Andrew Bogut On The Block?

Several league sources believe the Mavs could get a first-round pick from a playoff team -- plus whatever player(s) necessary to make the salaries work -- in return for a healthy Bogut. Snicker all you want about the Mavs' previous draft failures, but plenty of value can be found late in the first round. Take, for example, All-Star swingman Jimmy Butler, who went 30th in the 2011 draft -- four spots after the Mavs dumped their pick for Rudy Fernandez, who had decided by that point that he'd had enough of the NBA.

There has been speculation about the Boston Celtics being a potential fit for Bogut, which makes sense on a lot of levels. One problem: It's safe to assume the Celtics won't part with their 2017 pick, which they have the right to swap with the Nets for what should be a high lottery pick.



bob
MY NOTE:  Zeller and Young would work, salary-wise, we just have to wait until Zeller's contract is tradeable (12/15?).  I would not be interested in trading Kelly and Young for Bogut.  Bogut is definitely on the back 9, has been getting injured more and more and is a non-entity on offense. I would also give them our 2nd pick this year, OUR pick, NOT Brooklyn's. Two players gone, one player in, that gives players like Mickey and Jackson a chance to spend more time with the team and maybe even play. I know that Mickey and Jackson aren't direct replacements for Zeller's and Young's minutes but lineups wouldn't necessarily be the same either with a legit starting center allowing Horford to move to PF. I would also offer Amir for Bogut, but I don't see Cuban taking that bait.


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bobheckler wrote:Several league sources believe the Mavs could get a first-round pick from a playoff team -- plus whatever player(s) necessary to make the salaries work -- in return for a healthy Bogut. Snicker all you want about the Mavs' previous draft failures, but plenty of value can be found late in the first round. Take, for example, All-Star swingman Jimmy Butler, who went 30th in the 2011 draft -- four spots after the Mavs dumped their pick for Rudy Fernandez, who had decided by that point that he'd had enough of the NBA.

There has been speculation about the Boston Celtics being a potential fit for Bogut, which makes sense on a lot of levels. One problem: It's safe to assume the Celtics won't part with their 2017 pick, which they have the right to swap with the Nets for what should be a high lottery pick.



bob
MY NOTE:  Zeller and Young would work, salary-wise, we just have to wait until Zeller's contract is tradeable (12/15?).  I would not be interested in trading Kelly and Young for Bogut.  Bogut is definitely on the back 9, has been getting injured more and more and is a non-entity on offense.  I would also give them our 2nd pick this year, OUR pick, NOT Brooklyn's.  Two players gone, one player in, that gives players like Mickey and Jackson a chance to spend more time with the team and maybe even play.  I know that Mickey and Jackson aren't direct replacements for Zeller's and Young's minutes but lineups wouldn't necessarily be the same either with a legit starting center allowing Horford to move to PF.  I would also offer Amir for Bogut, but I don't see Cuban taking that bait.


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Bob,

I doubt there is much of any value for Bogut.
He was traded this summer to Dallas with a 2nd round pick, so Dallas would absorb his salary.

Most likely Boston won't have their 2nd round pick this year.
If Boston exchanges 1st round picks with Brooklyn and Boston's 2nd rounder is scheduled to be in the 46-60 range, that pick will also go to Brooklyn.
That will leave Boston with Minnesota's, the Cavs and the LA Clippers 2nd rounders next summer.
I am sure Dallas would be happy to trade Bogut for Minnesota's 2017 2nd round pick from Boston.

Bogut was injured last night but probably not too seriously.

I would seriously consider shipping out Amir and a 2nd round pick for Bogut. Their salaries match and both have contracts that expire next June. Neither is the long range answer to the center problem or the final piece to a championship team - but I believe that Bogut would be an upgrade at the center position for the balance of this year - and perhaps a decent back up for a couple years.

swish

shuffling pieces to shuffle pieces?

I see no upside in picking up Bogut. better to let this team jell and see what we have

kdp59 wrote:shuffling pieces to shuffle pieces?

I see no upside in picking up Bogut. better to let this team jell and see what we have

You'd see no upside in shuffling out Zeller and a 2nd rd pick we'd have a hard time fitting on our roster for Bogut?

Despite being injury prone, Bogut is an upgrade to Zeller. Especially in the area the team needs the most from their big: rim-protection and defense. He averaged 9.5pts, 12.4 rebs, 4 asts, 2.7 blocks and 0.85 steals per 36 minutes on those two very good GSW teams of the past 2 seasons. What would we need him for? Probably only 16-20 mins a game, so expect half those numbers in a reduced role. 

What did Zeller give us per 36 the last 2 seasons? 18 pts, 9.3 rebs, 2 asts, 1.1 blocks and 0.45 steals. So other than scoring, Bogut is a much more useful player. He provides almost 3x as many blocks, twice as many assists and steals and 25% more rebounds in his time on the floor than Zeller. 

Zeller is still only 26, and has a reasonable 1 year 8m option for next season. The rebuilding Mavs could pick it up and use him in a rotation at center and then deal him at next year's deadline. In addition to snagging a pick in the 33-37 range of a deep draft. That is a fair haul for Bogut, who (like another older vet in Amir) would leave them for nothing.

tjmakz wrote:
Bob,

I doubt there is much of any value for Bogut.
He was traded this summer to Dallas with a 2nd round pick, so Dallas would absorb his salary.

Most likely Boston won't have their 2nd round pick this year.
If Boston exchanges 1st round picks with Brooklyn and Boston's 2nd rounder is scheduled to be in the 46-60 range, that pick will also go to Brooklyn.
That will leave Boston with Minnesota's, the Cavs and the LA Clippers 2nd rounders next summer.
I am sure Dallas would be happy to trade Bogut for Minnesota's 2017 2nd round pick from Boston.

Bogut was injured last night but probably not too seriously.

Well I wouldn't say Dallas would be happy to trade Bogut for Minny's 2nd rd pick in 2017 quite yet. 

A. The OP said they are looking for a contender's 1st rd pick, so they'd have to first have found no teams willing to give them a pick in the 20's before agreeing to take one in the 30's.

B. Would Cuban want to deal with Danny again so soon after the Rondo trade blew up in his face?

If Bogut were to come to Boston for a Zeller/pick(s) package I think you would see a minutes distribution similar to this in the frontcourt:

C - Horford (24 mins), Bogut (16), Olynyk (8 )
PF - Amir (16 mins), Olynyk (16), Horford (8 ), Crowder (8 )

Jerebko would be the odd man out in the rotation (as long as Olynyk is healthy and hitting 3's). That lineup provides 40 mins of rim-protection from the center position, then likely an Olynyk/Amir pairing where Amir takes on that role and a lot of versatility and creative offensive pairings at the PF spot. 

He wouldn't be quite Nerlens Noel, but I think the package for Noel would have to contain either the Nets 2018 pick (top 3 protected) or TWO other 1st rd picks, along with Rozier and either Young/Mickey or maybe even Yabusele instead of those last two (a swap of Zeller's 8m salary for Sergio Rodriguez's would also make sense for both teams). The price is FAR less for Bogut. 

But make no mistake, if the C's plan on comfortably getting to the 2nd rd and then being favored to reach the ECF/give Cleve a fight, they need to upgrade Zeller to a better rim-protector and rebounder.

He is in the final year of his contract, and Dallas will want picks or young talent. If Danny could get him for a low picks, maybe, but the problem is making salaries work. Bogus makes alot, and the Celtics don't really have an equivalent bad contract. Maybe Amir?? A. Sherrod is saying the Celtics are interested, but we are now linked to every trade rumor.

Ram wrote:

kdp59 wrote:shuffling pieces to shuffle pieces?

I see no upside in picking up Bogut. better to let this team jell and see what we have

You'd see no upside in shuffling out Zeller and a 2nd rd pick we'd have a hard time fitting on our roster for Bogut?

Despite being injury prone, Bogut is an upgrade to Zeller. Especially in the area the team needs the most from their big: rim-protection and defense. He averaged 9.5pts, 12.4 rebs, 4 asts, 2.7 blocks and 0.85 steals per 36 minutes on those two very good GSW teams of the past 2 seasons. What would we need him for? Probably only 16-20 mins a game, so expect half those numbers in a reduced role. 

What did Zeller give us per 36 the last 2 seasons? 18 pts, 9.3 rebs, 2 asts, 1.1 blocks and 0.45 steals. So other than scoring, Bogut is a much more useful player. He provides almost 3x as many blocks, twice as many assists and steals and 25% more rebounds in his time on the floor than Zeller. 

Zeller is still only 26, and has a reasonable 1 year 8m option for next season. The rebuilding Mavs could pick it up and use him in a rotation at center and then deal him at next year's deadline. In addition to snagging a pick in the 33-37 range of a deep draft. That is a fair haul for Bogut, who (like another older vet in Amir) would leave them for nothing.

why I said shuffling pieces is IF Bogut would get playing time it would likely come at the expense of Amir, Since Zeller really isn't in the rotation when everyone is healthy.

so is Bogut better than Amir and by how much?

he's slow and old and Amir can move better even at his age now.

If Bogut is replacing Zeller, then he is the 11th man in the rotation...again shuffling pieces to me.

but people can differ in their opinion for sure.

Tough call.  If he could stay healthy, Bogut would be an upgrade defensively over Zeller.  He would be a half-year rental, I guess.  Absent of trades or a smart draft, that leaves us down two centers next season, however, if Zeller is dealt.  Maybe that's when Zizic gets a look.

As Shamrock points out, we're tied to every trade rumor.  Who knows if we're really even interested.  I think we need a little more time with our recovering walking wounded yet, before we know who stays and goes.  Maybe if Bogut is out there and available closer to the deadline.

FOOL'S GOLD.......PATIENTS PLEASE!

112288

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/andrew-bogut-describes-the-dallas-mavericks-as-a-target-for-bird-droppings-183051941.html




What has two thumbs and doesn’t think he’ll be on the Dallas Mavericks much longer? This guy. (AP)



Andrew Bogut just compared his current situation to being defecated on, so that should give you a decent idea about how he feels about coming off the bench for the bottom-feeding Dallas Mavericks.

“The best metaphor to use would be sometimes you’re the bird and sometimes you’re a statue,” Bogut said when asked during a 10-minute interview with Australia’s Sky Sports Radio to describe the differences between his first seven seasons on an often-middling Milwaukee Bucks team, four years with the ever-contending Golden State Warriors and a few months “now in probably one of the more testing years of my career here in Dallas.” And we all know what birds do to statues. Or on them.

Interestingly enough, it was the 32-year-old center’s statuesque play that became the impetus for Mavericks coach Rick Carlisle’s decision to move Bogut to the bench on Tuesday. Dallas could not afford to field a slow-footed starting frontcourt of Bogut and Dirk Nowitzki, so the former opted to come off the bench in favor of the sort of smaller, quicker lineup that’s become all the NBA rage.

“We’ll give it three or four more games and see how it goes,” Bogut told reporters after the experiment worked in Tuesday’s 113-105 win over the Washington Wizards. “We won the game. Obviously nobody wants to come off the bench. I knew what he was doing with starting both of us and then pulling one of us a minute into the game. If you’re going to go through that, you might as well do it the right way. You’re a 10-24 team and you’re coming off the bench, it’s never the most exciting thing in the world. It’s not something you go home and talk to with your family and get a cake over.”

For the record, the Mavs moved to 11-24 with that win — a half-game up on last place in the West and still only four games out of a playoff speed. This came up often during the Sky Sports Radio interview, which was then transcribed by news.com.au and published under the original headline, “Andrew Bogut trade: ‘I’m done with Dallas.'” Bogut took to Twitter to admonish folks for buying into the headline, which has since been adjusted to, “Andrew Bogut expects to be traded by Dallas Mavericks.”

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Andrew Bogut ✔ @andrewbogut
People are so gullible. Listen to the interview, not the headline.
8:04 PM - 4 Jan 2017
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Go ahead and listen to the entire interview. Bogut does not paint a much prettier picture:

https://soundcloud.com/believethehypenba/andrew-bogut-on-sky-sports-radio


“It’s definitely an adjustment,” he said of coming off the bench. “Thankfully, I’m a free agent, so I only have a couple of more months left here and then will obviously most likely move on. I don’t see myself hanging around with everything that’s gone on, so it will be an interesting six months ahead.”


Asked if he expected to be traded, Bogut added, “You never know,” and then detailed how attractive the remainder of his expiring $11 million salary might be to prospective trade partners, even detailing how he could reach a buyout agreement or be waived in order to sign with “whoever you want.”

“The trade deadline is obviously approaching in February, so a lot of action, a lot of teams will start heating up here,” Bogut added. “In the next two or three weeks, we’ll see a lot of movement. A lot of teams are now trying to free up money now. Obviously, the collective bargaining agreement was agreed to and signed for another seven years, so there’s a lot more cash floating around in the offseason. Teams are going to start trying to free up some cap space to go after certain guys, so the silly season will be absolutely nuts going into the trade deadline.
“I don’t really read too much online with that kind of stuff. I just have a direct contact with the people managing me and see what they have to say about it. But, look, it’s no secret I’m a free agent at the end of the season, and I’ve got a valuable contract. … I know being a free agent having four months left on my contract I’m a valuable commodity to be moved.”
Maybe, “I’m almost done with Dallas,” or, “Andrew Bogut won’t be surprised if he was traded,” are more accurate headlines. Either way, he is not long for the Mavs, and hopefully we can agree, “Andrew Bogut describes the Dallas Mavericks as a target for bird droppings,” is the best headline for this post.

After a few months, you might not think Bogut warrants a statue in Dallas, but don’t put it past Mavs owner Mark Cuban erecting a seven-foot effigy in an idea that’s strictly for the birds. (Hey-oh!)



bob
MY NOTE:  He was traded for a 2nd round pick, but that was a necessary move by GSW to clear cap space for Durant and was considered at the time to be a "steal" for Dallas.  Now that he's coming off the bench for a bottom feeder, and is 32 years old, I'm thinking his value isn't even much more than that, if that, ESPECIALLY after popping off like this. This is like the Nerlens Noel situation. It was clearly not working out but after Noel started talking it became even more untenable.


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