Do Celtics Have ‘Legitimate’ Title Shot? NBA.com Counts Boston Among Contenders

https://nesn.com/2019/10/nba-com-counts-celtics-among-eight-teams-with-legitimate-shot-to-win-title/




Do Celtics Have ‘Legitimate’ Title Shot? NBA.com Counts Boston Among Contenders



by Marcus Kwesi O'Mard

on Mon, Oct 21, 2019 at 4:16PM




Are the Boston Celtics actually contenders to win the NBA Finals this season?

NBA.com’s Shaun Powell included the Celtics on his list of eight teams that have a “legitimate shot” to win the championship in 2019-20. Given last season’s disappointing results and the bevvy of offseason roster changes in Boston and around the NBA, most observers peg the Celtics as the third-best team in the Eastern Conference. Yet, Powell suggests expected chemistry improvements and Gordon Hayward’s potential reemergence as an All-Star-caliber player might vault the Celtics into contention in the coming months.

“Maybe the breakthrough simply skipped a year,” Powell wrote Monday. “Yes, the Celtics were supposed to be in this position in 2018-19 with Kyrie Irving and now they’re bringing Kemba Walker instead. For those who insist Kemba is short on Kyrie’s skills, he’s also short on Kyrie’s drama, so there’s that. And speaking of delayed reaction, if — and yes, it’s a big if — Gordon Hayward finally comes around to being Utah Jazz-era Gordon Hayward, next summer’s forecast could indeed be green.”

Most oddsmakers and experts predict the Celtics will around 49 games and claim the third seed in the Eastern Conference playoffs. It would take a considerable over-achievement for Boston to unseat the Milwaukee Bucks, Philadelphia 76ers or other would-be contenders in the Eastern Conference.

Nevertheless, anything is possible in what’s expected to be one of the most unpredictable races for NBA supremacy in recent memory.

The Celtics will begin their regular season slate Wednesday when they visit the 76ers.



bob
MY NOTE:  To me, a lot of our success will boil down to how well we can fill the hole created by the loss of Horford (NOT Kyrie!) and Baynes.  If our 4-headed monster (Kanter, Poirier, Theis, Williams; in alphabetical order) can make up for the loss of Horford and Baynes we could/should be better this year than last.


.

Personally, I think the Celtics have a decent shot at coming out of the east. Philly, in my mind, is way over-rated. Embiid is a legit force, but everyone else is over-rated. Simmons is probably the most over-rated player. Until he can hit free throws and an occasional 3 (or anything outside of 5 feet), he is ultimately going to be a liability. Good handle, but if you look at points produced (via scoring or assist) vs time he holds the ball, his numbers are bad. Tobias Harris is okay. Better than average, but nowhere near a superstar. Al - I hate to say it, but Al is over-rated. I know he is a good guy and "does a lot of things that don't show up in the score box", but I think both the effect of his leaving the Celtics and the effect of him joining the 76ers is over-rated. He is not a particularly good offensive rebounder, and while he can shoot threes, he ultimately depends on others to set him up. Bucks lost  Brogdon, which will hurt. Middleton kills us, but not sure he can be the number 2 on a contender. Giannis is a beast, but still can't shoot that well. It will catch up to him. God forbid he gets hurt, but if he misses a lot of games, the bucks are suddenly very ordinary. Of course the Celtics have their flaws as well, but I don't think the Bucks and 76ers are the locks everyone thinks they are, especially the 76ers.

Hi,
I say this - stop counting Celtics. Everybody'd already counted them last year. We know what happened.
Come April and they will count themselves in or out.

AK

No they are not title contenders. No everyday PF
and no everyday center.

dboss wrote:No they are not title contenders.  No everyday PF
and no everyday center.

Are you convinced they are at a fundamentally different tier than the 76ers or Bucks? I am not.

Shamrock1000 wrote:

dboss wrote:No they are not title contenders.  No everyday PF
and no everyday center.

Are you convinced they are at a fundamentally different tier than the 76ers or Bucks? I am not.

Celtics play Sixers Raptors and Bucks real soon so we will get a better picture.

I think the Nets may be just as good as Boston and Indiana is no joke.

The Celtics have a lot to prove before I can endorse them as contenders.  There are way too many questions on the eve of their first game.

dboss wrote:

Shamrock1000 wrote:

dboss wrote:No they are not title contenders.  No everyday PF
and no everyday center.

Are you convinced they are at a fundamentally different tier than the 76ers or Bucks? I am not.

Celtics play Sixers Raptors and Bucks real soon so we will get a better picture.

I think the Nets may be just as good as Boston and Indiana is no joke.

The Celtics have a lot to prove before I can endorse them as contenders.  There are way too many questions on the eve of their first game.

Agree - just as 76ers have to answer a few questions before they can be annointed contenders. Also agree that its too early to count out the Pacers and maybe Toronto. Without Durant, I think the Nets might be limited.

Yep, lots of team have unanswered questions.

I think Boston is a total wild-card this year.

Player-for-player, the team is more inexperienced and less accomplished. The starting lineup appears weaker, mainly due to the loss of Al Horford.

The good part of this is they may actually play better as a team. Ball movement may really improve, shot distribution should improve, and shooting off the bench could look substantially better. Rebounding should pick up too.

Defense will be the biggest question mark, with players like Walker and Kanter challenged on that end. I think that's the reason only Philadelphia and Milwaukee are getting serious attention as contenders for the East. Boston is also small this year, in a league and conference returning to big front lines.

So, while I don't think Boston has a shot to come out of the East this season, they might have the energy and drive to make some noise.  I think anything they do to step up the D, and locate a big forward or two, could lift them into serious contention quickly.

Regardless, I still think this may be one of the most enjoyable Celtic lineups to watch in the past several seasons.

NYCelt wrote:I think Boston is a total wild-card this year.

Player-for-player, the team is more inexperienced and less accomplished. The starting lineup appears weaker, mainly due to the loss of Al Horford.

The good part of this is they may actually play better as a team. Ball movement may really improve, shot distribution should improve, and shooting off the bench could look substantially better. Rebounding should pick up too.

Defense will be the biggest question mark, with players like Walker and Kanter challenged on that end. I think that's the reason only Philadelphia and Milwaukee are getting serious attention as contenders for the East. Boston is also small this year, in a league and conference returning to big front lines.

So, while I don't think Boston has a shot to come out of the East this season, they might have the energy and drive to make some noise.  I think anything they do to step up the D, and locate a big forward or two, could lift them into serious contention quickly.

Regardless, I still think this may be one of the most enjoyable Celtic lineups to watch in the past several seasons.

Wild-card is perfect. Chemistry should indeed be better. If it's worse, then we are in for a long season. Don't even want to think about that. Regarding talent, it is hard to say. Kyrie vs Kemba is a wash. Big Al vs Enes/Time Lord/Theis/Poirier is almost certainly a step backwards unless Enes suddenly learns to defend or Time Lord time warps into a savvy veteran. I think a lot of people are underestimating the loss of Morris, and as excited as I am about Edwards/Waters, Rozier, with all his warts, was an NBA proven player. However, I think it's a reaonable bet that this year's GH, JT, JB, and MS will be better than last year's GH, JT, JB, and MS. At least one of those four could be considerably better. Thus, the talent level might not be as different as people assume.

Shamrock,

Agreed as to you thoughts on the loss of Morris and Rozier.

Regards

I don't think Al will be healthy this year. Just my ontuition. So although we don't have him now, I expect we wouldn't have him in April anyways. Just my guess. I do think Poirier will emerge as as solid reliable center for us and that GW, JT JB GH and Theis will perform well at the 3 and the 4.

I think tonight probably answered that question. I do think we will be better than what was showed tonight. A title, I don't think we are close to that.

Don't throw in the towel yet, tardust! Let's see how we do Friday against hapless TOR at home. I'm betting your paycheck that we'll see a totally different result! hahajk Remember the rest of the league doesn't look anything like a fully operational PHI team. Let the injuries to Embiid and Horford settle in for most of the season and we'll see how they look and how much we have improved then.

db

dbrown4 wrote:Don't throw in the towel yet, tardust!  Let's see how we do Friday against hapless TOR at home.  I'm betting your paycheck that we'll see a totally different result!  hahajk  Remember the rest of the league doesn't look anything like a fully operational PHI team.  Let the injuries to Embiid and Horford settle in for most of the season and we'll see how they look and how much we have improved then.    

db

I'm not sure why you are predicting injuries to Horford.
Al has played at least 68 games per year over the last 5 years.
He's not an 80-82 game guy but he should be expected to play 70+ games per year.

I watched Toronto play on Tuesday night.
I was quite impressed how they played without Kawhi.
Fred VanVleet looks like a legitimate and very effective starting point guard.
Siakam looks like he will make the jump to make an all-nba team.

Celts lose all star point guard and center and replace with (lesser) all star point guard and center by committee of role players. Only way Celtics can be in the hunt is if the two Js take the Big leap to legit all stars; both of them. Neither J looked all that good last night (Tatum tight; Brown loose). Kyrie said they didn't know what it took to win a Championship and Al voted with his feet in leaving to Philadelphia (and his pocketbook to be fair). Tatum I think can be part of making a Championship happen and I have no clue if Brown has that in him or if he's just another talented guy.

Father Time for Al. No AD or ZW for Pelicans. OT at home to win?! I say, Come On, Man! Long Season ahead for TOR.

db

This is why making predictions this early in the season are submerged in the unknown.

Give me 25-30 games.  By then the rotations and the roles of this team should be well established.

Agreed dboss.  All speculation at this point.  It's what makes betting on a horse race...a difference of opinion.  I don't want Al to be injured or any player for that matter.  Just going with the odds for Al (age) and past history for Embiid.  

db

In the East, I think Philly and Milwaukee are easily the two best teams in the conference.
Then there are 4 solid playoff teams 3-6 in some order. Boston, Brooklyn, Indiana and Toronto.
Then there are 4 teams who will be battling for the 7th and 8th spots. Atlanta, Detroit, Miami and Orlando.
Then there are 5 teams that will be lottery bound. Charlotte, Chicago, Cleveland, New York and Washington.

Unless Boston makes a big trade which might include the Memphis pick, I do not see Boston as having a legitimate title shot.

tjmakz wrote:In the East, I think Philly and Milwaukee are easily the two best teams in the conference.
Then there are 4 solid playoff teams 3-6 in some order. Boston, Brooklyn, Indiana and Toronto.
Then there are 4 teams who will be battling for the 7th and 8th spots. Atlanta, Detroit, Miami and Orlando.
Then there are 5 teams that will be lottery bound. Charlotte, Chicago, Cleveland, New York and Washington.

Unless Boston makes a big trade which might include the Memphis pick, I do not see Boston as having a legitimate title shot.

TJ,

That's probably a fair appraisal of the overall situation. What's your take on the West? LAC, GS, LAL or Houston?

Not to you in particular, but just in general, there's a popular sportscaster who is always saying "that's why they play the games," because something unexpected can always happen.

We also had an old friend who used to say "see me in April."

I'm good with giving it a solid prediction. Like to make those myself (Philly over the Clippers in 7). But I know the wisdom behind those other two quotes.

So, although I agree with TJ's take on this, after one game I'm still rooting for a Celtics vs Lakers final.

I hope you are as well!

NYCelt wrote:

tjmakz wrote:In the East, I think Philly and Milwaukee are easily the two best teams in the conference.
Then there are 4 solid playoff teams 3-6 in some order. Boston, Brooklyn, Indiana and Toronto.
Then there are 4 teams who will be battling for the 7th and 8th spots. Atlanta, Detroit, Miami and Orlando.
Then there are 5 teams that will be lottery bound. Charlotte, Chicago, Cleveland, New York and Washington.

Unless Boston makes a big trade which might include the Memphis pick, I do not see Boston as having a legitimate title shot.

TJ,

That's probably a fair appraisal of the overall situation. What's your take on the West? LAC, GS, LAL or Houston?

Not to you in particular, but just in general, there's a popular sportscaster who is always saying "that's why they play the games," because something unexpected can always happen.

We also had an old friend who used to say "see me in April."

I'm good with giving it a solid prediction. Like to make those myself (Philly over the Clippers in 7). But I know the wisdom behind those other two quotes.

So, although I agree with TJ's take on this, after one game I'm still rooting for a Celtics vs Lakers final.

I hope you are as well!

NY Celt,

The West to me is much, much harder to gauge for the regular season and the playoffs.
There are teams like Denver and Houston who could finish 1 and 2 in the regular season and then get beat by the LA teams in the 1-4, 2-3 conference semi-finals match ups.
I think there are 4 top teams in the West and the Clippers are the best team until some team proves otherwise.
Here are my categories:
Top 4 teams: Clippers, Lakers, Denver, Houston. Their regular season records won't matter much at all.
Next 3 teams: Utah (don't like their bench at all), Portland, GS
Borderline West playoff teams: San Antonio, Sacramento, Dallas, New Orleans
Lottery bound: OKC, Phoenix, Memphis, Minnesota

I agree that so much can happen that can completely change the playoff picture.
An injury to a top 10 player.
A trade near the deadline.
A buyout of a good player (Iguodala, Jay Crowder or many others on expiring contracts) and them being signed by a contender.
I think this year we could see quite a few good players looking to secure a buyout and then signing with a contender.

tjmakz wrote:In the East, I think Philly and Milwaukee are easily the two best teams in the conference.
Then there are 4 solid playoff teams 3-6 in some order. Boston, Brooklyn, Indiana and Toronto.
Then there are 4 teams who will be battling for the 7th and 8th spots. Atlanta, Detroit, Miami and Orlando.
Then there are 5 teams that will be lottery bound. Charlotte, Chicago, Cleveland, New York and Washington.

Unless Boston makes a big trade which might include the Memphis pick, I do not see Boston as having a legitimate title shot.

I pretty much agree with you.   If Jaylen and Jayson really up their game they can push for the 3rd spot in the East.  Jayson is still learning but he looks like he can be a solid scorer when it "clicks" for him.  I don't know if Jaylen is going to reach the really good player or not.  He definitely has the talent.   Both of these guys need to get some kind of "attitude" on both offense and defense.