NBA Commissioner Adam Silver: ’we need to revisit and reset (tampering) rules'

https://www.masslive.com/celtics/2019/07/nba-commissioner-adam-silver-we-need-to-revisit-and-reset-tampering-rules.html



NBA Commissioner Adam Silver: ’we need to revisit and reset (tampering) rules'




Updated 12:50 AM;
Today 12:50 AM



By John Karalis | JKaralis@masslive.com




LAS VEGAS -- The NBA just underwent a free agency unlike any other in its history. Five of 15 All-NBA players switched teams, many amidst questions of exactly when their deals were actually done.

New York Knicks forward Bobby Portis recently said he knew Kyrie Irving and Kevin Durant had committed to Brooklyn in February. Al Horford reportedly stepped away from negotiations with the Boston Celtics after getting word that a much bigger offer was waiting for him somewhere else weeks ago.

Tampering has always occurred to some level that commissioner Adam Silver characterized as “historically... acceptable in the league,” but this summer’s antics pushed the issue to the forefront of league business.

The first question asked of Silver at his Board of Governors press conference was about the level to which interfered with one another. If rules exist to prevent tampering, why is it so clearly happening?

“I think the consensus at both our committee meetings and the board meeting was that we need to revisit and reset those rules, that some of the rules we have in place may not make sense.” Silver said. “I think it’s pointless at the end of the day to have rules that we can’t enforce. I think it hurts the perception of integrity around the league.”

The obvious question is how the rules might change. There are easy ways to circumvent tampering with technology that can hide conversations. There is also a question of who can change the rules.

“The marching orders to the league, together with our Labor Relations Committee, is that we should spend the next several months thinking about both what is in our unilateral power to change," Silver said. "Then potentially what it is we should be discussing with the players when we sit back down for bargaining.”

Player movement is at an all-time high. Players, especially the superstars, have more power than ever. Wherever there is the potential to sign a franchise-changing player, teams are going to push the line to get whatever advantage they can get.

However, there is a very dangerous pitfall here if things don’t change. Fans have less time to fall in love with players, and they spend money on paraphernalia that becomes outdated quickly. Fan money is what makes this league possible, and the immense fan interest means more money than ever for everyone. If there’s any issue in the league that could threaten that, all sides could lose.

“There certainly was a sense that we can do a better job," Silver said. "And I think that’s in the interest of the players and the teams because at the end of the day, players want fair competition, too. They know if they and their representatives are following the rules that they’re not being told that that cap space has already been filled. Everybody should have an interest in the rule of law for this league. Everybody recognizes, players and teams, that they’re all part of something larger.”



bob
MY NOTE:  Silver is right, something needs to be done.  The league front office looks like a toothless joke.   If Philly tampered with Horford, what should be the penalty?  Cancel Horford's contract?  Can't do that.  Lose a draft pick? Barely a slap on the wrist if it gets you a player of Horford's caliber, especially from your arch division rival, certainly not much of a deterrent.  If Kyrie "tampered" with Durant while he was still under contract with GSW, then what?  Should players be constrained by the same anti-tampering rules as GMs and agents, and how would/could you enforce them?  In my opinion the status quo represents an existential threat to the NBA as a league.
That's how serious I consider it.


.

since you will never "fix" this problem because teams and players will do what humans always do...LIE about talking before the period they can.



Perhaps the NBA should just Take whatever players salary is off ther cap allowance? It would be easier if the NBA had a HARD salary cap but it could still be done.

IF the NBA sees a problem they really want to fix ( I think this is just for publicity myself) lowering a teams cap and making the team less competitive (which would be a proper penalty for illegal signings) would be a real fix.


oh...I will note that the K. Walker signing was reported BEFORE the 6PM time that team can START to negotiate with other teams free agents. Horford's signing by Philly was reported at least 3 hours later. So I would say the Celtics did some "tampering" as well.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nba/news/nba-free-agency-rumors-2019-live-updates-news-signings-trades-more/arbfxccmt6w0164xz792amsum

a good time line showing the problem with teams not only TALKING, but getting deals done with other teams Free agents, which is blatant tampering according to the rules ,

It seems like most or probably all teams ignored tampering rules this summer.
Days before free agency technically started we knew Kemba was going to Boston, Kyrie was going to Brooklyn and many other deals were set already.
Two things the NBA should do is move free agency up to maybe 3 days after the finals have ended. Also, they need to have free agency before the draft. Having all the trades announced during or before the draft, then waiting weeks for them to be completed is crazy.

tjmakz wrote:It seems like most or probably all teams ignored tampering rules this summer.
Days before free agency technically started we knew Kemba was going to Boston, Kyrie was going to Brooklyn and many other deals were set already.
Two things the NBA should do is move free agency up to maybe 3 days after the finals have ended. Also, they need to have free agency before the draft. Having all the trades announced during or before the draft, then waiting weeks for them to be completed is crazy.

agree on the draft AFTER the new NBA season starts.

so either move the start of the new NBA season before the draft or move the draft back a couple weeks.

The timing of the draft is a thing of the past anyway....was well before there was any Free agency in the NBA.

Free agent signing is the #1 way to improve your team now. The draft is second or third along with trades, IMO.

Summer league could be moved back until the end of July or even first of August, though I know all the beautiful rich people of the NBA will hate to not be in Vegas the first of July...but so be it.

that will not fix the tampering issue however.

NBA needs a hard cap and elimination of the max contract rules. Neither will likely happen, as the players run the league. But the idea that you can pay any amount over the cap to resign your own players or that max players will basically make the same wherever they go, makes this play with your buddies thing a reality.

As the rules stand now, stars are highly incentivized to merely team up and dominate rather than spread out and maintain some measure of competitive balance. That instills extreme predictability on the vast majority of NBA games, you can pretty much state now who has a chance of winning the title and who does not.

mrkleen09 wrote:NBA needs a hard cap and elimination of the max contract rules.  Neither will likely happen, as the players run the league.  But the idea that you can pay any amount over the cap to resign your own players or that max players will basically make the same wherever they go, makes this play with your buddies thing a reality.  

As the rules stand now, stars are highly incentivized to merely team up and dominate rather than spread out and maintain some measure of competitive balance. That instills extreme predictability on the vast majority of NBA games, you can pretty much state now who has a chance of winning the title and who does not.  

I agree on a hard cap.

my idea to help keep super teams from happening (somewhat) would be a HARD salary cap (like the NFL uses) only each team would be allowed to "exempt" one salary each year from that cap. Call  it a max player rule or something.

something like......the cap this year is $109M, but many teams are well  over the cap.

so use maybe $100M as the hard cap, with each team able to exempt one salary.

probably would end up a wash as far as over all salary's to players (they can make those numbers work) and less likely a team can have more than one max salary on the roster.

another upside could be more salary in the $10-20M range along with less MAX deals.


https://www.spotrac.com/nba/cap/

a quick look shows the average salary's at about $124M or so right now with only TWO teams below the $109M cap.

so why have a cap or one this low?

the numbers actually show you could have a $90M hard cap with one exempt max player per team and still be paying the same over all salary to the players.

20 NBA players currently have a salary at over $30M next year

another 26 are between $25-30M (this is where some lower salary's would likely fall)

6 more players between $20-25M

about 30 between $15-20M

43 or so between $10-15M ( probably some more here)

68 or so between $5-10M (more here too)

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/rankings/cap-hit/

mrkleen09 wrote:NBA needs a hard cap and elimination of the max contract rules.  Neither will likely happen, as the players run the league.  But the idea that you can pay any amount over the cap to resign your own players or that max players will basically make the same wherever they go, makes this play with your buddies thing a reality.  

As the rules stand now, stars are highly incentivized to merely team up and dominate rather than spread out and maintain some measure of competitive balance. That instills extreme predictability on the vast majority of NBA games, you can pretty much state now who has a chance of winning the title and who does not.  

Agree 100%

The NBA has LAL, LAC, Brooklyn and Houston that have player collaboration.  All teams including the Celtics expect their stars to recruit other stars.  

OKC lost PG but extracted a World War I level restitution fee.

Some teams lost an Elite player like Boston and Toronto did.  But those teams knew the risks when they made trades for those elite players.

NOLA lost their franchise player in AD but are well positioned to put an exciting and talented young team on the court.

Putting a team together is one thing.  Keeping it together is another.  

I have no problem at all when talent pairs itself up.  Teams that do this become contenders but there is no guarantee that they will win.  Competition remains.  

I would like to see compensatory picks be awarded to a team that losses a player.  If a player leaves a team because they do not want to pay him is one thing but if a team like Toronto or Boston losses a player that they intended to resign, the team he signs with should part with a pick.  I think every team should be able to tag one player that will get them a compensatory 1st round pick if he signs elsewhere during FA.

Players should remain free to talk with any other players in the league about wanting to play together.   Agents do most of the tampering as they are hustling trying to find the best deal for their clients and themselves.

something like 68 free agents were spoken for in the 1st 24 hours of free agency.  Teams (all team) had to engage in tampering to some degree.

NBA --- oWNERSHIP and PLAYER contractual arrangement
Slavery - 1949 through 1987
Free agency - 1988 through 2019
1949-50 through 1986-87,,, 48 years and only 12 different franchises were champs.
1988-89 through 2018-19,,, 31 years and 11 different franchises were champs.

Pick your poisson.

swish

kdp59 wrote:since you will never "fix" this problem because teams and players will do what humans always do...LIE about talking before the period they can.



Perhaps the NBA should just Take whatever players salary is off ther cap allowance? It would be easier if the NBA had a HARD salary cap but it could still be done.

IF the NBA sees a problem they really want to fix ( I think this is just for publicity myself) lowering a teams cap and making the team less competitive (which would be a proper penalty for illegal signings) would be a real fix.


oh...I will note that the K. Walker signing was reported BEFORE the 6PM time that team can START to negotiate with other teams free agents. Horford's signing by Philly was reported at least 3 hours later. So I would say the Celtics did some "tampering" as well.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nba/news/nba-free-agency-rumors-2019-live-updates-news-signings-trades-more/arbfxccmt6w0164xz792amsum

a good time line showing the problem with teams not only TALKING, but getting deals done with other teams Free agents, which is blatant tampering according to the rules ,

                                                                                                                  There is no way the player's union will agree to the lowering of salary caps. It hurts  the players as well as the offending teams. I'm not pooh-poohing your solution. I just don't think it can be imposed on the players. Maybe if they raised the salary cap as a whole.

actually the total over all players salaries would stay the same.

the lower hard cap would not include the top player salary on each team

but you're right something like this is not likely to happen while the league is swimming in money.

I mean the NBA won't even move back the draft a few weeks.

* Players free to discuss choice of teams. Tampering not an issue.
* 7 years in league to become an unrestricted free agent.
* When the cap space is available -----
* A team can sign just one free agent per year at contract value of 18 mil plus per year.
* A team can sign two free agents per year valued at 5 mil plus each at contract total value of no more than 18 mil per year.
* A team can sign unlimited players at league minimum salary.
* All final figures suject to existing cap requirements
* Unused cap space available - carry forward to next year.


Just some thoughts to throw against the wall. Tough to compromise an issue such as this - Players, Ownership and fans all have different motivations.

swish

If Adam Silver were to seed his position to me, the first two things I would do would be to 1. institute a hard cap, and 2. outlaw ping-pong balls at basketball meetings and eliminate the whole silly lottery system.

I'm not waiting around for Adam's call, however.

Cede.

NYCelt wrote:If Adam Silver were to seed his position to me, the first two things I would do would be to 1. institute a hard cap, and 2. outlaw ping-pong balls at basketball meetings and eliminate the whole silly lottery system.

I'm not waiting around for Adam's call, however.

Do you think they should have the draft based solely on the standings?
Worst team gets #1 pick, etc?
One of the best things they did was to change the draft lottery percentages this year and have 4 teams that are chosen by ping pong balls.

Almost none of the ideas here are even remotely on the radar of the league.
Yes, they will address some of the tampering issues. The change will probably be to weaken the tampering rules and by changing the date of free agency.
I don’t think the league should or will ever have a hard cap or free agent compensation. Free agent compensation hurts free agents because all teams would be discouraged from signing free agents if they would lose a draft pick. A team like Golden State or Milwaukee might not care as much as a team like Phoenix or Charlotte who could potentially give up a top 5 pick because they signed a free agent.

The super max that allows teams to sign their own previously drafted free agents for more money has resulted in very mixed results. It has worked out well so far for Curry and Westbrook but has been a disaster for John Wall’s contract. Anthony Davis walked away from super max money.

worcester wrote:Cede.

Oops. I planted the wrong word!

tjmakz wrote:

NYCelt wrote:If Adam Silver were to seed his position to me, the first two things I would do would be to 1. institute a hard cap, and 2. outlaw ping-pong balls at basketball meetings and eliminate the whole silly lottery system.

I'm not waiting around for Adam's call, however.

Do you think they should have the draft based solely on the standings?
Worst team gets #1 pick, etc?
One of the best things they did was to change the draft lottery percentages this year and have 4 teams that are chosen by ping pong balls.

Yes. Worst record drafts first.

I think the lottery is the most convoluted way to solve a rare occurrence.

tjmakz wrote:Almost none of the ideas here are even remotely on the radar of the league.
Yes, they will address some of the tampering issues. The change will probably be to weaken the tampering rules and by changing the date of free agency.
I don’t think the league should or will ever have a hard cap or free agent compensation. Free agent compensation hurts free agents because all teams would be discouraged from signing free agents if they would lose a draft pick. A team like Golden State or Milwaukee might not care as much as a team like Phoenix or Charlotte who could potentially give up a top 5 pick because they signed a free agent.

The super max that allows teams to sign their own previously drafted free agents for more money has resulted in very mixed results. It has worked out well so far for Curry and Westbrook but has been a disaster for John Wall’s contract. Anthony Davis walked away from super max money.

I agree with TJ on this. This is the system MLB uses, and it's so broken it may lead to a strike. Teams are holding off on signing free agents with compensation picks attached, leaving star players unsigned for the last few years until those penalties clear after the draft (about 1/3 of the way into the season). And in baseball, draft picks have historically been less valuable, as even 1st round picks aren't guaranteed make it to the big leagues, though this is changing with better analytics and better access to video. In basketball, where there are a lot fewer picks and each pick is a lot more valuable, any free agent with loss of a pick attached to them would really have their earning potential hurt. No way the player's association goes for that.

-V

I also wonder why tampering seems so prevalent in the NBA, but less so in the other major sports. You rarely hear about baseball players doing this sort of thing, and MLB has the least restrictions on teams signing whoever they want, with no salary cap, max salary, or other protectors in place to prevent it. Likewise, you don't really hear about Tom Brady recruiting specific receivers or linesmen that he wants to work with.

Is it just because one superstar makes a bigger difference in the NBA? Or is there something else about the league and its culture that is driving this behavior?

-V

BaronV wrote:I also wonder why tampering seems so prevalent in the NBA, but less so in the other major sports.  You rarely hear about baseball players doing this sort of thing, and MLB has the least restrictions on teams signing whoever they want, with no salary cap, max salary, or other protectors in place to prevent it.  Likewise, you don't really hear about Tom Brady recruiting specific receivers or linesmen that he wants to work with.  

Is it just because one superstar makes a bigger difference in the NBA?  Or is there something else about the league and its culture that is driving this behavior?  

-V

It is mostly because one superstar makes a bigger difference in the NBA.

Why fear openly expressing those players that you would like to have on your team or for the players those teams that you would like to play on - Whether it be Ownership, Players or Fans voiceing their opinion (who doesn't have their favorites) whats the harm. Getting it done while playing by the financial rules - that's the hard part.

swish

tjmakz wrote:Almost none of the ideas here are even remotely on the radar of the league.
Yes, they will address some of the tampering issues. The change will probably be to weaken the tampering rules and by changing the date of free agency.
I don’t think the league should or will ever have a hard cap or free agent compensation. Free agent compensation hurts free agents because all teams would be discouraged from signing free agents if they would lose a draft pick. A team like Golden State or Milwaukee might not care as much as a team like Phoenix or Charlotte who could potentially give up a top 5 pick because they signed a free agent.

The super max that allows teams to sign their own previously drafted free agents for more money has resulted in very mixed results. It has worked out well so far for Curry and Westbrook but has been a disaster for John Wall’s contract. Anthony Davis walked away from super max money.

LOL...hell I'm so old I remember when the commish decided compensation after a team signed a free agent!!!

I think Rick Barry left GS for Houston back in the day the and Larry O'Brien sent John Lucas to GS as compensation....now THAT was a way to dampen player movement!!!

ahhhhh...the old days

kdp59 wrote:

tjmakz wrote:Almost none of the ideas here are even remotely on the radar of the league.
Yes, they will address some of the tampering issues. The change will probably be to weaken the tampering rules and by changing the date of free agency.
I don’t think the league should or will ever have a hard cap or free agent compensation. Free agent compensation hurts free agents because all teams would be discouraged from signing free agents if they would lose a draft pick. A team like Golden State or Milwaukee might not care as much as a team like Phoenix or Charlotte who could potentially give up a top 5 pick because they signed a free agent.

The super max that allows teams to sign their own previously drafted free agents for more money has resulted in very mixed results. It has worked out well so far for Curry and Westbrook but has been a disaster for John Wall’s contract. Anthony Davis walked away from super max money.

LOL...hell I'm so old I remember when the commish decided compensation after a team signed a free agent!!!

I think Rick Barry left GS for Houston back in the day the  and Larry O'Brien sent John Lucas to GS as compensation....now THAT was a way to dampen player movement!!!

ahhhhh...the old days

Good old days ? Yeh I guess so - just as long as it wasn't your freedom of movement.

swish

swish wrote:

kdp59 wrote:

tjmakz wrote:Almost none of the ideas here are even remotely on the radar of the league.
Yes, they will address some of the tampering issues. The change will probably be to weaken the tampering rules and by changing the date of free agency.
I don’t think the league should or will ever have a hard cap or free agent compensation. Free agent compensation hurts free agents because all teams would be discouraged from signing free agents if they would lose a draft pick. A team like Golden State or Milwaukee might not care as much as a team like Phoenix or Charlotte who could potentially give up a top 5 pick because they signed a free agent.

The super max that allows teams to sign their own previously drafted free agents for more money has resulted in very mixed results. It has worked out well so far for Curry and Westbrook but has been a disaster for John Wall’s contract. Anthony Davis walked away from super max money.

LOL...hell I'm so old I remember when the commish decided compensation after a team signed a free agent!!!

I think Rick Barry left GS for Houston back in the day the  and Larry O'Brien sent John Lucas to GS as compensation....now THAT was a way to dampen player movement!!!

ahhhhh...the old days

Good old days ? Yeh I guess so - just as long as it wasn't your freedom of movement.

 swish

I agree with you swish, that comment was meant to be sarcasm (we need a sarcasm emo, LOL)