Is their youth (inexperience) catching up with them ?

I've always heard that in sports - that mind and body peak at ages somewhere between 28 and 32. If this is true - consider the following.

Since 1990-91 (27 years) the nba champ has had the following player age figures.
Of the top 10 players, based on minutes played per game, each nba champ had the following number of players that were under 24 years of age.

6 champs have not had any of its top 10 players at under 24 years of age
16 champs had 1 player
4 had 2
1 had 3 ,,,, (The 2008-09 Lakers)

The present Celts have 5. And if age is making it's presence felt on the Celts - what is the cure?


swish

swish wrote:   I've always heard that in sports - that mind and body peak at ages somewhere between 28 and 32. If this is true - consider the following.

       Since 1990-91 (27 years) the nba champ has had the following player age figures.
 Of the top 10 players, based on minutes played per game, each nba champ had the following number of players that were under 24 years of age.

   6 champs have not had any of its top 10 players at under 24 years of age
   16 champs had 1 player
   4 had 2
   1 had 3 ,,,, (The 2008-09 Lakers)

  The present Celts have 5. And if age is making it's presence felt on the Celts  - what is the cure?


  swish

Wait a year and everyone will be older

We still are in a good good overall position.

Our players/core still has a lot of upside, with Hayward back and another year of seasoning/improvement for the rest, we are very close....maybe not this year, but a little tweaking and growth, we will be right there.

Let’s pray Cavs don’t get Ayton and sooner or later we will need a monster board eater, but we’re still close.

Most young teams are not this good.

The notion that we have a championship expectation at some point defies the youthful profile on this roster.

The Celtics will add a frontline stud when the right opportunity presents itself.  

We should however not overlook what teams are winning with.  The Celtics talent is primarily guards and wings.  The last stud center to win a title was Tim Duncan.

dboss wrote:Most young teams are not this good.

The notion that we have a championship expectation at some point defies the youthful profile on this roster.

The Celtics will add a frontline stud when the right opportunity presents itself.  

We should however not overlook what teams are winning with.  The Celtics talent is primarily guards and wings.  The last stud center to win a title was Tim Duncan.

[quote="dboss"]"Most young teams are not this good."

Sort of depends on which Celtic team turns out to be the real Celtic team - The 22-4 team or the 18-15 team.

swish

dboss wrote:Most young teams are not this good.

The notion that we have a championship expectation at some point defies the youthful profile on this roster.

The Celtics will add a frontline stud when the right opportunity presents itself.  

We should however not overlook what teams are winning with.  The Celtics talent is primarily guards and wings.  The last stud center to win a title was Tim Duncan.

Right, but there are so many young monsters out there, we match up great with GS, they don’t have a monster 5, teams with stud 5’s have been killing us lately and in a matter of time a franchise will get enough pieces around that monster 5.

With college players leaving after one year, 25 could be the new 28. Smart and Rozier are still not at their best yet. Marcus turns 24 on March 6th. Wow, Terry also turns 24 on March 17th. They were born within two weeks of one another.

Those two plus Jaylen and Jayson are not usual young prospects. Even Rozier showed a lot of pizzazz and flash as a rookie. Avery Bradley took a few years. It doesn't take forever.

So maybe the questions should not center around age, but how good are player ceilings to begin with and what kind of teams are they joining.

Horford and Irving need to be the alpha dogs. Tatum is great, but only if he is in a backup, go with the flow role. Brown is ready for more responsibility because he's older and more experienced, yet but not by much.

Guys like Morris hurt by ruining the flow that naturally takes off pressure on all players. Irving would look overrated without Horford. Isaiah would have looked like fool's gold without Avery and Marcus bailing him out on defense. It takes a village of players on the same page.

Brad should take some heat and I'm glad he is. Even geniuses can both fail and improve.

The team needs Kyrie to kick it up a gear like Pierce did in 2008. The Big Three guys sublimated their diva roles for the greater good. Morris simply has too much tunnel vision. Irving has too much of a good handle to not become a better facilitator.

I am agreeing with Cowens on the need for less Morris and more Monroe. I am agreeing with everyone saying Brad needs to mix it up better with strategies. I'm sure Swish would love to eat some crow and the C's go on a tear flying into the playoffs. I have been very pro-optimism all season. I don't like the taste of crow. Maybe the opposite happens from what I predict. Maybe I need to go full on negative to help the team. Sometimes I get superstitious like a baseball player.

No. I still think the Celtics are in the hunt until elimination. That's the nature of sports and humanity, to never give up. Let's see what they got coming out of the break.

Phil Pressey wrote:With college players leaving after one year, 25 could be the new 28. Smart and Rozier are still not at their best yet. Marcus turns 24 on March 6th. Wow, Terry also turns 24 on March 17th. They were born within two weeks of one another.

Those two plus Jaylen and Jayson are not usual young prospects. Even Rozier showed a lot of pizzazz and flash as a rookie. Avery Bradley took a few years. It doesn't take forever.

So maybe the questions should not center around age, but how good are player ceilings to begin with and what kind of teams are they joining.

100% on the money, in my opinion.

cowens/oldschool wrote:

dboss wrote:Most young teams are not this good.

The notion that we have a championship expectation at some point defies the youthful profile on this roster.

The Celtics will add a frontline stud when the right opportunity presents itself.  

We should however not overlook what teams are winning with.  The Celtics talent is primarily guards and wings.  The last stud center to win a title was Tim Duncan.

Right, but there are so many young monsters out there, we match up great with GS, they don’t have a monster 5, teams with stud 5’s have been killing us lately and in a matter of time a franchise will get enough pieces around that monster 5.

I still want the Celtics to add a stud center.  If they cannot find that give me a gifted PF.

swish wrote:

dboss wrote:Most young teams are not this good.

The notion that we have a championship expectation at some point defies the youthful profile on this roster.

The Celtics will add a frontline stud when the right opportunity presents itself.  

We should however not overlook what teams are winning with.  The Celtics talent is primarily guards and wings.  The last stud center to win a title was Tim Duncan.

 

dboss wrote:"Most young teams are not this good."

Sort of depends on which Celtic team turns out to be the real Celtic team - The 22-4 team or the 18-15 team.

 swish

I said good not great but even 18-15 is good.  Not great but that is good.

I think this is the best collection of young talent that we have seen.  We have already seen exponential growth.  I think it would be well not to dwell on what happens this year including the 16 straight wins.  Without GH we cannot really judge how good this team is going to be.

dboss wrote:

swish wrote:

dboss wrote:Most young teams are not this good.

The notion that we have a championship expectation at some point defies the youthful profile on this roster.

The Celtics will add a frontline stud when the right opportunity presents itself.  

We should however not overlook what teams are winning with.  The Celtics talent is primarily guards and wings.  The last stud center to win a title was Tim Duncan.

 

dboss wrote:"Most young teams are not this good."

Sort of depends on which Celtic team turns out to be the real Celtic team - The 22-4 team or the 18-15 team.

 swish

I said good not great but even 18-15 is good.  Not great but that is good.

I think this is the best collection of young talent that we have seen.  We have already seen exponential growth.  I think it would be well not to dwell on what happens this year including the 16 straight wins.  Without GH we cannot really judge how good this team is going to be.

dboss

"I think this is the best collection of young talent that we have seen" Time will tell if they will maximize their potential. I've seen too many great prospects, in all sports, flatten out and fail to reach the heights predicted - but I do fully understand your loyal Celtic optimism.

swish

swish wrote:

dboss wrote:

swish wrote:

dboss wrote:Most young teams are not this good.

The notion that we have a championship expectation at some point defies the youthful profile on this roster.

The Celtics will add a frontline stud when the right opportunity presents itself.  

We should however not overlook what teams are winning with.  The Celtics talent is primarily guards and wings.  The last stud center to win a title was Tim Duncan.

 

dboss wrote:"Most young teams are not this good."

Sort of depends on which Celtic team turns out to be the real Celtic team - The 22-4 team or the 18-15 team.

 swish

I said good not great but even 18-15 is good.  Not great but that is good.

I think this is the best collection of young talent that we have seen.  We have already seen exponential growth.  I think it would be well not to dwell on what happens this year including the 16 straight wins.  Without GH we cannot really judge how good this team is going to be.

dboss

     "I think this is the best collection of young talent that we have seen"     Time will tell if they will maximize their potential. I've seen too many great prospects, in all sports, flatten out and fail to reach the heights predicted - but I do fully understand your loyal Celtic optimism.

   swish

I also can think of several other teams with a collection of young talent.

dboss wrote:

swish wrote:

dboss wrote:

swish wrote:

dboss wrote:Most young teams are not this good.

The notion that we have a championship expectation at some point defies the youthful profile on this roster.

The Celtics will add a frontline stud when the right opportunity presents itself.  

We should however not overlook what teams are winning with.  The Celtics talent is primarily guards and wings.  The last stud center to win a title was Tim Duncan.

 

dboss wrote:"Most young teams are not this good."

Sort of depends on which Celtic team turns out to be the real Celtic team - The 22-4 team or the 18-15 team.

 swish

I said good not great but even 18-15 is good.  Not great but that is good.

I think this is the best collection of young talent that we have seen.  We have already seen exponential growth.  I think it would be well not to dwell on what happens this year including the 16 straight wins.  Without GH we cannot really judge how good this team is going to be.

dboss

     "I think this is the best collection of young talent that we have seen"     Time will tell if they will maximize their potential. I've seen too many great prospects, in all sports, flatten out and fail to reach the heights predicted - but I do fully understand your loyal Celtic optimism.

   swish

I also can think of several other teams with a collection of young talent.  

dboss

And it's these other teams that have me viewing the Celtic future from a realistic perspective rather than optimistic one.

swish

Being realistic and optimistic are not mutually exclusive feelings about things.

dboss wrote:Being realistic and optimistic are not mutually exclusive feelings about things.

dboss,

I couldn't agree with you more...

except when it comes to filling annual income tax returns.

Regards

dboss wrote:Being realistic and optimistic are not mutually exclusive feelings about things.

dboss,,,,,, You got me on my wording - correction - "Because of other talented young teams in the league - I'm not as optimistic about the the Celtic future as many other fans are"

swish

A puncher's chance is nothing to sneeze at. Some of these other teams are dreaming if they think they have that, say Washington or Milwaukee.

Start Smart, move Jaylen to small forward and Tatum to bench scorer role, then the team is not so inexperienced. Kyrie and Al are the core of the puncher's chance. Kyrie has already led a team to a championship.

I'm not saying those guys play like video games, but it is in their ceilings. Pierce was very good. Then he became great but towards the end of his prime. This is Al Horford's now. He is the true team captain and leader, with perhaps Marcus Smart as Robin or Alfred the butler.

My mind is wandering without games. There are only 23 left. Savor them and the playoffs. It will be Summer soon and then it will be ugh, no real games until November. The time right now through until elimination or Cinderella glory is the main seasonal course.

If one must be a curmudgeonly wet blanket, it'll be interesting to keep an eye on a bunch of players. So when the team is great next year, it won't be, "I didn't see that coming."

I don't think anyone knows how this C's season will conclude. But I do know that the light at the end of the 2017-18 NBA tunnel is approaching.

I respect people who think the C's have no real chance this year. I don't agree. I am sort of agnostic. I am both realist and optimistic. Buster Douglas beat Mike Tyson. No one saw that coming? Never say never. The roster is undeniably stacked, imho. Even if the Celtics choke and it gets ugly, it probably won't mean much long-term because the core is so young. It becomes a learning experience.

This is basically a free poke at trying to steal a title.

Phil Pressey wrote:A puncher's chance is nothing to sneeze at. Some of these other teams are dreaming if they think they have that, say Washington or Milwaukee.

Start Smart, move Jaylen to small forward and Tatum to bench scorer role, then the team is not so inexperienced. Kyrie and Al are the core of the puncher's chance. Kyrie has already led a team to a championship.

I'm not saying those guys play like video games, but it is in their ceilings. Pierce was very good. Then he became great but towards the end of his prime. This is Al Horford's now. He is the true team captain and leader, with perhaps Marcus Smart as Robin or Alfred the butler.

My mind is wandering without games. There are only 23 left. Savor them and the playoffs. It will be Summer soon and then it will be ugh, no real games until November. The time right now through until elimination or Cinderella glory is the main seasonal course.

If one must be a curmudgeonly wet blanket, it'll be interesting to keep an eye on a bunch of players. So when the team is great next year, it won't be, "I didn't see that coming."

I don't think anyone knows how this C's season will conclude. But I do know that the light at the end of the 2017-18 NBA tunnel is approaching.

I respect people who think the C's have no real chance this year. I don't agree. I am sort of agnostic. I am both realist and optimistic. Buster Douglas beat Mike Tyson. No one saw that coming? Never say never. The roster is undeniably stacked, imho. Even if the Celtics choke and it gets ugly, it probably won't mean much long-term because the core is so young. It becomes a learning experience.

This is basically a free poke at trying to steal a title.

Phil,

"This is Al Horford's now. He is the true team captain and leader, with perhaps Marcus Smart as Robin or Alfred the butler."

Maybe more like The Green Hornet and Kato (played by Bruce Lee) than Batman and some British butler.  


bob


.

I think Al is the spiritual leader on this team because of his demeanor but Marcus is the emotional leader on this team.

Yes, Al is basketball sage Al Horford on the mountaintop of basketball wisdom. Jaylen Brown might have some of that inward character. They are lead by example guys. Smart is the pitbull and mysterious wild card. He is the army and electricity.

The team will really need a lot of guys playing very well at the same time- Smart, Monroe, Theis, Rozier, Brown, Tatum, Morris and Baynes. Kyrie and Al are the only two I expect greatness from as long as they are healthy. The others I expect to play smart team ball and fit around the top two. It'll probably be Marcus Smart based on his last name, if I had to guess who is most likely of the core to start breaking out. Jaylen still has some things to solve and Jayson is too young. The rest are proven NBA roster guys. I think Theis and Rozier have proven themselves.

The roster is ten deep right now. Brad Stevens should be able to get the team back on track or he should take some blame if the season fizzles. How is that not a stacked roster?

Everyone swoons over Philly or Anthony Davis, but the Celtics are stacked. Kyrie can only get better as a Celtic.