DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
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DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
BOSTON.COM
By Adam Kaufman @AdamMKaufman
Kings star DeMarcus Cousins has long been on the trade block, depending on what you want to believe.
There have been reports of his unhappiness in Sacramento, perhaps the direct result of playing for five head coaches in five years for a dysfunctional and ineptly-run franchise that still hasn’t won 30 games in a season since the remarkably talented All-Star center arrived in the NBA in 2010. His maturity and effort have often been called into question dating back to his time at Kentucky, which has no doubt played a role in his limited team success.
As Cousins has improved — his season-averages jumped from 14.1 points, 8.6 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 0.8 blocks, and 1.0 steals a game as a rookie to last year’s second-team All-NBA-recognized totals of 24.1 points, 12.7 boards, 3.6 dimes, 1.7 stuffs, and 1.5 thefts — the Kings really haven’t. In his first season under Paul Westphal, Sacramento won 24 games. In his latest for Mike Malone, Tyrone Corbin, and George Karl (continuity, right?), the club amassed 29 victories and a 13th-place finish in the ultra-competitive Western Conference. As a result, the Kings landed the No. 6 overall pick in the upcoming June 25 draft.
When Karl was preparing to join the Kings for the final one-third of last season, there were rumblings he didn’t believe Cousins fit on his roster and, equally, the center wasn’t in favor of the veteran coach’s impending hire. Shortly after Karl took over, he called his relationship with Cousins “a process.”
When the season ended, Karl — in his own way — said he’s open to trading his soon-to-be superstar if that’s what it takes to end the team’s nine-season-long playoff drought.
“I’ve had some great players and I’ve never had one player that I have said is untradeable,” the coach — who has dealt the likes of Carmelo Antony, Shawn Kemp, and Ray Allen — told CSN Bay Area. “You always got to be ready for the possibility of a great trade that could come your way.”
Shortly thereafter, ESPN’s Marc Stein speculated the Celtics would pursue the 24-year-old.
Let’s pretend for a moment Kings vice president Vlade Divac didn’t respond to his coach’s comments by saying, “if we’re talking about today, yeah, DeMarcus is untradeable,” and assume Danny Ainge will target the stud big man who’s yet to even reach his prime, and that Sacramento will be listening to offers.
Is that necessarily the right move?
Cousins has three seasons remaining on a five-year, $65 million deal. He’s worth the money, especially with the new TV dollars set to make every owner’s wallet better resemble George Costanza’s next summer. As noted, Cousins is still a kid with, barring injury, at least six elite years ahead of him and a seemingly limitless ceiling. He’s huge and plays a position that, these days, is virtually impossible to fill with a top-tier player unless you luck out in the draft or can easily attract free agents. Soon, he might be the best in the game in that role. Surrounded by the right players and in the Eastern Conference, the game-changer could instantly make several franchises a title contender.
The Boston Globe’s Bob Ryan, who has forgotten more about the NBA than most will ever know, recently said he’d personally pick up Cousins at the airport if Ainge could land the 6-foot-11 stud in a trade.
But, as Ryan and others have acknowledged, this conversation over the Kings potentially dealing a premier player such as Cousins is only happening because of his fiery, sometimes selfish, and easily frustrated personality on the court and years worth of evidence he can be difficult to coach.
Brad Stevens just got rid of one of those guys and he had a first-hand look at this one back on New Year’s Eve when Cousins tossed rookie Marcus Smart to the parquet when he took exception to the rookie’s box-out during a 33-point deficit.
Cousins has been assessed a league-high 73 technical fouls and nine ejections since he entered the league, including that ugly capper to 2014. Skill aside, does Stevens need a historically unstable addition like this, especially when acquiring Cousins would cost Ainge a bevy of the assets he’s worked so hard to stockpile?
No, Cousins is not Rajon Rondo. Talent-wise, they aren’t in the same stratosphere at this stage of their careers and even Rondo in his prime probably wasn’t worth close to what Cousins could bring to the equation. Both, however, are enigmatic and their play has been largely determined by their moods and not the other way around.
That in mind, how would Cousins react if one or two thoughtless acts resulted in a strong finger-wagging from the talking heads who have irritated so many Boston athletes in the past. This city, for better or worse, is a heck of a lot different than Sacramento when it comes to media coverage.
Most would agree Cousins is worth the gamble and potential headaches for a coach who, after a long series of moves, finally got his Celtics to believe in him, his system, and each other, while overachieving by at least 10 wins last season in the estimation of most pundits. A college-like chemistry was the difference, and Cousins has been known in his brief pro career to interrupt it. If winning is his top priority — an arguable concept for his current team — perhaps he’d fit in seamlessly in a more positive environment.
We all know how desperately the Celtics need a rim-protector, a genuine shot-blocking rebounder, and both Ainge and Stevens have prioritized the need for additional scorers. Cousins is both, but he comes with warts. Forced into a decision, Ainge would surely decide the embattled Kings star is worth any risks or baggage he brings. He wouldn’t be wrong. With Cousins, ultimately, talent, size, and youth should win out.
But, if this fantasyland scenario ever comes to fruition, it’s not a no-brainer. It’s one that would require careful consideration, conversations with multiple people close to Cousins and his existing situation, and assurances the difference-making star has indeed matured. With the right pieces, Cousins could be part of a select group to lead a team to a championship. With the wrong attitude, he could set a franchise back for years.
112288
By Adam Kaufman @AdamMKaufman
Kings star DeMarcus Cousins has long been on the trade block, depending on what you want to believe.
There have been reports of his unhappiness in Sacramento, perhaps the direct result of playing for five head coaches in five years for a dysfunctional and ineptly-run franchise that still hasn’t won 30 games in a season since the remarkably talented All-Star center arrived in the NBA in 2010. His maturity and effort have often been called into question dating back to his time at Kentucky, which has no doubt played a role in his limited team success.
As Cousins has improved — his season-averages jumped from 14.1 points, 8.6 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 0.8 blocks, and 1.0 steals a game as a rookie to last year’s second-team All-NBA-recognized totals of 24.1 points, 12.7 boards, 3.6 dimes, 1.7 stuffs, and 1.5 thefts — the Kings really haven’t. In his first season under Paul Westphal, Sacramento won 24 games. In his latest for Mike Malone, Tyrone Corbin, and George Karl (continuity, right?), the club amassed 29 victories and a 13th-place finish in the ultra-competitive Western Conference. As a result, the Kings landed the No. 6 overall pick in the upcoming June 25 draft.
When Karl was preparing to join the Kings for the final one-third of last season, there were rumblings he didn’t believe Cousins fit on his roster and, equally, the center wasn’t in favor of the veteran coach’s impending hire. Shortly after Karl took over, he called his relationship with Cousins “a process.”
When the season ended, Karl — in his own way — said he’s open to trading his soon-to-be superstar if that’s what it takes to end the team’s nine-season-long playoff drought.
“I’ve had some great players and I’ve never had one player that I have said is untradeable,” the coach — who has dealt the likes of Carmelo Antony, Shawn Kemp, and Ray Allen — told CSN Bay Area. “You always got to be ready for the possibility of a great trade that could come your way.”
Shortly thereafter, ESPN’s Marc Stein speculated the Celtics would pursue the 24-year-old.
Let’s pretend for a moment Kings vice president Vlade Divac didn’t respond to his coach’s comments by saying, “if we’re talking about today, yeah, DeMarcus is untradeable,” and assume Danny Ainge will target the stud big man who’s yet to even reach his prime, and that Sacramento will be listening to offers.
Is that necessarily the right move?
Cousins has three seasons remaining on a five-year, $65 million deal. He’s worth the money, especially with the new TV dollars set to make every owner’s wallet better resemble George Costanza’s next summer. As noted, Cousins is still a kid with, barring injury, at least six elite years ahead of him and a seemingly limitless ceiling. He’s huge and plays a position that, these days, is virtually impossible to fill with a top-tier player unless you luck out in the draft or can easily attract free agents. Soon, he might be the best in the game in that role. Surrounded by the right players and in the Eastern Conference, the game-changer could instantly make several franchises a title contender.
The Boston Globe’s Bob Ryan, who has forgotten more about the NBA than most will ever know, recently said he’d personally pick up Cousins at the airport if Ainge could land the 6-foot-11 stud in a trade.
But, as Ryan and others have acknowledged, this conversation over the Kings potentially dealing a premier player such as Cousins is only happening because of his fiery, sometimes selfish, and easily frustrated personality on the court and years worth of evidence he can be difficult to coach.
Brad Stevens just got rid of one of those guys and he had a first-hand look at this one back on New Year’s Eve when Cousins tossed rookie Marcus Smart to the parquet when he took exception to the rookie’s box-out during a 33-point deficit.
Cousins has been assessed a league-high 73 technical fouls and nine ejections since he entered the league, including that ugly capper to 2014. Skill aside, does Stevens need a historically unstable addition like this, especially when acquiring Cousins would cost Ainge a bevy of the assets he’s worked so hard to stockpile?
No, Cousins is not Rajon Rondo. Talent-wise, they aren’t in the same stratosphere at this stage of their careers and even Rondo in his prime probably wasn’t worth close to what Cousins could bring to the equation. Both, however, are enigmatic and their play has been largely determined by their moods and not the other way around.
That in mind, how would Cousins react if one or two thoughtless acts resulted in a strong finger-wagging from the talking heads who have irritated so many Boston athletes in the past. This city, for better or worse, is a heck of a lot different than Sacramento when it comes to media coverage.
Most would agree Cousins is worth the gamble and potential headaches for a coach who, after a long series of moves, finally got his Celtics to believe in him, his system, and each other, while overachieving by at least 10 wins last season in the estimation of most pundits. A college-like chemistry was the difference, and Cousins has been known in his brief pro career to interrupt it. If winning is his top priority — an arguable concept for his current team — perhaps he’d fit in seamlessly in a more positive environment.
We all know how desperately the Celtics need a rim-protector, a genuine shot-blocking rebounder, and both Ainge and Stevens have prioritized the need for additional scorers. Cousins is both, but he comes with warts. Forced into a decision, Ainge would surely decide the embattled Kings star is worth any risks or baggage he brings. He wouldn’t be wrong. With Cousins, ultimately, talent, size, and youth should win out.
But, if this fantasyland scenario ever comes to fruition, it’s not a no-brainer. It’s one that would require careful consideration, conversations with multiple people close to Cousins and his existing situation, and assurances the difference-making star has indeed matured. With the right pieces, Cousins could be part of a select group to lead a team to a championship. With the wrong attitude, he could set a franchise back for years.
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Unbelievable that a published sports article could scratch out (like fleas) 19 paragraphs without saying a single thing. Not one single doggone thing!
So Cousins is undeniably talented—perhaps even intimidating—but carries some risk of manageability—at a position where the Celtics have a dramatic need for a player who is way past the project stage and could arguably be more ready to grow up than to choose the road to self-destruction as part of a tradition like that of the Celtics. Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh and Dubble-Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
So he's not the perfect choice—unlike the 150 other supermen who have rented tents with heat warmers named Trixie along Causeway Street, just aching to be asked to be allowed to enter the hallowed sanctity of the Garden and gain an opportunity to win the team's MVP award (a holdover from the old days) known as the Order of the Rat.
And, should Cousins achieve basketball perfection with the Celtics, could he potentially rise after three days, according to the Scriptures of Stern, and demand to be traded to some heavenly world that has eluded those who have passed through these portals and enjoyed mixed success ranging from bulky fumblefinger supporters of the defense of Sir Kevin of Garnett to no success at all?
Nay, nay, I say. Leave Cousins (and his sisters and his aunts whom he reckons by the dozens) on the West Coast to migrate from the farmlands of California southward to the Town of Tinsel where his ego will be fed—nay nay, over-stuffed—by the balloonfest that treated us to Saint Shaq of Blubber in closing the championship gap over a period of decades. To combat the purple and yellow (barf) Cousinly successor to Saint Blub—aka the Slack of Jaw—bring forth more sheet soilers (aka crap shooters) from the Tentative Village on Causeway Street to do Behemoth Basketball Battle—stalwarts like Raef the Eight Foot Court Spacer....or Mark the Blunted Beast....or Fab "They Call Me Melo Yellow—Quite Right". If anything could revive dog racing at Wonderland up the road, it would be this kennel-full of curs.
The only thing Kaufman has contributed to journalism in this article is the ability to use "fruition" and "no-brainer" in one sentence and "historical" and "bevy" in another.
Sam
So Cousins is undeniably talented—perhaps even intimidating—but carries some risk of manageability—at a position where the Celtics have a dramatic need for a player who is way past the project stage and could arguably be more ready to grow up than to choose the road to self-destruction as part of a tradition like that of the Celtics. Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh and Dubble-Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
So he's not the perfect choice—unlike the 150 other supermen who have rented tents with heat warmers named Trixie along Causeway Street, just aching to be asked to be allowed to enter the hallowed sanctity of the Garden and gain an opportunity to win the team's MVP award (a holdover from the old days) known as the Order of the Rat.
And, should Cousins achieve basketball perfection with the Celtics, could he potentially rise after three days, according to the Scriptures of Stern, and demand to be traded to some heavenly world that has eluded those who have passed through these portals and enjoyed mixed success ranging from bulky fumblefinger supporters of the defense of Sir Kevin of Garnett to no success at all?
Nay, nay, I say. Leave Cousins (and his sisters and his aunts whom he reckons by the dozens) on the West Coast to migrate from the farmlands of California southward to the Town of Tinsel where his ego will be fed—nay nay, over-stuffed—by the balloonfest that treated us to Saint Shaq of Blubber in closing the championship gap over a period of decades. To combat the purple and yellow (barf) Cousinly successor to Saint Blub—aka the Slack of Jaw—bring forth more sheet soilers (aka crap shooters) from the Tentative Village on Causeway Street to do Behemoth Basketball Battle—stalwarts like Raef the Eight Foot Court Spacer....or Mark the Blunted Beast....or Fab "They Call Me Melo Yellow—Quite Right". If anything could revive dog racing at Wonderland up the road, it would be this kennel-full of curs.
The only thing Kaufman has contributed to journalism in this article is the ability to use "fruition" and "no-brainer" in one sentence and "historical" and "bevy" in another.
Sam
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Sam,
You know when its is pre draft - summertime period when you get articles like this. Hey they have to justify their employment, like meter maids justifying their existence by handing out tickets even if half of them are bogus.
112288
You know when its is pre draft - summertime period when you get articles like this. Hey they have to justify their employment, like meter maids justifying their existence by handing out tickets even if half of them are bogus.
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Cousins so is talented and is so desirable the guy Kaufman says "has forgotten more about the NBA than most will ever know (which, I presume, includes Mr. Kaufman), recently said he’d personally pick up Cousins at the airport if Ainge could land the 6-foot-11 stud in a trade" could be available, depending upon you talk to, but we'd have to think about this first, just in case, you know, maybe there is a down side that, possibly, could rear its ugly head and, potentially, tarnish the deal (with the second-guessing being pumped up on steroids by comparing any progress of whatever assets we traded to get him are doing).
I'll give this to Adam Kaufman, he practices what he preaches. He's proposing "paralysis through analysis" and that is precisely what he does in this column. He said it's not a no-brainer. I could be cold and say that describes him pretty well but that would be untrue. It takes a fair amount of brain power to be able to dance on the head of a pin with all those angels without falling off.
DeMarcus Cousins has been with Sacto for 5 years. Sacto is in a 9 year playoff drought. That means that Sacto has never made the playoffs since he turned pro. Kevin Love left Minny for that same reason, it's frustrating as all get-out for someone as competitive as a pro athlete. Over the 5 seasons Cousins has been in Sacto they have won a grand total of 131 games. 131 wins, over 5 seasons. That's a little over 26 wins/season average. We won only 25 games in 2013-2014 and our heads exploded, imagine if that was the norm! Imagine if you've never known anything else for as long as you've been in the NBA!
"Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser." - Vince Lombardi
So DeMarcus Cousins isn't a good loser. So Cousins doesn't like it, he doesn't like feeling his team is a doormat and it pisses him off publicly and openly. Good. That is precisely the type of player I want on my team. You know what I think would cure his little tantrums? Winning. Winning fixes all kinds of ailments: physical, emotional and spiritual. Yet, somehow, Mr. Kaufman didn't think of connecting the part of his piece that talks about George Karl wanting to end Sacto's 9 year playoff drought and the part of his piece that talks about DeMarcus Cousins' bad attitude. How sad that we read his work more thoroughly than he did.
The good news is that there are only 15 more days until the draft. In about a week we should start seeing some actual happenings as teams make deals swapping draft picks, draftees who are likely to be drafted at #16 start showing up for workouts, etc. One week, maybe a week-and-a-half more of this drivel and there might be some shakeups that shift the terrain. Then, there'll be 2-3 weeks before summer league and the open gun to announce free agent signings (and all the sign-and-trades that will go along with that). Those 2-3 weeks will also produce movements around the league.
bob
.
I'll give this to Adam Kaufman, he practices what he preaches. He's proposing "paralysis through analysis" and that is precisely what he does in this column. He said it's not a no-brainer. I could be cold and say that describes him pretty well but that would be untrue. It takes a fair amount of brain power to be able to dance on the head of a pin with all those angels without falling off.
DeMarcus Cousins has been with Sacto for 5 years. Sacto is in a 9 year playoff drought. That means that Sacto has never made the playoffs since he turned pro. Kevin Love left Minny for that same reason, it's frustrating as all get-out for someone as competitive as a pro athlete. Over the 5 seasons Cousins has been in Sacto they have won a grand total of 131 games. 131 wins, over 5 seasons. That's a little over 26 wins/season average. We won only 25 games in 2013-2014 and our heads exploded, imagine if that was the norm! Imagine if you've never known anything else for as long as you've been in the NBA!
"Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser." - Vince Lombardi
So DeMarcus Cousins isn't a good loser. So Cousins doesn't like it, he doesn't like feeling his team is a doormat and it pisses him off publicly and openly. Good. That is precisely the type of player I want on my team. You know what I think would cure his little tantrums? Winning. Winning fixes all kinds of ailments: physical, emotional and spiritual. Yet, somehow, Mr. Kaufman didn't think of connecting the part of his piece that talks about George Karl wanting to end Sacto's 9 year playoff drought and the part of his piece that talks about DeMarcus Cousins' bad attitude. How sad that we read his work more thoroughly than he did.
The good news is that there are only 15 more days until the draft. In about a week we should start seeing some actual happenings as teams make deals swapping draft picks, draftees who are likely to be drafted at #16 start showing up for workouts, etc. One week, maybe a week-and-a-half more of this drivel and there might be some shakeups that shift the terrain. Then, there'll be 2-3 weeks before summer league and the open gun to announce free agent signings (and all the sign-and-trades that will go along with that). Those 2-3 weeks will also produce movements around the league.
bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62620
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
We will not know what the Celtic decide to do until draft night and probability into the draft.
112288
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Sounds as though things may soon heat up on the "move up" front. Celtics moving up to 4 to pick WCS with some combination of picks and/or Sully and/or Bass involved?
Hey, how about if the C's wind up with both Cousins and WCS? Maybe WCS could play some "4" or even a little "1." Cousins could score 30-40 a game, while WCS shuts out the opponent. Maybe they could even play a little 2-on-5 to make for a more even playing field.
Sam
Sam
Hey, how about if the C's wind up with both Cousins and WCS? Maybe WCS could play some "4" or even a little "1." Cousins could score 30-40 a game, while WCS shuts out the opponent. Maybe they could even play a little 2-on-5 to make for a more even playing field.
Sam
Sam
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Whoever Danny decides to go with, the sales pitch needs to be similar to the KG, Ray Allen pitch he gave them which included, "We're going to win a championship within 3 years with or without you. If you wish to be a part of this, leave your ego and attitude and scoring titles at the door and get ready for the most difficult but rewarding, gratifying 3 years of your life. But I guarantee you will win at least one championship in that time frame if you do everything the coach and I say. I have a ring or two. You don't. I know what I'm talking about and will make it happen. You don't. Again, with our without you." And slide the contract across the table. "Are you in or out?"
db
db
dbrown4- Posts : 5614
Join date : 2009-10-29
Age : 61
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Sam,
After all is said and done, and there is more said than there is done, everyone has to come to the realization that the Celtics (and the Lakers for that matter) know how to win championships. A lot of championships. It makes good sense for anyone interested in joining the Celtics to go to the Garden and look up in the rafters. Then listen to Danny's pitch and decide for themselves. The odds for a championship over the last 60+ seasons are a little better than 25%. Same for LAL. No one else is anywhere near those kind of numbers. Not even close.
db
After all is said and done, and there is more said than there is done, everyone has to come to the realization that the Celtics (and the Lakers for that matter) know how to win championships. A lot of championships. It makes good sense for anyone interested in joining the Celtics to go to the Garden and look up in the rafters. Then listen to Danny's pitch and decide for themselves. The odds for a championship over the last 60+ seasons are a little better than 25%. Same for LAL. No one else is anywhere near those kind of numbers. Not even close.
db
dbrown4- Posts : 5614
Join date : 2009-10-29
Age : 61
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
D,
Well, it certainly SOUNDS good. I think it's more a Celtics fan's perspective than that of a potential free agent, who may not feel quite as emotionally involved. But, rafter for rafter, I'm taking banners over balloons.
Sam
Well, it certainly SOUNDS good. I think it's more a Celtics fan's perspective than that of a potential free agent, who may not feel quite as emotionally involved. But, rafter for rafter, I'm taking banners over balloons.
Sam
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
What ever makes the team better, but be careful in what you ask for.
Celticspride- Posts : 39
Join date : 2014-05-23
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Pride,
For those of us who may be slow thinkers, can you elaborate on your "careful" remark? Obviously, you see a danger flag, but I'm just wondering what it is. Not disagreeing in any way; just interested in specifics.
Thanks,
Sam
For those of us who may be slow thinkers, can you elaborate on your "careful" remark? Obviously, you see a danger flag, but I'm just wondering what it is. Not disagreeing in any way; just interested in specifics.
Thanks,
Sam
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Sam,
I think it is what I and others have been saying.
112288
I think it is what I and others have been saying.
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
112288,
Thanks for the clarification. I honestly had no idea what it was referring to. I now assume it was referring to Cousins' so-called warts.
Sam
Thanks for the clarification. I honestly had no idea what it was referring to. I now assume it was referring to Cousins' so-called warts.
Sam
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Their is some very good talent in the NBA, but teams are not careful in bringing in players that fit with them. Good talent is great if the shoe fits and that players is willing to except the role that team gives him. Celtic teams are made with players that fit the roles they are ask to play since day 1. The Celtics would not have 17 banners to prove this.Celticspride wrote:What ever makes the team better, but be careful in what you ask for.
Celticspride- Posts : 39
Join date : 2014-05-23
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Pride,
I agree with absolutely everything you say. But I also feel the Celts may have a little extra gas in the tank when it comes to handling players—in the forms of Ainge and Stevens. Moreover, as I've said elsewhere, some players who have been noted primarily for one skill seem to blossom when they learn how much more valuable and popular they get when they become more well-rounded. (I've used Cedric Maxwell as an example.)
Obviously, nothing's guaranteed. And I assume there's a low percentage of likelihood that the Celts would have a legitimate shot at Cousins. But the past few Celtics seasons have convinced me that a team can go only so far, by exerting maximum teamwork and excellent chemistry, if the quality of talent is not there. Obtaining quality generally involves greater risk than acquiring mediocre quality, because better quality players have more leverage. So, at some point, you take your chances and hope you get exactly what you asked for—a talented star who can grow into manhood with a nurturing team.
Sam
I agree with absolutely everything you say. But I also feel the Celts may have a little extra gas in the tank when it comes to handling players—in the forms of Ainge and Stevens. Moreover, as I've said elsewhere, some players who have been noted primarily for one skill seem to blossom when they learn how much more valuable and popular they get when they become more well-rounded. (I've used Cedric Maxwell as an example.)
Obviously, nothing's guaranteed. And I assume there's a low percentage of likelihood that the Celts would have a legitimate shot at Cousins. But the past few Celtics seasons have convinced me that a team can go only so far, by exerting maximum teamwork and excellent chemistry, if the quality of talent is not there. Obtaining quality generally involves greater risk than acquiring mediocre quality, because better quality players have more leverage. So, at some point, you take your chances and hope you get exactly what you asked for—a talented star who can grow into manhood with a nurturing team.
Sam
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Sam,
I think you are lowering the Celtics ability to land someone of significance. I think they have a good shot at Cousins. 2 first rounders and eiither KO or Sullinger or some combo. Maybe one first rounders and throw Bradley in. Remember Sac will go for Cauley Stein so they are acquiring a center.
I also think they have a shot at any top free agent as well if they do not go the Cousin's route. They can trade and get a good surrounding cast to complement any top free agent center , enough to draw them to the Celtics.
112288
I think you are lowering the Celtics ability to land someone of significance. I think they have a good shot at Cousins. 2 first rounders and eiither KO or Sullinger or some combo. Maybe one first rounders and throw Bradley in. Remember Sac will go for Cauley Stein so they are acquiring a center.
I also think they have a shot at any top free agent as well if they do not go the Cousin's route. They can trade and get a good surrounding cast to complement any top free agent center , enough to draw them to the Celtics.
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
If Sacramento wants to trade Cousins, I think they could get quite a haul for him. I'm sure they would want an all star type player plus a lottery pick to even start the discussion.
i could see a package built around Nerlens Noel and some Philly draft picks as pretty enticing to Sacramento.
i could see a package built around Nerlens Noel and some Philly draft picks as pretty enticing to Sacramento.
tjmakz- Posts : 4278
Join date : 2010-05-19
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
112288,
I'm usually the eternal optimist, and I do think the Celtics have a bit of an edge when it comes to free agents or difficult-to-handle players. But the type of asset in which they're weakest is players who can command a strong return. I have to agree with TJ on that. Olynyk's a body who has some potential but probably long-term warts as well. Same, to a slightly lesser extent, with Sully. I''m not the biggest Bradley fan because I think he has a lot of limitations, so I'd give him up in a heartbeat. I just think he probably wouldn't fetch as much as Celtics fans believe he would fetch. If it were possible to pry Cousins away from the Kings, I also wouldn't hesitate to offer Smart as I happen to think his current reputation is predicated upon just one phase of the game, and I'm not convinced he has an impact position in the NBA. Isaiah Thomas would obviously have some value too, but I wonder if it was damaged near the end of last season when opponents found a way to neutralize him offensively by putting bigger guys on him.
I know people will call me predictable, but the only Celtics player I'd absolutely hate to trade right now is Crowder because (1) I believe he represents a much rarer set of attributes than he's given credit for and (2) I think he's could be a prototypical long-term mainstay of Celtics-type teams.
Anyway, the dearth of high-quality players is what makes me hope Danny will not hesitate to use those draft picks early and often. As it is, draft picks are only as valuable as the drafting position they eventually assume; and that's the nature of the crap shoot.
In a sense, the Celtics' tradeable assets are much like the Celtics' roster—more quantity than quality. Danny will have to be amazingly creative, and I don't lack confidence in that direction.
Sam
I'm usually the eternal optimist, and I do think the Celtics have a bit of an edge when it comes to free agents or difficult-to-handle players. But the type of asset in which they're weakest is players who can command a strong return. I have to agree with TJ on that. Olynyk's a body who has some potential but probably long-term warts as well. Same, to a slightly lesser extent, with Sully. I''m not the biggest Bradley fan because I think he has a lot of limitations, so I'd give him up in a heartbeat. I just think he probably wouldn't fetch as much as Celtics fans believe he would fetch. If it were possible to pry Cousins away from the Kings, I also wouldn't hesitate to offer Smart as I happen to think his current reputation is predicated upon just one phase of the game, and I'm not convinced he has an impact position in the NBA. Isaiah Thomas would obviously have some value too, but I wonder if it was damaged near the end of last season when opponents found a way to neutralize him offensively by putting bigger guys on him.
I know people will call me predictable, but the only Celtics player I'd absolutely hate to trade right now is Crowder because (1) I believe he represents a much rarer set of attributes than he's given credit for and (2) I think he's could be a prototypical long-term mainstay of Celtics-type teams.
Anyway, the dearth of high-quality players is what makes me hope Danny will not hesitate to use those draft picks early and often. As it is, draft picks are only as valuable as the drafting position they eventually assume; and that's the nature of the crap shoot.
In a sense, the Celtics' tradeable assets are much like the Celtics' roster—more quantity than quality. Danny will have to be amazingly creative, and I don't lack confidence in that direction.
Sam
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Sam,
You hit on all good points but if Sac is looking to move Cousins, they git warts to. No one moves a player of his caliber just for the sake of moving a guy and selecting a rookie center. So Cousin's value I believe drops as well. LAL would offer Randle as part of a deal.....he is an unproven rookie. I think Sac would want more proven players so they know who they are getting.
Just my thoughts, 2 weeks and counting!
112288
You hit on all good points but if Sac is looking to move Cousins, they git warts to. No one moves a player of his caliber just for the sake of moving a guy and selecting a rookie center. So Cousin's value I believe drops as well. LAL would offer Randle as part of a deal.....he is an unproven rookie. I think Sac would want more proven players so they know who they are getting.
Just my thoughts, 2 weeks and counting!
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
112288,
Just about any current post concerning the Celtics (directly or indirectly) can raise skepticism in the short run or can turn out to be prescient in the long run.
I wish I could say that I can't wait for the draft. It's certainly true in the sense that, when the draft occurs, two more weeks will have gone buy in this summer of conjecture. But I can go to Vegas if I want to shoot craps. While the draft certainly could be a major element in setting the stage for the Celtics' future, my money is more on trades (#1) and free agency (#2).
Sam
Just about any current post concerning the Celtics (directly or indirectly) can raise skepticism in the short run or can turn out to be prescient in the long run.
I wish I could say that I can't wait for the draft. It's certainly true in the sense that, when the draft occurs, two more weeks will have gone buy in this summer of conjecture. But I can go to Vegas if I want to shoot craps. While the draft certainly could be a major element in setting the stage for the Celtics' future, my money is more on trades (#1) and free agency (#2).
Sam
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
Sam, Yep!
What I meant by 2 weeks to the draft, the draft and the processs will begin the free-up the current non activity between all the teams and something will happen, be it trades, moving up etc and that sets the table for free agency and allows free agents to begin looking at each roster of teams they want to go to.
112288
What I meant by 2 weeks to the draft, the draft and the processs will begin the free-up the current non activity between all the teams and something will happen, be it trades, moving up etc and that sets the table for free agency and allows free agents to begin looking at each roster of teams they want to go to.
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
We have all read of Cousins having troubles in Sacramento, but I disagree that he might not just be THE perfect fit for the Celtics.
This guy has off the wall talent, is only 24 years old, has five years experience playing in the better western conference, is a true center, has not been injured so not carrying a knee or whatever injury in to the equation, is signed for three more years at less than max level money, etc, etc.
Now that he is not a teenager any longer he has to be looking for better place to ply his basketball talents. He has to know that he could easily be in his thirties before Sacramento is ready to compete in the west never mind in the total league. He knows that Sacramento has had lottery picks for the last eight years and still can only average 26 wins per season. He knows that the center play in the east is not as strong as out west so his stats will likely increase. He knows that the constant turnover of head coaches in Sacramento is is likely to continue, With the Cs, he would be in the playoffs immediately, even from the other coast he knows that Stevens is a good/excellent coach (with a great staff) who has at least four more years on his contract, he knows the history of the Boston franchise, he knows that the basketball 'culture' in Boston has been changed by Stevens and the players etc, etc, etc.
He SHOULD be asking/begging to be traded to Boston immediately!
If weather and climate are important to this guy we cannot tell him that Boston is South Beach, but Sacramento is not South Beach either.
If he wants to win, he knows that it is not happening in Sacramento as fast as it will in Boston. He knows that he is good enough to be the hub of a fast growing, successful team.
Now, even without a college degree he knows all of this stuff as well as we do, but the question will be what he does about it. Also, what does he do to build a better base from which to launch his career as far as being a better citizen? He has already shown that he has grow up to some degree from his days as a 19 year old kid so I think that
he has found his way somewhat already and could be very ready to blossom out into the full fledged star that his talents indicate that he can be.
If trading up to get Cauley-Stein is a gamble (which it is), I would rather trade up a little higher (some more of the MANY draft pics Ainge has) to gamble on a much more established player.
Yes, still a gamble but this guy may just be perfect for the Celtics.
This guy has off the wall talent, is only 24 years old, has five years experience playing in the better western conference, is a true center, has not been injured so not carrying a knee or whatever injury in to the equation, is signed for three more years at less than max level money, etc, etc.
Now that he is not a teenager any longer he has to be looking for better place to ply his basketball talents. He has to know that he could easily be in his thirties before Sacramento is ready to compete in the west never mind in the total league. He knows that Sacramento has had lottery picks for the last eight years and still can only average 26 wins per season. He knows that the center play in the east is not as strong as out west so his stats will likely increase. He knows that the constant turnover of head coaches in Sacramento is is likely to continue, With the Cs, he would be in the playoffs immediately, even from the other coast he knows that Stevens is a good/excellent coach (with a great staff) who has at least four more years on his contract, he knows the history of the Boston franchise, he knows that the basketball 'culture' in Boston has been changed by Stevens and the players etc, etc, etc.
He SHOULD be asking/begging to be traded to Boston immediately!
If weather and climate are important to this guy we cannot tell him that Boston is South Beach, but Sacramento is not South Beach either.
If he wants to win, he knows that it is not happening in Sacramento as fast as it will in Boston. He knows that he is good enough to be the hub of a fast growing, successful team.
Now, even without a college degree he knows all of this stuff as well as we do, but the question will be what he does about it. Also, what does he do to build a better base from which to launch his career as far as being a better citizen? He has already shown that he has grow up to some degree from his days as a 19 year old kid so I think that
he has found his way somewhat already and could be very ready to blossom out into the full fledged star that his talents indicate that he can be.
If trading up to get Cauley-Stein is a gamble (which it is), I would rather trade up a little higher (some more of the MANY draft pics Ainge has) to gamble on a much more established player.
Yes, still a gamble but this guy may just be perfect for the Celtics.
wide clyde- Posts : 815
Join date : 2014-10-22
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
hey,
If the coaching staff can make it work.....and it does not cost us an arm and a leg for psychiatry bills ...............let the trade begin!
112288
If the coaching staff can make it work.....and it does not cost us an arm and a leg for psychiatry bills ...............let the trade begin!
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: DeMarcus Cousins is elite, but he’s not a perfect fit for Celtics
112288,
A few counseling sessions (even one per day, if necessary) would actually be a cheap price to pay for 10 more wins, a better standing in the East and winning at least one playoff series.
I could easily give up 3 number one picks a few number two picks and a player for this guy. Sacramento is very far from getting to the playoffs so they could use a big addition of top tier draft picks. They are not just one player away from the playoffs in the west. One player is not going to get them to 45 wins with or without George Karl from the 26 wins that they had this year. They need to seriously think of getting and developing a bigger batch of young players now and hope to make a run in maybe 2017 or 2018. They may not want to 'tank' like Philly has but they are just as far away from making the playoffs.
A few counseling sessions (even one per day, if necessary) would actually be a cheap price to pay for 10 more wins, a better standing in the East and winning at least one playoff series.
I could easily give up 3 number one picks a few number two picks and a player for this guy. Sacramento is very far from getting to the playoffs so they could use a big addition of top tier draft picks. They are not just one player away from the playoffs in the west. One player is not going to get them to 45 wins with or without George Karl from the 26 wins that they had this year. They need to seriously think of getting and developing a bigger batch of young players now and hope to make a run in maybe 2017 or 2018. They may not want to 'tank' like Philly has but they are just as far away from making the playoffs.
wide clyde- Posts : 815
Join date : 2014-10-22
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