KG and Pierce on booing

“Then don’t come to the (expletive) games,” said Kevin Garnett in a relatively low tone as he headed from the court.

“It doesn’t help when the boos happen, but we’re a group of veterans and we are a team - a real team. You know, we’re not fair-weather. So when that occurs we all sort of just get together and say we’ve just got to grind this out. Through any type of adversity, you grip up and come together. I think that’s where your bond comes and is very much needed at that point.”

Christ, guys, if this doesn't piss you off, I don't know what will. Don't come to the games, KG? Really? Okay... guess you're out of work. Guess you're out of the one NBA accomplishment that means anything. I suppose you'd be content going back to playing for a non-contender?

KG, if you are satisfied with the effort that you and your TEAMMATES have shown throughout the duration of this season, then maybe you're as washed up as the media says you are. I'm not ready to believe that. Directing comments like that towards fans, many of whom have been around through the extreme and frustrating lows of the Rick Petino era, is inexplicable. If you don't play hard, you deserve to hear about it. If you don't play well, and you're boxing out, hitting the floor, and putting your heart on the line, then you don't. That's it.

Tickets at the Garden are expensive. Give us an indication of your appreciation for the opportunity afforded you by the fans every night, or expect to get booed. You don't get paid millions upon millions of dollars to foster this sort of "I'll play in the spring when it means something to me" attitude. Grow up.

On the other side of the coin, Paul Pierce gets it. Maybe its because he's been here through the good and the bad; the highest of highs and the lowest of lows. This is why he is the captain. This is why he is the glue that holds the team together. This is why I get so annoyed when people call him dispensable.

“So I think it’s all about the effort. Regardless if you win or lose, the fans want that effort. When you see the other team beating us to all the loose balls and we’re turning the ball over, I think that’s the things they see and they start to boo about. I don’t think it’s about missed shots and stuff like that." - Paul Pierce

Any thoughts? Is KG right? Should we all blindly support this team despite some lackluster performances (not in terms of anything other than effort)? Ought we to take a leap of faith and cheer when the other team beats us to every loose ball? Am I too hard on KG?

Effort first, second, third..................the wins will follow more times than not!

beat

I think what KG means is that, if your not going to come to games as fans and support the team, "then don't come to the (expletive) games" at all.

But on the same note,
Garnett has to understand that it is hard to support & cheer for the team at home games when they're getting blown out by a team like the Washington Wizards or NJ Nets. Teams that they're expected to be just absolutely demolishing.

And that's where the booing is coming from. The booing should be a wake up call to the team that the energy level Vs Washington is not acceptable. Espically if your a team looking to go far in the playoffs.

Give a quality effort and the fans will be knowledgeable enough to accept that! No team wins every time. However the ticket prices were previously mentioned and they are steep. When fans see players mailing it in, after they have paid hard earned money for a ticket, fans have a right to be upset and vent by booing. Most of these guys on the team now are not hungry enough to give the maximum effort every game, and just pay lip service with standard cliche excuses such as "We have to focus better," etc.The team is likely splintered into at least two factions: Big 3 & Sheed vs the younger players led by Rondo. Umbutu is a thing of the past. We got to build around Rondo with younger atletes. The old guys save for Ray can't give the energy needed over an 82 game schedule. If you're bored with the regular season, get out, sell insurance, slice meat at the grocery store. However, don't try to pass yourself off as an NBA player!-MD.

I guess the booing is a sign of the times. I think today's fans, who pay a bundle to see games, feel entitled.

My only concern is that I believe in positive reinforcement rather than negative reinforcement. I suppose that comes partly from becoming habituated to it long ago. The Russell Celtics submitted stinkers from time to time, and I never heard one boo at Boston Garden. In fact, anyone who booed them even at their worst could very possibly have been lynched.

People would yell advice to Red. "Put in Satch" was the one I remember most often. But otherwise, they'd only yell encouragement. And sometimes it could become deafening.

Of course those teams built a lot of fan equity through their achievements. Fans did everything they could to help the Celts reverse negative results because they had confidence in what the Celtics were cpable of.

Sam

We see the same phenomenon on this board. People that claim to be die hard fans, who flip back and forth rooting for the team or ripping them apart, depending on the latest results.

Most people in modern society are like that about everything. They change jobs like they change their underwear, drop girlfriends and marriages at the drop of a hat, and generally go with the prevailing wind.

I think there have been times when the Celtics have underachieved this season. There have been games when it is painful to watch, as they get totally out hustled and out played by inferior opponents. However, I think there is a lot going on in the background that we dont know about as fans - that would change our minds if we were aware of it.

I think the knees of KG and Pierce are in much worse condition than we know. Perk has had severe tendinitis for months now. Marquis Daniels cant even palm the ball with his injured hand - and who knows how many others have injuries we dont know about.

I find it hard to believe that someone like KG (or Pierce for that matter) is all of a sudden at this point in his career going to stop giving maximum effort. I see the look on KGs face, and what I see is frustration that his body just wont do what it used to. That he cant get up to block that shot, or spin back in the other direction. He seems to be dragging his knee around the court on a regular basis.

Fans can boo if they want to...but not me. I just think it is disrespectful and distasteful.

I was at the game in question and the booing was really not that bad; there were scattered boos, nothing to boohoo about. It was much louder and more coordinated in the Nets game. As a long time Celtic fan who attended a lot of games in the late Sixties and throughout the Seventies, it was a shock to hear the Boston Celtics being booed on their home court. I understand it but have no frame of reference for it.

That was a seriously off-night for KG: not sure if he was hurting, but he wasn't moving all that well and Blatch was the one who looked like the future hall-of-famer. KG did not make his reputation based solely on his height and on physical skills. It was (and still is) mental toughness, that refuse to lose mentality, and he just didn't bring it that night. Neither did Paul or Rajon, if you ask me.

When KG came out of the game, it may have appeared to some people that Doc was putting in the subs, but to me it looked like Doc was benching him. So I'm going to take his foolish statement about not coming to the games as an expression of frustration at his own performance. As the ancient Celtic Druids taught, all anger is self-anger. So, go KG, get angry; get very very angry.

>

Spike

I don't think any of us have the perception of what it is to be a professional athlete. Their job is to play a game at a very high level. They are in the top few % of what they do and are paid more in a year than most will make in a lifetime. So what should we expect? 100% effort every time? What is a fair and reasonable expectation of this team?

Thought about this a lot. And as a fan who might only get to go to 1-2 games a year (money that certainly could be used for other needs) I can certainly see the fans point. I have been to precicely 2 Celtic games in the old garden in my entire life. 72 and 74. I guess I was too much in awe to remember much about either game but the ticket prices were in 72 five or six bucks for a floor seat behind the basket. And as a college kid that was quite affordable.

Booing the home team? Would I do it? A few beers who knows. If they are not putting forth a good effort perhaps there is a good chance I would.

As for things we don't know about I guess that is up to management to let us know what they want us to know esp reguarding injuries. I am certainly of the opinion if you are well enough to set foot on the court, your well enough to play hard, win or loose.

3 times I bought tickets to Celtic games in Philly during the 80's to see Bird. Three times he never made the trip. Was I pissed? You bet.

I guess for me again the bottom line is effort. And if I perceive an absolute lack of it I may very well be vocal about it too.

beat

I think if you look on the back of every NBA ticket sold there is a disclaimer to some effect that the NBA and whatever teams you are watching that night isn't responsible for any of your (our) well beings, enjoyment of the game, future incomes, sex lives, criminal history, etc. It also does not say they owe us any effort or victory for that matter. Yes, we all come into an NBA game with expectations, but it's alot like once you push your bet in poker across the line(buying your ticket in this case) in that that money is no longer yours and hence the probable outcome (or your potential return on that investment or bet or game) is out of your hands (going to the game itself). Also, you buy a ticket at your own risk, I believe it says in some certain terms. The fan is risking everything (injury, etc) when they come to the game. They can even throw you out or refund your money for no reason if they so choose.

KG, in his statement, is encompassing that message on the back of the ticket. We all know these athletes make ridiculous sums but they make those ridiculous sums because people like us feed them. KG knows he is not entitled to anything. He just applied for the job, met the necessary credentials and his paycheck is what he gets for doing that job. There is nothing wrong with what he said. His statement may sting a little and appear to bite the proverbial hand that is feeding him because we take our kids to these games and put out our hard earned dollars and think we are entitled to something, but his statement is 100% correct and accurate. He also was smart enough to give us an out. The Boston Celtics, like it or not, own you (us) nothing. This is their job. You would feel the same way if some people in your office came by and booed you or told you that you suck while you were working for missing the mark that day.

Sam, you know me to be on the positive side like yourself for the most part, but if we are always positive and pumping these guys up, you wind up alot of times with what I call the American Idol phenomenon. If you ever watch the first few episodes of this show each season, they show certain musician who, even if you are tone deaf yourself, you can tell have no ear for music. They are pathetic. Couldn't carry a tune in a bucket. The interesting thing about these people is their background that AI covers just before their live audition. It's the same every time. Usually they are in a church choir or big group of family and friends each of whom keep telling them they are really great at what they do, when they aren't anywhere close to it. That is why they are completely stunned when Simon tells them in no uncertain terms, that their "career" in music is over. They simply have no clue how bad they are because no one has told them they suck. They actually think they can win the whole thing. But we are talking about the difference between an amatuer and a professional.

The Celtics, on the other hand, know they are good. They are professionals. We know they are good. And when they are on, they are very good and impossible to beat. KG's answer comes from knowing that they are good, not the AI phenomenon described above. The idiots, I'm sorry, the poor souls, on AI have not had to face anyone telling them they suck at least until they meet Simon. While it would have been nice and made us feel good if KG acknowledged his fan base by throwing us a bone, I don't expect him to because I placed my bet long ago.

I think Boston knows when they drop an egg. Us reminding them by booing does nothing but let them and the NBA remind us to turn over our tickets and read the fine print. While we are well intentioned (and free to do so) by making our voices and disapproval known given that we have forked out the money and expect something for our entertainment dollar, the Celtics know what is at stake, but they are playing for a paycheck just like you and I do every day and don't owe us anything. These guys would show up to an empty stadium and play if they could get the same check. It just so happens that it is easier to include willing noisy fans (and an ESPN, League Pass or TNT) to help foot the bill so they choose to do it this way.

BTW, Paul is right as well. No further comment on his statement.

Thank God we are in a place where you can express your opinions and not lose your head. But that's what they are, opinions. No one has to like your opinion or even respond to it or owe you anything for it. If you are offended about what KG said you can either turn your ticket over and read the fine print or not open your checkbook in the first place. There are plenty of other ways to spend your entertainment dollar, and for considerably less money. Try local high school basketball. Great, great cheap entertainment you and your kids can safely enjoy for about $20 a game, food included, for yourself and three sons (in my case).

In sum, KG and Paul are both right. Remember the '08 run. That team had a gimmick/motivating factor. They felt they had to have home court advantage to win it all. And, by God, the first 2 rounds made that explicitly clear. This year's team's gimmick/motivating factor is turn it on/turn it off. Beating Milwaukee @ Milwaukee without KG...They know what they are doing. That is a team they may very well be facing in the playoffs in the first round. It appears dangerous to us to play Russian roulette like that and may well prove to be their downfall, but I think they know what they are doing and will show us and give us in the playoffs what we want to see...Banner 18.

BTW, just thought of this. I hate to use maybe a bad example right now, but Tiger for the most part, just plays the majors. Yeah, he plays a few of his favorite tournaments during the year but mainly, he just plays the 4 majors. He turns it on/turns it off. Still the best golfer in the world. No one's complaining about his effort...well on the course...Sorry, Phil.

LeBron...here comes the 18-mile marathon brick wall again. This time it's wearing Green not Blue.

Dbrown,

I think I just figured out why I feel so strongly about supporting this team. Starting when I was a teenager, I was so into them that I regarded them more as associates or family than as performers. If they suffered a cut, I bled. I never felt like a spectator. It was as though we were all in it together. And, for some strange reason—maybe their accessibility—I don't believe I was alone. And, for some strange reason—maybe their accessibility—I don't believe I was alone.

To tell the truth, I feel more removed from today's team. There's a sense of remoteness that sort of dulls the perception of collegiality. Now it's more a matter of respect. But it doesn't really matter. I would never boo a colleague, and I would never boo someone I respect. The passion is still there, and it's not an on/off faucet; there can be no equivocation as far as I'm concerned. It's all or nothing in terms of loyalty. And, for the Celtics and me, it's all in. Cheer them on until I lack the breath to so do.

Sam

Yeah, that's why I keep coming back to them to. My kids are more into them than I am. And of course, I can't lay down!!

I think your perception is right on. But I think it has to do with (y)our longevity in watching this team team. I remember games growing up whether it be college or pro, that were bigger than life. They were my whole life. I think you just become dulled over time and it takes greater and greater "acrobatics", if you will, to get your attention because in most cases, you really have seen it all or seen it before.

I was not into the '08 run as much as I was the '84 and '86 runs. Nowhere close.

I'm with you and all of those on this board. I'm all-in as well. I just love Celtic basketball. Love its history, its players, its organization.

I think we, myself included, have already downplayed it if they win it this year by making comparisons to the '69 team. It's already been done before. Now if they pull it off, we'll be swinging from the rafters and be excited, but life and time have eroded that sense of excitement and that sucks to a certain degree.

One thing I'm not doing this season is saving the losing games of the Celtics for my boys to watch the replays. Probably not very realistic for me to be doing but I just don't want my boys to see them fail. Evan, my middle and most devoted fan, bleeds green. He's 5 years old. He's kept me in several times this year with his undying love and devotion for and to them. It's really impossible for me to quit on the Celtics when I see him get up in the morning, go out and get the paper, open it to the sports section, go to the box score section, pick out the NBA section and start telling me what games I need to record in addition to the Celtics games and asking me to explain why one team beat another that night! I just let him look the scores up in the paper in the morning if the Celtics lost the night before.

That's the kind of stuff that makes me think young again.

Dbrown

Guess all I can say if I didn't care it wouldn't matter. If I choose to yell at um for doing good or bad. And anyway the sound on the TV only goes one way!

The 70's were MY time.

The 80's were an extension of it to a degree.

08 brought back some memories of those times.

Last year when the C's were finally eliminated Marcus drew a BOSTON CELTIC 2010 WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP banner and stuck it on the wall above his bed, it's still there. And no matter what happens It'll stay there.

beat

The problem we all seem to have is that the Celtics, as the saying goes, are not just a basketball team but a way of life. The Celtics do represent certain values called teamwork, integrity and pride. Guys like Bill Russell and John Havlicek were more than basketball players; they were icons of sports, as were Cooz, Tommy and Red, later K.C., Larry and his band of brothers. They're world famous, they made the game popular around the world, and every kid in every country where kids toss up basketballs has heard the expression 'Celtic pride'. Hollywood made a movie with that title.

To the L.A. plastic people those may be just words, but to real Celtic fans who've supported the team since the Fifties and Sixties, they were words we grew up with and tried to incorporate into our own lives.

The current Celtics haven't done much to be proud of - yet. Still, occasionally this season, particularly early on, they showed something approaching teamwork, one of the great concepts of all time. Teamwork will take them past anything except better teamwork. In teamwork there's hope.

spike

You may think it is the sign of the times, however, I have an article written by Ed Gillooly of the Boston Herald about the 1969 team:

"The Jolly Green Giants were struggling at the time after all hopes of placing third had disappeared. But no one ever dreamed the Celtics could perform as pitiful as they did that Sunday while losing a l08-73 decision to Los Angeles on national television. They were boohed loud and long by the Boston Garden fans and deserved every shrieking bit of it. Russell was thoroughly ashamed and closeted for an hour with the team and threatened fines to everyone, including himself, if there wasn't an immediate improvement." It was a man to man talk in longshoremen's language and the message reached home. The Celtics ran roughshod over the final four opponents to regain their confidence and winning attitude."

So.....even back then it happened. Now, we don't have a Bill Russell to pull us up by our bootstraps, but, will Kevin Garnett come alive?????
It is not a sign of the times, we are all human, and most of the fans are in love with this team and are trying to find a way of stirring them up. Can you even imagine booing Bill Russell, Sam Jones, John Havlicek???????
I am not one who would boo at all, however, there are times when I can't stand it any longer and shut the game off!!

So, Kevin, don't get your feelings hurt, don't take it out on fan, just get ticked off and play your ass off.

RosalieTCeltics wrote:You may think it is the sign of the times, however, I have an article written by Ed Gillooly of the Boston Herald about the 1969 team:

"The Jolly Green Giants were struggling at the time after all hopes of placing third had disappeared. But no one ever dreamed the Celtics could perform as pitiful as they did that Sunday while losing a l08-73 decision to Los Angeles on national television. They were boohed loud and long by the Boston Garden fans and deserved every shrieking bit of it. Russell was thoroughly ashamed and closeted for an hour with the team and threatened fines to everyone, including himself, if there wasn't an immediate improvement." It was a man to man talk in longshoremen's language and the message reached home. The Celtics ran roughshod over the final four opponents to regain their confidence and winning attitude."

So.....even back then it happened. Now, we don't have a Bill Russell to pull us up by our bootstraps, but, will Kevin Garnett come alive?????
It is not a sign of the times, we are all human, and most of the fans are in love with this team and are trying to find a way of stirring them up. Can you even imagine booing Bill Russell, Sam Jones, John Havlicek???????
I am not one who would boo at all, however, there are times when I can't stand it any longer and shut the game

So, Kevin, don't get your feelings hurt, don't take it out on fan, just get ticked off and play your ass off.

great post wish we could figure out a way to send this text to KG

RosalieTCeltics wrote:You may think it is the sign of the times, however, I have an article written by Ed Gillooly of the Boston Herald about the 1969 team:

"The Jolly Green Giants were struggling at the time after all hopes of placing third had disappeared. But no one ever dreamed the Celtics could perform as pitiful as they did that Sunday while losing a l08-73 decision to Los Angeles on national television. They were boohed loud and long by the Boston Garden fans and deserved every shrieking bit of it. Russell was thoroughly ashamed and closeted for an hour with the team and threatened fines to everyone, including himself, if there wasn't an immediate improvement." It was a man to man talk in longshoremen's language and the message reached home. The Celtics ran roughshod over the final four opponents to regain their confidence and winning attitude."

So.....even back then it happened. Now, we don't have a Bill Russell to pull us up by our bootstraps, but, will Kevin Garnett come alive?????
It is not a sign of the times, we are all human, and most of the fans are in love with this team and are trying to find a way of stirring them up. Can you even imagine booing Bill Russell, Sam Jones, John Havlicek???????
I am not one who would boo at all, however, there are times when I can't stand it any longer and shut the game off!!

So, Kevin, don't get your feelings hurt, don't take it out on fan, just get ticked off and play your ass off.

That about sums it up, but I'll add a few more things.

I started watching this team when I was VERY young (I don't remember when I saw my first game, but I can't remember a time when I didn't watch them, either). Now I'm 21 years old. I have seen the team at its extreme lows, and at its best in 2008. I support this team year in and year out. No matter how they do at the end of the year, I will come back with hope and vigor for the next season. I am a loyal guy. I have never thrown in the towel. It ain't over till its over. But does that mean that I ought to follow blindly? Does that mean that I have to be satisfied when they lay egg after egg due to arrogance and ill-preparation? Does this mean that I should cheer them on when they're playing with lethargy? I think not.

I want to clear up an analogy that has caused some trouble here. As a fan, I view my relationship to this team as an employer, rather than (as others have stated) as a colleague. That may sound arrogant at first, but come on! If it weren't for us, these guys would not have jobs. That's a fact. Just as employers have the right to be critical of their EMPLOYEES when their effort iS NOT THERE, so do FANS have the right to be critical of their TEAMS when the effort isn't there.

Yeah yeah yeah, the tickets say what the tickets say, but why is that? If you want the answer, you need look no further than to the litigious nature of our society. THE NBA DOES NOT WANT FANS SUING, OR DEMANDING REFUNDS WHEN THEY ARE DISSATISFIED. They are not trying to discourage "booing"! That's completely ridiculous! I'm not demanding a refund. I am wholly invested in this team. I'm certainly not going to sue the NBA, so the back of the ticket does not mean ANYTHING in the context of this conversation.

Kleen, Sam, DBrown, I respect the fact that you are able to stay positive all the time; however, you all seem to have the benefit of living through and bearing witness to some of the best athletes of all times-- and the integrity they brought with them to the game they love. I on't think we see as much of that today. I certainly do not think Bill Russell Would be satisfied with the way this team has played this season-- but how can we know?

The injuries only affect the injured players. I still expect those that come to play hard. Have they done so? I don't think so-- not consistently anyway. Sure there have been moments of brilliance, but in my mind, this turn it off, turn it on attitude is a fallacious justification for poor, lazy, uninspired play.

I totally buy that KG said what he said because was frustrated. I'm fine with that. I'll forgive him, moreover, I'll cheer for him as we enter the play offs! I am not writing this team off, but I am merely asserting my right to express dissatisfaction when it is so warranted. I'm not a boo-bird. I don't look for the negative all the time. However, the type of attitude displayed by KG in that moment of weakness makes my insides twist.

I guess that's all.

I will agree with you on one point. At the price of tickets today, let's say loge seats for $126.00, I guess anyone who is totally disappointed in the product that is put out on the floor thinks that it is okay to boo. I have never been that kind of fan, however, I respect the rights of others who feel that way.

In the two years before "the trades", the team that was put on the floor was far inferior to the team today. Yet, you never heard the crowd booing. That is because we could see the effort that was being put forth by these young guys. I hate this theory that the Celtics were "bored" this season. I wish I could be "bored" for $20plus million dollars a year. Get with it guys,
look in the mirror and see what is looking back at you. Time to give the fans
what they have paid for all year!

NE SportsFan: I wish I was your age again, just beginning. However, I have seen it all, right from the early l960's. There were teams at times that just didn't have the talent that these guys have. However, I have seen the best, that is the one advantage I have over anyone your age. I will hang onto those memories forever. However, I have stuck with this team through thick and thin, so......keep the faith, you may just find that there is still a pot at the end of the rainbow!!

I believe KG was blowing a smoke screen for some of their short coming and was letting off some steam. KG knows what the real deal is in the locker room and what is going down with the team. But his hands are tied. He's not the coach or GM. As far as the boo's go. The boo's are a way of directly reaching the team, coaching stall and management. I mean, few have the privilege of having KG, Doc, Danny or Wyc's home phone number to voice their displeasure or add their two cents on what the team must do. It's harmless, not out of line and allows the fans to let off some steam. It has nothing to do with the price of a ticket paid to see a bad game. It's Celtic pride and and wanting to see the team excel. I think everyone can except a tough loss to a great team it's happened throughout Celtic history but getting blown out too many times to sub par teams this season have people on edge and pissed-off. Hey, we got a taste of champagne in '08 and people want more. Perhaps its the fear of going another 22 years without another taste!

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Rosalie, great find among that treasure trove of 1969 articles you have. I'm sure I was there because I never missed a game, so I must have screened the booing out. However, I was more likely trying to shout down those who were booing, and I know our entire Section 88 would have too. It would have been a very rare event at the Garden in those days.

Sam

NESportsFan,

Different strokes for different folks, I guess. I personally do not feel that paying money to see a basketball game give me anything remotely approaching the entitlement felt by most employers.

Because employers earn that sense of entitlement not simply by paying employees but by being better-informed than the employees about all aspects of the business so they can offer constructive criticism (or even demands).

While fans may earn the right to boo (at least in their own minds) by buying tickets, I can't see one constructive thing it accomplishes. If the players mess up, they already know the fans are unhappy. Most players are more critical of themselves than the fans are because they know more than the fans do about the associated reasons.

I think the booing is more cathartic for the fans than anything else, regardless of rationalizations to the contrary. The fans feel cheated. Their instinct is not to help the players; they're mad at the players. So they open their yaps and boo. There must be some Amendment that covers Freedom of Boo.

It seems to me that the unconstructive booing of players proves that fans should never be thought of as implicit employer. Because, if they're employers, they're lousy ones.

And, by the way, my feeling of collegiality with the Celtics was firmly established before they ever won a championship.

Sam

Sam,

I don't think it is entirely unconcstructive. The silence or boisterousness of a crowd at a basketball game is an incredibly effective tool for turning things around, depending on which way it goes. That's pure energy, and I happen to think that energy sends a stronger message than all the "constructive", articulate words in the world.

Has this team been critical of itself? Sometimes... But mostly they've been unaccountable and arrogant. They've blamed officials. They've stated boredom as a cause. They have, at all costs, avoided recognition of the real, consistent problem. The only time they seem to recognize it is after they get booed. They hit us in the postgame interviews with the same cookie cutter responses, but their boredom shows.

I think it was Rosalie that pointed out that it is the only way we have any recourse with these guys. We can't call them up, or send them our notes, or any of that.

It may not be a perfect analogy, and you do make a very valid point regarding the fact that they know the game much better, and thus, are in a better position to be critical of themselves. BUT, this has nothing to do with basketball IQ. You don't need to know a damned thing to see that there have been several games where this team has thrown in the towel. I'm not booing the team because I think KG's jumpshot needs work. I'm not booing them because they plays they call are inadequate. I'm certainly not booing them because I think I could perform better.

To me, if I'm the CEO of a company, and I have to hire an expert to do computer programming, and he is showing up late, falling asleep at work, and sexually harassing my female employees, I have every right to criticize the job he is doing. Not his skillset, not his programming techniques, but his effort level. The team is not getting booed for their skill set; they are not getting booed for their execution; they're getting booed for something much more fundamental: their effort level. When I would go see the celtics in the Pitino era did I ever boo? Absolutely not. But did the team ever claim boredom with the regular season? Nope. To me, that's just a slap in the face.

I tend to respectfully disagree with you NE, on the employer/employee analogy. We may be colleagues or employers, but we really are gamblers when it comes to these games. We purchase a ticket or follow a team with the expectation of having a great time and enjoy seeing two talented teams battle it out and hopefully getting a win but knowing full we. In a more indirect way we are hoping maybe a hero or two will emerge that either we or our kids can latch on to like an MJ, LB, KG, PP or RA and emulate their strengths and traits.

(Here's a better gambling analogy. We're in a craps game, at the table, without the dice. We can come in any time, spend as much money as we want with no gaurantee of return on investment, with a chance to leave with more than we came in with.)

More often than not, most of that doesn't happen. Our team doesn't win or they have a losing season or most importantly our heroes turn out to be human and come up woefully short, as Tiger found out, for example. In my book, that's a gamble. We hope to be entertained, but our expectations are very high normally and we can come up empty handed and can feel like we've lost everything. Sounds like an option contract in my business. In Celtic Land, we have been blessed, (and some feel cursed over the 22 year span) but mainly blessed by the rich history, current and past, it has provided. Each of us has a part we can latch on to and call it our own. It includes concepts like loyalty, teamwork, hard work, effort, champions, heroes, synergy, dynasty, coming to work 3 hours earlier than everyone else, the 80's, the 60's. That's just the concepts. The visual results are the games themselves, the parades in Boston after the championships, all the villians and teams trying to keep us down and hoisting the O'Brien trophy.

As far as we're footing part the bill for the talent on the floor and in the front office, you are correct. But they don't need us to play or to fund their salaries. We are just a very good willing, paying option and patron. And in the world of economics, supply and demand is all you need to potentially make money. But don't think for a moment if we cut our interest by not showing up to games or booing ourselves right out of our seats that the NBA doesn't have a Plan B to replace us. Clearly, it would be a stupid move on their part, but stranger things can and have happened.

Of course the NBA is reasonable and they expect a certain amount of dissatifaction from the fans and it is warranted and is heard and taken note of.

NE, I think you are correct and I think Sam said it as well that times have changed and there is a shortage of integrity out there now. I think a MeBron feels entitled. At least he certainly acts like it. (And that's why I want his a$$ handed tohim on a platter until he figures it out.) I think KoMe has come around, figured it out and softened a little. Back in the 60's there was relatively nowhere near this type of money available and it clearly affects you attitude. Unfortunately, and I digress, this attitude is gaining steam with the current people and parties running our country right now. I'm entitled to health care and don't have to pay for it. It's a right.

I don't think anyone on the Celtics feels that they are entitled. They don't act like it. They may perform poorly more often this season than we would like, but they certainly don't feel entitled to anything. Not even Banner 18. That must be earned. And that is the beauty of the NBA. No title ever goes unearned.

NE, keep up the loyalty. I cannot claim that as one of my strengths as far as the Celtics go. I was nowhere to be found after the Bird era. I admire anyone who can come through the rough times after 22 years of zilch and see the promised land again.

As I've said before, I think we are in for a very pleasant surprise come playoff time. I think this teams is a thousand times better suited for playoff basketball than regular season. I think that's what made the '69 team stick out more than most other championship teams in that there was so much against them, although I've experienced them through others stories, eyes and ears since I was only 5 at the time. I've got to believe Doc's motivational speeches are laced with clip after clip of the '69 season. If not, he's missing the missing link.

All I'm asking for the Celtics to do is get to 4 games before their opponent does 4 times. I'm only asking them to win 57% of their games in the playoffs. They've already won 62.5% so far. I'm actually asking for less!!!

Go Celtics!!

This is a great thread. Different views from various people but everyone keeping it civil. I think both sides have valid points. I think the thing to keep in mind is that there really have only been a few games this year where the crowd has voiced their displeasure. It's not as though Boston fans have made a name for themselves as being negative or too hard on their teams.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the first game the crowd boo'ed this season was the horror show vs. Memphis in early March. I happened to be at this game. I didn't boo, I just quietly seethed in my $90 seat, but I'm not going to deny that a small part of me felt some satisfaction that people were letting the team know just how disappointed they were with the effort. I was also at the Denver game two weeks later and the only boo's I heard were directed towards the guy three rows in front of me wearing a baby blue headband and sporting a hair-do that would make the Birdman proud. The Garden was electric and people were shouting their praises to the C's all night.

Now obviously these games were complete opposites, but I've also been to 7 other games this year, 3 losses and 4 wins. The losses were to Orlando, LA and Atlanta. They were big games that the C's and the fans really wanted to win. They played hard in all 3 games, but they still lost. And there was no booing.

My point is that fans aren't booing the result, they are booing the effort, or lack thereof, expended to get to that result. Is it constructive? I guess that depends on the player. PP's quotes seem to imply that he gets it and maybe he will use it as a motivator. He sure had a great game vs. Milwaukee. KG's quotes sounded more reactionary and we haven't seen him play since, so I guess we'll have to wait and see. Is it warranted? I think so. There was certainly nothing to cheer about in the Memphis and Washington games.

Ever since this team was put together, they have had the adulation of the crowd night in and night out. I, myself, touted them from the beginning as a team who could put three more banners up in the rafters. All of a sudden,
when they played so horribly that fans just couldn't stand it any more. It was the effort, not the players themselves that were being booed. However,
it just shocked KG a little, I think. People go to work every day and work hard.
Most don't get the pats on the back that these guys have become used to.
I think KG was a bit ashamed of the effort put forth by his team, but he lashed out at the wrong people. The fans have supported him for years. After watching a few replays of the game, though, I bet he finally "got it".
I see a fiery Garnett for the playoffs.