Post Game - Celtics vs. New York Knicks - Tuesday, October 22 (W)

cowens/oldschool wrote:

dboss wrote:The Knicks may end up becoming a really could team but our beloved Celtics sent a clear message to them and the rest of the NBA that we are not to be trivialized.

This has to be the most domineering open game salvo that I can recall.

The Celtics are well positioned to knock at the door of 50 (3) point attempts per game.  They can shoot them and they can defend against them.  In today's NBA they are the perfect storm.

True, we are absolute murder to opposing points. Our switching perimeter defense is this eras standard. J’s are also the best defensive wing tandem in the league.

cowens/oldschool wrote:As much as I loved seeing Ray and Paul play together and both took turns playing Kobe tough, J’s are in a multiple level defensive class of their own. The way they blanket points, and rumble with PF’s is beautiful to watch. I love watching Jaylen go at Luka, Zion and Lebron, how he didn’t get on all defensive is a crime!!

dboss wrote:The timeline for this team is significantly more favorable than the 08 big 3. Yeah, I agree.

My only concern is about new ownership and their appetite to spend top dollars on a top team.  However, the completion of the sale is stagnated.  We could keep it together for 2 years before we see tax relief.  Next season is when the tax penalty will be most punitive. Yeah, I agree.

The ugency of winning with this team is not lost.  We need to win it again this year.  We do not know what next year's team will look like but this year we are locked and loaded. Yeah, I agree.

KP has 2 years on his contract.  If he is not able to stay healthy they may try to move him. Yeah, I agree.

Last night I watched a few games like Philly and Milwaukee.   Both Joel and PG 13 were out.

bobheckler wrote:

cowens/oldschool wrote:As much as I loved seeing Ray and Paul play together and both took turns playing Kobe tough, J’s are in a multiple level defensive class of their own. The way they blanket points, and rumble with PF’s is beautiful to watch. I love watching Jaylen go at Luka, Zion and Lebron, how he didn’t get on all defensive is a crime!!

Cow,

I think some differences between the 2008 team and this one was they had multiple elite defenders like KG, Tony Allen and Leon Powe playing starter or rotation minutes.  Additionally, those elite defenders were playing multiple positions (i.e. center, PF, guard) and could, therefore, lock down whomever their top scorers were no matter where in the lineup they played.  Who are our defensive stoppers?  A pair of guards and Jaylen who is a 2/3 and, hopefully someday, Walsh.  None of them bigs.  Do we have an elite defensive center?  Not really.  We're ok with Z and Al, but elite?  We don't have a back line policeman, an eraser, like KG.  

Our defense is a combination of having a couple of elite defenders and a couple of above average defenders in our top, say, 7-8.  I suppose we could now include Hauser in the "above average" category, which would mean only Payton is not above average because of his size.

Additionally, we have rule changes, which is why I hate comparing eras.  NBA players now are all graduates of the Stanislavski School of Acting.  They practice taking ridiculous off-balance shots and falling down while yelling "PLUS ONE!!", and the refs reward them for that because we're now talking about giraffe-sized Ming Vases that are "insured" for hundreds of millions of dollars over the course of their careers and need to be protected.  Any player who tried that with KG would have a plus one headache and he'd make sure that Big Baby and everybody else on the team enforced that too.

And then there's the 3s.  Pierce was a 36.8% 3pt shooter.  That's mediocre in today's NBA, and Pierce was an elite scorer for his time.  Ray Allen, one of the greatest shooters in NBA history, was a career 40% 3pt shooter.  On admittedly much (MUCH!) fewer attempts Sam Hauser is shooting 42.1% from 3.  Pritchard is shooting 39.2% career from 3.  Think about that.  We have two shooters coming off our bench who are shooting almost as well, or better, than the #2 most prolific 3pt shooter in NBA history, a player who started and played heavy minutes for the 2008 team and for as long as he was in Boston.  Payton's counterpart on the 2008 team was Eddie House.  House shot 39.3% in 2008, identical to Pritch.  House also only had 1.9 apg and 1.0 TOpg.  Last year Pritch averaged 3.4 apg and .7 TOpg in just slightly more mpg.  Pritch also almost doubled Eddie's rebounding.  My point is that Pritchard is as good a shooter as our Championship bench shooter and better all-round.  HOWEVER, Pritchard's DefRtg is about 115 while Eddie's was 100.  NBA team defense, back then, was stifling because Eddie House was not that good a defender.


As we head into this season I'm going to try to focus on Joe's exhortation for them to play "like a pod of Orcas".  I'm going to be watching to see if they coordinate and swarm and sacrifice individual achievements to share the effort and rewards like Orcas.  The league has Steve Kerr to thank (or blame) for the torrential downpour of 3s this Celtic team is about to rain on them this season but they may have to give those same props to Joe Mazzulla (and Sir David Attenborough) for our defensive and offensive styles.


Bob


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