Jaden Springer traded to Celtics

From Sixers for 2nd rounder

Well that is it.

Boston trades for 2 poor offensive players.  They are defenders however as both players have negative net ratings it would be hard to conclude that either deal will be impactful.  In other words their defense does not offset their putrid offense.

Grade C at best.

What grade did we give Derrick initially? I don't think I even gave Derrick a grade because he was so far off the radar or so it seemed.

fdb

What grade did we give Derrick initially?  I don't think I even gave Derrick a grade because he was so far off the radar or so it seemed.  

db

Watching ESPN this afternoon with all the vomiting over the Knicks, what these very intelligent people all seemed to have completely forgotten and thrown caution out the window and into the wind is the fact that they are still.....THE KNICKS!!  My entire life they haven't done SQUAT save over 50 years ago in the late 60's/early 70's!  You can't change those stripes!!  This will be the same as Steven A. predicting with great accuracy the demise of the Cowboys.  Over the last 28 years, the Cowboys are the perfect role model for these current Knicks.

And guess which team went completely unmentioned and unnoticed the whole afternoon for either pick up?...Just the way Brad likes it.  

db

db two points to make here

I do not recall if D White got a grade.  The Celtics gave up a lot to get him.  It was more about having less depth after the trade than if he was a good player. His first year (26 regular season games) was not particularly good.  His playoff performance (23 games) was not particularly good either  (GSW championship)

Last season he played great including the playoffs.

Today I am giving him an A because if i gave him a grade in 2022 he would have earned a C.

The Knicks did play in the championship other than in the early 70's.  They  had 2 rather deep playoff runs in 1998-99 and 1999 to 2000.  Also, I cannot forget when they smacked the Celtics around during the 2013 playoffs.   After that playoff loss the Celtics traded PP and KG etc.  (June 2013)

I like the fact that they are competitive because beating them has always brought me joy.

Springer is just 21.He was the G League finals MVP. He may still develop an offensive game. I believe he was added primarily for his potential. Xavier is strictly insurance. He can bang a little against the Centers too strong for our other guys. We gave up diddly. I see no reason to be critical, given our resources and cap situation. The D White trade was almost universally panned on this board. We were giving up too much, blah blah blah. I was called every kind of idiot for defending the trade. One member went so far as telling me that he knew way more about basketball than I did.Probably true, but not a very effective rhetorical device. Maybe Springer can be coached up. Lamar wasn't playing and we still have several hundred second round picks. Ok, that's a slight exaggeration. Putting my faith in Mr. Stevens judgement. Finally, Tillman's shoorting % this year is somewhat of an anomoly, given past performance. Anyway, he won't be taking a lot of difficult shots in a Celtics uniform. He's a decent rimrunner , and at least as good a rebounder as any of our other bigs.

Good deal. So we pursue the obvious solution...let this play out. Brad is the man for team building!

db

P.S. dboss, I'd somewhat forgotten/blocked out those other two brief runs by the Knicks to Nowheresville. Clearly they made quite an impression upon my overall view of the franchise! Like you, their demise brings me great pleasure as well!

Well it is all done now.  

Time will tell if either player can help us.  I would have prefer to see Brad split the baby.

You know,  add a defensive guy and an offensive guy.  

CAP limitations withstanding, the much talked about TPE disappears like a fart in the wind.  The very notion that Brad had the Green light to add whatever he wanted is a song with a very familiar tune.

I do hope that the 2 new additions can help us and do not turn into 2 additional warm bodies that rack up DNP's coaches decision.

Jaden probably will not get much run unless Jrue continues to have elbow issues but I can see Xavier getting playing time.

Best of luck to both of them because if they can add to an already significant team, the Celtics should be even better, at least on defense.

Wow, we have a lot of high quality defenders now, don't we?

Derrick
Jrue
Jaylen
Walsh
Tillman
Springer

I'm surprised Brad didn't get that big wing he said we needed.  Maybe that was all misdirection on his part.  You have learned well from Jedi Master Trader Danny, young one.

Springer is 6'3" in barefeet and has a 6'7 1/2" wingspan.

Springer has only played 377 minutes so far this season.  He wasn't a rotation player under Nick Nurse in Philly, he won't be one here either. I expect him to spend a lot of time in Maine.

Neverthess, a 2nd round pick isn't a bad price for a player that was picked 28th I suppose.  I understand this trade, on first glance, even less than I did the Tillman one.


Bob


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bobh

I think Brad made the move to add more frontcourt depth because he does not have enough confidence in our backup centers Kornet and Queta. AH at age 37 cannot be expected to come out every game during the playoffs and do well. The Celtics have managed to win even with KP missing 14 games and AH missing 9. Maybe Tillman can at least temper some of the wear and tear on them.

The Celtics have experienced tough going in the playoffs because of our center depth. RW could not be counted on due to injuries. We have to be able to withstand an injury at center and still win.

IF KP gets hurt, AH would not have to play big minutes throughout the playoffs. They will be able to buy some minutes with Kornet and Tillman. However KP is the key to this team making it all the way.

By the way KP, has very limited playoff experience (10) games total.

2020 3 games
2021 7 games

Springer can help us on the defensive end. If we need another defender in the backcourt he could factor in.

In both cases, Tillman and Springer should be able to play defense at a high level on this team and the Celtics have enough shooters to compensate for their lack of offense.

It will be up to CJ to figure out how to get the most out of them. CJ is a bigtime analytics guy. You are not going to get the same level of firepower as you do with with any 5 of our top six on the floor. If the two new guys can help to facilitate offense and lock down on defense there should be some minutes for them.

I've read that this trade is more developmental. The Delano experiment didn't bear fruit, so it's off to the next tree.

Springer already can play defense, perhaps he can learn to shoot straight.

Bob


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Seems that Springer might be able to help more than just on defense. Even though he is a career 23.8% three point shooter in limited games as a pro (on just 42 attempts), in his one college year at Tennessee he shot 43.5% on threes (20-46). Let's hope his college percentage on threes is a better reflection of his long-range shooting ability than what he's shown in his extremely sparse minutes in Philly.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/jaden-springer-1.html?__hstc=180814520.0caa78fd3041e06be968aee9a3ae619e.1698947772655.1707095730987.1707451591712.33&__hssc=180814520.3.1707451591712&__hsfp=1135167407

Banton is gone, off to Portland for a protected second rounder, I am surprised he got a taker for him, that guy is a g leaguer permanently as far as I am concerned, this is one move Brad made that was a loser. Stevens, I thought, could have been more helpful but obviously did not show them enough to stick around, He was a popular player with the team in the locker room though,never negative, always pumping up his teammates, Can’t hold on to him for that, so off he went.

I knew we would not see much, but was disappointed he did not use the exception on someone to upgrade a little. Obviously when you are on top, teams don’t want to offer you much to get stronger, We will just have to see in buyout if anyone shows up, I doubt it. So this is it!! Stop ‘yer moaning, I believe the best is yet to come with this team

Springer's salary is being covered by Grant Williams' $6.2M TPE. The TPE has expired because we're over the 2nd Apron.

Steve mentioned Springer's college 3pt fg%. Those are college 3s against weaker competition. His G-League 3pt fg%, and they take NBA 3s in G-League, isn't good either. He played in one G-League game this year, he shot 3-5, but in 6 games 2022-2023 he shot 31.3% and in 9 games in 2021-2022 he shot 28%.

Well, I've always heard that shooting is the easiest skill to teach, all you need is good form and tons of repetitions. Here's where we find out if I know wtf I'm talking about.


Bob


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The bottom line is the two players acquired provide added depth behind Porzingis, Horford and Holiday, all three of whom have serious durability concerns.

A couple of moves for defense and depth. A couple of players that might have a little offensive capability since both have displayed some in the past. Neither are shooters, but we may have just enough of those in the rotation to carry the team. Nothing much was given up, although I suspect Stevens can be productive as he was in Cleveland.

Tillman may have enough game to move in behind Porzingis and Horford on the depth chart. Springer might be a couple of players behind Jrue, but if Pritchard ends up spelling Jrue for even more minutes it couldn't hurt to have a defense first guard somewhere further back in the order.

In the big picture, the team may not be able to carry the contracts they have now next season, so adding to the load was out of the question. TPEs almost always expire unused and worthless so who really thought they could be of major value? Anything you get with those amounts to a bonus. The best available short-term rentals on the cheap are the only way to go.

Brad got what he could. Onward.

Did anyone notice the highlights on Springer. He stole Jayson's lunch a couple of times!

I wouldn't get all that worked up about Brad not using the TPE in order to upgrade our roster.  Just having the TPE available allowed him another option for roster building as he scoped out who was actually available and who would actually trade with him.

Just like when we got Malcolm Brogdon from Indy (for spare parts in a trade), Brad had a big TPE available at that time.  He chose the trade, which opened up the roster a bit, instead of using the TPE.

This time, he also chose a trade over using the TPE, thus keeping that 15th roster spot open for the buyout market.  The value we got back (Xavier and Jaden) are just about what we'd have gotten with the TPE.

If Xavier was under contract for more money ($4-5M`ish), and Brad had to use the TPE in order to make the money work, we'd be just as happy with the result.  At least after all the player's skill sets were discovered and verified.  LOL

And yes, Dboss, I did see Springer take advantage of Jayson in the highlight reel, more than once.

There have been multiple TPE's that have expired. It was not unusual that the Celtics went in another direction.

This team sits on one of those very expensive locations. From my perspective, the Celtics have 2 years including this year to win a title with our current top 6 players.

I would disagree with one thing gyso, with regards to getting Brogdon for some spare parts.

The real cost for constructing this team can only be determined when a string of transactions has been realized.

Let me provide an example. Jrue Holiday = Brogdon (Nesmith + Theis + 1 first round pick) + ( RW + 2 first round picks).

Winning #18 would justify the cost (assets) Holiday is not responsible by himself for winning the title. Every player on the team will contribute to winning or losing.

Gary Washburn: Jaden Springer will wear #44; Xavier Tillman will wear #26. #Celtics 1 hour ago – via Twitter GwashburnGlobe


Bob


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PERSPECTIVE ON THE TRADE FROM THE SIXERS' SIDE:


https://thesixersense.com/posts/daryl-morey-comments-traded-guard-anger-76ers-fans



Daryl Morey’s comments about recently traded guard should anger 76ers fans


The Philadelphia 76ers made a surprising trade before the deadline, and Daryl Morey’s provocative comments should anger fans.


By Nicolas Kyle Pring | Feb 10, 2024


The Philadelphia 76ers were one of the busiest teams before the trade deadline lapsed, signing off on multiple deals as they shape up the roster for a late season push without Joel Embiid for the meantime. However, the team was far from spotless, pulling the trigger on a certain trade that puzzled many fans.

Shortly after trading Patrick Beverley to the Bucks for Cameron Payne and a second-rounder, the 76ers shipped young guard Jaden Springer to their biggest rival, the Boston Celtics, for chump change. When asked about his rationale for the deal, Daryl Morey dished out something that will probably not be appreciated by many.

Daryl Morey’s remarks about Jaden Springer shows the 76ers are making a big mistake


Asked about the reasoning behind the 76ers’ last-minute trade to send Springer to Boston, Morey had this

"We had to look at, what are the odds Jaden Springer — who I think has a great future — helps our playoff rotation in the one, two, three-year horizon. And what are the odds a second-round pick helps us? And we thought the second-round pick helped us more. And that’s just the reality, it allows us to maybe get a veteran at next year’s deadline, things like that.

We did it. It sucks. Jaden’s going to be really good, I think. I think his timetable is a little pushed out, though. Our evaluation was that his timetable to help a playoff team is farther than what the second-round pick can do for us."


Trading a potential key player to your biggest rival is one thing, but justifying it by saying that a second-round pick could net you a bigger return is too broad of a hypothetical to reliably bank on, especially in this post-deadline context.

As constructed, the 76ers have one reliable perimeter defender in the backcourt in De’Anthony Melton, who’s oft-injured. Buddy Hield, their biggest midseason addition, is nowhere near a defensive asset, and losing Beverley for Payne is a defense-for-offense trade-off. Even the player they are linked to in the buyout market cannot be pegged as a stopper at this juncture.

Springer has largely been out of the rotation, but that’s mostly due to the team having too many mouths to feed in the backcourt. Now that their guard rotation has thinned out significantly, Springer would have been a nice rotation piece they can invest on for little with how great he’s been in spurts this season.

Once again, Morey and co. are exhibiting sheer unwillingness to develop players, which plays into why people think that their window to compete is too fragile to hold up at this rate. Even the greatest teams in history had a young player or two that frankly made them much more competitive.

That this franchise continues to show an allergic reaction to player development is beyond anyone. All fans can hope for is that this one-sided way of team-building eventually culminates into a much-needed championship.


Bob
MY NOTE:  Yeah, this doesn't sound like a very cogent explanation, does it?  Maybe Morey saw Brad trade the rarely-played end-of-bencher Lamar Stevens and some seconds for Xavier Tillman and thought "why can't I have nice things?".  Jaden Springer isn't an offensive player (a classic understatement) but he sure can defend at a high level.  A team that cannot find a roster spot for a high quality defender better be up to their eyeballs in defenders that are even better and, as this article points out, by trading Pat Bev for Buddy "lead boots" Hield the Sixers now have limited defensive presence at the perimeter, and the perimeter is where defense starts in this NBA. And Darryl Morey doesn't think 1-3 years is long enough for a 21 year old to learn how to jump shoot? Jaden won't be 22 until September, Morey doesn't think he could become at least a decent jump shooter by the time he's 25? 3-and-D guys don't have to shoot off the dribble, they don't need to create like the Js. They just have to stand out at the arc, rotate away from defenders when the defenders rotate towards the ball, and catch-and-shoot when it's passed to them and all it takes to get better at that is sound mechanics and thousands of repetitions, all of which can come with time.

As I said on another thread, maybe Brad Stevens is good at this "GM thing".


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