IRISH COFFEE: AN IN-DEPTH LOOK AT DANNY AINGE’S REMARKABLE CELTICS TRACK RECORD ON PERSONNEL DECISIONS

WEEI

By Ben Rohrbach

We constantly examine the players Danny Ainge has acquired since becoming the Celtics‘ president of basketball operations in 2003, but rarely do we take a look at his departed assets. Bill Belichick is so often lauded for the lack of success in which his ex-Patriots have wallowed in, but Ainge’s batting average rivals The Hooded One, and that’s an important notion to keep in mind in this ever-changing Celtics world. Don’t believe me? See for yourself.

For the purposes of this exercise, we’re only looking at outgoing players who appeared in games for the Celtics. That rules out training camp invitees (I see you, Michael Sweetney) and immediately waived trade acquisitions (Hi, Donte Greene). Incoming players are an entirely different story, albeit another successful one (What up, Kevin Garnett?). So, without further adieu, here’s who Ainge bid adieu to (and, yes, I just used adieu twice in a sentence).

2003-04

Let free agents Mark Bryant, Bimbo Coles, Grant Long, Mikki Moore, Ruben Wolkowyski walk July 2003.
Traded J.R. Bremer and Bruno Sundov July 2003.
Traded Tony Delk and Antoine Walker October 2003.
Traded Tony Battie, Kedrick Brown and Eric Williams December 2003.
Traded Mike James February 2004.
BRYANT: Never played again.
COLES: Played just one more season, averaging 1.3 points in 22 games for the Heat.
LONG: Never played again.
MOORE: Somehow lasted another eight seasons in the NBA, including another stint in Boston (see below), even averaging 9.2 points and 5.6 rebounds from 2006-08, but c’mon: This is Mikki Moore we’re talking about.
WOLKOWYSKI: Never played again.
BREMER: Averaged 3.3 points over 36 games for the Cavaliers and Warriors in 2003-04, his final season.
SUNDOV: Averaged 1.4 points over 36 games for the Cavaliers and Knicks from 2003-05, his final two seasons.
WALKER (see below): Averaged 14.6 points, 8.7 boards in 2003-04, but shot a career-worst 26.9 percent from 3.
BATTIE: Signed a four-year, $24.8 million deal in Orlando, and began declining in 2006-07.
BROWN: Averaged 1.5 points over 12 games the next seasons before playing his way out of the league.
WILLIAMS: Played for five teams over three more seasons before starring in Basketball Wives.
JAMES: Still in the league nine seasons later, including a career year (20.3 points, 5.8 assists) in 2005-06, although averaged double-digits just once more and has played for 12 different teams.


2004-05

Let free agents Dana Barros, Brandon Hunter and Chris Mihm walk in July 2004.
Traded Chucky Atkins and Jumaine Jones in July 2004.
Traded Tom Gugliotta,Walter McCarty, Michael Stewart and Jiri Welsch in February 2005.
BARROS: Never played again.
HUNTER: Averaged 3.1 points over 31 games in 2004-05, his final season.
MIHM: Played four more seasons for the Lakers, averaging 10.0 points and 6.5 rebounds in the first two years since leaving the C’s, but played only 41 games over his final two injury-riddled seasons.
ATKINS: Averaged 12.2 points and 4.0 assists over his next three seasons, and then fell off the map.
JONES: Out of the league within three seasons, but averaged 10.5 points for a terrible Bobcats team in 2005-06.
GUGLIOTTA: Retired at the end of the season.
MCCARTY: Averaged 2.4 points over 36 games in 2005-06, his final season.
STEWART: Played only 12 more games in his NBA career.
WELSCH: Averaged 4.3 points over 58 games in 2005-06, his final season.

2005-06

Let free agents Gary Payton and Antoine Walker walk in July 2005.
Amnestied Vin Baker in August 2005.
Traded Marcus Banks, Mark Blount, Ricky Davis and Justin Reed in January 2006.
Traded Dan Dickau and Raef LaFrentz in June 2006.
Waived Orien Greene in June 2006.
PAYTON: Played two more, relatively unproductive seasons in Miami (6.6 points, 3.1 assists), but won a title.
BAKER: Played all of 52 games for three teams over his final two-plus seasons.
BANKS: Never averaged more than 6.6 points or 1.7 assists after the 2005-06 season.
BLOUNT: Had one productive season for the Timberwolves (12.3 points, 6.2 rebounds) for a Timberwolves team that missed the playoffs with Kevin Garnett on its roster, and then decline for his final two seasons.
DAVIS: Likewise, averaged 17.0 points, 4.8 assists for the same T-Wolves in 2006-07, but similarly declined.
REED: Averaged 2.5 points over 41 games in 2006-07, his final season.
DICKAU: Averaged 4.4 points over 117 games from 2006-08, his final two seasons.
LAFRENTZ: Averaged 2.5 points over 66 games from 2006-08, his final two seasons.
GREENE: Averaged 1.4 points over 51 games for three NBA teams from 2006-11.

2006-07

Traded Dwayne Jones in July 2006.
Traded Wally Szczerbiak and Delonte West to Sonics.
JONES: Appeared in 58 games for three teams over next four seasons.
SZCZERBIAK: Steadily declined before retiring from basketball in 2009.
WEST: Averaged 9.7 points and 3.5 assists from 2007-10, but well worth a Ray Allen haul.

2007-08

Let free agents Michael Olowokandi and Kevinn Pinkney walk in July 2007.
Waived Allan Ray in July 2007.
Traded Gerald Green, Ryan Gomes, Al Jefferson, Theo Ratliff and Sebastian Telfair in July 2007.
OLOWOKANDI: Never played again.
PINKNEY: Never played again.
RAY: Never played again.
GREEN: In and out of the league since 2008, but didn’t average double-digits again until 2011-12.
GOMES: A consistent contributor in three seasons for the Timberwolves, but …
JEFFERSON: Even an up-and-coming double-double machine was worth Garnett and the 2008 NBA title.
RATLIFF: Played 131 games for six teams over his final four seasons.
TELFAIR: Likewise, played for five teams over his next six seasons.

2008-09

Let free agents P.J. Brown, Sam Cassell, Scot Pollard and James Posey walk in July 2008.
Traded Patrick O’Bryant in February 2009.
BROWN: Never played again.
CASSELL: Never played again.
POLLARD: Never played again.
POSEY: Failed to live up to the four-year, $25 million contract he signed in 2008.
O’BRYANT: Averaged 1.7 points over 11 games in 2009-10, his final season.

2009-10

Let free agents Stephon Marbury, Mikki Moore, Leon Powe and Gabe Pruitt walk in July 2009.
Waived Lester Hudson in January 2010.
Traded J.R. Giddens, Eddie House and Bill Walker in January 2010.
Waived Marcus Landry in April 2010.
MARBURY: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
MOORE: Still Mikki Moore.
POWE: Played 50 games for the Cavaliers and Grizzlies over his final two injury-plauged seasons.
PRUITT: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
HUDSON: Played 36 games for three teams in his final two-plus seasons.
GIDDENS: Out of the league at the end of the season.
HOUSE: Averaged 6.5 points over 74 games for two teams through 2011, his final season.
WALKER: Out of the league by age 25.
LANDRY: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.

2010-11

Let free agents Tony Allen, Michael Finley, Brian Scalabrine and Shelden Williams walk in July 2010.
Waived Rasheed Wallace in August 2010.
Waived Oliver Lafayette in September 2010.
Traded Semih Erden, Luke Harangody, Kendrick Perkins and Nate Robinson in February 2011.
Let Chris Johnson‘s 10-day contract expire in March 2011.
ALLEN: Probably the biggest mistake of the Ainge era, TA became a consistent contributor for a perennial playoff team at relatively short dollars ($3-4 million), earning three NBA All-Defensive nods.
FINLEY: Never played again.
SCALABRINE: Averaged 1.1 points over 46 games for the Bulls from 2010-12, his final two seasons.
WILLIAMS: Played 117 games for three different teams from 2010-12, his final two seasons.
WALLACE: Played 21 games for the Knicks last season after a two-year hiatus, and then retired.
LAFAYETTE: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
ERDEN: Returned to Turkey in 2012.
HARANGODY: Averaged 2.9 points over 21 games in 2011-12, his final season.
PERKINS: Has steadily declined to averages of 3.2 points and 4.2 rebounds this season.
ROBINSON: Averaging 11.7 points, 4.0 assists since, but still Nate Robinson.
JOHNSON: Played 57 games for three teams from 2011-13, his final two seasons.

2011-12

Let free agents Carlos Arroyo, Nenad Krstic, Troy Murphy, Shaquille O’Neal and Delonte West walk in July 2011.
Traded Glen Davis and Von Wafer in July 2011.
Waived Jermaine O’Neal in April 2012.
ARROYO: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
KRSTIC: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
MURPHY: Averaged 3.5 points for two teams from 2011-13, his final two seasons.
S. O’NEAL: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
WEST: Released from the Mavericks in 2012.
DAVIS: Averaging 11.7 points, 6.3 rebounds since, but landed Brandon Bass in return.
WAFER: Averaged 5.9 points over 33 games in 2011-12, his final season.
J. O’NEAL: Averaging 7.8 points, 5.1 rebounds over 72 games for the Suns and Warriors since.

2012-13

Let free agents Ray Allen, Marquis Daniels, Keyon Dooling, Ryan Hollins, Sasha Pavlovic, Mickael Pietrus and Greg Stiemsma walk in July 2012.
Traded JaJuan Johnson, E’Twaun Moore and Sean Williams in July 2012.
Waived Darko Milicic in November 2012.
Waived Kris Joseph and Jarvis Varnado in January 2013.
Traded Leandro Barbosa and Jason Collins in February 2013.
Waived Terrence Williams in June 2013.
ALLEN: Not much Ainge could have done about this one, since he offered twice the Heat’s average annual value, and while Allen essentially won Miami last year’s title with his Game 6 3-pointer, he’s now averaging career lows.
DANIELS: Out of the league within a season.
DOOLING: Played all of seven games since.
HOLLINS: Averaging 3.1 points over 91 games for the Clippers since.
PAVLOVIC: Out of the league within a season.
PIETRUS: Out of the league within a season.
STIEMSMA: Averaging 3.8 points over 89 games for two teams since.
JOHNSON: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
MOORE: Averaging 7.2 points, 2.4 assists since, but worth Courtney Lee at the time.
S. WILLIAMS: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
MILICIC: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
JOSEPH: Scored two points in four games for the Nets last season.
VARNADO: Scored two points in eight games for the Heat last season.
BARBOSA: Made his return from ACL surgery at age 31 on Wednesday.
COLLINS: Scored four points in six games for the Wizards last season.
T. WILLIAMS: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.

2013-14

Let free agent Chris Wilcox walk in July 2013.
Traded Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Jason Terry and D.J. White in July 2013.
Waived Shavlik Randolph in August 2013.
Traded Fab Melo in August 2013.
Traded Courtney Lee in January 2014.
WILCOX: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
GARNETT: Averaging career-low 6.3 points (36.8 FG%) this season.
PIERCE: Averaging career-low 12.8 points (39.8 FG%) this season.
TERRY: Averaging career-low 4.6 points (38.3 FG%) this season.
WHITE: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
RANDOLPH: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
MELO: Hasn’t played in the NBA since.
LEE: TBA.

With the exception of letting Tony Allen leave via free agency after reaching the 2010 NBA Finals, Ainge has been nearly flawless in this regard since taking over in 2003. Heck, even Belichick let Wes Welker walk. Sure, the C’s president waived goodbye to an aging Ray Allen, an about-to-be-overpaid Tony Battie and both Chucky Atkins and Mike James — who respectively helped land first-round picks that eventually turned into Rajon Rondo and (ironically) Tony Allen — but he’s seen exactly 100 players (including Antoine Walker, Mikki Moore and Delonte West twice) leave Boston after wearing a Celtics uniform and made only one glaring mistake.

So, as Courtney Lee departs, Brandon Bass sits upon the chopping block and decisions on a logjam of Avery Bradley, Jordan Crawford and Jerryd Bayless loom this summer, keep Ainge’s track record in mind.

112288

Dannys done alot of good, the biggest mistake of everything he has done is passing on DeAndre Jordan, which led to 2 other mistakes, signing Patrick O'Bryant and Jermaine O'Neal IMHO. Imagine how good Jordan would be right now after learning from KG all these years and playing with Rondo and Pierce and Perk....damn.

112288,

Humphries will figure into the decisions as well. And I wouldn't be shocked to see the Celtics' braintrust reevaluate Kelly Olynyk's future with the team.

Sam

whats your take on KO Sam?

LOL..OK Danny...but shouldn't be doing other things rather than writing pieces about how great you are?


Just sayin'

Cow,

I've expressed it better in the Post Game San Francisco thread.  But my take is much like Dboss' in that Kelly demonstrates just enough potential to keep the Celtics brass hopeful but, even if he took a post-graduate course in the late Jack LaLane's Strength Academy, he would still be woefully short (no pun intended) in defensive and rebounding techniques and aggressiveness.  He's certainly not hopeless like Melo and Johnson were in recent years, but I'd love to see him traded for even a one-trick pony type of player who's really, really good at that one trick.

What's your take?

Sam

It's not fair to saddle Ainge with TONY Allen's departure.  He offered Tony enough money, but Tony felt like he was going to be behind Ray Allen and Paul Pierce forever (as defined by the length of a professional athlete's career) and wanted his own place in the sun.  We weren't ready to move either Allen or Pierce at that time, so...

Yes, it's easy to say "because he took this player in the draft he passed over that player", but that's why the draft is such a crap shoot.  If we passed over DeAndre Jordan that means that every other GM who picked before us did too.  Los Suns traded Rondo to us for a box of donuts.  We picked up Leon Powe, in the 2nd round from Denver, for cash.  We got Big Baby in the 2nd round.  That means that Colangelo (whom I believe was still the GM in Phoenix at the time) blew it big-time and every GM who passed on Powe and Davis did too (and the GMs who traded them blew it too).  One could say that Ainge "blew it" by drafting Melo instead of Festus Ezeli (who went #30 to GSW).  He's out with knee surgery, but he proved he could play in the NBA before he went down.  It happens.  I'll bet if we do a full-league run down of every 1st round pick of every team over the 10 years Danny has been here we'll find tons of them who are out of the league or are clearly underachievers for where they were picked.  We'll also see where every one of those GMs also passed over the DeAndre Jordans and Kenneth Farieds (#21.  Nolan Smith was #20).  We'll also see New Orleans taking Cole Aldrich with #11 and Jordan Crawford going at #27, Memphis taking Bustapalooza Hashem Thabeet with #2 and a ridiculous number of great players going later (Rubio, Harden just to name a few).  Andrea Bargnani #1?  It goes both ways.

Personally, I'd rather pay a premium for a player that has already laced up sneakers in the NBA and has proven they can succeed than roll the dice in the draft.  I know that the new CBA and the cap make that harder but that's the way I'd prefer to go.  There are only 15 slots on an NBA team.  This isn't football where you can bury some on the bench for depth or let them run on special teams and that's ok.  Every player on a basketball team is high profile, every one, since even the end-of-benchers are "sparring partners" for the rotation players and starters in practice and have to be able to make them break a sweat.

I think Danny's one of, if not the, best player on our team.  We talk about how Rondo is the hub of the wheel that makes all the spokes turn better but in the bigger picture, the bigger wheel, it's Danny that's the hub.


bob


.

Nice post, Bob. Considering that he's a human being, I believe Danny has been more consistent than most (if not all) of his peers through the years.

Sam

Just for a little balance here.........

since the article above is very slanted (we have to remember the DEALS that went down)........

bleacherreport.com/articles/1044486-boston-celtics-top-10-worst-moves-by-danny-ainge

enjoy!

I don't think I really like the idea of looking at the players that he got rid of as a way of evaluating how good a GM has been over the years. Most of those players were added to the team by Ainge and mostly seem to be monitoring where the worse players on the roster have ended up. I'd expect the players at the end of the bench to get few options elsewhere in the NBA in future seasons. Allen is the example of a player who was developed by the Celts and then left to perform well elsewhere. I don't know if that negatively reflects on Ainge or not. More importantly, I want to see if the moves of the GM makes sense and has a direction that would bring championships to the Celts. Ainge tends to have a good grasp of where his team is and what he needs to do to improve that situation. With the Celts in transition, that could me trading away talent, players who should perform well elsewhere, Humphries, Crawford, Bass, or even Green or Bradley if they are decided to be part of the Ainge's exodus.

Hmm.. Ainge has made more good moves than bad moves. Most of his bad moves involve passing up on players in the draft. He did strike gold drafting Rondo, Bradley, Sullinger, Perkins, etc; but he passed on guys like DeAndre Jordan, Omer Asik, and Marc Gasol in other years.

However, Danny has made some rather beneficial trades these past few seasons dating back to the championship run.




KJ

Sam, I agree about KO; I've seen enough that I wouldn't be upset if he were traded before he gets hurt and can't be traded. As far as Danny goes; he's been reliably good, shrewd, although I knew that not signing TA was a mistake. As I recall, Allen wanted a four-year contract, having lived through so many uncertainties, and Danny would go only for three. With Ray and Paul slowing down, we needed TA's speed and tenacity to beat the best teams, and I felt his absence cost us dearly until we rebooted. Hawk

An often-overlooked element of Danny Ainge's has been his instinct for knowing when to part with personnel.  I do not count Tony Allen because I thought Tony Allen got rid of Tony Allen as far as the Celtics were concerned.

Some of the departees had been inherited.  Almost as soon as Danny came on board, he realized that the Celtics would never go anywhere with Antoine Walker as an integral part of the core, and 'Toine was soon gone.  Danny brought him back on a hunch toward the end of one season, and Toine first rewarded him by becoming a contributor and then reverted to his trick-or-treat form and became a two-time loser in his Celtics life.

They weren't all players.  Anyone know Jim O'Brien's address?

Some were draft picks who didn't pan out, and Danny was sage enough to cut his losses and send them walking.  So long, Gabe Pruitt

Others were very timely acquisitions and proved to be equally timely departures.  There's no better example than James Posey.

A few were born to be journeymen at best but were worth a flyer by Danny in his usual mediocre drafting slot.  They titillated people just long enough to hang around a while, and then Danny realized they had no long-term potential and sent them packing.  Bill Walker was one example, and Gerald Green was another.

They haven't always been inspired moves; but when one considers all the facets of being in such a position of responsibility with the most storied basketball franchise of all-time, Danny's had a pretty fine track record.

Go Danny!

Sam

As far as Kelly Olynyk is concerned I have come to this conclusion: it's not that he's a bad player, he just shouldn't have been their first pick.

Poor Kelly has to deal with physical limitations which affect other parts of his game. He's not a great rebounder, defender, or scorer. He's not very athletic, either. He also lacks aggression. He's too soft to play center and will get bested by pretty much every other PF he goes against.

I thought they should have drafted Dieng out of Louisville, because they needed a center, not a "stretch" forward that is more of a novelty player than a major rotation player. I don't dislike Kelly, but he doesn't fill any need this team has in any way, shape, or form. He's a short-handed (or armed, if you prefer), mismatched piece.

Perhaps Stevens can develop him enough for another team to be enticed into trading with Ainge for him.



KJ

KJ....your description of KO sounds a lot like me. Let Danny know I'll play KO's position for a lot less money.

sam wrote:Cow,

I've expressed it better in the Post Game San Francisco thread.  But my take is much like Dboss' in that Kelly demonstrates just enough potential to keep the Celtics brass hopeful but, even if he took a post-graduate course in the late Jack LaLane's Strength Academy, he would still be woefully short (no pun intended) in defensive and rebounding techniques and aggressiveness.  He's certainly not hopeless like Melo and Johnson were in recent years, but I'd love to see him traded for even a one-trick pony type of player who's really, really good at that one trick.

What's your take?

Sam

unfortunately hes a player hard to hide on defense as he can't defend either big position, even with alot of work, I don't see him being more than a marginal defender and even that would take alot of work....he might have some offense potential, as of right now I wouldn't be too upset if he could be included in a deal for other pieces.

One other feature that distinguishes me from KO besides the 16" differential in height is that KO has a high basketball IQ. Maybe, just maybe his offensive production will soar when Rondo is on board to distribute passes. KO knows how to move without the ball, and RR is smart enough to deliver accurate passes. Rondo may be just what's needed for KO to have a career as a Celt.

worcester wrote:One other feature that distinguishes me from KO besides the 16" differential in height is that KO has a high basketball IQ. Maybe, just maybe his offensive production will soar when Rondo is on board to distribute passes. KO knows how to move without the ball, and RR is smart enough to deliver accurate passes. Rondo may be just what's needed for KO to have a career as a Celt.

He also already sets a better pick than Vitor.

Oy.


bob


.

bobheckler wrote:

worcester wrote:One other feature that distinguishes me from KO besides the 16" differential in height is that KO has a high basketball IQ. Maybe, just maybe his offensive production will soar when Rondo is on board to distribute passes. KO knows how to move without the ball, and RR is smart enough to deliver accurate passes. Rondo may be just what's needed for KO to have a career as a Celt.

He also already sets a better pick than Vitor.

Oy.


bob


.

Bob....

You're nearly 2000 miles away...........and you set a better pick than Vitor.

beat

beat wrote:

bobheckler wrote:

worcester wrote:One other feature that distinguishes me from KO besides the 16" differential in height is that KO has a high basketball IQ. Maybe, just maybe his offensive production will soar when Rondo is on board to distribute passes. KO knows how to move without the ball, and RR is smart enough to deliver accurate passes. Rondo may be just what's needed for KO to have a career as a Celt.

He also already sets a better pick than Vitor.

Oy.


bob


.

Bob....

You're nearly 2000 miles away...........and you set a better pick than Vitor.

beat

beat,

Make that 3,121.91 miles away, according to Yahoo Maps.


bob


.

Bob,

well thats about as close as his picks I guess.

beat

According to Paul Simon, you're only emotion away.