Celtic's Closing In On Nate Robinson For Eddie House

Sources: Celtics to land Knicks’ Nate Robinson

Trade winds won’t die

By Mark Murphy
Wednesday, February 17, 2010 - Updated 2h ago
+ Recent Articles + Recent Blog Entries + Email
E-mail Print (16) Comments Text size Share Buzz up!
According to multiple sources, the Celtics [team stats] and Knicks are close to a deal that would bring guard Nate Robinson to the Celts, possibly in exchange for Eddie House.

A league source, as well as a Knicks source, said yesterday that both sides still have interest in the deal that has been discussed in the past month. Two sources in Sacramento, where the Celts played the Kings last night, verified the interest from both sides.

The Celts have narrowed their positional need to a backup point guard who can defend. They have until tomorrow’s trade deadline to fill that need.


The Knicks, who are trying to slash their payroll for this summer’s free agent market, are only interested in players with expiring contracts. The Celtics have three players who would match up to Robinson: House ($2.8 million), Brian Scalabrine ($3.4 million) and Tony Allen ($2.5 million).

The Knicks might have particular interest in House, who played for coach Mike D’Antoni in Phoenix. D’Antoni was said to be a fan of House’s abilities at that time.

A league source said any interest the Celtics had in Sacramento forward Kevin Martin expired. A second source said while the C’s have continued interest in Chicago’s Kirk Hinrich, the sides aren’t close.

Robinson, who has the right to approve or disapprove a trade as part of his expiring $4 million contract, also is getting interest from the Lakers. A league source said the Celtics and Lakers are the only teams that would get his approval. There have been reports he’s agreed to go elsewhere, but the source only confirmed the Celts and Lakers as definites.

The 5-foot-9 Robinson, who won his third dunk championship at last weekend’s NBA All-Star festivities in Dallas, is averaging 13.2 points and 3.7 assists in 24.4 minutes per game this season for the Knicks. The 25-year-old is averaging 12.5 points and 2.8 assists per game in his four-year NBA career.

The Knicks could dump approximately $40 million by the end of the season, including Tracy McGrady’s $23.3 million deal, by moving a matching package to Houston.

D’Antoni’s apparent desire to shed Robinson is a minor consideration, but one the Celtics appear ready to pounce on.

It would mark the second straight year the Celtics picked up an indigent Knick. Stephon Marbury joined the Celtics for last year’s stretch run.

New York Knicks working on deal to ship Nate Robinson to Atlantic Division rival Boston Celtics

BY FRANK ISOLA
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Tuesday, February 16th 2010, 8:59 PM


Sipkin/News
Nate Robinson may find himself wearing a Celtics uniform if New York Knicks completes deal shipping him to Boston.
RELATED NEWS
Kiki, Nets not likely to make move
Blueshirt 'proposal' is exposed as fake
Voice of the People for Feb. 16, 2010
Knicks sent packing after 33-point loss
Nets hold steady to beat Charlotte
CHICAGO - The Knicks have been looking to relocate Nate Robinson since December and they may have found a taker in the Boston Celtics.

According to a league source, the Knicks and their Atlantic Division rival are working on a deal that would send Robinson, the back-up guard and three-time Slam Dunk champion, to Boston. Since Robinson is entering the last year of his contract the Knicks will only take back expiring contracts.

Eddie House, who played for Mike D'Antoni in Phoenix, has an expiring contract as does Tony Allen and Brian Scalabrine.

The Knicks have been trying to trade Robinson since December when D'Antoni benched the energetic yet erratic guard for 14 games. The Knicks were in talks with the Memphis Grizzlies but the deal never progressed once Robinson informed the club that he wouldn't approve a trade to Memphis.

Robinson has veto power but according to a source close to the situation Robinson would gladly accept a trade to Boston.

Robinson did not accompany the Knicks to Chicago. According to the club, he is home with the flu.

112288

I say lets do it. need scoring.

Nate Robinson is a BYC player plus he has trade veto power, because he will lose his Bird rights in the transaction.

The BYC makes it hard to make the trade but he has said that Boston is an acceptable destination.

I tried to make a couple trades on the RealGM Tradechecker, but none of them work. I needed to know if any Knicks were signed with the vet minimum contract, then I would include him to soften the BYC penalty.

gyso

If this trade can reduce Ray's minutes, then I say go ahead. I believe that Ray shooting % goes way up, when he is not play 39 mins. a game. I think that Ray's decrease in production is directly related to him being worn down.

Pete

Eddie House is one of the best clutch shooters we have. According to 82games.com, he's shooting 50% from the field with 5 minutes or less in the game (or OT) and neither team ahead by more than 5 points. He's shooting 57% from 3 in the clutch.

Nate Robinson isn't even listed.

We need a backup point guard. But a backup point guard needs players he can pass the ball to. If Eddie's gone, who does Nate pass to when we need to open the floor with outside shooting? Sheed? Not with his stroke this year so far? Davis? Metzo-metzo. Quis? Not.

I'm ambivalent about this trade. It will free up Ray to shoot more and that's good. However, with the return (and good play) of Marquis Daniels he doesn't need to play as many minutes anyway, certainly not as the 2nd unit ballhandler.

Lastly, Eddie House is a good chemistry guy. A team player, like Scal, who will sit or play and never bitch. He doesn't need the ball to be effective. He knows his role and understands what the team expects from him. Is that (and will that) be true of Nate?

bob

gyso,

I tried for over an hour on the ESPN Trade Machine. Nothing! I finally made some trade I'd never make but I knew had to work, just to make certain the thing wasn't stuck on "FAILURE."

If the Celtics make this trade (whoever's involved), I'm worried about what it does to the chemistry of the bench. Would Nate be the PG (he's not tall enough for anything else) and be the designate floor-spreader? Or would Sheed gleefully revert to form and spend most of his time outside the arc? I'd have to assume that Danny and Doc would have conferred about how Nate would fit into the scheme of things; and it could possibly hinge on additional trades. But I'm just not "getting it" right now.

Sam

Sam,

Let the Knicks just release Nate and then we can sign him in 30 days to our 15th roster spot. After reading this thread I have come to the belief that losing Eddie is too high a cost to get Nate.

I have to think that Doc, Danny and friends liked what they saw from the bench last night. That will surely help them make their decision.

gyso

Seems like kind of a lateral move to me.

Dont really see the point.

swedeinestonia wrote:Seems like kind of a lateral move to me.

Dont really see the point.

swede,

My thoughts exactly.

Regards

Nate Robinson’s Issues
By Zach Lowe, CelticsHub.com @ February 16th, 11:11 pm Leave a reply »
Just a few quick addendums on Nate Robinson, whom the C’s are reportedly close to acquiring as we approach the deadline, according to the Herald:

• Robinson is what’s known as a base-year compensation (BYC) player, a designation given to players who receive a big salary increase from the previous season. This makes a straight-up Knicks/Celtics trade very difficult. Here’s what I wrote a month ago:

[Under BYC rules] Nate Robinson counts as a $4 million player (his real salary) for the Celtics but as a base-year player (with a $2 million salary) for the Knicks. So trades in which the C’s are sending out about $2 million for Robinson—don’t work, since the C’s are bringing in a $4 million player.

If you want more on BYC, check out this piece in The New York Times by salary cap expert Larry Coon, which addresses Robinson directly. (Hat tip: Green Street). Basically: A straight-up two-team trade between the C’s and Knicks is very difficult.

There are two ways to overcome this problem:

1) Add a third team with the cap space to swallow the extra salary the C’s must send out in any Nate trade but which the Knicks can’t accept. Memphis would seem to be the only logical candidate, and they might demand some sweetener—cash or a pick—for their participation in a three-way;

2) Include enough players on each side that the salaries even out. This is unlikely, since the C’s aren’t looking to deal too many guys and the Knicks are on the verge of a mega-deal with Houston for Tracy McGrady.

• One reason the C’s are said to be looking for a back-up point guard despite having both Marquis Daniels and Eddie House on the roster is that Daniels, though a skilled ball-handler, might not be up to defending ultra-quick point guards. And we know the team doesn’t trust House to guard star point guards.

Your first instinct is probably to laugh at the idea that Nate Robinson—a 5′9” guy not exactly known for his D—could be an asset on defense. That was my first instinct, too.

Then I dug into every publicly available stat that could reveal Robinson’s defensive impact since he entered the league in 2005. The numbers told a different, subtler story: Nate Robinson has had no significant statistical impact, positive or negative, on New York’s defensive performance. The numbers are basically neutral. That obviously doesn’t mean Nate is some sort of stopper. You only need to watch the Knicks for a half to know that’s not the case.

But it means that he may not be as big a liability as you (or I) might think. I can at least say this: There is no statistical proof Robinson has ever made a bad Knicks defense any worse.

• Robinson will be a so-called Bird free agent if the Knicks keep him, and (as I understand the CBA) he must consent to any trade, since he will no longer be a Bird free agent if the Knicks deal him. For our purposes, this means the C’s would not have the usual Bird right benefits in negotiating with Robinson in the off-season—namely, the ability to go over the cap to re-sign him without using the mid-level exception. They’d either have to let him walk or use the mid-level.

In any case, Eddie House would seem to be a logical main ingredient in any deal for Robinson. They are by no means identical players, but their skills—and heights—overlap enough that I can’t see Doc finding enough minutes for both of them to justify keeping House and trading for Nate.

I do not understand why Boston would make this trade. Seems to me it helps the Knicks more becasue they are still trying to dump salaries.

I think the weaknesses that i see are defensive. I think the Celtics could use a long quick defender and a BU PG

Nate is basically an undersized combo guard. How does that improve the team?

dboss

Robinson can handle the ball - he can score - he can defend when he wants to - he is capable of carrying a team for stretches.

I like Eddie House, but Nate is a substantial upgrade at the back up PG position.

mrkleen

I do not disagree with you about Nate. House is a pure spot up shooter but lacks the quickness on defense to stay in front of his man.

Nate can take you off the dribble and is therefore a more dangerous player to guard.

Perhaps this is just a tweak but it could also lead to some chemistry issues.

I heard the Knicks are looking for more than just House. i hope DA does not give up any first round pick to make this deal. I could live with a 2nd rounder.

I feel bad for House. He has been a good bench player for Boston.

We will see how all of this plays out real soon.

dboss

Latest rumor is Nate for House + a second rounder.

bobheckler

Seems like this one is going to get done!

The question remains..is this it? Are their other shoes to fall?

I do not see the Celtics doing the deal for Robinson and then doing another deal invloving Ray Allen.

With Daniels back and with baby rounding(lol) into shape, the bench is starting to look promising again.

Now we just got to hope that KG can get closer to 100%.

Let's hope that the injury bug will not visit the celtics for the remainder of the year.

dboss

gyso wrote:Sam,

Let the Knicks just release Nate and then we can sign him in 30 days to our 15th roster spot. After reading this thread I have come to the belief that losing Eddie is too high a cost to get Nate.

I have to think that Doc, Danny and friends liked what they saw from the bench last night. That will surely help them make their decision.

gyso

agree with gyso.
and i think we can use Eddie, and use him well. he was certainly part of the 2nd unit spark that pulled the game out for us last night.
plus, like dboss, i'd feel bad for House to get dumped.

I concur with Kleen. Doode can score 40 points. We need a spark on o. With proper motivation he can play d. I hate to see Eddie go but we need a ball handler and a spark. Eddie aint exactly lit it up this year.

dboss wrote:bobheckler

Seems like this one is going to get done!

The question remains..is this it? Are their other shoes to fall?

I do not see the Celtics doing the deal for Robinson and then doing another deal invloving Ray Allen.

With Daniels back and with baby rounding(lol) into shape, the bench is starting to look promising again.

Now we just got to hope that KG can get closer to 100%.

Let's hope that the injury bug will not visit the celtics for the remainder of the year.

dboss

dboss,

It sure is looking like it's getting done. D'Antoni loves House, from his Phoenix days, and obviously isn't a big fan of Nate's.

Danny has said, and has acted, as if breaking up the 3 Amigos is something is loathe to do. Sure, throw a great deal his way and he will, but he's not going begging.

We can't trade KG because of his contract and because he's obviously diminished (is this it for him, or will get back closer to what he was? Time will tell, but GM's won't want to wait for an almost 34-year old). The management loves Pierce, so he's untouchable. That leaves Ray Allen, and nobody's offering Danny what he thinks Ray is worth.

With Davis back and KG coming back, what does our frontcourt need. Not want, we'd like to have Amar'e or some other big time player, but what do we NEED?

Our outside shooting efficiency has fallen way off, but with Quis back we should see Pierce and Ray's minutes go down and that should help them. The loss of Eddie means the loss of a very clutch big-time longrange gunner. That now becomes our weakness on the second team. As Sam has pointed out we need space creators, especially now that it's looking like we're losing one of the best we had. Who knows, maybe Danny will sign Ricky Davis after all? Then our second unit would be Nate, R. Davis/TA, (depending upon matchups), Quis, UnoUno (even writing that makes me throw up in my mouth a bit) and Sheed. Better ball handling than the current second unit, can shoot like the current one (IF he signs Ricky) because we'll have Nate AND Quis (which frees up TA to run and slash, which is what he does best).

Unless we're talking Monta Ellis or some other stud guard, I could easily see Danny staying pat. If Ray was SUCH good bait, he'd have been gone by now.

Bob

Eddie House is far from what is ailing this team. Over the past several games it has been the STARTERS who have played poorly, not the bench. Eddie is a guy who commands a defender on the perimeter. With Robinson in there, who is not as good a shooter as House. who spreads the floor (as others have written here). Unless there are other trades that have not received publicity to strengthen our outside shooting and youth, this trade makes no sense and would cost the team a draft pick to boot.
Nix it.

bigpygme wrote:

gyso wrote:Sam,

Let the Knicks just release Nate and then we can sign him in 30 days to our 15th roster spot. After reading this thread I have come to the belief that losing Eddie is too high a cost to get Nate.

I have to think that Doc, Danny and friends liked what they saw from the bench last night. That will surely help them make their decision.

gyso

agree with gyso.
and i think we can use Eddie, and use him well. he was certainly part of the 2nd unit spark that pulled the game out for us last night.
plus, like dboss, i'd feel bad for House to get dumped.

bigpygme,

I looked out this morning and the sun was gone
Turned on some music to start my day
I lost myself in a familiar song
I closed my eyes and I slipped away

So many people have come and gone
Their faces fade as the years go by
Yet I still recall as I wander on
As clear as the sun in the summer sky


So it looks like House and JR are gone. I have more than a feeling that House will get bought out and return to the Celtics as a St. Patrick's day present. Who is the third team?

"D’Antoni was said to be a fan of House’s abilities" ? I hope D'Antoni is a fan of House's ability to scoot back to the Celtics after a buyout. Maybe we don't have to lose House to get Nate. Another day, another possibility.

gyso

How do buyouts work, do they pay out the remaining amount of the contract or is it negotiated between player and team?

swedeinestonia wrote:How do buyouts work, do they pay out the remaining amount of the contract or is it negotiated between player and team?

"...on January 10 all contracts become guaranteed for the rest of the season."

"Even though the team & player can mutually agree to reduce or eliminate the player's compensation protection, he is still owed his full salary if waived after January 10."

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q61

It is after January 10, so any player waived now is guaranteed the rest of his salary, according to this. How did Marbury and the Knicks negotiate a lower number? I don't see anything here that supports that, but it happened. What it means is that the player is owed the entire contract value and it is the player's option to take less.

Not a total answer, do I get partial credit?

gyso

Thanks for the answer gyso.

You get full credit from me.

For what it's worth, here's Hoopshype's scouting report on Nate. The good news, I guess, is that they don't mention a defensive deficiency.

http://hoopshype.com/players/nate_robinson.htm