My way to soon to try off-season moves.

after spending the past week combing the innerwebs for info on the draft, free agents and possible players who may be trade options, this is my current (read as I can and WILL change this as time goes on) favorite off-season moves.

1) Celtics trade #3 & #35 pick to Philly for Okafor. While I think Philly wants vet players, the #35 pick allows them to make another deal for a vet guard with either the #24 or 28 pick and this one (or combo of them). They get Dunn to be the PG of the future there at #3. Celtics get a better player in Okafor than anyone left in this draft with the #3 pick.

2) Celtics trade #16, #51 and K. Olynyk to OKC for S. Ibaka. Yes folks there are already rumors that OKC will move Ibaka, who will be on the final year of his deal ($12.5M) next year. OKC also has ZERO draft picks this year and we send them a med first and a late second along with Kelly (who is on a cheaper rookie deal and will be a RFA next season). We get a young player (27YO) to team up with Okafor and solidify our big man rotation. Danny WILL have to PAY him next season at or near max money though ( I will note that Amir and Ibaka's combined dollars are a max deal).

3) Draft as follows: My fav picks firstin each spot)
#23- one of T. Maker, T. Prince or P. McCaw
#31- one of A. Zizic, Z. Qi or I. Zubac ( Draft and stash)
$45- one of D. Hamilton, W. Selden or M. Brogden

4) sign Jared Dudley (wash) to a 3 year /$24M deal.
Dudley is maybe the best 3 point shooter in this years Free agent class. A guy who works hard on the defensive end as well and knows his place on a team and is willing to fill it. He is 30YO now and should have no issues finishing his 3 year deal. Replaces Turner here for me at the same or less salary. Another option if you prefer a younger (though not as good a 3 point shooter) would be K. Bazemore from Atlanta. Danny had Bazemore here for a look see before he signed with the Hawks two years ago. Bazemore may command more in the $10M range for 4 years however.

5) resign T. Zeller to a 2yr $10M deal similar to the one Jerebko signed last season.

This team would be only at about $80M in salary as built, allowing for one more signing if needed or the cap flexibility for a mid season trade for a possible higher end player.

Roster as built:

Starters
J. Okafor- 2200 Min
S. Ibaka-2400
J. Crowder-2400
A. Bradley-2400
I Thomas-2400

Bench in order of playing time
M. Smart-1800
A. Johnson-1600
J. Dudley-1400
J. Jerebko-1200
T. Rozier-800

Deep Bench/young players
T. Zeller-600
RJ Hunter-300
J. Mickey-100
T. Maker
J. Young , #45 pick or other.


in 2017 Ibaka, Amir and Jerebko would be the Free agents we have here.

Not enough 3 point shooters.  We need great shooters.

I really like Serge.  Less thrilled about Okafor.

Dboss

3 point numbers

Okafor- 1/6-16.7%
Ibaka- 60/184-32.6%
Crowder- 122/363-33.6%
Bradley- 147/407- 36.1%
Thomas- 167/465-35.9%


Smart- 61/241- 25.3%
Johnson- 10/43-23.3%
Dudley- 100/238-42.0%
Jerebko- 43/108- 39.8%
Rozier- 6/27-22.2%

this years team at 33.5%
that team at 34.4%

If smart can get up to 30% or better, we'd be in the middle of the league.

What about if you had Hield on the team instead of Okafor for 3 point average? I'd like to get Serge and Hield.

I was talking to a friend of mine on Saturday who is friends with a guy who works in the scouting department for the Knicks. The Knicks suspect that Ibaka is at least 5 years older than his listed age. Maybe 10 years older. Pass on Ibaka.

are you sure he wasn;t talking about Biyombo?

when he was in the draft most thought he was 4 years older than he listed.

and you just want want the Lakers to get him anyway.

worcester wrote:What about if you had Hield on the team instead of Okafor for 3 point average? I'd like to get Serge and Hield.

not enough big men for me then and I would have no minutes for a rookie guard. Dudley is a better 3 pt shooter anyway.

kdp59 wrote:are you sure he wasn;t talking about Biyombo?

when he was in the draft most thought he was 4 years older than he listed.

and you just want want the Lakers to get him anyway.

We were talking about the GS/OKC series and the different players.
Biyombo is prob much older too.
I don't want Ibaka or Biyombo.
Good players, but don't expect it for much longer since they older prob older than listed.

tjmakz wrote:I was talking to a friend of mine on Saturday who is friends with a guy who works in the scouting department for the Knicks. The Knicks suspect that Ibaka is at least 5 years older than his listed age. Maybe 10 years older. Pass on Ibaka.

Hahahaha

There is no way he is TEN years older than his listed age.

This is 2016. Mutombo was first suspected of being 3-4 years older than he actually was back in the 80's and 90's and the man ended up playing past age 40 anyhow. If he was putting out decent production at his listed age of 38-40 in 2005-07, when he was actually 42-44, that is pretty impressive. 

Even if Ibaka is 2-4 years older than his listed age he is still a worthy trade target, but anyone thinking a person is able to lie about their age by 5+ years in this day and age is kidding themselves. I know a lot of African soccer players and even future NBA players try to make themselves a few years older (Biyombo is in this camp) but to do it by 5 years would be VERY hard and by ten years basically impossible.

Say he is 3 years older and is 29 instead of 26. He'd be the same age as Al Horford and it doesn't change the fact that he'll have played less than 4000 career minutes than him.

1. I'd do the picks 3 and 35 deal for Okafor, but am not thrilled with it. I've said many times I'd prefer Noel and Saric, or Jimmy Butler, but if this is the best trade out there then I'd have to pull the trigger. 

2. I think picks 23, 45, Amir Johnson and James Young would be a fair offer for Ibaka. Olynyk has a lot of value as a 7' 3 point shooter when healthy and is a RFA the C's wouldn't have to lose next offseason if they don't want to. The cash swap of Amir/Ibaka's 12m contracts makes more sense anyhow. 

3. At 16 take Maker, at 31 Qui or Zubac. At 58 take the best available player. Probably a guard with lots of NCAA experience. 

4. Still love this idea: Trade Sully (QO extended) and pick 51 to LA for Pierce

5. I'm cool with the local BC kid Dudley over Turner if he costs less and hits 3's at a MUCH higher %, both of which are likely. 

C - Okafor (28 mpg), Olynyk (20), Maker (D-League)
PF - Ibaka (28 mpg), Mickey (12), Jerebko (
SF - Crowder (28 mpg), Dudley (14), Jerebko (6), Pierce
SG - Bradley (30 mpg), Smart (10), Hunter (, 2nd rd pick (D-League)
PG - Thomas (30 mpg), Smart (18), Rozier

I put Hunter over Rozier b/c we really need a SG with size who can shoot 3's more than a 3rd defensive minded guard under 6'4". Rozier could either be trade bait or bear out Hunter for all I know. Pierce could be dusted off from time to time for a few magic moments, ties Hondo's team record for # of seasons in green, mentors the kids and transitions into a front office role.

Ram wrote:1. I'd do the picks 3 and 35 deal for Okafor, but am not thrilled with it. I've said many times I'd prefer Noel and Saric, or Jimmy Butler, but if this is the best trade out there then I'd have to pull the trigger. 

2. I think picks 23, 45, Amir Johnson and James Young would be a fair offer for Ibaka. Olynyk has a lot of value as a 7' 3 point shooter when healthy and is a RFA the C's wouldn't have to lose next offseason if they don't want to. The cash swap of Amir/Ibaka's 12m contracts makes more sense anyhow. 

3. At 16 take Maker, at 31 Qui or Zubac. At 58 take the best available player. Probably a guard with lots of NCAA experience. 

4. Still love this idea: Trade Sully (QO extended) and pick 51 to LA for Pierce

5. I'm cool with the local BC kid Dudley over Turner if he costs less and hits 3's at a MUCH higher %, both of which are likely. 

C - Okafor (28 mpg), Olynyk (20), Maker (D-League)
PF - Ibaka (28 mpg), Mickey (12), Jerebko (
SF - Crowder (28 mpg), Dudley (14), Jerebko (6), Pierce
SG - Bradley (30 mpg), Smart (10), Hunter (, 2nd rd pick (D-League)
PG - Thomas (30 mpg), Smart (18), Rozier

I put Hunter over Rozier b/c we really need a SG with size who can shoot 3's more than a 3rd defensive minded guard under 6'4". Rozier could either be trade bait or bear out Hunter for all I know. Pierce could be dusted off from time to time for a few magic moments, ties Hondo's team record for # of seasons in green, mentors the kids and transitions into a front office role.

I personally think Pierce is done now.

the reason I put Kelly in the deal is because it makes sense for OKC. with Adams and Kanter they have to low post guys, Amir would be a third one. Kelly gives them that stretch big man they need. Also they need to lose some salary not take back more, if they re-sign Durant as is expected.

I think Rozier showed late in the year, that he can be a solid back up next year.

Also Dudley is one of the best 3 point shooters who is an UFA this year. Not sure who else is better that we might be able to sign, if we want to improve that aspect of the teams game. the fact that he can play 2-3 spots with SF being his main spot is a good fit for us

Agree on Dudley

I think Pierce is pretty much done as well, but as a 13th man I am ok with him returning as a legend who can give a young team trying to get out of the first rd of the playoffs a lot of advice

I think pick 16 and Olynyk is too much to give up for Ibaka

Rozier can definitely be a solid backup. Unless they trade Avery or Smart I see his skills being more valuable on another team as 3 point shooting is what the C's need from their 5th man at the PG-SG-SF positions. That is why Dudley is a good signing, but he is not a 20+ minute guy like Turner was, so that role will hopefully be split among 2 players who can both shoot unless they get a guy like Butler.

well Butler and Ibaka may be possible, but it would cost us Bradley or Smart also, IMO.
I've said before to get Butler (who I am not sure is on the trade market now) would cost a minimum of Bradley or Smart, #3, #31 and a future first rounder.

perhaps OKC would take Kelly and #23 instead, since he is on the last year of his deal.

in that case a back of the napkin makeover would be something like

Ibaka
Amir
Sully- resigned here then in the $8M range?
Jerebko
Zeller- Same as above $5M
Mickey
Crowder
Dudley- Same as above $8M
Young or second round pick ($5, 51 or 58 whichever is left after trades)
Butler
Thomas
Smart
Rozier
Hunter
D. Murray or M. Beasley- #16 pick

quick salary number on that team= about $92M (cap is projected to be around $89-92M)

so we are right there cap wise with this team also

After last night, I would not pursue Ibaka at all. Zip. Nada for him.

Ram wrote:

tjmakz wrote:I was talking to a friend of mine on Saturday who is friends with a guy who works in the scouting department for the Knicks. The Knicks suspect that Ibaka is at least 5 years older than his listed age. Maybe 10 years older. Pass on Ibaka.

Hahahaha

There is no way he is TEN years older than his listed age.

This is 2016. Mutombo was first suspected of being 3-4 years older than he actually was back in the 80's and 90's and the man ended up playing past age 40 anyhow. If he was putting out decent production at his listed age of 38-40 in 2005-07, when he was actually 42-44, that is pretty impressive. 

Even if Ibaka is 2-4 years older than his listed age he is still a worthy trade target, but anyone thinking a person is able to lie about their age by 5+ years in this day and age is kidding themselves. I know a lot of African soccer players and even future NBA players try to make themselves a few years older (Biyombo is in this camp) but to do it by 5 years would be VERY hard and by ten years basically impossible.

Say he is 3 years older and is 29 instead of 26. He'd be the same age as Al Horford and it doesn't change the fact that he'll have played less than 4000 career minutes than him.

Ram and TJ,

Serge Ibaka and Bismaaackk BiYOMMMMBOOOOOoooo!!!! are not Dominican baseball players. LOL. The body doesn't lie in basketball, it is much too punishing a sport. Ibaka moved to France when he was 17. He is #3 of 18 children (Jeez!). That doesn't leave a lot of wiggle room on fudging birth dates. Furthermore, his hometown of Brazzaville, Congo has a population of 4.5M people. It is not some tiny little village with no city hall or recording institutions or hospitals without maternity wards.

Bismaaackk BiYOMMMBOOOOOooo!!! was discovered at 16 and played in Europe when he was 17. How much older than 16 can you be without looking like it? Certainly not 10 years. He's from the 2nd biggest town in the Congo with a population of 1.5M. That's 2x more people than Athens, Greece or Cartagena, Columbia.

My point is that neither of these guys just walked out of the desert with a ball in their hands.


bob


.

Yes, Athens city is 665,000, but the Athens Metropolitan Area is in the Attica region with 58 municipalities with a population estimated at 3.75 million in 2014.

worcester wrote:Yes, Athens city is 665,000, but the Athens Metropolitan Area is in the Attica region with 58 municipalities with a population estimated at 3.75 million in 2014.

The city of Brazzaville, capital of the Republic of Congo, is across the river from the city of Kinshasa, capital of the Democratic Republic of Congo (separate countries).  It's like a Minneapolis/St. Paul type of deal, except that they are both capitals of different countries.  The population of the Kinshasa-Brazzaville district is 8.5M.


Here's is a picture of Brazzaville.  My point in this is that it is not some forgotten little village.  The SUVs you are looking at are modern and in good shape and there are quite a few of them.






bob


.

Whether you like Ibaka or not, I don't see OKC blowing up their team. Durant signs a two-year deal with the second year a player option, allowing him to re-sign the year after for the big payday.

They are close. They beat the 67-win Spurs. They pushed the 73-win Warriors to the brink. They are championship contenders, and they have a year under their belts with a new coach. They should want to ride this as long as they can, not blow it up. Being a legitimate championship contender is all you can hope for when it comes to building a team. Why should they throw that away?

If Durant leaves, that's a killer blow, but I don't think that's likely, both from a business standpoint and a basketball one. Other than joining the Warriors, where is he going to go where he'd have a better chance at winning a title? I understand the desire of Boston fans to bring him to the Celtics, but the Celtics with Durant aren't in a better position to win a title than where he is now. If he leaves, it's likely for non-basketball reasons.

And if Durant stays, they're not trading Ibaka. Ibaka is limited -- I've never understood why he hasn't developed a post game, and he's just okay as an outside shooter -- but he's on a team-friendly $12.3 million contract next year. They should want to give this group one more go.

Outside,

I agree that Durant will most likely sign a 2 year deal with OKC( second year being a player option ala Labron)

but when they sign Durant they wll then have over $94M in salarys on the books. no room for any other moves and they also have ZERO draft picks this year.

Ibaka will be in the final year of his deal next season. OKC has a history to trading players before they become FA's when they feel they cannot sign them.

Adams and Kanter are both under contract next year are both low post players only. One of the reasons Ibaka has developed a 3 point shot now.

so Kelly ( a legit 3 pt shot) a first and second round pick for Ibaka could very well make sense for them.

of course the rumors that Ibaka is on the block could be made up also.