of it, you wanted to go to the Clippers, and it happened. Just own what you did.”

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Simmons is one of the few "good" (and I use that term loosely) sports writers in the business. I agree with him here.

dBoss,

Perhaps Simmons hit a nerve in Doc.  

Knowing business pretty well the smoking gun for me that proved Doc instigated this was his May 9th conversation with Danny and a formal followup letter by the Celtics to Doc the very next day in Orlando informing Doc of his contractual obligations to the Celtics.

And oh by the way ........Doc did not open and read the letter........that tells me the conversation was very direct.......Doc had to have ask Danny what his rights were and could/would he be let out of his contract to explore other options.............There was no other reason for the Celtics to write and send  (I am sure a registered letter...return receipt requested to Doc)........a formal letter.........to a coach that was supposed to be a "Team Player or Partner" with Danny, informing him of his contractual obligations.

And, oh by the way................if Doc said he was never approached by the Clippers ...........that the Clippers approached the Celtics about speaking to Doc...................do not believe that bunch of bull..............you have to understand that Doc is being cute ....ya I never spoke to the Clippers before all this..............

YA.....BUT I BET YOU DOC............. ONE OF YOUR HANDLERS DID.........HOW ABOUT YOUR AGENT OR PEOPLE YOU KNOW WHO ARE CLOSE WITH THE CLIPPERS OR FOR THAT MATTER CHRIS PAUL!

That is why you asked about your contract with Danny on May 9th, and that is why Danny sent you a formal letter!

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"Moving on for the benefit of both parties" is not the same as "quitting." Doc gave everything he had to the team for nine years. "Quitting" would be sitting on the bench during games with his legs crossed and just collecting a paycheck.

Although Ainge and Doc may have agreed on what to do logically, it was still an emotional breakup for both of them, and it's an emotional breakup for many fans. Blaming Doc for what little he said during the unfortunately public on-off-on again-off again fiasco makes Simmons sound like a jilted boyfriend.

"He really needs to know the whole truth, which he doesn’t,” said Doc. Yep.

Simmons has a point, though.

It wasn't so much what Doc said, but what he didn't say. All this speculation was swirling around about him going to LAC and he never came out to say if the rumors were true or not. The fact is, Doc wasn't direct about what he did. I think that's probably what gets people going.

k_j,

I don't get how that works. The guy keeps quiet until finding out whether a deal can be made and gets blamed for staying quiet. Or he says something about an incredibly fluid situation when the media and fans aren't privy to what was going on and then gets blamed for saying something.

It's like the Richard Jeni bit about responding to a loaded question from an emotionally volatile date -- there are 40 million possible ways Doc could've responded, and every one of them is incorrect.

I dont blame Doc for not wanting to be part of a rebuild. But him trying to come out of this whole thing squeaky clean is annoying as well.

He signed a 5 year deal knowing that the team would need to rebuild at some point during that 5 years. Part of why he did this was so in any instance (staying in Boston or leaving), he would be considered and perceived as the top paid coach in the NBA. He is getting paid that kind of money from the Clippers - in part because DA set the bar high for him with his last deal.

No matter what way Doc spins it...he reneged on his promise to coach the team for 5 years. No two ways around that. Whether he left for LA as a mutual decision between DA and Doc - or demanded to be moved is not yet known. But Simmons point is taken.

Doc signed a deal for 5 years - when he saw it was going to get tough around here - he said I want out. That is the DEFINITION of quitting.

mrkleen09 wrote:Simmons is one of the few "good" (and I use that term loosely) sports writers in the business.  I agree with him here.  

I love Simmons, his book is great!! agree with 99% of his book.

Doc we know you didn't want to coach the team thru a rebuild without KG and Pierce, its okay, just don't sugarcoat it anymore.....

Gentlemen,

Forget what was said or not said publicly.........Look at the time line and the facts as presented. The logic and actions taken by the parties as they relate to the intentions of Doc is quite clear.

TIME LINE

May 3 - The Celtics lost to the Knicks, and to Ainge’s surprise Rivers expressed concern about returning.
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May 7th - Boston Celtics president of basketball operations Danny Ainge laughed off the rumor. A source of CSNNE's Greg Dickerson called it "absurd." The mere thought of the Boston Celtics sending two aging veterans and their head coach in exchange for some of the Los Angeles Clippers' finest young talent certainly seems far-fetched.

But during a Wednesday interview on WEEI, ESPN's Stephen A. Smith stood by his claim that the Celtics could potentially send Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett and Doc Rivers to Los Angeles for a package including Blake Griffin.

While admitting that "I don’t even think the Clippers are that stupid to let go of Blake Griffin," Smith believes the prospect of pairing Rivers with Chris Paul might be enough for the Clippers to acquiesce to Ainge's high demands. Paul is a free agent, and the Clippers are looking to tempt him into signing a long-term deal.
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May 8th - Ainge approached a still hesitant Rivers, who asked what his options might be moving forward.

Ainge, who initially was adamant that Rivers would return to Boston, said Rivers asked about potential options on May 8 and the two met privately soon after. That's when the Clippers vacancy was discussed for the first time. Rivers expressed interest and the two agreed to examine the possibility so long as it netted Boston enough compensation to allow Rivers to depart.
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May 9th - The Celtics sent Rivers a letter alerting the coach they expected him to fulfill his contract.
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LET US KEEP IN MIND THESE FACTS - Doc had job security. He signed a 5 year $35M contract. Even through the next rebuilding phase, Doc would not be judged on the teams record like he was judged before 2007 - 2008......he won a title. Here is Danny Ainge's take on the Doc Rivers contract signing during his press conference last Tuesday:

"When we signed Doc to the highest-paid coaching contract in the NBA a couple years ago, we talked, we knew the ages of our players," Ainge said. "We knew that we would be here at a phase -- maybe it would have been last year, maybe this year, maybe next year -- but a time to rebuild and restore. We talked about that. At that time, before it hit him, he was all on board and I felt like I did a very good sales job on Doc at that time; maybe he did a sales job on me.

"We knew that this time would come, everybody knew that. I think that coaches are judged by wins and losses ... we're always [graded] on the results and Doc's been around the block, he sort of gets that. He's also been in the rebuilding process, and maybe it hit him. It was really hard those first few years in Boston, that was a real challenge."

IN SUMMARY

Before or Right After May 3rd - Doc through his handlers (Agent or friends close to Clippers) were in contact with the Clippers sniffing out the possibility of Doc going to the Clippers. When asked prior to May 8th meeting with Danny, Doc was vague....because he still did not get an answer form the Clippers.

May 7th - Story breaks with Stephen A. Smith....story is now public.

May 8th - Danny calls Doc and they have a discussion.

May 9th - Danny and Celtics send formal letter to Doc at his home in Orlando.

No one sends a formal letter like that if Doc was thinking of stepping down and going into broadcasting.........the only time they would send a letter like that spelling out Doc's contractual obligations, was if Doc raised that issue of going to another team and talked about the Clippers to Danny in their meeting May 8th.

June 26th Doc Rivers News Conference - He openly admits he did not open the letter sent by the Celtics on May 9th.

Why? He already knew why from the discussion with Danny on May 8th. He obviously broke the news to Ainge that he wanted out (breach of contract) of his contract and the Celtics were legally protecting their position.

Forget all the drama and emotions that played into this 1 1/2 month drama, if you follow the time line and events, you will see how Danny and the Celtics were blindsided with Doc's intentions of breaking his contract. Danny and Celtic ownership tried to rationalize with Doc, but it was clear from Doc's opening intentions on May 8th that it probably would be better to get rid of Doc rather then pay a guy who really does not want to be in his current position as coach of a rebuilding Celtic Team.

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I'm just glad we got a #1 pick for him.

Once upon a time, there was a basketball fan named Simon, who worked in an office. One day, he realized that he did a pretty good job and could probably advance himself by looking around to see if something better was available. And besides, working conditions at his current office were poised to deteriorate considerably. Lo and behold, he found something better. So he took the new job.

The following morning, Simon walked out the door to drive to his new place of employment, and his neighbors, former co-workers, town officials, and members of the press were ringed around the house, screaming epithets and accusing him of being a quitter. He tried to ignore it, but they refused to quit their babble about quitting. They clearly felt personally insulted and thoroughly entitled to be informed and vote on every occupational choice Simon might choose to make.

Simon finally made it to his car and sadly drove away. For some reason, he recalled a full-time advertisement that had appeared in the local paper, the Globe, just the previous day. The ad had been placed by a hockey team from another town that had recently beaten the hockey team from Simon's town for the championship. The message in the ad focused on registering thanks for the class, hospitality and resiliance displayed by Simon's town.

"Yeah, right!" thought Simon as he suffered a lurchin, which is the term for a rush of cold turd to the heart. And he drove off to do his best in his new job—same as the old job.

Sam

BOSTON.COM

Doc Rivers quit on the Celtics
Posted by Adam Kaufman

It’s amazing how much can change in a few days.

Last Friday morning, the Celtics announced a press conference featuring the team’s general manager and president of basketball operations Danny Ainge and head coach Doc Rivers, theoretically to announce the coach’s return for a 10th season amid weeks of rumors to the contrary.

Tuesday afternoon, a long weekend after canceling that sit-down with the media, the meeting was back on, this time with Ainge seated beside team president Rich Gotham to detail the 2013 remake of Doc Hollywood.

The press conference was littered with questions, offered few answers, and sprinkled in uncomfortable humor as Ainge tried to engage clean-cut, warmly-dressed reporters. Who could blame him for seeking levity? The once fiery player probably wanted to punch a wall with each passing query.

Ainge went out of his way to thank Rivers for his nine years of service to the Celtics, filled with friendship, teamwork and, when armed with the proper talent, fine coaching. He said, and I agree, that the C’s don’t raise Banner 17 in 2008 without their motivational leader, and he wished his old friend well out west.

But Ainge was also quick to repeatedly note that this situation was not his idea – Rivers is off to a place he “chose to go” and “wants to be.” He claimed he expected his now former coach to be back on the Boston bench right up until the moment the deal with Los Angeles was completed. Frankly, throughout the entire session, Ainge maintained a look of disbelief that any of this was actually happening and it probably still hasn’t set in.

Likely seeing that and hoping for a juicy sound bite, one journalist inquired if Ainge felt Rivers had quit on the Celtics, given the three years and $21 million remaining on his contract.

“I would never say that he quit,” Ainge remarked, while adding that that Rivers has the pulse of the players and felt maybe a change was necessary, or that he needed a change.

Perception is everything, and based on what’s transpired since the C’s untimely ending on May 3, there is only one reality as it concerns Doc Rivers:

He absolutely, unequivocally quit on the Boston Celtics.

Let’s get this out of the way – I believe Rivers did a good job while in Boston and he should ultimately be remembered fondly for his efforts. No one would question that he gave all that he had over nearly a decade with the Green, but he didn’t need a Magic 8-Ball to know what awaited him when he inked a five-year deal in the spring of 2011 as opposed to stepping away from the game as was widely rumored. Make no mistake, a rebuild is coming and the manner in which Rivers left is worthy of the beating it will receive.

Read between the lines of this comment from Ainge:

“When we signed Doc to the highest-paid coaching contract in the NBA a couple years ago, we talked, we knew the ages of our players (Paul Pierce was 33, and Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen were each 35). We knew that we would be here at a phase – maybe it would have been last year, maybe this year, maybe next year – but a time to rebuild and restore. We talked about that. At that time, before it hit him, he was all on board and I felt like I did a very good sales job on Doc at that time. Maybe he did a sales job on me.”

Translation: He got me. We handed this guy seven mil a year and all his aging stars we could possibly retain or acquire to squeeze a couple more years out of what started as a three-year window, and now he’s walking away because he doesn’t feel like starting over. Does he think this is what I wanted? He probably never planned on fulfilling his deal in the first place!

I don’t blame Rivers for biting at the young Clippers talent, the same money with more power, the bright lights and warm weather, and the inevitable late-night talk show appearances that netted the Celtics a mere 2015 unprotected first-round draft pick. There’s nothing appealing about a rebuild ever, let alone when you’ve been to the top of the coaching mountain. He wants to win another championship, and that day’s not coming at the Garden any time soon, unless maybe you’re surrounding yourself with Bruins sweaters.

I do blame him for not displaying the loyalty he always preached to his players and conveyed to the fans. Ubuntu, be damned. Rivers will address the media in the City of Angels this afternoon and he’ll inevitably explain his desire for a change of scenery and how he felt it would benefit all parties involved.

Spare me.

Theo Epstein used a similar rationale when he weaseled out of the last year of his contract with the Red Sox for a promotion and less controlling bosses in Chicago. Sometimes, whether it’s because you’re staring at a playoff-less future, you don’t like the hard-headed point guard, you’re tired of dealing with the same co-workers day-in and day-out, the grass is greener someplace different, or whatever else, you’re ready to move on, I get that. It’s not simply because you felt like a change. Own it.

While Rivers is busy trotting out the same spin Ainge was forced to spew, he should remember what he said last August after Allen departed as a free agent to chase a title in South Beach.

“I was really disappointed, pissed, because I thought it was for all the wrong reasons. It was more about himself.”

Again, Allen was a free agent, not a guy committed for three more years.

This, Mr. Rivers (since, after all, you’re not really a doctor), is about you and your desire to abandon ship now that it’s spouted a couple leaks. You’re no Gregg Popovich, you’re no Jerry Sloan, and you’re certainly no Red Auerbach. And how do you suppose KG feels, knowing now that parameters of your agreement won’t – at least for the time being – allow him to join you? This whole scenario went from what appeared to be a package deal that could really help the Celtics to one man taking care of himself. Consider it the new era of super teams where coaches, too, can finagle their way into more desirable circumstances.

We don’t know who the next coach of the Celtics will be, other than Ainge’s proclamation that it won’t be him, a decent run back in the 1990’s with Phoenix notwithstanding. We don’t know, as decisions possibly loom quickly, what will be of Pierce’s and Garnett’s careers in Boston with another average-at-best season on the horizon. We don’t know if Josh Smith and Rajon Rondo, old prep school roommates, will finally be reunited. We certainly don’t know how many years of postseason futility, 18-game losing streaks, and evasive ping pong balls could be in store before we’re again realistically discussing Banner 18.

We do know, despite weeks of being assured otherwise by upper management, that the man who proclaimed himself a Celtic is gone. It’s not because he couldn’t do the job. He just didn't want to.

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LIER...LIER PANTS ON FIRE...........DOC


While acknowledging he fared well by moving to the Clippers, Rivers said the Celtics had a strategy and they stuck to it.

“I think last night happened exactly the way Danny the Celtics wanted it to,” he said. “They wanted to unload contracts for draft picks, and I happened to be one of those contracts.”

Added Rivers: “Clearly, yeah, I had a selfish motive. I had a chance to not rebuild and go to a team that is in a different phase of their franchise so everybody benefited. And I clearly, at least I hope, I benefited from it. But this is done together. This is not me walking into the Celtics and saying I quit or anything like that.”

Doc your so full of crap it is coming out of your ears!  I have to admit you are cute with words and sentences...........They are dumping contracts and I was one of them.......BULL @HIT!

Then the next sentence you clearly contradict what you said in the sentence before or more to the point.............YOU LIED!

Simons was right...."THE TRUTH KEEPS CHANGING." WHEN HE STICKS TO A STORY, I'LL BELIEVE THE TRUTH."

AGAIN AS I STATED........DOC'S JUST AN EMPTY SUIT!

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So much rancor and bitterness!

After 12 years of marriage, my wife left me in 1999, and I was sad, disappointed, terribly hurt, and resentful. Although understandable in the short term, none of those emotions served my peace of mind in the long term. I resolved to reflect on what had been good in our marriage and moved on to a happier life.

Doc leaving the Celtics is a similar situation in a way. A sense of betrayal, abandonment, disappointment, sadness, and anger arise in many of us Celtic fans. It's ok to indulge in these emotions for the short term. However, wallowing in them long term does more damage than Doc's actual departure.

Let's give ourselves permission to grieve and then move on. Winning #18 would be the perfect balm to this wound, and Danny is still here, working his magic.

Wise words, Worsester.

WORCESTER

You do bring some common sense to this chapter in Celtic history!  Perhaps I have personal grudge against Doc...and here is why!

Doc was always cute with words and sentences ....call it head fakes..........not revealing the real truth when asked about players not playing well.....or to injuries etc....etc.....I get it and I can live with that because you do not want to give other teams insight into Celtic problems...........besides everyone knows any good coach will not reveal the whole truth when asked about the team......................BUT THIS IS DIFFERENT.

It is one thing trying to cover up about a player or team injuries .........but it is another to try covering up the REAL STORY to protect his own REPUTATION or legacy in Boston as he walks to another team with his services.

People in Boston are not only intelligent sports people.......but they can smell 3 day old Cod lying on the dock......when someone is Shucken & Jiving you with a load of Bull.

As for me....do not insult me Doc............with what you think you can throw up on the wall as the truth...........own up to what happened and move on............you'll be viewed a lot better in future years in Boston if you do!

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No doubt that Doc is obfuscating. When does an adulterer own up to his trangression? Usually only after the next gal turns out to be a dud. The day may come when Doc wishes he'd stayed true to his Celtic bride.

As the Lebanese say, "Revenge is a dish best tasted cold."

This whole situation with Doc reminds me of the Shaggy song,
"It Wasn't Me"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH_StQ6KdW0

In fact, revisiting this video almost makes the Doc escapade worthwhile.

(Yo', man) Yo'
(Open up, man) What do you want, man?
(My girl just caught me) You let her catch you?
(I don't know how I let this happen) With who?
(The girl next door, you know) Man
(I don't know what to do) Say it wasn't you
(Alright)

Honey came in and she caught me red-handed
Creeping with the girl next door
Picture this, we were both caught butt naked, banging on the bathroom floor

How could I forget that I had
Given her an extra key
All this time she was standing there
She never took her eyes off me

How you can grant the woman access to your villa
Trespasser and a witness while you cling to your pillow
You better watch your back before she turn into a killer
Best for you and the situation not to call the beaner
To be a true player you have to know how to play
If she say a night, convince her say a day
Never admit to a word when she say and if she claims
And you tell her baby no way

But she caught me on the counter (It wasn't me)
Saw me bangin'on the sofa (It wasn't me)
I even had her in the shower (It wasn't me)
She even caught me on camera (It wasn't me)

She saw the marks on my shoulder (It wasn't me)
Heard the words that I told her (It wasn't me)
Heard the scream get louder (It wasn't me)
She stayed until it was over

Honey came in and she caught me red-handed
Creeping with the girl next door
Picture this, we were both caught butt naked, banging on the bathroom floor

I had tried to keep her
From what she was about to see
Why should she believe me
When I told her it wasn't me

Make sure she knows it's not you and lead her on the right prefix
Whenever you should see her make the giggolo flex
As funny as it be by you, it not that complex
Seeing is believing so you better change your specs
You know she not gonna be worrying 'bout things from the past
Hardly recollecting and then she'll go to noontime mass
Wait for your answer: go over there
But if she pack a gun you know you better run fast

But she caught me on the counter (It wasn't me)
Saw me bangin'on the sofa (It wasn't me)
I even had her in the shower (It wasn't me)
She even caught me on camera (It wasn't me)

She saw the marks on my shoulder (It wasn't me)
Heard the words that I told her (It wasn't me)
Heard the scream get louder (It wasn't me)
She stayed until it was over

Honey came in and she caught me red-handed
Creeping with the girl next door
Picture this, we were both caught butt naked, banging on the bathroom floor

How could I forget that I had
Given her an extra key
All this time she was standing there
She never took her eyes off me

Gonna tell her that I'm sorry
For the pain that I've caused
I've been listening to your reasoning
It makes no sense at all
We should tell her that I'm sorry
For the pain that I've caused
You may think that you're a player
But you're completely lost
That's why I sing

Honey came in and she caught me red-handed
Creeping with the girl next door
Picture this, we were both caught butt naked, banging on the bathroom floor

How could I forget that I had
Given her an extra key
All this time she was standing there
She never took her eyes off me

Bobc,

Yes, and it says a lot about the class of Bruins' fans as well.  Very much like the time when Canadiens fans booed our National Anthem in Montreal and the Boston fans (at the next Bruins home game) "retaliated" with a loud, sustained ovation honoring the Canada national anthem.

http://www.metro.us/philadelphia/sports/2013/05/06/video-bruins-fans-cheer-canadian-national-anthem-in-2004/

I've always thought Red Sox fans were pretty generous in giving opposing heroes their due as well.

Maybe it's just Boston fans of other sports who actively seek ways to register disdain for people they've spent years cheering.  Aside from Jeb's death, this outburst (especially after the similar vitriol heaped on Ray Allen last year) is definitely the most disturbing and disillusioning thing I've experienced as a member of this forum.

And I'm speaking not as a moderator but as a member who's been through a lot of basketball campaigns. As a moderator, I believe in members' rights to register their opinions civilly.  As a member, I have the right to agree or not to agree with those opinions. As a member, my favorite conversations are those that have a constructive purpose and are based primarily on fact rather than speculation, rumor or innuendo. I feel that, as a member, it's my obligation to ensure that my posts pass the following test: What useful purpose is this post serving? It's distressing how many of my posts never see the light of day because they don't pass that test. And, very often, it's because the post selfishly vents my own emotions by inflicting them on others at their expense. I don't find that constructive. I find it self-serving.

Sam

Or self-disserving.

Amen, W.

Sam

Ah, but what are any post listed on this forum but an extension of one's inner - self thoughts!

Marginalizing them with ones own personal interpretation as to its significance in the forum of open debate, is as dangerous as not allowing them at all!

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