Semi Ojeleye

KyleCleric wrote:Bird and Allen probably going to two-way contracts, 16th and 17th roster spots.

Yesterday looks to me like them manufacturing depth at the wing positions in case of a trade involving Crowder and/or Bradley.

Kyle,

Bird and Allen? Aren't they retired?


bob


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bobheckler wrote:

KyleCleric wrote:Bird and Allen probably going to two-way contracts, 16th and 17th roster spots.

Yesterday looks to me like them manufacturing depth at the wing positions in case of a trade involving Crowder and/or Bradley.

Kyle,

Bird and Allen?  Aren't they retired?


bob


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No. Tony's an FA and Sue I believe is still active.

KyleCleric wrote:

bobheckler wrote:

KyleCleric wrote:Bird and Allen probably going to two-way contracts, 16th and 17th roster spots.

Yesterday looks to me like them manufacturing depth at the wing positions in case of a trade involving Crowder and/or Bradley.

Kyle,

Bird and Allen?  Aren't they retired?


bob


.

No. Tony's an FA and Sue I believe is still active.

Well played, sir.


bob


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kdp59 wrote:Interesting that some here think Semi will make the roster over Yabusele.

is that because of Yabusele's injury or because you think Semi is the better player?

Since Yabusele was drafted at #16 last year, one would think HE is the better player.

kdp,

I think Semi is a much better player than Yabusele, especially given the similar role both would be expected to fill.

This years draft was miles deeper than last year, which is why I'm kind of ignoring last year's #16 pick.  I was floored we picked Yabusele that high last year, and thought it was a total roll of the dice and way too much of a reach.  In this year's draft, I'm not sure he gets taken at all.

That being said, I think Semi will have an extremely tough time sticking with the Celtics this year as well.  He's got potential as a combo-type forward, but has never played SF in a game for SMU.  His defensive game is also merely adequate, to below-average at times.  He's a good athlete however, and is a very worthwhile project. If he can add a just a few needed skills at both ends, he could be a steal.  He should be a good G-League player this year. One caution; there has been some concern expressed about a possible weight issue.  After playing in the low to mid 230 range, and being measured with an incredibly low body fat %, his last weigh-in had him at 241 lbs.  Hopefully, getting some run this summer knocks that back.

Regards

bobheckler wrote:

Which brings me my rant. ...   we need bigs!  Danny, at this kid's #37, passed on Thomas Bryant of Indiana and Hartenstein of Germany.  They might not be what we'd like, but they would be 2nd rounders and that provides contract flexibility and value, and we desperately need bigs.

Horford
Zizic
Kelly (maybe)
Mickey (more of a swing than a big)

That's going to be all of our bigs because we will not be resigning Amir or Jonas, whose combined cap holds would be >$15.5M.

I have no idea what Danny is thinking/planning.  I said that, clearly, on the Draft Prediction thread but we need more than Al Horford, 20 year old rookie Ante Zizic and Kelly Olynyk (IF he is back).  


bob


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Bob,

I edited out some lines in your post (above) and left the ones I wanted to comment on.

My comment:  Amen Brother!

Regards

Edit:  I like Ojeleye, but would have preferred it if we had taken a big, especially Bryant.

It's so early in the offseason process.

Bryant has interesting skills as a big. Definitely one of those I was interested in. Anigbogu would have been interesting as well. Semi though wasn't a reach. His athleticism, strength and shooting translates well to the nba. He was expected to go early 2nd, perhaps late first like Anigbogu, Bryant was always a 2nd. With him and Nader, they represent some interesting forward potential in case we were to move Crowder.

KyleCleric wrote:It's so early in the offseason process.

Bryant has interesting skills as a big. Definitely one of those I was interested in. Anigbogu would have been interesting as well. Semi though wasn't a reach. His athleticism, strength and shooting translates well to the nba. He was expected to go early 2nd, perhaps late first like Anigbogu, Bryant was always a 2nd. With him and Nader, they represent some interesting forward potential in case we were to move Crowder.

kyle,

mynbadraft.com had Semi (I'm not even going to try his last name) going #23 to the Raptors.

nbadraft.net had him going #46 to Philly.

Draftexpress.com had him going #22 to the Nyets.

So, two had him late first round and one deep 2nd. At least two mock drafts thinking he was worth a guaranteed rookie contract.


bob

Pronounced Shimmy OH-jel-ay

Don't forget we got that guy from the German league coming over to solve all our issues with size.

gyso

gyso wrote:Pronounced Shimmy OH-jel-ay

Don't forget we got that guy from the German league coming over to solve all our issues with size.  

gyso

bob


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gyso wrote:Pronounced Shimmy OH-jel-ay

Don't forget we got that guy from the German league coming over to solve all our issues with size.  

gyso

When I see this kind of comments I ask myself,Why I am in a forum like this?Iknow that your comment is for me,but I never said,the German player is going to be a savior, I just said,the kid is going to help in some way ,because he is a good defensive player,with some experience,good ouside shot and is a key member on a very good national team.When I said two years ago that Willy Hernangomes could help our team ,everybody told me I was wrong because Europlayers were soft and not good rebounder,but Hernangomes had a very good season with the Knicks and right now is a key member of their team,same happened with Gobert,Jokic,Nurcic,Capella,Baynes,Portzingis,Kanter,The Gasol Brothers and many others.I think is time to stop with this negativity and realise basketball is global now and you can find good players in any part of the world.By the way as a former player I can say that players with the best pure fundaments are coming from Europe and those college kids are not even close.

international,

Sorry that you took it that way.  That is not how it was meant.  If you read the Draft On! thread, you will see that I was disappointed that we didn't draft more size, specifically Euro draft and stash guys.  The draft seemed to be all about wings and swings, so it didn't look like Danny addressed our needs at the big positions.

Then after the thread about getting George and Hayward, I made a comment about the makeup of the team being mostly wings and swings, with a couple smalls bringing up the ball and only a handful of bigs.

The "joke" (in my mind?) here was that Theis (the German guy) could be added to the handful of bigs and everything is solved (for Danny and the modern big-less NBA).  That, and it was a kind of a reminder that most people keep forgetting him when they make up their rosters for next year.

I have an odd and rather dry sense of humor.  It is often hard to get it properly conveyed with the written word.  So again, sorry, no offense intended.

gyso

NYcelt,

you feel that Yabusele may not have been drafted at all this year.

wow, if so what a wasted draft pick by Danny.

I guess we'll have to wait and see.

Semi looks like the typical undersized PF in college who gets swamped in the NBA to me. The fact that he couldn't cut in the ACC and had to go the football league to play BB to become a starter is also concerning to me.

gyso,

no one is forgetting Theus, we just don't see him as anything more than Summer league and maybe redclaws fodder.

scouting is too good now for an unknown to come out of nowhere and become even a rotational player. at least IMO.

I suppose there is always an exception

kdp59 wrote:gyso,

no one is forgetting Theus,  we just don't see him as anything more than Summer league and maybe redclaws fodder.

scouting is too good now for  an unknown to come out of nowhere and become even a rotational player. at least IMO.

I suppose there is always an exception

Kdp,

1.  It's Reggie Theus and Daniel Theis.

2.  Just because I never heard of Theis doesn't mean he isn't extremely well-scouted.  3x German League DPOY.  Every NBA team has a robust Euro league scouting department now.  The Knicks had someone babysitting Frankie Nicotine for weeks now, and Phil Jackson is senile, so you know everybody in rhe business knows Daniel Theis.


bob

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NYCelt wrote:

kdp59 wrote:Interesting that some here think Semi will make the roster over Yabusele.

is that because of Yabusele's injury or because you think Semi is the better player?

Since Yabusele was drafted at #16 last year, one would think HE is the better player.

kdp,

I think Semi is a much better player than Yabusele, especially given the similar role both would be expected to fill.

This years draft was miles deeper than last year, which is why I'm kind of ignoring last year's #16 pick.  I was floored we picked Yabusele that high last year, and thought it was a total roll of the dice and way too much of a reach.  In this year's draft, I'm not sure he gets taken at all.

That being said, I think Semi will have an extremely tough time sticking with the Celtics this year as well.  He's got potential as a combo-type forward, but has never played SF in a game for SMU.  His defensive game is also merely adequate, to below-average at times.  He's a good athlete however, and is a very worthwhile project. If he can add a just a few needed skills at both ends, he could be a steal.  He should be a good G-League player this year. One caution; there has been some concern expressed about a possible weight issue.  After playing in the low to mid 230 range, and being measured with an incredibly low body fat %, his last weigh-in had him at 241 lbs.  Hopefully, getting some run this summer knocks that back.

Regards

Tatum and Josh Jackson played purely PF as well, that doesn't mean anything. Ojeleye posted the 3rd fastest agility time at the NBA Combine, behind only a couple guys who weighed 190 lbs or less: http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/2017/NBA+Draft+Combine/all/all/1/lane_agility/asc

He also had one of the very fastest sprint times, and one of the very best vertical leaps. The best athlete in the draft.
And while he weighed 241 lbs, they also measured his body fat, and it was one of the very lowest at the Combine, 5.5%.

There's no damn weight issue. That would be Yabusele.

I said it before but Ojeleye might be better than Tatum next year, and might even be better long term. Don't bet on him toiling away in the GLeague just because he fell to the 2nd round.

As far as Jordan Mickey, I'll bet anybody here that he won't be on the roster this year, just like he had no business being on the roster last year.

Ojeleye was an amazing get for us at that spot, and that will become clear in no time. We absolutely should not have just drafted a big man with that pick, because Zizic is absolutely the real deal, much better than Bryant or Hartenstein, and we already have Horford and Zeller is under contract, and we might even bring back Olynyk.

Ojeleye is a more athletic Jae Crowder, and might be a better shooter right now too. Ojeleye is quite possibly more valuable than Avery Bradley right now, and quite possibly more valuable to winning actual games than Jayson Tatum.

With an offensive virtuoso like Isaiah Thomas on the team, the most effective players next to him aren't ball dominant sub-par defenders like Tatum, it's tough 3 and D guys who can just knock down shots and defend physically. Ojeleye is an absolutely perfect fit. He might even be the team's best 3 point shooter right now, in addition to being our best athlete. Even more athletic than Jaylen Brown because of his 15 pound muscle advantage.

This draft was crazy deep, and luckily we got an amazing first round talent with that 37th pick.

kdp59 wrote:gyso,

no one is forgetting Theus,  we just don't see him as anything more than Summer league and maybe redclaws fodder.

scouting is too good now for  an unknown to come out of nowhere and become even a rotational player. at least IMO.

I suppose there is always an exception

See what I mean Gyso ,when I am talking about negativity? I accept your apology and now understand better your point of view.But this sentence about good scouting is ridiculous,Scouts are responsible of players like Nikola Jokic taken in the the second round and Rudy Gobert selected later in the first round and traded the same day to Utah by Denver.The other sentence...an unknown coming from nowhere is an insult and cant be taken seriously.Kdp59 I am sure that if San Antonio bring a player like Davis Bertans from Latvia or the Knicks brings Mindaugas Kusminskas from Lithuania ,the fans of those teams don't say oh we signed an unknown from nowhere,but Celtics fans are always complaining ,maybe the accusation of racism is true.

international wrote:

kdp59 wrote:gyso,

no one is forgetting Theus,  we just don't see him as anything more than Summer league and maybe redclaws fodder.

scouting is too good now for  an unknown to come out of nowhere and become even a rotational player. at least IMO.

I suppose there is always an exception

See what I mean Gyso ,when I am talking about negativity? I accept your apology and now understand better your point of view.But this sentence about good scouting is ridiculous,Scouts are responsible of players like Nikola Jokic taken in the the second round and Rudy Gobert selected later in the first round and traded the same day to Utah by Denver.The other sentence...an unknown coming from nowhere is an insult and cant be taken seriously.Kdp59 I am sure that if San Antonio bring a player like Davis Bertans from Latvia or the Knicks brings Mindaugas Kusminskas from Lithuania ,the fans of those teams don't say oh we signed an unknown from nowhere,but Celtics fans are always complaining ,maybe the accusation of racism is true.

Don't forget Willy Hernangomez on the Knicks too, drafted in the second round. Looking like there starting center for the long-term. Yeah, the scouting community makes huge mistakes every single year, like saying Thon Maker was a borderline NBA talent last year.

Yabulsele was never drafted mid-first round because Danny viewed him as the 16th best player. It was always because Yabu was willing to stay overseas. I'm sure he could make an NBA roster, and it might even be this Celtics roster, I just think Yabu and Semi Ojeleye are neck and neck, to say the least about Semi. And both are miles above Jordan Mickey, 6'7 center.

The trick to solving our rebounding woes is to start Jaylen Brown at SG, but now I'm hearing rumors Jaylen is on the table in these Paul George trade rumors.

International: I feel you. There is a nasty undercurrent in a lot of posts concerning Euro's. or anything else that isn't American. It is what it is and I hope to see less of it as time goes on. As probably the biggest and longest booster of Yabusele and Zizic on this board I have really appreciated the way you kept providing links but wish you had provided more commentary yet understand how problematic that was.

Everybody has their own opinions on these things but there isn't any of us who really know what the truth is about any given player. That is why I was upset that Zizic and Yabusele didn't have a chance to compete for a roster spot last year. I hope that everyone gets their shot at making this team and let the time on the court determine who plays and stays and who goes. With 17 slots available there is room. If drafting Guerschon was a risky move at 16 it was done with an eye to his skill set vs what was available. If it had worked out the way I saw it he would be showing just how talented he is. If somehow #37 is better than so be it but let it be decided on the court and not in some knee jerk reaction to where a player was born and learned the game. But of course knee jerk reactions are the province of sports boards and not professionally run sports franchises like the Celtics.

international wrote:

kdp59 wrote:gyso,

no one is forgetting Theus,  we just don't see him as anything more than Summer league and maybe redclaws fodder.

scouting is too good now for  an unknown to come out of nowhere and become even a rotational player. at least IMO.

I suppose there is always an exception

See what I mean Gyso ,when I am talking about negativity? I accept your apology and now understand better your point of view.But this sentence about good scouting is ridiculous,Scouts are responsible of players like Nikola Jokic taken in the the second round and Rudy Gobert selected later in the first round and traded the same day to Utah by Denver.The other sentence...an unknown coming from nowhere is an insult and cant be taken seriously.Kdp59 I am sure that if San Antonio bring a player like Davis Bertans from Latvia or the Knicks brings Mindaugas Kusminskas from Lithuania ,the fans of those teams don't say oh we signed an unknown from nowhere,but Celtics fans are always complaining ,maybe the accusation of racism is true.

International,

Knick fans booed when Porzingis was drafted. Now they are screaming for the firing of the man who drafted him for thinking of trading him. That isn't racism, that is ignorance. Most US basketball fans know US basketball players.


bob

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Rmbone wrote:

NYCelt wrote:

kdp59 wrote:Interesting that some here think Semi will make the roster over Yabusele.

is that because of Yabusele's injury or because you think Semi is the better player?

Since Yabusele was drafted at #16 last year, one would think HE is the better player.

kdp,

I think Semi is a much better player than Yabusele, especially given the similar role both would be expected to fill.

This years draft was miles deeper than last year, which is why I'm kind of ignoring last year's #16 pick.  I was floored we picked Yabusele that high last year, and thought it was a total roll of the dice and way too much of a reach.  In this year's draft, I'm not sure he gets taken at all.

That being said, I think Semi will have an extremely tough time sticking with the Celtics this year as well.  He's got potential as a combo-type forward, but has never played SF in a game for SMU.  His defensive game is also merely adequate, to below-average at times.  He's a good athlete however, and is a very worthwhile project. If he can add a just a few needed skills at both ends, he could be a steal.  He should be a good G-League player this year. One caution; there has been some concern expressed about a possible weight issue.  After playing in the low to mid 230 range, and being measured with an incredibly low body fat %, his last weigh-in had him at 241 lbs.  Hopefully, getting some run this summer knocks that back.

Regards

Tatum and Josh Jackson played purely PF as well, that doesn't mean anything. Ojeleye posted the 3rd fastest agility time at the NBA Combine, behind only a couple guys who weighed 190 lbs or less: http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/2017/NBA+Draft+Combine/all/all/1/lane_agility/asc

He also had one of the very fastest sprint times, and one of the very best vertical leaps. The best athlete in the draft.
And while he weighed 241 lbs, they also measured his body fat, and it was one of the very lowest at the Combine, 5.5%.

There's no damn weight issue. That would be Yabusele.

I said it before but Ojeleye might be better than Tatum next year, and might even be better long term. Don't bet on him toiling away in the GLeague just because he fell to the 2nd round.

As far as Jordan Mickey, I'll bet anybody here that he won't be on the roster this year, just like he had no business being on the roster last year.

Ojeleye was an amazing get for us at that spot, and that will become clear in no time. We absolutely should not have just drafted a big man with that pick, because Zizic is absolutely the real deal, much better than Bryant or Hartenstein, and we already have Horford and Zeller is under contract, and we might even bring back Olynyk.

Ojeleye is a more athletic Jae Crowder, and might be a better shooter right now too. Ojeleye is quite possibly more valuable than Avery Bradley right now, and quite possibly more valuable to winning actual games than Jayson Tatum.

With an offensive virtuoso like Isaiah Thomas on the team, the most effective players next to him aren't ball dominant sub-par defenders like Tatum, it's tough 3 and D guys who can just knock down shots and defend physically. Ojeleye is an absolutely perfect fit. He might even be the team's best 3 point shooter right now, in addition to being our best athlete. Even more athletic than Jaylen Brown because of his 15 pound muscle advantage.

This draft was crazy deep, and luckily we got an amazing first round talent with that 37th pick.

Rambone,

Sorry but Tatum did not play purely as a power forward.

You have to understand the offensive and defensive schemes being run at Duke.  I'd be happy to explain it to you, but in short, Tatum's role was position-less, similar to the way Coach K used Parker, without the C/PF part.  He was basically a wing.

To suggest Ojeleye is more valuable than Bradley and could have a bigger impact on winning games than Tatum is, let's say, mystifying.  Tatum and Ojeleye are both rookies, so as far fetched as it may be, it's always possible. But Bradley...I mean...really? Deep draft or no, you're talking about the 37th pick!

Regards

NYCelt wrote:

Rmbone wrote:

NYCelt wrote:

kdp59 wrote:Interesting that some here think Semi will make the roster over Yabusele.

is that because of Yabusele's injury or because you think Semi is the better player?

Since Yabusele was drafted at #16 last year, one would think HE is the better player.

kdp,

I think Semi is a much better player than Yabusele, especially given the similar role both would be expected to fill.

This years draft was miles deeper than last year, which is why I'm kind of ignoring last year's #16 pick.  I was floored we picked Yabusele that high last year, and thought it was a total roll of the dice and way too much of a reach.  In this year's draft, I'm not sure he gets taken at all.

That being said, I think Semi will have an extremely tough time sticking with the Celtics this year as well.  He's got potential as a combo-type forward, but has never played SF in a game for SMU.  His defensive game is also merely adequate, to below-average at times.  He's a good athlete however, and is a very worthwhile project. If he can add a just a few needed skills at both ends, he could be a steal.  He should be a good G-League player this year. One caution; there has been some concern expressed about a possible weight issue.  After playing in the low to mid 230 range, and being measured with an incredibly low body fat %, his last weigh-in had him at 241 lbs.  Hopefully, getting some run this summer knocks that back.

Regards

Tatum and Josh Jackson played purely PF as well, that doesn't mean anything. Ojeleye posted the 3rd fastest agility time at the NBA Combine, behind only a couple guys who weighed 190 lbs or less: http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/2017/NBA+Draft+Combine/all/all/1/lane_agility/asc

He also had one of the very fastest sprint times, and one of the very best vertical leaps. The best athlete in the draft.
And while he weighed 241 lbs, they also measured his body fat, and it was one of the very lowest at the Combine, 5.5%.

There's no damn weight issue. That would be Yabusele.

I said it before but Ojeleye might be better than Tatum next year, and might even be better long term. Don't bet on him toiling away in the GLeague just because he fell to the 2nd round.

As far as Jordan Mickey, I'll bet anybody here that he won't be on the roster this year, just like he had no business being on the roster last year.

Ojeleye was an amazing get for us at that spot, and that will become clear in no time. We absolutely should not have just drafted a big man with that pick, because Zizic is absolutely the real deal, much better than Bryant or Hartenstein, and we already have Horford and Zeller is under contract, and we might even bring back Olynyk.

Ojeleye is a more athletic Jae Crowder, and might be a better shooter right now too. Ojeleye is quite possibly more valuable than Avery Bradley right now, and quite possibly more valuable to winning actual games than Jayson Tatum.

With an offensive virtuoso like Isaiah Thomas on the team, the most effective players next to him aren't ball dominant sub-par defenders like Tatum, it's tough 3 and D guys who can just knock down shots and defend physically. Ojeleye is an absolutely perfect fit. He might even be the team's best 3 point shooter right now, in addition to being our best athlete. Even more athletic than Jaylen Brown because of his 15 pound muscle advantage.

This draft was crazy deep, and luckily we got an amazing first round talent with that 37th pick.

Rambone,

Sorry but Tatum did not play purely as a power forward.

You have to understand the offensive and defensive schemes being run at Duke.  I'd be happy to explain it to you, but in short, Tatum's role was position-less, similar to the way Coach K used Parker, without the C/PF part.  He was basically a wing.

To suggest Ojeleye is more valuable than Bradley and could have a bigger impact on winning games than Tatum is, let's say, mystifying.  Tatum and Ojeleye are both rookies, so as far fetched as it may be, it's always possible.  But Bradley...I mean...really?  Deep draft or no, you're talking about the 37th pick!

Regards

People thought it was crazy to compare Isaiah Thomas to Jimmer Fredette, who was a lottery pick. Draft position ain't nothing but a number. I like Tatum a lot, but he has glaring defensive and strength deficiencies at the NBA level. Former GM Bobby Marks and Indiana coach Tom Crean were in agreement that Tatum might be more of a PF at the NBA level, and not until he fills out. They both pointed out his defensive struggles staying in front of athletes like he'll face at SF position in NBA.

Crowder was much more impactful than Bradley this year, and Semi is a more athletic, as-good-or-better shooter than Crowder. Semi's in better position to earn big minutes than Tatum, and he is 2-3 years older after all. Malcolm Brogdon was a second rounder last year, but according to advanced stats, he was more impactful than DeMar DeRozan who averaged 25ppg.

This kid is a freak! I love his violent finish to his dunks.

He has attitude!

112288

They will stash him in Europe for a year.

112288