Could JJJ become Odom 2.0?

Yesterday, after I was done drooling for the day over the upcoming Jason Terry signing, a thought occurred to me. I suggested that a 2nd unit backcourt of Terry and Ray Allen would be offensive dynamite. Putting Steamer and Sully up front and then a SF of your choice would be a good bench. Then I thought "why didn't I include JJJ in that list of SFs?"

At 6'10", 220# he's not built to be an NBA 4. It will take years, if ever, for him to bulk out enough to do that and who knows how effective he'll be with all that extra weight? At that weight, he's really a 3 and probably will be that for years.

Plusses

1. Along with Odom and Yi Jianlian (how do you say "El Busto" in Mandarin?) he'd be one of the longest 3s in the NBA. A definite plus.

2. He can run like a deer. Can he run with SFs? I think perhaps yes. If so, he'd be a force at both ends of a fastbreak. He'd be an intimidator against any guard or SF attacking our basket and he'd be an overwhelming finisher on offense. Starting his run closer to the perimeter, where he'd be spending more of his time as SF, would enable him to beat all but guards and SFs downcourt.

3. He has a solid mid-range jumpshot out to "KG range" (i.e. a step or two inside the 3pt line). With his good shooting mechanics it wouldn't be hard for him to extend that out to include 3ptrs in just a year or two.

4. On-the-ball defense. With his length he could compensate for any weakness in lateral quickness by backing off his man a step and, if his man pulled up for a shot, using his length to step up and still challenge his shot. Chris Ford, if you remember, was an extremely good defender using this technique. As a 6'5" slow-footed SG, he backed off to prevent penetrations but was long enough to step up and challenge mid-range shots.

5. Coming off of picks. Instead of using his boney-maroney toothpick body to set picks for others, why not let a wide-body (Sully?) set picks for him? JJJ comes off a pick and, unless Sully's man is aggressive and quick, has an open jumpshot. His man, even delayed a little will lack the height to challenge his shot.

6. Posting up. He could post up any SF in the league.

7. Rebounding. As a 4 he has a weight and width disadvantage. As a 3 he could outrebound any SF.


Minuses

1. Pick-and-roll defense. If JJJ's man sets the pick and then rolls to the hoop, will JJJ have the quickness to get back in time to defend? Remember, JJJ's man, at 3, will be much quicker than the ones he has been defending. If JJJ's man has the ball, would he be able to handle a smaller picker getting the ball back?

2. Lateral mobility. Can he keep up with other 3s laterally? Will they run him into the ground in the halfcourt?

3. IQ. JJJ strikes me as having a pretty decent basketball IQ, four years in a college program will help do that for you, but this is two positions away from where he played in college and yet another position away from where he spent all his time learning last year. Can he make this transition?

4. Dribbling/ballhandling. This is where the "Odom 2.0" analogy really falls down. Lamar Odom is a very, very good ballhandler for his size. NBA 3s are, and should be, expected to be able to handle the ball. If JJJ receives an outlet pass, he would have to gallop upcourt with it himself, with his head up leading the fastbreak. Can he do that? Can he do that without being an offensive charge waiting to happen? Sure, if his head is up he might see a guard and give it to him and keep running, but as a 3 it is not unreasonable for him to take it all the way if there is no open guard available. In the halfcourt, can he dribble around a pick and, if he is picked up by a smaller guard, be a good enough ballhandler that he can continue his dribble long enough to create separation between him and his picker OR dribble into the paint and then shoot over that guard?

It never occurred to me to think of JJJ as a 3 until yesterday but all this talk about needing some youthful deers to run with Rondo etc got the old creative juices flowing. Comparing him to Lamar was a natural, since that is what makes Odom such a difficult matchup, his length and versatility.

What do you think?

bob


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Bob none of us have seen that much of Johnson but I have seen enough to know that he does not have sf skills.

I think he can be an effective pf at 235. His athleticism and length will serve him well. He will be playing big minutes in the summer league so we will have a closer look at his development to date.

Dboss

I haven't seen enough offensive skills that would tell me he could post up anyone at this point. Maybe with more playing time he could show it. Right now I don't think so. He won't get much SF time with Paul and Green though. Unless they put Paul at the 2. Not so sure thats not a bad idea either. 10 minutes of Pierce playing shooting guard. He could abuse SG trying to guard him.

Nobody can tell what JJ's capable of at this point. I'm going out on a limb here and comparing him to Reggie Lewis. In Reggie's rookie year, the team really needed someone who could score, esp. in the playoffs, and K.C. wouldn't play him. In his second year, everyone was saying, WOW! Can this kid score. That's what I think is going to happen with JJ. He's going to start banging down 17-footers and carve out a spot for himself. Optimistic? Sure. I can't help it; I like 4-year college players and my favorite autistic kid in the world is nicknamed JJ.

One skill he didn't have enough chances to show this past year, just a tease, is lateral quickness. He has long strides and very quick feet.

Lastly, the team needs a big man coach pronto. What's Big Red doing these days?

Tardust,

That's the same thought I've had. Although I don't think Paul Pierce is nearly as good a SG as a SF, this could be the point in his career where he gains an advantage (height and bulk) over opponents as well as legitimizing his hanging out on the perimeter.

After we've seen so much small ball from the Celts, it would be rather novel to see some tall ball and banging of the boards from every position.

Sam

I was getting scared. The dearth of responses the first 24 hours was making me think I had completely lost my mind and everybody was just too polite to let me in on the secret.

As far as "tall ball" goes, it would help if Danny put as much effort into signing Steamer as he has trying to sign a host of others. Perhaps this idea of mine of playing JJJ at 3 was one born of creating a tall unit by supersizing the 3.

Jeff Green is still not a done deal. There have been a bunch of nice, fluffy thoughts coming from his agent, but that's it.

Who are our centers? KG, Melo (almost certainly not ready for primetime) and now they're talking about Sully learning center. A 6'9" center. Yes, I know Cowens was 6'9" but he was a superb athlete. He could jump as well as bigger centers and could outrun them all downfloor. I have not read anything that suggests Sully could do either of them. Furthermore, players are taller now. Sully would be going against: Howard, Bargnani, Hawes, Bynum, Horford, Hibbert, Chandler. All tall centers. Are they all top shelf talents? No, but they're not pikers neither (except for Hawes).

It isn't an either/or situation with being tall or quick. Not everybody has to run downcourt, but the ones who do have to be quick. Not everybody has to provide baseline defense, but the ones who do should be tall.

Ever since we traded Perk Danny has been applying short-term bandaids to the 5 position. We need some stability there.

Sorry, this is a "frustration rant" brought on by the drumbeat of Danny pursuing guards and wings and not bigs AND NO I don't include Melo. If even half the things beat and others have said about him are true he will not be offering us much this year and possibly not even next.


bob

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Bob,

I'm still not giving up on the possibility that Danny could use the sign-and-trade route (involving Ray) plus some draft picks and maybe Moore and/or Johnson to snag a veteran big backup. No, not with Miami. Who would want their bigs other than possibly Bosh?

I just can't get this vision of Danny waving a wand over the phone and producing something surprising. Also, by the way, I don't know how much they can depend on Wilcox (and he has yet to be signed), but I believe he should factor into the center situation somehow.

Sam

dboss wrote:Bob none of us have seen that much of Johnson but I have seen enough to know that he does not have sf skills.

I think he can be an effective pf at 235. His athleticism and length will serve him well. He will be playing big minutes in the summer league so we will have a closer look at his development to date.

Dboss

dboss,

He could be an effective PF at 235. The problem is that's 15# away. Who knows how long it will take him to add that muscle and what effect the weight will have on his speed and mobility?

Summer league will tell us something. He didn't have one last year but he has had a year to learn Doc's system. He should be looking better than almost every other big on the floor for us.

bob


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Does anyone know who's coaching the Celtics Summer League team(s)? It would be nice to think that whoever it is would employ Doc's system.

Sam

Sam,

This link indicates it is the regular Celtic coaching staff:

http://www.nba.com/celtics/roster/2012-celtics-summer-league-roster.html

gyso

Gyso,

Thanks for that great news! That could give the young guys at least the equivalent of 1 1/2 training camps under Celtics staff tutelage.

I find that news extremely exciting. Methinks this is worth some game-on threads during at least the Vegas summer league.

Thanks again.

Sam

Bob

15# is nothing. Been in Boston a week and added 20...ha...

Dboss