Giving Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett their Due

I posted this in the "Time to Say Goodbye" thread, but I believe a topic of this importance deserves its own thread.

In keeping with my policy of not making predictions, I won't predict what will happen with Pierce and KG. But, in terms of moving forward at the expense of some emotions and sentimentality, it can't be denied that parting with them (hopefully under conditions most favorable to them and to the Celtics) makes sense. And, IF that should happen, there have been all sorts of quotes to the effect that, if one goes, the other also goes.

And, IF it should happen, odds are that, in fairness to all parties, it make sense for it to happen sooner rather than later in the summer.

And, IF it should happen, I believe there's one thing the Celtics could do that (1) would right a wrong and (2) would make it just a bit easier for everyone involved (including the fans) to
confront the emotions and sentiment squarely and in a cathartic manner.

I suggest that a special appreciation night be held (again, sooner rather than later) to honor both of these gentlemen and retire their numbers (again, sooner rather than later). I believe there should be no admission charge so as not to discriminate against attendance by anyone for financial reasons' but I would also encourage donations by attendees who can afford it, with proceeds going to the Boston One Fund.

I would not telecast the event live because that could cut into attendance; but I would record it to be shown on tv—perhaps shortly before the start of the season. Another option would be to make the recording available for sale, perhaps also benefiting the One Fund.

IF Paul and Kevin have, indeed, played their last games for the Celtics (short of the possibility signing for one game to finish their careers in Boston), it would be ironic that they actually upstaged themselves in yesterday's sixth playoff game.

They and their teammates pulled off such an incredible comeback in the fourth quarter that people's attention was riveted to the excitement of the moment. When Paul and Kevin exited, it was conceivable that they could have returned, given the volatility of the ongoing game. In a sense, they upstaged themselves by sticking to business as usual. So applause was polite but not remotely approaching the outpouring of affection that they deserved. An appreciation night could leave these two Celtics giants with crescendos of cheers ringing in their ears, rather than with muted hissing of gas escaping from a balloon of hope.

Without an signal event such as this, thousands of fans will be left with an unfulfilled need for serious emotional closure over the departure of (arguably) the two most beloved Celtics icons of the 21st century.

It's not as though this special type of recognition is unprecedented. The re-retirement of Bill Russell's number comes to mind. Which reminds me that, together, Paul and Kevin represent for contemporary fans the Bill Russell and Larry Bird of this era. I don't know precisely what rules the organization may have with respect to the timing of retirement of numbers. But I believe there has to be room for some flexibility with respect to a tradition that's ceremonial in nature.

I realize that, without proceeds from admissions, some expense would be attached to the event as I have outlined it. But I can't believe the organization, which has consistently demonstrated that it cares deeply about its players, would begrudge that outlay. Besides, it wouldn't count against the Salary Cap (a little humor there).

I'm curious about what the forum members think of this idea.

Oh, and by the way, I just emailed this to Wyc Grousbeck.

Thanks.

Sam

Sam, My sense is that wherever and whenever Paul goes, KG goes as well, which I regret in a way, since KG still has LOTS in the tank and would be a valuable player for the Celts for the next two years. Paul has been a tremendous contributor over the years, but his age has caught up with him, and it's time to wish him heartfelt thanks and farewell.

They both deserve a warm outpouring of affection and acknowledgment from the entire Celtic family/nation. You idea is as good as any, espcially with contributions going to the Boston Fund.

Pierce was obviously spent by game 6, it was sad to watch. Doc should have given Pierce a 2 week rest toward end of season just like KG got. If Pierce does comeback he has to accept a role off the bench similar to Ginoblli. He still had some very good games during the season, he just got exposed during playoffs without Rondo.

Without knowing the physical condition of each player, I cannot make any grand proclamations. My sense is that both KG and Pierce were hurt during the playoffs.

Paul Pierce never looked worse, all season long than he did in this series. Suggesting that that guy who averaged 19 - 6 - 5 this season is 'done' based on his performance in this series is very short sighted IMO. He has more to give and is far from done. I think his role will need to change and his minutes and the expectations of his meaning to the team will need to be re-evaluated. But if Paul can accept a role as a 6th man on this team and be willing to restructure his deal a bit to give the team more flexibility, I see no reason why he wont be back.

KG - not sure. Unlike Pierce, who had a very good statistically year and played at a high level all year - KG played at a diminished level for most of the season. His pick and roll defense was just awful this series. He was not protecting the rim with the same efficacy as he used to. I think it comes out that his injuries were much worse than they were reported - and he played with a number of big issues.

I dont see KG being able to accept a diminished role - as I dont see him having it in his nature to let someone else start or play minutes when he feels he is capable of doing a better job of it. If the Celtics had someone like Al Jefferson or Dwight Howard here - and KG could work with them, play along side them and get them ready to fully take over the mantle - sure. But KG at this point isnt going to be able to take the battering over 82+ games with very marginal talent backing him up. DA needs to make a lot of noise with good signings in order for KG to be back next year.

I think Doc is also in danger of walking. If Pierce and KG go, Doc is gone. Doc will not be the coach here during a "rebuilding" period - and he has earned the right to go out his way. I think as KG and PP go, so goes Doc.

I am afraid you are right. He didn't sound too convincing the other night. I know alot of that was raw emotion, but, if those two go, Doc is very liable to say forget it I am gone too. The world is wide open for him. He can sit for a year and get back into it again with a team that is on the rise.. However, he loves being a Celtic, he loves working for the Celtics, so this will be a hard decision to make.

My other thoughts are, that I believe somehow, someway they are going to keep PP. I just don't see management letting this happen. I really wonder what his physical condition was at the end of the season. Maybe the legs are going, but there was something else going on. His mechanics were all messed up on his shot, therefore he kept missing. Sorry, I am from the old, die hard thought of letting a guy who has given so much to an organization retire where he has played his entire career. If they were willing to pay Ray Allen last year and give him $12 million, surely there is a way to keep Paul.

I am not naive, he is not the same player, I agree. But, if he wasn't on this team this year with Rondo going down, there is no way they would have even made the playoffs. He gave all he had, and then some. I believe he should be coming off the bench, which may not sit well with him. Let the young guys start, bring PP
in 6th, 7th, whatever and see what happens.

Time will tell. Ainge was not happy that they couldn't get out of the first round. But, don't blame Paul for that. Blame the bench. NO ONE CAME IN AND GAVE THE STARTERS A HAND. That is terrible.

Call me a sentimental fool, but I am all for keeping PP on this team

Rosalie

RosalieTCeltics wrote:I am afraid you are right. He didn't sound too convincing the other night. I know alot of that was raw emotion, but, if those two go, Doc is very liable to say forget it I am gone too. The world is wide open for him. He can sit for a year and get back into it again with a team that is on the rise.. However, he loves being a Celtic, he loves working for the Celtics, so this will be a hard decision to make.

My other thoughts are, that I believe somehow, someway they are going to keep PP. I just don't see management letting this happen. I really wonder what his physical condition was at the end of the season. Maybe the legs are going, but there was something else going on. His mechanics were all messed up on his shot, therefore he kept missing. Sorry, I am from the old, die hard thought of letting a guy who has given so much to an organization retire where he has played his entire career. If they were willing to pay Ray Allen last year and give him $12 million, surely there is a way to keep Paul.

I am not naive, he is not the same player, I agree. But, if he wasn't on this team this year with Rondo going down, there is no way they would have even made the playoffs. He gave all he had, and then some. I believe he should be coming off the bench, which may not sit well with him. Let the young guys start, bring PP
in 6th, 7th, whatever and see what happens.

Time will tell. Ainge was not happy that they couldn't get out of the first round. But, don't blame Paul for that. Blame the bench. NO ONE CAME IN AND GAVE THE STARTERS A HAND. That is terrible.

Call me a sentimental fool, but I am all for keeping PP on this team

Rosalie

I think it was pretty simple. PP was playing too many minutes each game and was being counted on to run the offense. NY was double teaming him and JG because we had such poor PG play. Add a Point guard and reduce the minutes and he is fine. We had probably the worst guard play of any team in the playoffs. That was the difference in that series.

mrkleen09 wrote:Without knowing the physical condition of each player, I cannot make any grand proclamations. My sense is that both KG and Pierce were hurt during the playoffs.

Paul Pierce never looked worse, all season long than he did in this series. Suggesting that that guy who averaged 19 - 6 - 5 this season is 'done' based on his performance in this series is very short sighted IMO. He has more to give and is far from done. I think his role will need to change and his minutes and the expectations of his meaning to the team will need to be re-evaluated. But if Paul can accept a role as a 6th man on this team and be willing to restructure his deal a bit to give the team more flexibility, I see no reason why he wont be back.

KG - not sure. Unlike Pierce, who had a very good statistically year and played at a high level all year - KG played at a diminished level for most of the season. His pick and roll defense was just awful this series. He was not protecting the rim with the same efficacy as he used to. I think it comes out that his injuries were much worse than they were reported - and he played with a number of big issues.

I dont see KG being able to accept a diminished role - as I dont see him having it in his nature to let someone else start or play minutes when he feels he is capable of doing a better job of it. If the Celtics had someone like Al Jefferson or Dwight Howard here - and KG could work with them, play along side them and get them ready to fully take over the mantle - sure. But KG at this point isnt going to be able to take the battering over 82+ games with very marginal talent backing him up. DA needs to make a lot of noise with good signings in order for KG to be back next year.

I think Doc is also in danger of walking. If Pierce and KG go, Doc is gone. Doc will not be the coach here during a "rebuilding" period - and he has earned the right to go out his way. I think as KG and PP go, so goes Doc.

I heard Bob Ryan say yesterday that when Doc signed his deal that he was on board for being in Boston for the rebuild. He also said he didn't think Doc would be going anywhere. He based his thoughts on conversations he has had with Doc.

[quote="cowens/oldschool"]Pierce was obviously spent by game 6, it was sad to watch. Doc should have given Pierce a 2 week rest toward end of season just like KG got. If Pierce does comeback he has to accept a role off the bench similar to Ginoblli. He still had some very good games during the season, he just got exposed during playoffs without Rondo.[/quote

The TEAM got exposed because of NO POINT GUARD period. Paul was just the most glaring because he was basically the only creator on the floor. Just a real backup point guard could have done wonders. Just a threat of someone scoring some points. Terry was basically it for guard scoring in that series. I don't know many that had much faith in JT.

Its never easy letting go of players that have given so much for so long. But winning is also a priority. The trades need to happen, otherwise Boston has a salary cap burden from aging players. They don't want to be in the kind of situation where they have a much longer rebuilding cycle than is necessary.

I say, retire their numbers and trade them.