POST GAME BROOKLYN - AWAY

If this is any indication of what is to come this season from the Celtics..Daily headlines will read................. SPEED KILLS!!!!!!!!!!!

This is a far superior team from the last two years, and Doc is just beginning to round out his starting line up and secondary bench players. With the addition of Barbosa...another winner of the 6th man ward this can be a scary team!

Great ball pressure by the Celtics...especially Lee....what an upgrade in the 2 guard position over Ray Allen. It's not a knock...we loved Ray...he had his time in Boston...but Ray's physical abilities diminished over the last several years.....mainly due to his loss of speed.....and ball pressure. Lee will be fun to watch!

This kid Joseph will be looked at as the steal of the draft........he looked like a veteran out there and is not afraid to get his nose dirty in the paint. Great game from The Jet......he is starting to get his outside game to heat up!

NEXT GAME - SATURDAY -HOME - 7:30 CSNE

POST GAME RECAP

WEEI 850


FAST BREAK: CELTICS FIND THEIR GROOVE IN ROUT OVER NETS 10.18.12 at 10:41 pm ET
By Paul Flannery

After the Celtics lost another preseason game on Tuesday, Rajon Rondo didn’t sugarcoat his thoughts. “We’re nowhere near where we want to be,” he said. “We’ve got to be a better pick and roll team [defensively], a better help-side team and obviously a better rebounding team.”

The preseason wins and losses don’t matter, but at some point the C’s wanted to start playing like the team they expect to see on opening night in Miami. Finally, in the first quarter of their exhibition rematch with the Nets in Brooklyn, the Celtics looked like the Celtics.

With Jared Sullinger and Courtney Lee in the starting lineup, the Celtics held Brooklyn to 3-for-16 shooting and just 15 points in the first quarter. They forced seven turnovers and came up with six steals — three by Lee — and generally made life miserable for Brooklyn’s regular starting five.

When the starters went out, the reserves — led by Jeff Green, Jason Terry and Brandon Bass — were efficient and productive. The Celtics shot 56 percent in the first half and had a 59-44 at the break. After a sluggish start to the second half, they picked it up again and cruised to a 115-85 win.

Here are some takeaways:

Paul Pierce is in regular-season form: After dropping 29 points on 17 shots against the Nets on Tuesday, Pierce said that it was time to get going. “I was really disappointed with the way I played the last couple of games, he said. “So, I wanted to start picking it up right now.” Consider his game picked up. Pierce followed up Tuesday night’s effort with 18 points on just 9 shots, including 4-for-4 from 3-point range.

Jared Sullinger and Brandon Bass played together: Like a lot of teams, the Nets don’t really have a backup center so when they went with Andray Blatche and Reggie Evans, Doc Rivers countered with Sullinger and Bass. It was the first time the two have been in the lineup together and while it’s not fair to call either one of them a “center,” they held their own inside. It’s yet another interesting look, especially with Darko Milicic (wrist) and Chris Wilcox (back) out of the lineup.

At one point Rivers had Sullinger, Bass and Green on the floor along with Rondo and Lee, making for a far more athletic and dynamic look than anything he’s been able to put together in years.

Jason Terry and Courtney Lee on the break: After years of watching the Celtics not run with Rondo, it’s a little strange to see backcourt partners who can’t wait to get up and down the floor with him. Lee’s young legs and athleticism were an obvious draw when he was acquired him from Houston, but Terry has been a bit of a revelation in transition. His favorite move is to hang back as the trailer and wait for Rondo to find him for wide-open 3′s on the secondary break, while Lee is straight speed to the rim.

Lee finished with 18 points on 8-for-12 shooting, while Terry made all 5 of his 3-pointers for 15 points. The roles will sort themselves out, but it seems clear that Rondo will have plenty of options next to him this season.

Kevin Garnett had a solid night: In four preseason games, Garnett has averaged less than 5 points and 4 rebounds in just under 15 minutes of action. It’s not as if anyone was worried about KG’s lack of production. Still it was still time for him to kick it up a notch, and he did with 14 points on 7-for-9 shooting in 22 minutes.

Kris Joseph made an impression: It sure looks like the second-round draft pick from Syracuse will make the final 15-man roster, but nothing is ever guaranteed in the NBA until it is contractually. Given some time with the regulars and all of the fourth quarter to make an impressions, Joseph dropped in 11 points to go with 5 rebounds and showed the kind of versatile offensive game the Celtics liked when they drafted him.

112288

i didnt watch this one either, but read as usual the game on thread, and, well d@mn im excited about what we're gonna be like in the reguler season. Its early but has danny once again found second round draft pick gold?

Last night the Celtics decided to get serious. Take notice NBA, the Celtics might run teams off the court with legit talent 1-12 being led by a great pg and supported by 2 future hall of famers who still have something to prove.

Now we can start to see just how good the new addtions are as they begin to blend their skills into the greater team..

Every year I always think we added depth. This year they have depth on top of depth. This one feels like the 2008 team but this team is more talented.

Dboss

With the talent depth of the Celtic team, Doc will drive other coaches crazy trying to figure out how to match-up all these new players and looks on the court when Doc begins to throw out new bodies all the time.

112288

Hi,
A few notes on the players from the game.
CL got winded at one point running back and forth at full speed. The positive aspect of this is he gave 100% on defense and on offense. No wonder Nets were:"What? Did someone just run by? And scored?Hmm..Did we have a possession in the last 5 minutes?"

Once again, was impressed by Sully's smarts: he knows, feels, whatever, where and when the right place and time are.
Very solid outing by KJ.

I agreed 100% with PP's indignation after he was shoved by J Johnson: it's not a playoffs, not even a regular season game - WTF.

If Blatch continues to perform as he has so far, Nets got the best deal of the summer.

While watching and comparing DWill and RR I was totally unimpressed by the former's performance. At times he seemed lost. I understand it's just one game but still - he's considered one of the elite PGs.

AK

It was a slug fest last night. Not the game, just watching it. I was perched on my bar stool in a pub where every other denizen of the dark wanted every other TV glued to either the SF Giants game or the SF 49ers game. You don't want to exchange elbows with me, not when the Celts are on. When the final buzzer went off there was a mad scramble as grown men practically climbed over each other grabbing for the remote. Now I understand what women go through almost every night, and it isn't pretty.

Payback is a bitch. The message delivered last night was "Your JV might be able to beat our JV, but our Varsity can still beat the ever-loving snot out of your Varsity" ("Speed Kills" works too).

The over aggressive outlet passes got shortened. Showtime was shelved in favor of Fundamentals, like running. I don't want to read too much into this game, it's just one game, but if this is what the Celtics want and can do night-in-and-night out we are going to be very difficult to deal with. And this was without Darko adding shot-blocking, Wilcox running the floor and Avery Bradley and The Brazilian Blur running game equivalents of suicides, up and down the court again and again at full speed.

Sam has been extolling the virtues of a running game for years (preaching to the choir, admittedly). He must be in hog heaven today. We didn't run on every possession but we ran on damn near every possession. Off the top of my head I cannot think of more than once or twice where we started our half court sets with only 15-17 seconds left on the clock. We didn't have one 24-second shot clock violation.

1. Rondo ran. I think he did his "walk it up" once, I think. He attacked the rim. How often have we seen a Celtic team that was up on the break with him?

2. Courtney Lee looked great. Still not hitting his corner 3s, but he did everything else right (I keep harping on the 3s since that was harped on when he signed). What he did do instead was take a dribble or two away from his man and hit the jumpshot. For a player whose rep is as a face-up shooter, this was a pleasant surprise. He played solid man-to-man defense, played the passing lanes and, most rewardingly, ran ran ran. He had 4 steals and only 1 TO. 18 points on 8-12 shooting. Funny how layups will make your boxscore look good, isn't it? He'd get the ball to Rondo and then just take off. I'm an Avery Bradley fan, but if this is how Lee plays consistently Doc has a tough choice to make in a couple months, but it's a good place to be. Decisions like this have no losers as long as egos stay in check. We got this guy for a bunch of rarely used spare parts (Moore, JJJ, Williams). It's not Parish and McHale for Joe Barry Carroll, but it sure is looking like another coup for Trader Danny.

3. Green struggled. Might be those sneakers. One of the downsides to HD is that I couldn't escape those sneakers. 6 rebounds is a lot for him. Now, he needs to figure out how to score and rebound in the same game. He played 32 minutes, probably due to the Pierce injury. Ahh, the value of depth.

4. We had 43 rebounds, Brooklyn (I almost wrote "NJ". It's like writing your first check of the new year. Gotta pay attention) had 40. Considering how often and how badly we were beaten on the boards last year and the year before I'm loving everytime we win this battle. Green and Sully tied for Celtics high with 6.

5. Sully got blocked underneath again, but his intelligence shined through repeatedly. He has a natural instinct for going to the front of the rim. That got him layups last night. Please God, let the crap about his back be nothing but a load of crap...I still shake my head at how wrong I was (and, quite frankly and bluntly, just about everybody on the board was) on draft night when we picked him. Just goes to show, you can never be too sure what other ideas might be running through Trader Danny's mind. We had no idea we'd end up with JET and Lee and Barbosa. We had no idea that Darko wasn't going to be a complete, unmitigated bust. All we knew is that we wanted TALL.

6. Kris Joseph finally played like Kris Joseph. In 12 minutes he was 5-7 for 11 points and grabbed 5 rebounds. He finally looked like knew what he was doing out there. They still used him as a primary ballhandler. Hmmm, it will be interesting to see how that experiment turns out. Let's be honest, though, Doc has been known to try to force square pegs into round point guard holes (e.g. Jamar Smith, Avery Bradley).

7. We had 106 points with 4 minutes left. 106 points! We would have had to get to OT to score that many last year (and maybe not even then). 115 points would require 2OT. We are given credit for 12 fast break points, they only had 7. I don't see how we only had that few. On the other hand we outscored them in the paint 54-34, so maybe what I'm attributing to a fast break they just consider it a point in the paint. Doesn't matter really, either way we killed them every which way.

8. Only 14 TOs. 57%fg%. Brutally efficient. We only had 10fta though. I guess you can't foul us if you can't catch us. They had 31 ftas. Think of that. We obliterated them by 30 points and they had 21 more ftas than us. That's awesome firepower.

9. Revenge of the Scrubs. Kurz, Downs and Melo entered the game with 4:07 left (roughly the same place they came in the last game) and the score 106-81 (25 point lead). We won by 30. The addition of Barbosa and the confidence Doc is showing in Joseph won't result in this game changing their final dispositions, but they redeemed themselves last night.

10. JET didn't run like Lee, but I sure as hell don't want to ever get into a game of HORSE with him. 5-5 from 3 and he makes them look effortless. 3 steals too. He's very deceptive defensively. If our running game is stymied, just get the rock to JET.

Once again, I don't want to go overboard over one game, but if this is was a glimpse into our future, we are going to be the living nightmare of 29 other coaching staffs.


bob



.

I apologize if some of this duplicates what others have said. I make it a point to write any game analyses before reading anyone else's. Having submitted this, now I can go back through this thread and find out where I screwed up.

This came as close to a perfect game as I could ever hope for by the Celtics; and it was against a pretty good Nets’ varsity squad. It could justifiably be considered the pivotal contest for the preseason because they did everything so well. However, I believe the real turning point occurred in the previous Nets game for one reason. Despiite “only” getting up by double digits that the rookies lost, the core players finally got a taste of what an uptempo pace can mean to this team. In that game, they had a couple of great runs, and I could have sworn that I saw light bulbs going off over their heads. This game was all about one word—tempo.

All of a sudden, this is a team that looks for pace at every opportunity. Now why would that be? The number one reason was that Rajon Rondo, Courtney Lee and Jeff Green played 34, 33 and 32 minutes respectively—certainly not excessive time on the floor but enough to establish a greyhound mentality throughout the team. Those guys can fly; they handle the ball well, and they finish beautifully.

But wait, there’s more. Paul Pierce was ahead of the pack on numerous fast breaks. Yes, that name is Paul Pierce. Sure, once in a while he’d take a fast break off, loaf around perimeter, and nonchalantly knock in a three (4 for 4 on the evening). But, if Paul Pierce can reduce his minutes and, at least occasionally, even have a game where his minutes are in the twenties (22 last night), he can conceivably do this all season long and get a lot of easy buckets deep into the…..well, you know.

Virtually every Celtic showed to best advantage. Bass got only two points in his 14 minutes, but I thought his floor awareness was great. In the first quarter, falling out of bounds just to the left of the basket, he threw a pass on the money to Jason Terry, who hit a three (he was 5 for 5 from the arc).

Jared Sullinger, despite being burdened with foul trouble all evening long, was 5 for 9 from the floor and shared the team lead in rebounds with (hmmmm) Jeff Green. The Celtics had nine more defensive rebounds than the Nets. Yes, the Nets had a 16-10 advantage on the offensive boards, but perhaps that was largely because they had 49 field goal misses to 37 for the Celtics.

Another thing about the rebounding. The Celtics were doing exactly what a team should do when they’re at a height and hops disadvantage—namely, gang bang the boards. All too often last year, some onelike Varejao could easily get past a couple of Celts and gain great rebounding position. Iin this game, the team in green came away with many of those boards—often to ignite the fast break.

One good thing about tempo that you don’t see mentioned a lot is that, if a team can excel at the uptempo game, the rhythm improves the team chemistry in other areas as well. In this game, both the halfcourt game and the defense were just dripping with chemistry. The Celts had 26 assists (finally!) and only Doc’s magic number of 14 turnovers. The fact that they forced the Nets into 18 turnovers and 37% shooting doesn’t fully describe the dominance that the Celtics held at the Nets’ end of the floor.

Another thing an uptempo pace does is to act as a catalyst that keeps everything moving. The Celts had great ball movement and great player movement. And even the Nets’ defense was kept moving all over the place, giving the Celts a lot of open looks.

Courtney Lee deserves particular defensive mention with four steals (they may all have been in the first quarter—I’m not sure) and for stonewalling Joe Johnson. Lee is a dynamo everywhere on the court, but he does it in a controlled manner. And, oh yeah, he tied Pierce for the team lead in points with 18. Thank you, Danny. Thank you, Danny.

The Celtics leaped out to a 9-0 run, and I hope for that sort of thing to happen more often than not this season. Six steals for the Celts in the first quarter and only 19% shooting for the Nets. How many times have I said that the best way to win a game is to force the other team to play catchup? And, if you combine that with a consistently withering uptempo game and stifling defense throughout the season and playoffs, you’ll be dominating in ways I haven’t seen from a Celtics team since the sixties. Note: I’m not comparing this and any sixties teams in terms of how good they are; I’m simply noting a similarity in stylistic identities. And I’m predicting nothing about the eventual fate of the 2012-13 Celtics.

It does my heart good to see a Celtic other than Pierce who absolutely loves to take it to the hoop in the halfcourt game. Looks like it also does Jeff Green’s heart good too.

Time and again, the Celts exhibited great synchronicity in the halfcourt. The aforementioned passout by Bass. A great give and go from KG to Rondo for the stuff.

KG looks in mid-season form, (7 for 9 and four boards, and he’s certainly not being overworked by Doc in preseason (22 minutes in this one).

There were so many good things (and virtually no bad things as long as Paul’s ankle is okay) about this game, and I’m sure others will pick up on what I missed.

But my last point (a Sammy point) goes to Kris Joseph. Yes, the most productive of his 11 minutes happened in garbage time, but I was really impressed (once again) with his fluidity as he scores in almost every conceivable way (from strong moves inside to a three-pointer).. He also garnered five rebounds (including two of the offensive variety). But what pleased me most was that he got some run at the PG position, moved the ball well (especially advancing it—which is a major deficiency I attribute to Bradley as a PG.)

Go Celtics!

Sam

Ok, these hurt. Would it really be asking a guy named Green, who plays for The Green, to wear green?









Rondo, over the top of Blatche, to KG.







KG returning the favor to Rondo with a classic give-and-go.







Our bigs, running the break. GREAT laydown by KG.







I don't what to say about this, but I'm laughing my ass off







Rondo's elbow looks tucked in nicely now. Taking his hand off the ball a bit early, but his results have improved dramatically.







Eat'em up KG!







The JET, taking off







This is the cover of Rondo's next GQ photo shoot.







bob



.

Missed all but a little of this game...... just so much going on at home, nothing earthshattering but busy.

Liked the bit I did see.

And the big news is Marcus and I got tickets for the next game in Albany tomorrow eve. I know Doc has said soem won't play, so be it, some will and they will be in green so we will be happy and we'll get a good look at the bottom half of the roster anyway. Seats are not courtside but not far up either.


Certainly will bring my notepad and camera and see what shots I can get!

beat

Rondo not walking the ball up ???? Now that is the best news of all!!

Cow,

Loved the remark about Hollinger. Why how dare you pick on the the idol of the masses?

Sam

P.S. And, yes, I loved the uptempo game and particularly the fact that Paul Pierce at times was out in front of the pack. If his minutes can be reduced all season long and he can sprint out like that, this team could be capable of incredible things.

beat wrote:Missed all but a little of this game...... just so much going on at home, nothing earthshattering but busy.

Liked the bit I did see.

And the big news is Marcus and I got tickets for the next game in Albany tomorrow eve. I know Doc has said soem won't play, so be it, some will and they will be in green so we will be happy and we'll get a good look at the bottom half of the roster anyway. Seats are not courtside but not far up either.


Certainly will bring my notepad and camera and see what shots I can get!

beat

Rondo not walking the ball up ???? Now that is the best news of all!!

Beat,

I'll be looking for you, what seats do you have??? I'll come find you.

bobc33 wrote:

beat wrote:Missed all but a little of this game...... just so much going on at home, nothing earthshattering but busy.

Liked the bit I did see.

And the big news is Marcus and I got tickets for the next game in Albany tomorrow eve. I know Doc has said soem won't play, so be it, some will and they will be in green so we will be happy and we'll get a good look at the bottom half of the roster anyway. Seats are not courtside but not far up either.


Certainly will bring my notepad and camera and see what shots I can get!

beat

Rondo not walking the ball up ???? Now that is the best news of all!!

Beat,

I'll be looking for you, what seats do you have??? I'll come find you.

Bob

All I know is that they are good, we are taking a bus in from Syracuse and willl get the tickets from them I was told it was lower level court side a few rows up.............all you need to do is stand up and scream during the first time out....... we will see you......... as they escort you out. Their computer wasn't working so he could not give me exact section row sear ect....

If you have yours section post it here and I will make a note of it and look you up. We should get there pretty early as we leave syracuse at 3PM. We'll hook up somewhere.

beat

Pretty much agree with everything that has been said.

Couple of random comments.

-Joe Johnson always seemed like a good kid, maybe it was the heat of the moment....but I lost a bit of respect for him last night.

-Jet is a straight assassin. Guy has ice in his veins. Ray who?

-Can you imagine Lee, Bradley, Rondo and Green on the court at together? Celtics just went from old and nonathletic to rivaling any team in the NBA in those categories.

-I was even impressed with Jason Collins. He played under control, made no big mistakes, AND took a couple of hard fouls on Lopez, which is just what the doctor ordered.

My only concern here is that we dont forget Brandon Bass. This kid came in last year, and in the face of injuries - became a very solid starter. I dont care if he starts or Sully....but I hope he does not get caught up in the shuffle. He is a great shooter, great athlete and is getting better on the defensive end every day. Hope Doc doesnt get overly infatuated with his new toy and give up on Bass.....only to have Sullys back flare up and the team be left without a confident PF off the bench.

MRKleen,

You are right about Collins. They asked Scal about him recently and he said he is one of the best low post defenders he has seen from from his observations when they were teammates with the Nets.

Could be the next PJ Brown!

112288

The Celtics are the fastest team in the league. Last time that was true, they won 8 in a row. They're the fastest team without Bradley, Barbosa and Wilcox. Doc's gonna need a calculator to figure out who to put in and when.

This is a team that likes to run, like the 80s' teams, but it isn't yet a running team. Right now, they're running off turnovers and rebounds. When they run after made free throws, then they'll be a certifiable running team.

Tommy, who ran the floor with the same wild abandon Lee shows, talked about how other teams will be affected, not just worn out but intimidated. Maybe the scariest thing will be when Lee and Rondo go to the bench and Bradley and Barbosa come in. When you could swear the pace couldnt get any faster, it escalates.

Bob C 33

I am PM ing you with Marcus's cell # give us a shout tomorrow when you get there.

beat

rickdavisakaspike wrote:
The Celtics are the fastest team in the league. Last time that was true, they won 8 in a row. They're the fastest team without Bradley, Barbosa and Wilcox. Doc's gonna need a calculator to figure out who to put in and when.

This is a team that likes to run, like the 80s' teams, but it isn't yet a running team. Right now, they're running off turnovers and rebounds. When they run after made free throws, then they'll be a certifiable running team.

Tommy, who ran the floor with the same wild abandon Lee shows, talked about how other teams will be affected, not just worn out but intimidated. Maybe the scariest thing will be when Lee and Rondo go to the bench and Bradley and Barbosa come in. When you could swear the pace couldnt get any faster, it escalates.

spike,

I became a Celtic fan in 1976, when I moved to Boston, so I can't speak to the Russell years Celtics, but I've never seen a Celtic team run like that before. The last time I saw a track meet like last night was the old ABA teams like Stan Albeck's Spurs and Doug Moe's Nuggets. I suppose I could say the Suns team of Nash/Marion/Amar'e/Barbosa too. We were running 3 and 4 man fast breaks last night with different sets of 3 or 4. Pierce/Rondo/Lee, Rondo/Green/Lee, Lee/Green/Pierce. We were rich with runners last night and not just in spurts. We ran all night.


bob



.

Here's a tidbit I found. A bit early to start making conclusions about 5-man units, it's just one game against one team, but I'm liking that's the approach being taken here. Interestingly, the small lineups with Sully playing center held their own. Not sure I'd want to have live or die by it, though.

There's more at the page, including where KG talks about the "responsibility that comes when you put on this jersey". Exactly what Sully, Darko and other newbies need to hear and be around.

http://greenstreet.weei.com/sports/boston/basketball/celtics/2012/10/19/irish-coffee-limiting-doc-rivers-celtics-lineup-options/


In the first three-plus quarters of the two games against Brooklyn — before Micah Downs, Kris Joseph, Robert Kurz or Fab Melo made obligatory fourth-quarter appearances — Rivers used 23 different lineups. Other than starters Rajon Rondo, Courtney Lee, Paul Pierce, Jared Sullinger and Kevin Garnett,
no unit played longer than 8:36 together. Before making any
observations, here are the combinations, playing time and plus/minus
statistics.



Rajon Rondo

Rondo, Lee, Pierce, Sullinger, Garnett (21:28): +18
Rondo, Terry, Green, Bass, Jason Collins (8:36): -5
Rondo, Terry, Pierce, Green, Sullinger (7:30): 0
Terry, Lee, Green, Bass, Collins (4:15): -2
Rondo, Lee, Pierce, Bass, Sullinger (3:49): +5
Rondo, Terry, Green, Bass, Garnett (3:39): -4
Terry, Lee, Green, Bass, Sullinger (3:23): +3
Rondo, Lee, Pierce, Green, Garnett (2:45): -4
Rondo, Terry, Lee, Green, Garnett (2:42): 0
Rondo, Lee, Green, Sullinger, Collins (2:35): -3
Rondo, Lee, Green, Bass, Sullinger (2:32): +2
Rondo, Terry, Pierce, Green, Bass (2:30): +2
Rondo, Terry, Pierce, Green, Garnett (2:24): +8
Terry, Pierce, Green, Bass, Sullinger (2:02): 0
Rondo, Lee, Pierce, Green, Collins (1:53): +2
Rondo, Terry, Green, Bass, Sullinger (1:49): +2
Rondo, Terry, Pierce, Green, Collins (1:19): +2
Rondo, Terry, Pierce, Bass, Sullinger (1:09): 0
Rondo, Lee, Pierce, Garnett, Collins (1:07): -1
Terry, Lee, Green, Bass, Sullinger (:59): -1
Rondo, Lee, Green, Bass, Garnett (:50): 0
Rondo, Lee, Pierce, Green, Bass (:30): -1
Rondo, Terry, Lee, Green, Pierce (:17): +1 (end of quarters)




bob




.

BobH and Spike, one big difference between the fast break of the old Celtics and these Celtics is that this team doesn't use the lanes the way the old Celtics did. Typically, one of the current Celtics (it will frequently be Lee or sometimes Green or Bass or hopefully Wilcox or even—last night at least—Pierce) will take the lane on one side, while the other (it is often Terry or Pierce) will trail down and park himself at the arc in attempt to set himself up for the three. The playmaker (usually in the center lane) has three choices—take it in himself, pass to the guy who's running a lane all the way to the hoop, or pass it back out to the trailer.

Without the allure of the three point shot, the old Celtics' fast break usually involved the PG in the center and a wing running in each of the outside lanes all the way to the hoop. If they had a trailer, he was more likely to be a big guy who ran down the middle after competing for the rebound, and wound up lurking around the top of the key. MacAuley was a master at that because he had an amazing pop shot from there. Russell was equally effective as a trailer because he'd lope past his PG, who would set a screen as Russ received the short pass and soared toward the hoop. (Excuse me for a moment while I wipe my eyes.)

The PG and the two guys running the lanes were usually closer together (laterally) than the three guys involved in the current break. Consequently, proximity of the three old guys with one another led to a lot of short, crisp passes, and many's the time the ball would never touch the floor. Because a pass travels much faster than a dribble, slower guys like Heinsohn and Nelson were frequently very effective wing men on the break.

Today's break features more dribbling downcourt, although some of these greyhounds, like Lee, cover a lot of ground with each stride so there aren't necessarily a whole lot of dribbles.

In summary, on the fast break, the older team overwhelmed the opponent primarily with passing. The current team overwhelms the opponent primarily with speed.

That doesn't mean the oldies had no speed. Russell and Sam would have given any of the Celts' current speedsters a real run for their money. And it doesn't mean mean the current guys never pass—not with Rondo out there. And both teams had/have a guy (the older Celts had several) who could throw a great TD pass on a breakaway.

Breakaways might be one reason why the Russell Celts were somewhat more likely than the current team to fast break after an opponent's made free throw. The older Celtics were a vastly better rebounding team. (Even Cousy averaged more than 5 boards per game for his entire career). Shrewd guys like Heinie, Nelson, Sam and John would frequently gamble and break downcourt when an opponent's free throw was in the air—with confidence that Russ or Loscy or Satch or Heinsohn or Howell or another Celtic would grab the board.

If the Celts of today can improve their rebounding (are you listening Bass and Green?), they'll have a much better opportunity for breakaways after a made freebie.

Sam

BobH,

Interesting stats. 82games?

Based on these tiny samples, very preliminary information suggests that combinations including Terry as SG are more effective than combinations including Terry as a PG. It's very early though.

Sam

sam wrote:BobH,

Interesting stats. 82games?

Based on these tiny samples, very preliminary information suggests that combinations including Terry as SG are more effective than combinations including Terry as a PG. It's very early though.

Sam

sam,

http://greenstreet.weei.com/sports/boston/basketball/celtics/2012/10/19/irish-coffee-limiting-doc-rivers-celtics-lineup-options/#more-44840


I don't know where he got them from. It's just one game, so it could have been manual.


bob


.

Bill Russell came to a team that already loved to run and he proceeded to let the horses out of the barn by rebounding and outlet passing. Those teams ran on every play. Two big differences between then and now, - back then, every team had a running game and most players aspired to playing the all-around game. Today, the kind of running the Celtics showed against Brooklyn will cause teams to give up. They're just not mentally or physically prepared.

Like Red, Tommy coached the teams of the 1970s to run on every play. They practiced running so incessantly that even iron man John Havlicek once complained. They could do it because Cowens got the boards and Chaney and JoJo didn't have a problem advancing the ball, they had Havlicek. But those 1970s teams were running teams.

Larry and Tiny passing back and forth down the court like two magicians with the ball is one of the iconic images of the 1980s. Yet the truth about those teams is that they liked to run but weren't running teams. They simply couldn't keep up with the Lakers and needed herculean efforts from Larry to beat LA.

Ironically, the running game was becoming a thing of the past even as Magic took it to new heights. It's a style of play that's too hard, requires tons of practice, too hectic, demands coolness under fire, and too chaotic, needs faith that one's teammates are going to be behind you. It's about team and in the 1990s, the game became structured and morphed into hero ball. I swear the game's marvelous spontaneity bottomed out when coaches started calling every play from the sidelines.

It's almost as though, when the fast break died, pressure defense passed with it. So it's altogether fitting that the team that's keeping defense alive in the 2010s also has a chance of resurrecting the running game.

There seem to be two identifiable types of running games. Red preached what he called "an organized fast break." The ideal break was when the offensive team advanced the ball down the court without letting it touch the floor. I did some research and found that this was the way that James Naismith envisioned the game. Naismith was still alive during Red's time. Wonder if they ever talked?

Anyway, Red said in college they practiced passing the ball up the floor over and over, running lanes, running to spots, until they got it right, and, when it worked in a game it was the ultimate thrill.

What the present incarnation of the Celtics is trying to pull off is what I call blitzkrieg basketball, that is, to differentiate it from the style of running game Red preached. Blitzkrieg doesn't depend on rebounds or outlet passes, or running to spots, it doesn't mean running on every play, and it may not even involve passing at all, Naismith be damned. It means make the steal or grab the long rebound and blastoff up the floor with unstoppable speed and aggression.

At least Red will be pleased that the current version of the running game starts with swarming, disrupting defense. Plus ca change, plus c'est le meme chose.

Incidentally, Bob, you mentioned Stan Albeck and Doug Moe - I was thinking they'd do well to bring Nellie in for a quick consult with these guys.

beat wrote:

bobc33 wrote:

beat wrote:Missed all but a little of this game...... just so much going on at home, nothing earthshattering but busy.

Liked the bit I did see.

And the big news is Marcus and I got tickets for the next game in Albany tomorrow eve. I know Doc has said soem won't play, so be it, some will and they will be in green so we will be happy and we'll get a good look at the bottom half of the roster anyway. Seats are not courtside but not far up either.


Certainly will bring my notepad and camera and see what shots I can get!

beat

Rondo not walking the ball up ???? Now that is the best news of all!!

Beat,

I'll be looking for you, what seats do you have??? I'll come find you.

Bob

All I know is that they are good, we are taking a bus in from Syracuse and willl get the tickets from them I was told it was lower level court side a few rows up.............all you need to do is stand up and scream during the first time out....... we will see you......... as they escort you out. Their computer wasn't working so he could not give me exact section row sear ect....

If you have yours section post it here and I will make a note of it and look you up. We should get there pretty early as we leave syracuse at 3PM. We'll hook up somewhere.

beat

Beat,

I just came from Brandon's house - I'm attending with him, his brother and Mom and Dad - and his Mom told me she has spent the last two days looking for the tickets and they can't be found! But Ticketmaster will have replacements at Will Call thankfully.

I'll call you on Marcus' phone late tomorrow afternoon.