NCAA Corruption Probe

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Post by dboss Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:42 pm

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2761098-miles-bridges-among-players-schools-reportedly-listed-in-ncaa-corruption-probe

Rookies Markell Fultz and Dennis Smith are mentioned as having received thousands of dollars.



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Post by dboss Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:43 pm

Big time programs may be in violation according to the report

"Duke, North Carolina, Texas, Kentucky, Michigan State, USC and Alabama are among the schools potentially in violation of NCAA rules for giving "impermissible benefits and preferential treatment for players and families of players," per the report."
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Post by k_j_88 Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:00 pm

No one should be surprised. Attracting top talent is a competition in and of itself. It's the metagame of college basketball (and college football).

If a prospect is choosing between 3-4 schools, it only makes sense to choose the institution willing to sweeten the deal the most.


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Post by NYCelt Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:59 pm

This one is going to implicate many if not most of the top programs, yet assessing even penalties will be difficult, if not nearly impossible.

The heart of the matter is that the payments and rules infractions seem to have come from one or more agencies. In many cases the school and program may not have had any knowledge this was going on. In the schools or programs that were complicit, proving the actual personal connections will not be any easier. In many cases, the schools are already stating that named players have not violated rules, and you can bet they're willing to put backing into legal defense to preserve their name and program status.

The high number of impoverished families involved, willing to have an agent steer them to a particular school in return for benefits, in order to stay connected and then become a client at draft time, is tragic. Despite clear NCAA rules about agencies steering clear of amateur players, there is always the temptation. it's a relatively low upfront cost for the agency, in return for a high and fairly quick payoff if the kid is a top talent. A number of schools have influential alumni willing to make the bridge to an agent if it favors their school.

At the heart of it, the ones who stand to lose the most are kids who are D1 talents, yet certain one-and-done for both financial and academic reasons.

The debate around this is not new; do you pay a college athlete? In my opinion, there are as many reasons against as for. One long proposed solution would be a minor league system similar to baseball. Those with NCAA talent, but not the academic or fiscal ability, could go there. The borderline success/failure of the G-League illustrates the difficulty with that concept. Sponsors making big bank on NCAA basketball would probably fight the shift. Even if it did work, it would then diminish the  popular NCAA program. Schools aren't likely to be eager to help foster that change toward less revenue. On the either hand it would eventually mean that student-athletes, would again be largely actual students.

No simple solution. This is a problem that has gone on in some form at least back to the 1940's, and has apparently only grown. The greatest crime may be that this will probably stand a chance to blow over in time, without any real change. The big money sponsors will need to be brought into being part of the solution before change is possible, and that will take time.
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Post by k_j_88 Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:12 pm

The economics of the situation can't be stated enough. Star players attract attention and revenue to major programs. The better the program performs, the easier it is to cultivate a perpetual influx of talent. Alumni and other donors are much more likely to donate funds when the program is enjoying success.

As we all know, a lot of kids come from underprivileged environments. And to people in this situation, money has a great deal of immediacy in terms of pure survival. $100K is huge to a family with no conceivable means to move up the socioeconomic ladder.

Another thing is that top talents are often times one and done. If a rookie scale contract is going to net you over $30M in 5 years, it only makes sense to pursue it. High school players are unable to directly join the NBA anymore as a result of the rule change.

I think a minor league system could theoretically work, but how do we go about balancing the G-League with the NCAA?

In either case, I have no issue with a student-athlete being able to profit off of their talents.


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Post by k_j_88 Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:18 pm

http://www.newsweek.com/2017/05/19/tax-havens-richest-us-colleges-get-richer-606707.html

While this article may not be sports-related, it does dig into some of the financial power that major universities in the US have. A full-ride athletic scholarship is literally a drop in the bucket to these schools.


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Post by NYCelt Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:49 pm

KJ,

Interesting article. Sometimes a story doesn't have to be directly related to sports to add to the discussion. Thanks for posting this.

The only point they make that I can see they got wrong is the amount of money going to financial intermediaries, or Wall Street for lack of a better name. Newsweek claims the standard management fee for endowments is 2%, and it's almost always .50% or significantly less. Most of the sizable Ivy League schools, for instance, have a committee with a hand in management, and pay around .10% to outside management firms. They may be going by rates filed in disclosure statements, which are maximums and almost never used. That's still a good amount of money, but also a more than fair fee for the work done. I think Newsweek succumbs to the unfounded but crowd-wowing sensationalism of demonizing the financial community, needlessly and often.

It is true that many universities have large endowments, and, as you state, a scholarship is pretty small change in comparison. NCAA rules do restrict the number of scholarships that can be granted, per team, per school. At least when it comes to men's sports, only two sports, football and basketball, can even offer a full scholarship. Non-D1 sports can't offer athletic scholarships. At least not directly. Some IIs, IIIS and NAIAs, do, fairly openly, award money to student-athletes, but based on other stated criteria that covers the actual intent. Technically, this doesn't violate NCAA rules. I personally know one DIII school's financial administrator in charge of structuring assistance packages for Student-athletes. The aid isn't often that big. Those schools may tap even less of their endowments to direct toward aid package programs. Part of easing the burden might be to broaden the range and number of these packages allowed. That might then help open the wallets a little further.

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Post by kdp59 Sun Feb 25, 2018 7:44 am

complete ban of a couple MAJOR schools FOREVER will fix the problem.

don't tell me the schools don't know money is going to players parents /friends, we all know that's BS.

BAN a couple major players (Kentucky, NC, Duke, WHOEVER) and make a statement that there is a ZERO tolerance rule now. Any other schools that turn a blind eye will get the same permanent ban in the future.

anything less is a slap on the wrist and will not fix the problem.

oh yeah...and PAY the damn players that are earning you money in college sports!

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Post by bobheckler Sun Feb 25, 2018 11:00 am

Acton's Axiom - "Pwer corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely"



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Post by mulcogiseng Sun Feb 25, 2018 11:10 am

I think that it is past time for a little spring cleaning.

1. The NCAA needs to tell the NBA to get their own minor league and stop ruining college basketball with one and done players.

2. The NCAA needs to bring down the hammer on these teams, their AD's, and coaches. No scholarships for 3 years for these offending schools.

3. The coaches and AD's have to go or there should be more penalties. That's right, fire Coach K. It looks like UofA is about to do exactly that with Sean Miller.

4. The NBA has to make the G-league THE minor league venue for NBA players. That means the players need to be paid more so that the G-league is a viable alternative to the NCAA.

In this manner the NBA will provide their own minor league instead of forcing the NCAA to do double duty. While it may not restore the basketball student athlete to a four year commitment to play college ball it will be a lot easier for players to play 2 or 3 years and that will restore the integrity of the college game.

As others have said, by funneling the need students who are only interested in an NBA spot, to the G-league, they ratchet down the likelihood of rule breaking at the college level. Even so, it is still time for these college kids to share in the revenue they are producing.

The problems are real and the solutions are evident. Now it just takes the will to get it done.
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Post by gyso Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:15 pm

mulcogiseng wrote:I think that it is past time for a little spring cleaning.

1. The NCAA needs to tell the NBA to get their own minor league and stop ruining college basketball with one and done players.

2.  The NCAA needs to bring down the hammer on these teams, their AD's, and coaches. No scholarships for 3 years for these offending schools.

3. The coaches and AD's have to go or there should be more penalties. That's right, fire Coach K. It looks like UofA is about to do exactly that with Sean Miller.

4. The NBA has to make the G-league THE minor league venue for NBA players. That means the players need to be paid more so that the G-league is a viable alternative to the NCAA.

In this manner the NBA will provide their own minor league instead of forcing the NCAA to do double duty. While it may not restore the basketball student athlete to a four year commitment to play college ball it will be a lot easier for players to play 2 or 3 years and that will restore the integrity of the college game.

As others have said, by funneling the need students who are only interested in an NBA spot, to the G-league, they ratchet down the likelihood of rule breaking at the college level. Even so, it is still time for these college kids to share in the revenue they are producing.

The problems are real and the solutions are evident. Now it just takes the will to get it done.

I agree with much that you propose.

In addition, eliminate the one and done rule. Let the market speak. If a player is good enough to make the NBA, so be it. If a player falls into the next tier, then G league for them. Either way, it creates a path for them to get out of the poverty that many players and their families are familiar with.

For those players that do go on to college, make class attendance mandatory and verifiable. Create actual classes that are relevant to young athletes, like Money Management 101, Life Skills 101 (how to apply for an apartment, do laundry, prepare food, shop for food and clothing, when to use Uber, etc.) It wouldn't hurt if the NBA and the G league also had mandatory seminars on some of these topics as well.

gyso


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Post by dboss Sun Feb 25, 2018 2:04 pm

kdp59 wrote:complete ban of a couple MAJOR schools FOREVER will fix the problem.

don't tell me the schools don't know money is going to players parents /friends, we all know that's BS.

BAN a couple major players (Kentucky, NC, Duke, WHOEVER) and make a statement that there is a ZERO tolerance rule now. Any other schools that turn a blind eye will get the same permanent ban in the future.

anything less is a slap on the wrist and will not fix the problem.

oh  yeah...and PAY the damn players that are earning you money in college sports!


kd59

I agree that players should be paid. With respect to your suggestion that offending schools should be Banned, how long should they be banned for?
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Post by dboss Sun Feb 25, 2018 2:45 pm

mulcogiseng wrote:I think that it is past time for a little spring cleaning.

1. The NCAA needs to tell the NBA to get their own minor league and stop ruining college basketball with one and done players.

2.  The NCAA needs to bring down the hammer on these teams, their AD's, and coaches. No scholarships for 3 years for these offending schools.

3. The coaches and AD's have to go or there should be more penalties. That's right, fire Coach K. It looks like UofA is about to do exactly that with Sean Miller.

4. The NBA has to make the G-league THE minor league venue for NBA players. That means the players need to be paid more so that the G-league is a viable alternative to the NCAA.

In this manner the NBA will provide their own minor league instead of forcing the NCAA to do double duty. While it may not restore the basketball student athlete to a four year commitment to play college ball it will be a lot easier for players to play 2 or 3 years and that will restore the integrity of the college game.

As others have said, by funneling the need students who are only interested in an NBA spot, to the G-league, they ratchet down the likelihood of rule breaking at the college level. Even so, it is still time for these college kids to share in the revenue they are producing.

The problems are real and the solutions are evident. Now it just takes the will to get it done.

mulcogiseng

The G League is the minor league for the NBA.

The problem as I see it is the arbitrary one and done rule.  Those players that play one year and then enter the draft would have gone pro right out of high school if not for the one and done rule.

The issue with college teams using the backdoor to pay players as an enticement is not new.  It has been going on for decades.  The only issue that I have with it is that it undermines competition for the best high school players.  The Powerhouse teams can buy players and the lesser schools cannot.  Otherwise I have no problem with player X getting 100k to play for a school like Arizona.

The two things that I would like to see is elimination of the one and done rule and the implementation of a salary structure that allows college teams to pay their players.  I would like to see a graduated payment structure that increases based on how long the player stays in school and on the team.  Maybe players would choose to stay a year or two longer if they were able to address their financial needs.

Colleges that have violated the current rules must be held accountable. Take away scholarships and levy fines against coaches and others that have violated the rules. I would not necessarily fire coaches and AD's although circumstances may dictate the severity of the punishment. It would depend on the situation.

In the end, this is all about the money that college athletics generates. This is all about behind the scenes enablers that exploit the financial needs of both student athletes and schools. Everyone wants to get paid.
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Post by NYCelt Sun Feb 25, 2018 8:52 pm

The heart of the problem here is still the agencies. They're problem number one before the schools. The schools aren't paying these families.

Too many schools have been implicated; there aren't going to be any major penalties handed out. Doubtful more than a token coach or two gets penalized or fired. And those will have to have a direct, provable link before action is taken.

Business will go on as usual for the schools and the NCAA.

To ease the problem, you need to go after the agencies. So far, I think only one is being looked at. As is often the case, the witch hunt is going in the wrong direction.
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Post by k_j_88 Sun Feb 25, 2018 9:20 pm

The NCAA as an organizational body needs some changes, too.


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