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Celtics Wrap: Brutal Third Quarter Dooms C’s In 103-95 Loss To Magic

NESN by Darren Hartwell on Sun, Jan 21, 2018

The good news: Kyrie Irving didn’t miss a beat after sitting out the Boston Celtics’ last game due to injury. The bad news: The rest of his teammates did. Irving’s game-high 40 points weren’t enough Sunday afternoon at TD Garden, as the Orlando Magic used a strong third quarter to earn a 103-95 victory and hand the Celtics their third consecutive loss. Boston falls to 34-13 with the defeat, which gave the team its longest losing streak of the season to date. Jaylen Brown added 17 points while Marcus Morris contributed 12, but the Magic put five players in double figures in a balanced effort that included a 32-point third quarter to take the lead for good. Here’s how this one went down.

STARTING FIVE PG: Kyrie Irving SG: Jaylen Brown SF: Jayson Tatum PF: Marcus Morris C: Al Horford

TWO-MAN GAME Boston’s first quarter belonged almost exclusively to Irving and Brown, who combined to score 23 of their team’s first 25 points. Irving led the way with 15 first quarter points on 6-of-7 shooting, while Brown chipped in with eight of his own in a somewhat frantic first quarter that featured nine total turnovers. The C’s made just two of their first eight shots out of the gate but capitalized on some sloppy Magic play later in the frame to take a one-point lead heading into the second quarter.

STAYING AFLOAT The Celtics weren’t exactly a model of defensive excellence in the second quarter. Boston suffered several breakdowns on defense in the period, allowing Orlando to drop 30 points — 15 of which came from Evan Fournier and D.J. Augustin — on 63.2 percent shooting. Fortunately for the C’s, their offense was up to the task. Marcus Morris racked up 10 points in the frame while Irving added nine more to finish with 24 first-half points, and Boston closed the half on an 8-2 run to take a one-point lead into the locker room.

SINKING SHIP The Celtics continued to struggle defensively in the second half. But this time, the offense couldn’t save them. Orlando ripped off a 9-2 run early in the third quarter and never looked back, outscoring Boston 32-12 in an abysmal frame for Brad Stevens’ club. Fournier and Elfrid Payton led the charge with seven and eight points, respectively, as the Magic capitalized on a whopping eight Celtics turnovers to pull ahead. Irving was the Celtics’ only source of offense in the quarter, scoring eight of his team’s 12 points while Boston shot a woeful 4 of 17 from the floor to enter the fourth quarter trailing 90-71.

LAST GASP As they always do, the C’s battled until the end, cutting the Magic’s lead to single digits with under three minutes to play after an Al Horford 3-pointer. But they dug themselves too deep a hole, as Shelvin Mack and Khem Birch scored back-to-back buckets in the final two minutes to seal the win for Orlando.

PLAY OF THE DAY At least Irving brought his A-game.

UP NEXT The Celtics kick off four-game West Coast road trip Tuesday night when they take on Lonzo Ball and the Lakers in Los Angeles. Game time at Staples Center is set for 10:30 p.m. ET

112288

So, this is what "rock bottom" looks like?  Losing to the league worst team to create a 3-game home court losing streak.

Kyrie had 40 on 14-23.  Take him out of the equation and the team was 23-62, 37%.  It's hard to win a game when 10 out of 11 players shoot a combined 37%.  Kyrie scores 40 and we lose by 8.  That should send a message that the rest of the team is not responding.

Rozier 1-9, 0-5 from 3.  Horford 4-11.  Tatum 4-11.  Ugh.

People are saying "get Tatum more shots!"  I've been saying that too, but he's not being aggressive.  He's getting the ball on top, looking at the guy in front of him, and passing out of it.  Some people say "there is no rookie wall, that's just made up!".  Maybe, but hasn't been burning up the media wires for a while has he?  He's a year-and-a-half out of High School.  He played 37 games last year and he's already played 46 this year with almost the same number of mpg (33.3 @ Duke vs 31 with Boston) against bigger, stronger players.  And we're just a little more than 50% there and that doesn't include playoffs.  This is all uncharted territory for Tatum, and the Boston Celtics.

Our bench was 4-19.  21%.  We all love defense, our history and tradition is based upon it, but this is ridiculous.  Brad's approach of deciding who the starting 5 are based upon matchups may work in some ways but without Marcus Morris coming off the bench we have no reliable offense off the bench.  Every time I think "we need another big!" I see a game like this and flip to "we need a scorer!".  What this means is that we have multiple holes/weaknesses...

Evan Fournier from outside and The Elf from inside.  Payton with 22 on 9-for-freaking-16 and one fgm was from 16' and the rest were from point blank.  Elfriid Payeton scoring 19 points in the paint is an indictment of our guards' defense.

The last 3 games, all home games, are like we've forgotten everything we learned and did for the first half of the season.  It's like we just popped out of pre-season.  AWFUL transition defense and no movement on offense.  Al Horford had the ball on the wing in a half court set and was looking for a cutter and there was none.  NOBODY did anything besides set picks high for another player who set another high pick.  NOBODY went to the rim.  Except for Theis, the best pnr guy on the squad.  The ball goes up and he goes to the front of the iron.  He sets a pick and is he popping out for a jumpshot?!  No, he's rolling to the rim.  Wanna talk "old school"?  That's Daniel Theis.  I LIKE THEIS!!

http://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=400975429




bob



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Well, if Tatum is going to hit a wall, let it be now and have him learn how to climb over it. This was bound to happen at some point. I have seen such a reluctance in him to take the shots in the first half of games. So for all you people out there that are saying we don't need Gordon Hayward, this is the definite reason why we do. The kid is 19 years old, just had a kid and is overwhelmed, in my opinion.

I didn't get to watch the game much, what happened to Jaylen's offense in the second half? And that Al Horford/Kyrie Irving combo that was working so well in the early part of the year seems to have disappeared.

They need something to shake them out of this funk. What, a couple of good wins, playing good ball. I will say, every team seems to be going thru this at some point. Even GSW. So, hopefully Brad will be able to reach them and shake them out of it. Maybe a. Change in the lineup with Morris instead of Tatum in the starting lineup? And what has happened to Terry Rozier/Marcus Smart combo? They are both playing lousy.

Well, enough complaining from me. See you next game!!!

We are starting to get into the IT syndrome with Irving.  Over weighted score with one player while the numbers drastically fall off across the board with the rest of the team. Look at the number of shots he put up verses the rest of the team.  If we get into this type of ball...........we are doomed!

The key to success is balanced scoring.  You put the ball in the hands of one player and it throw the entire team out of sync. The rest of the players loose their rhythm.

Brads got to change this trend because it will continue even with Haywood coming back one of these days.  

Not good!

112288

http://www.nba.com/celtics/news/sidebar/post-012118-irving-losing-skid-exactly-adversity-celtics-need?sf179855955=1

If you gonna lose its better to make it vs Orlando for many reasons. Orlando needs all the wins and confidence they can get to get above the Lakers. Golden State are probably going to have both the best record and be coming out of the West so as long as the Celtics have the best record in the East it wont make any real practical difference.

swedeinestonia wrote:If you gonna lose its better to make it vs Orlando for many reasons. Orlando needs all the wins and confidence they can get to get above the Lakers. Golden State are probably going to have both the best record and be coming out of the West so as long as the Celtics have the best record in the East it wont make any real practical difference.

Toronto is only one game back of Boston in the loss column and Orlando is a lock to end the season with a worse record than LA. - a win here or a win there for them will not change that. Horrible loss and a real eye-opener concerning our deficiencies as a team that is perceived by many as a contender.

For a significant part of this season we have seen the Boston bench struggle offensively.

Our two main players, Smart and Rozier are both very inconsistent.  Yesterday's game only highlights this issue.  Orlando's bench scored 38 points and the Celtics bench only manage a paltry 8 points. That is the reason why the Celtics lost yesterday.  Our bench was outscored by 30.

I do not agree that Tatum has hit any rookie wall.  He has struggle a bit as of late with his shooting percentage but he does other things like the 10 rebounds that he grabbed.  I do not think it has anything to do with him being more or less aggressive.  It has more to do with schemes.  Let him run more P and R up top.  Also he is usually the first one who comes off the floor.  How difficult is that for him?  He plays 5-6 minutes and is pulled from the game regardless of how he is playing because Brad needs him to help anchor scoring off the bench.  How many 19 year old rookies have a dual role like that?

I also do not agree that we have entered some IT syndrome with Irving as 112288 suggests.  I see no meaningful change in the shot distribution.  To prove my point, in the game yesterday all of our starters except for Kyrie took their normal number of shots.  The numbers in parentheses are the average field goal attempts per game.  So here is what happened yesterday in terms of FGA.  Horford 11 (10.4), Tatum 11 (9.5), Morris 9 (9.9), Brown 12 (11.3)  

Irving took more shots than usual and Boston needed every single one of them  because our bench stunk the place up  (4-19 and 0-8 from deep)  Irving went 14-23 (61%), 5-7 from deep (71%) with 7 rebounds 5 assists and only 1 turnover.  This was a fairly remarkable performance.

It is what it is.  Clearly we have an offensively challenged rotation.  

I do not like the overall distribution of minutes nor the substitution patterns.  For example Al Horford was not very effective yesterday yet Baynes only plays 5 minutes.  I also see no good reason to sub-out Tatum 1/2 through the 1st quarter.  I think Irving, Brown and Tatum should play most of the 1st quarter.  Bring Morris off the bench since all he does is shoot anyways. Brad needs to let his best players play more minutes together.

Rumor has it that the Celtics are actively looking to add another player so the recent 10 day contract for player X is probably just that.  A 10 day contract.  

It is easy for fans to get things twisted.  We do not have all star Gordon Hayward.  Our inconsistent bench will remain inconsistent because the two main players Smart and Rozier are inconsistent.  People get all upset if it is suggested that Boston is not an elite level team good enough to make it to the finals let alone win the whole thing.  This rebuild is not complete yet and our #2 scorer is likely out for the year.

The Celtics are having a great year.  All of the pieces are not in place but nevertheless the team remains very competitive. This teams has a lot of bumps and bruises and that god awful flu bug is hanging around the locker room.

dboss

I do know one thing, and it is silly to talk about it for, as you say, it is what it is. (My Mom's favorite saying the last few years of her life!!), but I can only dream what this team would be like if Gordon Hayward had not gotten hurt. All those shooting woes and gaps would have been negated. If one had a bad game the other would be there to pick it up.

Also, the lack of Horford/Irving plays these last few games has bee obvious. I really think the reason Al was having such a good game is because the offense was running thru him alot of times and if not, he was on the end of a pick and roll, or alley-opp from Irving. It seems like we haven't seen that for a while.

My reason for thinking that Tatum has hit a "wall" is he appears to be second guessing shots alot of the time. He passes even when he is wide open. To me that shows and indecisiveness in his game that he can out grow with time and practice and prodding from coach and teammates.

Rosalie

Maybe I'm not noticing trends. I am not sure about him hitting the wall.

We have never really defined what we mean by a rookie hitting the wall. I think it is a combination of both physical and mental fatigue. Jason has played in all 47 games this year and has been remarkably consistent. I am sure the grind of a long season is taking its' toll on him but there has been no significant drop off in his productivity. If he has hit the Wall it ha snot been very dramatic.

I think his utilization is very difficult for him. If Hayward was healthy, Jason would be coming off the bench. I think he is the 2nd best scoring option on the team but Boston does not run their offense through him. He has to start and anchor the bench and also play some minutes at the 4 even though he is probably a few years away from having the strength to play at the 4. Last year Jaylen Brown played 17.2 MPG and he had a few ups and downs but his role was significantly less burdensome than Jason's.

I think his shooting (FG%) has been a little off in January but if you look at his consistency since the beginning of the year he is a double digit scorer on most nights.

Here is a month by month look at the number of game he scored in double digits divided by the total number of games each month.

Oct 5/7, Nov 15/16, Dec 14/17 and Jan 5/7

In sum, I am just not sure about how he is feeling. It seems every player on this teams goes through up and down periods and in that regards maybe every player hits the wall.

dboss

JT MAY BE DEALING WITH A KNEE ISSUE SUFFERED IN THE GAME AGAINST PHILLY IN LONDON.

IF YOU ARE FAVORING AN INJURED AREA YOUR TIMING IS AFFECTED. JT WILL BE A SUPERSTAR AND WHO'S NUMBER SOMEDAY WILL BE RETIRED. HE'S 19 YEARS OLD REMEMBER AND ALSO REMEMBER HE IS NOT THE FIRST, SECOND OR THIRD OPTION ON OFFENSE!

112288

112288

112288 wrote:JT MAY BE DEALING WITH A KNEE ISSUE SUFFERED IN THE GAME AGAINST PHILLY IN LONDON.

IF YOU ARE FAVORING AN INJURED AREA YOUR TIMING IS AFFECTED. JT WILL BE A SUPERSTAR AND WHO'S NUMBER SOMEDAY WILL BE RETIRED.  HE'S 19 YEARS OLD REMEMBER AND ALSO REMEMBER HE IS NOT THE FIRST, SECOND OR THIRD OPTION ON OFFENSE!

112288

112288

His ability to score off the dribble, on the break or catch and shoot off the ball would make him the #2 option on this team and #3 If Hayward was playing.

Now all Brad has to do is put him in a position to do those things more often.

We are waiting to see that happen................as we are waiting for spring as well.

112288

Jayson Tatum


Averages/game......................fgas...........fg%...........3ptfgas..........3ptfg%.......ftas..........ft%...........reb...........ast...........TO.........points
Year-to-Date--------------------9.5----------49.2%........3.1-------------45.1%------3.6---------81.7%-----5.5---------1.3---------1.3------13.7
Last 5 games-------------------11.2---------42.9%-------3.2------------43.8%-------1.6--------62.5%------5.8--------1.0---------1.8-------12.0
Last 10 games--------------------------------42.1%-------------------------------------------------------------5.1----------.9--------------------12.5
January (7 games through 1/21)------------41.9%-------------------------------------------------------------5.3---------1.1-------------------11.3

His shooting efficiency is way down, from 49% down to 43%, and he taking the same number of 3s.  His ftas are down and his ft% is WAY down.  His rebounding is steady his 10 rebound game vs Orlando notwithstanding.  Call it "the rookie wall", call it "a slump", call it "adjusting to mean" or "water finding its level" but he is clearly off some from his stellar start of the year.



bob


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Trade JT for Sullinger.

It is a team slump including Brad's coaching. It is the NBA dog days. It is a team edition which will not threaten Golden State without Danny adding some reinforcements.

I like the idea of Morris or Tatum coming off the bench knowing they will be relied on for scoring. A player should embrace something like that as we've all mentioned McHale as a great sixth man in his early years.

Horford had six assists and no turnovers at halftime and that's what he ended with.

Cowens backed me on this in a game thread that Marcus Smart has regressed for pg skills. All players need to focus in on what their true roles are. Marcus had four turnovers and three assists. I'm not scapegoating him. If he can't handle being a ball distributor, someone else needs to fill the role.

I agree with others that Brad is not utilizing Baynes enough. I would like to see Danny go to work and not let this play out on its own. What is missing is ready made players at the end of the rotation. Brad is working with only nine guys all year who are ready to win games. And then within that list of nine guys are players unable to fill all necessary roles.

I thought Smart was the answer for backup pg, but the stats say otherwise and there is no one else to try. It's the same problem for bigs. Brad is stuck with Morris, Theis and Baynes to complement Al Horford. While those three guys are competent, it doesn't seem to be working.

It's like when we had Sully, Kelly, Zeller, Amir and Bass. That was a lot of competence, but it was just structurally never going to get past a low ceiling.

If we had better passing, the scoring would improve. There is no Rondo, Isaiah or Evan Turner to keep the machine moving. The Celtics don't need Anthony Davis. They need to replace spark plugs. That's Danny's job. Brad Stevens can only do so much. Ojeleye and Yabusele for deep bench has lowered this year's ceiling. That's my hot take while waiting for the next game.

Winning cures everything. This is the second slump. Hopefully it gets turned around on the West Coast trip.

Maybe Smart can turn it around and get back to piling up assists with low turnovers. If I was Danny, I'd ask Brad to get him focused on that or trade him while he might still bring someone back to fill the ball distributor role. It's a real shame because Marcus Smart has always been one of the key wild cards with Brown and Tatum for this season, as is Rozier to a degree.

The Celtics will become a much greater threat this year if Smart quickly improves and makes a leap. If this is who he is, I am ready to move on unless he can be resigned with a reasonable contract for a defensive specialist off the bench.

bobheckler wrote:Jayson Tatum


Averages/game......................fgas...........fg%...........3ptfgas..........3ptfg%.......ftas..........ft%...........reb...........ast...........TO.........points
Year-to-Date--------------------9.5----------49.2%........3.1-------------45.1%------3.6---------81.7%-----5.5---------1.3---------1.3------13.7
Last 5 games-------------------11.2---------42.9%-------3.2------------43.8%-------1.6--------62.5%------5.8--------1.0---------1.8-------12.0
Last 10 games--------------------------------42.1%-------------------------------------------------------------5.1----------.9--------------------12.5
January (7 games through 1/21)------------41.9%-------------------------------------------------------------5.3---------1.1-------------------11.3

His shooting efficiency is way down, from 49% down to 43%, and he taking the same number of 3s.  His ftas are down and his ft% is WAY down.  His rebounding is steady his 10 rebound game vs Orlando notwithstanding.  Call it "the rookie wall", call it "a slump", call it "adjusting to mean" or "water finding its level" but he is clearly off some from his stellar start of the year.



bob


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His shooting percentage is down as I also indicated but I see no structural issues with his form.

I guess we need to also define shooting slump.  What is a shooting slump?  

Everything is subjective.  I will make up my own definition so that if ever I use that term in a post it will be clear what I am referring to.

How about a 20% deviation off their average over a 10 game span.  Includes productivity  and efficiency like FG%.   So if a guy is shooting 41% from 3 and then over a 10 game period that percentage drops 20% that may be a slump.