Smart to Grizzlies

We have not heard much about the Brogdon elbow injury in terms of recovery.

There have been no reports of surgery.

I guess us fans are up in the air for the time being.

It may be a situation where he does not opt for surgery.

So we still have Brogden at the moment?

db

I see where some feel that this (and the prior fake Malcolm trade) may now open up more minutes for Payton.

Thats a good thing?

We lose a Smart or a Brogdan and Payton getting more minutes is a good thing?

Yes, it would be for Payton but hardly for the team as a whole.

Payton wasn’t bench-side because of the depth in front of him. Payton was bench-side because the depth in front of him were better players

So are we better now with losing one of our best guards and giving more minutes for the the talented diminutive one? Nope.

Yup. We may or may not end up being better as a whole with the addition of KP and we still need someone to set the table.

We still need a guy who can see the the floor and put the ball in the sweet spots where our stars can and will score more efficiently.

Marcus was my fave but he wasn't a pass first PG and no one on this team was or is now.

Looks like we addressed the “Bigs” situation and thats a “big” thing. A good thing.

Regarding the Guard piece, you could say I’m borrowing trouble but this is still something we sorely need and (bless his heart) Payton cannot fulfill that need.

Can we stop there?

Derrick White is more than capable of starting at PG for the Celtics.  Plus he is not a half bad defender.

You are not going to find a replacement for what Marcus did.  However, his body has been put through the ringer a few times and just about every year he gets injured.  I think what will be missed the most is his physicality.

I also think the Celtics' offense will be better with White at the point because he plays with more pace.  Plus  Zinger was top 3 in scoring from the center position last season.  The offense should be more diverse.

Let's see how Brad builds out  the rest of his roster.

Ktron wrote:I see where some feel that this (and the prior fake Malcolm trade) may now open up more minutes for Payton.

Thats a good thing?

We lose a Smart or a Brogdan and Payton getting more minutes is a good thing?

Yes, it would be for Payton but hardly for the team as a whole.

Payton wasn’t bench-side because of the depth in front of him. Payton was bench-side because the depth in front of him were better players

So are we better now with losing one of our best guards and giving more minutes for the the talented diminutive one? Nope.

Yup. We may or may not end up being better as a whole with the addition of KP and we still need someone to set the table.

We still need a guy who can see the the floor and put the ball in the sweet spots where our stars can and will score more efficiently.

Marcus was my fave but he wasn't a pass first PG and no one on this team was or is now.

Looks like we addressed the “Bigs” situation and thats a “big” thing. A good thing.

Regarding the Guard piece, you could say I’m borrowing trouble but this is still something we sorely need and (bless his heart) Payton cannot fulfill that need.

Can we stop there?

ktron at the very least Peyton should be able to return to the playing time that he got before the MB trade. More specifically, he only played in 48 regular season games this year but he played in 71 games the prior year.

The MB elbow injury is a big question mark for going into the regular season with sufficient PG depth.

D White at 30 MPG works but who gets the other 18 minutes at point if MB is still not ready to play?

My best guess is that Brad will address that issue as needed. Right now it is undetermined.

dboss wrote:Derrick White is more than capable of starting at PG for the Celtics.  Plus he is not a half bad defender.

You are not going to find a replacement for what Marcus did.  However, his body has been put through the ringer a few times and just about every year he gets injured.  I think what will be missed the most is his physicality.

I also think the Celtics' offense will be better with White at the point because he plays with more pace.  Plus  Zinger was top 3 in scoring from the center position last season.  The offense should be more diverse.

Let's see how Brad builds out  the rest of his roster.

My “point” is that we need a pass first guy. Sure White is capable but i am not talking capability as mush as the ability to put the ball in the right spots for our high end scorers.

I am not talking replacement for Smart. As I stated he was not a pass first guy either. However to your point, we probably won’t or can’t replace Smart on the defensive end. You’re right, players like him don’t walk through the door everyday.

My concern is we don't have a superior pure pass first point guard to complement our stars and I think we are going to need that.

All things considered, I love this trade! Smart is valiant, but a handful for a coach, demanding to play, even when hurt and substandard. Let’s keep Brogdon! I hope we don’t make another big move, but add the grace notes around the current roster. The start of 23-24 can’t come soon enough! hawk

dboss wrote:

Ktron wrote:I see where some feel that this (and the prior fake Malcolm trade) may now open up more minutes for Payton.

Thats a good thing?

We lose a Smart or a Brogdan and Payton getting more minutes is a good thing?

Yes, it would be for Payton but hardly for the team as a whole.

Payton wasn’t bench-side because of the depth in front of him. Payton was bench-side because the depth in front of him were better players

So are we better now with losing one of our best guards and giving more minutes for the the talented diminutive one? Nope.

Yup. We may or may not end up being better as a whole with the addition of KP and we still need someone to set the table.

We still need a guy who can see the the floor and put the ball in the sweet spots where our stars can and will score more efficiently.

Marcus was my fave but he wasn't a pass first PG and no one on this team was or is now.

Looks like we addressed the “Bigs” situation and thats a “big” thing. A good thing.

Regarding the Guard piece, you could say I’m borrowing trouble but this is still something we sorely need and (bless his heart) Payton cannot fulfill that need.

Can we stop there?

ktron at the very least Peyton should be able to return to the playing time that he got before the MB trade.  More specifically, he only played in 48 regular season games this year but he played in 71 games the prior year.  

The MB elbow injury is a big question mark for going into the regular season with sufficient PG depth.

D White at 30 MPG works but who gets the other 18 minutes at point if MB is still not ready to play?

My best guess is that Brad will address that issue as needed.  Right now it is undetermined.

Dboss, the operative term being “the very least”. We need better. Payton getting those minutes back doesn’t necessarily make us better. Those minutes now are a luxury and it’d be nice to keep PP if we have that luxury.
I don’t think at this point we do.
Payton is a nice player but id rather see him play nice elsewhere while we upgrade at PG.

I too am hopeful that Brad addresses this as well and please dont get me wrong, I'm not dissing PP. I admire him but id much rather admire him from afar.

I don't know about anyone else, but I myself posted , when Brogdon wa the guy going out, that Pritchard would get more plaing time ( assuming he wasn't himself traded.) Never said , or thought, it was a good thing.Its obvious we beed another point guard.Three first rounders we can throw at somebody in today's draft and next year's to pry one loose.

hawksnestbeach wrote:All things considered, I love this trade! Smart is valiant, but a handful for a coach, demanding to play, even when hurt and substandard. Let’s keep Brogdon! I hope we don’t make another big move, but add the grace notes around the current roster. The start of 23-24 can’t come soon enough! hawk

a handful for a coach, demanding to play, even when hurt and substandard.

I don’t know what you are referring to with him being a handful but all the other attributes mentioned are things I would want out of a player.
Anybody and too many can and will sit it out with a toothache or a hangnail.

Maybe the hallmark of a great trade; everyone is a little shocked and opinion is divided.

The picture isn't complete yet with at least the potential of a draft pick being added this year and another next.

The fun in being a fan is we all get to play GM and coach. Some love this deal as it is, some would have done it differently.

The only ones proven right so far are those that thought a roster shakeup would be coming.

jrleftfoot wrote:I don't know about anyone else, but I myself posted , when Brogdon wa the guy going out, that Pritchard would get more plaing time ( assuming he wasn't himself traded.) Never said , or thought, it was a good thing.Its obvious we beed another point guard.Three first rounders we can throw at somebody in today's  draft and next year's to pry one loose.

Amen my brother.

NYCelt wrote:Maybe the hallmark of a great trade; everyone is a little shocked and opinion is divided.

The picture isn't complete yet with at least the potential of a draft pick being added this year and another next.

The fun in being a fan is we all get to play GM and coach. Some love this deal as it is, some would have done it differently.

The only ones proven right so far are those that thought a roster shakeup would be coming.

Its fun but id be ‘funner” if we got paid “>)

Ktron wrote:

dboss wrote:Derrick White is more than capable of starting at PG for the Celtics.  Plus he is not a half bad defender.

You are not going to find a replacement for what Marcus did.  However, his body has been put through the ringer a few times and just about every year he gets injured.  I think what will be missed the most is his physicality.

I also think the Celtics' offense will be better with White at the point because he plays with more pace.  Plus  Zinger was top 3 in scoring from the center position last season.  The offense should be more diverse.

Let's see how Brad builds out  the rest of his roster.

My “point” is that we need a pass first guy. Sure White is capable but i am not talking capability as mush as the ability to put the ball in the right spots for our high end scorers.

I am not talking replacement for Smart. As I stated he was not a pass first guy either. However to your point, we probably won’t or can’t replace  Smart on the defensive end. You’re right, players like him don’t walk through the door everyday.

My concern is we don't have a superior pure pass first point guard to complement our stars and I think we are going to need that.

ktron

I think that we talked about that last night. The Celtics have not had that type of player since Rondo.

It would be great if we could find one on the cheap but I do not think that we can.

Still, having a legit scorer at center gives the team more positional scoring balance.

The Celtics will still be a team that likes to spread the floor but with D White taking on a more prominent role and adding a legit shooter/scorer in Zinger, the Celtics offence will have a different look (feel).

I am wondering if JD Davidson will get to play this year.  He played well and averaged 8.7 assists per game in Maine.  I know it is just the G-league but has point guard skills.

Ktron, IMHO, Smart plays all-out, which comes from desire, and many times is indispensable for the team. He wants to play no matter how’s he hurting, and when he’s got a twisted ankle or other injury, at times he forces the issue and this hurts the team. A seasoned excellent coach would sit him. A less secure coach would play him. We learn as we go and I am not dissing our coach.
The last time we traded a defensive standout (Tony Allen) to Memphis, I think it cost us at least one ring. This time there is Porzingis. He is not the defensive stopper I covet, but he’s 7’ 3’’. If the current team, including Porzingis, is healthy for next year’s playoffs, that might be fun. hawk

I don’t see D White as a PG, he’s not a distributor. He can handle the ball and start the offense, but that’s it.

Brogdon’s on the other hand, has a skill set that is better suited to being a point guard. He has to be healthy and ready to go next season because I don’t think there is a better point guard option on the roster at this time.

I'm really not sure how I feel about this trade. Time will tell, I guess. My only concern really is Smart's toughness will be missed.


KJ

dboss wrote:

Ktron wrote:

dboss wrote:Derrick White is more than capable of starting at PG for the Celtics.  Plus he is not a half bad defender.

You are not going to find a replacement for what Marcus did.  However, his body has been put through the ringer a few times and just about every year he gets injured.  I think what will be missed the most is his physicality.

I also think the Celtics' offense will be better with White at the point because he plays with more pace.  Plus  Zinger was top 3 in scoring from the center position last season.  The offense should be more diverse.

Let's see how Brad builds out  the rest of his roster.

My “point” is that we need a pass first guy. Sure White is capable but i am not talking capability as mush as the ability to put the ball in the right spots for our high end scorers.

I am not talking replacement for Smart. As I stated he was not a pass first guy either. However to your point, we probably won’t or can’t replace  Smart on the defensive end. You’re right, players like him don’t walk through the door everyday.

My concern is we don't have a superior pure pass first point guard to complement our stars and I think we are going to need that.

ktron

I think that we talked about that last night.  The Celtics have not had that type of player since Rondo.  

It would be great if we could find one on the cheap but I do not think that we can.

Still, having a legit scorer at center gives the team more positional scoring balance.

The Celtics will still be a team that likes to spread the floor but with D White taking on a more prominent role and adding a legit shooter/scorer in Zinger, the Celtics offence will have a different look (feel).

I agree

hawksnestbeach wrote:Ktron, IMHO, Smart plays all-out, which comes from desire, and many times is indispensable for the team. He wants to play no matter how’s he hurting, and when he’s got a twisted ankle or other injury, at times he forces the issue and this hurts the team. A seasoned excellent coach would sit him. A less secure coach would play him. We learn as we go and I am not dissing our coach.
The last time we traded a defensive standout (Tony Allen) to Memphis, I think it cost us at least one ring. This time there is Porzingis. He is not the defensive stopper I covet, but he’s 7’ 3’’. If the current team, including Porzingis, is healthy for next year’s playoffs, that might be fun. hawk

Did we let Tony Allen get away with no compensation? I think so.
If thats the case then at least this time we got something back, something big!

gyso wrote:Final haul from the Marcus Smart trade:

https://twitter.com/brohrbach/status/1672134258532442113?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1672134258532442113%7Ctwgr%5Edb6381abc7f830fbd6754c015367c73382ac4539%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fsports.yahoo.com%2F2023-nba-draft-tracker-complete-list-of-first--and-second-round-picks-analysis-grades-reaction-051342661.html

Plus: For moving out of the guaranteed money for the first round pick, we stay under the 2nd apron and retain the little MLE.  Once we determine the name of that guy, we can add him to the list.

Then, when the future 2nd round picks are included in future trades, the whole thing begins to resemble a spiderweb.

Brad must be some kind of genius, look what Utah got for Gobert, who has such limited offense compared to Porzingis, and look what we gave up to get him…??? And we even acquired 2 first round picks. I know we kept on trading down and getting more and more picks, I missed how we got Golden States first round pick? That is amazing, can anyone explain how we pulled that one off? That pick can be huge, as I’m not expecting them to contend next year.

Cow,

Here's my draft day notes.  Step by step pick swaps.  The last one threw me, I thought we kept that big guy, Mouhamed Gueye, but we traded him for another SRP.

In the first pick swap, we traded #25 for #31, plus received 2 Second Round Picks (SRP) for 2025/2026.  At #25, Detroit took Marcus Sasser. (PG).  The website I was using gave Detroit a D+ for their pick.

I hope this helps.

Gyso thanks it was a weird draft day for us, think I understand most of that. Love the pick we did get. I can’t figure out how we also ended up with GS’s 24 first round pick?