Disappointment with Rondo

I just read about how Rondo has already changed the Mavericks defensive numbers. It seems since Rondo has arrived in Dallas the Mavs are now almost six points better defensively per game.

So, why am I disappointed? I am disappointed because improving a team's defensive performance can only come from a much higher level of effort and intensity than what he showed when in Boston this year. As a pro making over 12M and the team captain the last thing I would have expected was a lack of effort at any end of the court.

If he can now perform so well on defense because he has been traded I am very glad that he was traded. As talented as he was/is my respect for him has greatly diminished. He has turned out into just another selfish guy.

For me, there is just no excuse for being able to play harder now that he is on a better team, and I know that some will offer many excuses for his lackluster play when in Boston.

Clyde,

I haven't watched any Mavericks games  (I'm in Thailand.  If I could watch any NBA  games it would be the Boston Celtics!) but I'm having trouble believing that Rondo is single-handedly lowering the team's defensive numbers.  Even at his best, he is no KG.

Is it possible that the Mavs team was playing lackluster defense (Dirk and Monte are offensively-oriented, not defensively-oriented, players) before Rondo and is playing with more inspiration now and that is the explanation for their improvement on defense rather than Rondo's individual performance and/or efforts?  You are, after all, talking about Dallas' TEAM stats, right? If so, I suppose he deserves credit but what does it say about our team that he didn't have the same effect despite everybody claiming he was fully engaged and plugged in?  It would say to me that they really do not believe they can win and played like it.  Have we seen any evidence of that, both before and after the Rondo trade?


bob



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Personally I've watched most of the Rondo's Mavs games and from what I see the offense is slower and they are getting a few less shots thus the opponents have less possessions from which to score.


Rondos defense has NOT picked up. His man still blows past him at will.

beat

beat wrote:Personally I've watched most of the Rondo's Mavs games and from what I see the offense is slower and they are getting a few less shots thus the opponents have less possessions from which to score.


Rondos defense has NOT picked up. His man still blows past him at will.

beat

Beat,

So the reason for the lower opponent's  ppg Avg  is because of fewer possessions because the Dallas offense is more deliberate and half-court?



bob



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Beat's explanation makes sense to me.  I'd have to have it proven to me that Rondo is personally elevating the level of the Mavs' defensive effort.  Maybe he can convince me tomorrow night.  Or maybe not.

Sam

bobheckler wrote:

beat wrote:Personally I've watched most of the Rondo's Mavs games and from what I see the offense is slower and they are getting a few less shots thus the opponents have less possessions from which to score.


Rondos defense has NOT picked up. His man still blows past him at will.

beat

Beat,

So the reason for the lower opponent's  ppg Avg  is because of fewer possessions because the Dallas offense is more deliberate and half-court?



bob



.

At this time I'd say yes. Plus he really is TRYING to fit in. Offensively he sure appears to be getting used to his teammates but that will take time. Defensively he is just what we had. Plus in looking at the 6 games he's played

GAME 1 HM San Antonio... Dallas "HELD" a team without Parker Duncan Green and Ginobili to 93 points (16 in the final quarter when the cleaning crew played for SA)

GAME 2 HM vs Atlanta.......Hawks had 82 points the first 3 quarters and led 82-63 although SA made a charge the hole was too deep and they lost by 3, the Atlanta starting guard duo of Korver and  Schroder were a combined +15 playing 62 total minutes and going 13 for 23 from the field. Dallas pair of Ellis and Rondo were a
combined -8 playing 69 minutes going a combined 14 for 37 from the field.

GAME 3 @ Phoenix.........Suns Score 124 (71 in the second half) and win by 9. Sure Dallas scored 115 but a loss is a loss. Suns 4 guards that played scored 72 points. Appears Dallas played little defense this game.

GAME 4 HM vs Lakers....LA leads the League in POINTS allowed at 109 so Dallas getting 102 is below what one would expect from one of the best offenses in the NBA, Lakers were w/o Kobe yet still scored 98,  Rondo had perhaps his best all around game but he led the team in FGA with 17 (Dirk had 13) and Dallas only had a low 83 FGA as a team.

GAME 5 HM vs OKC Thunder.....Mavs started 3 guards with Barea joining Rondo and Ellis, must have worked cause they won. Rondo again led the team with 17 FGA (yet was the 4th highest scorer) Thunder shot 50% from the field but Westbrook struggled going 6 for 23. In recalling this game Ellis took him "most" of the time. Of course Durrant was out too, yet they still put up 107 points against the Mavs defense.

GAME 6 HM vs the Wizards.... The wiz never showed up and DAllas won in a walk, no Dallas starter played 30 minutes. Wiz managed to get to 83 points but this game was basically over by the half. Dallas only had 82 FGA ( the Wiz chucked up a rather anemic 74 hitting on only 44% of those.) Both benches saw a lot of time this game so the individual results are not worth looking at too much Rondo shot 10 times which was only exceeded by Ellis who shot 15.


So there are the games Rondo has played so far. Far to little a sample to say if the Dallas defense or for that matter the offense is better. The played a toothless SA team, OKC without Durrant. Lakers without Kobe, and a Wiz team that decided to stay in the locker room. The 2 teams that did play well Atlanta and Phoenix had no problem putting up some points. Dallas is a work in progress now. They have little depth up front and Dirk has played a little more 5 than he probably likes. Ellis sharing the ball is an issue but he appears to be adjusting better. As for Rondo.......his individual defense is what it is.

beat

Straight from the horse's mouth:

"I haven't played defense in a couple of years," Rondo said, via Masslive.com's Jay King. "I've been able to hide it a lot with Avery Bradley on the ball. He's helped me out, the young guy. But here they expect me to play defense. And in the West, if you don't play defense you'll get embarrassed every night at the point guard position. I took it as a challenge [for] myself."

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24931283/mavericks-rajon-rondo-i-havent-played-defense-in-a-couple-of-years

Sloopjohnb wrote:Straight from the horse's mouth:

"I haven't played defense in a couple of years," Rondo said, via Masslive.com's Jay King. "I've been able to hide it a lot with Avery Bradley on the ball. He's helped me out, the young guy. But here they expect me to play defense. And in the West, if you don't play defense you'll get embarrassed every night at the point guard position. I took it as a challenge [for] myself."

Only stating what most people already could see....

and I don't see him any better in Dallas. His greatest asset was quickness....and since the ACL he has lost that edge.

beat

I think several people are misunderstanding what Rondo meant.
To save myself some time, here are a couple of comments from the article.

He didn't mean he wasn't trying, he meant with Bradley playing the other team's best guard, he didn't have to work as hard as he would if he were on the opponent's best.  The writer himself seems to miss this point!

One of the problems with Rondo being as intelligent as he is, is he assumes everyone else automatically gets what he's saying, and talking to the media, well, that's just unlikely.


Smitter1
2 hours ago
This article goes out of it's way to turn a positive into a negative. The Mavs D is better since the trade, and Rondo gives Bradley credit for covering the point guard in Boston. Sure he sticks his foot in his mouth with the "haven't played D in a while" comment, but the rest of what he says is all good. And of course the title of the article implies the worst.

Whatever, will see how Dallas looks come playoff time!


patsfan_1977
2 hours ago
It shows how much smarter Rajon is (basketball smarts) than the media. He didnt mean he took a nap. Just that sticking to a lower tier player is not the same as guarding Wall or Westbrook one on one. Being THE guy who is in charge of shutting down the playmaker of the other team

xrisanderson
2 hours ago
I sincerely doubt Rondo meant that he wasn't playing defense at all. He said that in Boston he was rarely tasked with guarding the best player on the opposing team's backcourt in the least few years, because that job went to Bradley. In Dallas he doesn't have the same luxury, so he doesn't get to "rest" on the defensive end in the same way. Don't overreact people... and shame on the writer for putting the title of this article in this context. ** Unless I'm blatantly wrong, and Rondo was being a punk when he spoke, in which case feel free to call him out for being a bonehead.


I've watched a couple of Mavs games since Rondo got there; he sure looks like he's picking it up to me.  As a matter of fact, I don't see where he lost much when he was with us, he was just carrying out what he was assigned to do on both ends.  Except for Bradely, it's not like the defense around him the past two years has provided much help.

I hope Rondo can distinguish between instigators posing as reporters and the real thing, so we'll continue to hear from him. His manner draws criticism, no matter what uniform he wears. IMO, he lost a half step to knee injury and surgery, but may continue to heal and extend himself on defense as he realizes he is completely healed. I am not disappointed with Rondo; I wish him well, hope we beat him tonight! Hawk

It is at about the 5 minute mark of part 1 of the Rondo 'I'm back in Boston' video.

File this under 'no shit, Sherlock'.


http://www.nba.com/celtics/video/presser/rajon-rondo-010215




bob




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bobheckler wrote:It is at about the 5 minute mark of part 1 of the Rondo 'I'm back in Boston' video.

File this under 'no shit, Sherlock'.


http://www.nba.com/celtics/video/presser/rajon-rondo-010215




bob




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Glad you provided that link Bob.

How dumb can some writers be.  He certainly didn't mean he wasn't trying to play defense, he meant that Bradley took the biggest assignment.

I guess Rondo's biggest crime is figuring everyone around him has half a brain.

(I also took the liberty of moving this thread here, since it duplicated this conversation and your point fit.)

Thanks for the memories.....still love the final one where he dives thru the legs to get the ball, then gets up and lays it in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Df7HmRoyl1I

beat

Sorry to run counter to other opinions (what's new?), but my eyes have told me that Rondo turned from a good defender into a mediocre (and often indifferent) defender.  The mediocre part can possibly be explained at least partially by the impact of injuries.  Not so the indifferent part.  Too often, in the halfcourt, he resorted to letting his man get by and trying the poke-check thing that occasionally worked but more often draw foul calls.  This practice placed added pressure on interior defenders, who were often defense-challenged in the first place.

Any public statement that has to be regurgitated and manipulated to convert it from a negative to a positive has the earmarks of what I would call "rationalization."  I've watched the interview several times (although I couldn't hear the precise question that produced Rondo's response, but it's unlikely a response that clear would have been unduly influenced by a question nuance).

Frankly, whatever he meant, however he wished it had been received differently, any interpretation other than a negative one seems to me to be mostly a rationalization.  It's as though Rondo thought, "Bradley's got a great defensive reputation.  I'll give the impression that my defensive presence was calculated to be of lower priority because of Avery's renowned defensive presence.  They'll buy that."  If Rondo had no culpability, why did he choose the terminology, "I've been able to hide it a lot?"

As for Bradley's actual involvement, Rondo played many minutes for the Celtics without Bradley at his side.  Remember a guy named Ray Allen?  And, even when Bradley and Rondo played as a tandem, the majority of the many minutes I watched had Bradley defending against the opposing shooting guard and Rondo defending against the opposing "1."  Some of the time, Bradley may have switched to covering the "1" when he brought the ball up the court (although Bradley seldom guards full-court these days); but, in the halfcourt, Rondo usually guarded the "1."

Eyes and ears don't lie.

Red, I apologize for even being part of a conversation about why slacking off on defense can be a good thing.

I'm not trying to Rondo-bash but simply to provide an objective perspective.  Rondo remained my favorite Celtic throughout his Boston tenure, (JOKE ALERT, JOKE ALERT) and I always give the benefit of the doubt to a floor general, because floor generals are obviously the closest to perfection among all basketball players.

Sam

Rondo's admission of not playing much defense for the last few years was the last thing I wanted (or needed) to hear from him.

For a captain and supposed leader of a team he greatly embarrassed himself in my eyes.  I have been a Cs fan since 1959 and have never heard (or read) of any other player issuing/admitting such a totally disappointing statement although I am sure that others may have not performed to their best at all times.

I am even more disappointed in this guy after that statement than I was when I started this thread, and I will likely never be able to consider him an all time Celtics type player because of it. I know that I will cringe when I read others mention how important, how good, etc he was.  He was good again last night, but I could care less.  If he is good again next week or next month I will not care then either. Please, give me Satch Sanders, Larry Zigfried, Bailey Howell and even guys like Hank Finkel, the Johnson kid from last year and many, many others who I at least still think that they gave everything to their team.

Like it or not, Dallas has won 4 games in a row with Rondo while we're still flopping around like a flounder.

This DAL v. BOS game was Rondo's "You guys blew it, Boston, by trading me and not surrounding me with a Big Three that knows what they are doing" games.  Come on.  12-19 and 5-7 from the line?!!  He even skillfully avoided the free throw line!  THAT'S vintage Rondo.    

Rondo is right where he needs to be.  4th in line on the team, not team leader trying to rebuild while Danny accumulates draft picks.  We made the right choice at the time.  It currently looks like we got the shaft, but Danny will make the big move(s) in time.

This is the age old management trick of trying to put a square peg in a round hole. Rondo was great as a fourth wheel. Management decided to take a different direction, blew up the team, Rondo was left and they asked him to be team leader/Captain. And guess what? He became indifferent and subsequently got traded.

Happens a million times a day.    

db