SI.com & ESPN; Celtics Interested in Chris Paul

An argument can always be made that Rondo looks good because he is surrounded by great offensive players.

However it is not just the idea that Rondo passes the ball to Ray and Ray scores it is the timing of the pass and the location that makes it easier for Ray to shoot the ball well. Ray does not shoot well if his timing is off on the catch and shoot. Much of the credit has to go to the passer and make no doubt about it. Rondo is the best pure passing PG in the NBA.

The experts also forget to mention that Rondo is really an uptempo point guard that has learned to be effective running a half court offense. How many more assist would Rondo have if he was running point on a runnin team?

I think this Rondo thing only serves to motivate him to get even better. I think DA came out with denials but where there is smoke there is fire. The question is who approached who? Did DA see this as an opportunity to remake the team?

Would I trade Rajon for Paul if I could also get DH? Hell yes. But that senario is still far fetched.

DA needs to rebuild 4 out of 5 starting positions except for PG. We need a center, a replacement for Ray at the 2, a replacement for KG at the 4 (let's see how Johnson Pans out) and a replacement for PP at the 3. JG is no small forward nor is he a power forward so i do not see him as a true replacement at SF for PP. Jeff is athletic and is a very good basketball player but he is limited offensively and defensively at the 3 and he cannot bang in the post with true PF. He is a tweaner.

If DA is smart he will resign green and then trade him at some point. He should also consider moving RA and /or KG before their contracts expire. This should be done because the Celtics cannot win this year unless they acquire a significant player or two. I am not sure if DA will be able to fill out the roster with enough talent this year. So perhaps looking to next year would be a more realistic strategy.

Can't wait for the games to begin.

dboss

Rondo is an elite, top five pg. any one who questions this needs to rethink what they think they know. He is by far the best pg for this current group of Celtics. This group is not going anywhere barring some kind of miracle trade by Danny. RA and KG will sign extensions, they are not through yet. They both want to finish in Boston. Both can play and be effective, not necessarly start, for 2-5 more years. PP will also sign an extension. The only caveat for this would be unrealistic salary demands. The C's will compete for a championship this season. The future depends on how well DA does in trades and drafting. Optimism will make the season flow much more smoothly. This will be a great season for the Green!

tj,

Thanks for getting the whole thing.

"Assists are tricky"? "Potential assists"?

So let's dig deeper into those gaudy assist totals and see whether we can separate what is Rondo and what isn't. One way to zoom in on his true talent is to remove a Hall of Famer from the equation. What happens to Rondo's assist rates when one of Boston's Big Three leaves the floor?

Consider this: When Ray Allen was on the court, Rondo tallied 11.4 assists per 36 minutes. When Ray Allen left the court?

8.0 assists per 36 minutes -- the equivalent of Devin Harris' rate last season.

One way to separate what is Rondo and what is Harris is to even things up. Lets take away the assists from Harris' top shooter and what is left?

6.0 assists per 36 minutes -- the equivalent of DJ Augustin's rate last season.

I made up the relative loss of assists (2) when Harris lost his best shooter, but you get the point. I could have taken 3 away, but that would have left us with Jordan Farmar. (LOL)

Take away your best shooter and the offensive statistics suffer. Take away your most versitile offensive player and the statistics suffer even more. I couldn't have predicted that one. (LOL)

Anyway, it was an interesting read. I'll close with this:

But for potential rebuilding suitors outside of Boston, the here's what's clear to me: Rondo's probably way better than what you got!!

TJ,

I haven't gone out of my way to follow Lakers' news the way you're generous enough to do with Celtics' news. Do you think they'll stick with Fish and Blake at PG this season?

Hope you're enjoying the Tampa area.

Sam

To quote Mark Twain (or misquote) "There are three kinds of lies: Lies, Damned Lies and Statistics."

Following the line of reasoning in the article t.j. was kind enough to post, if you removed Rondo's top four scoring options from the floor, so he was out there alone, his assists probably would go to zero. I say probably because he may bounce to ball off his head and catch it himself, but it may not be ruled an assist.

The Celtics have had some players who couldn't score if the basket was as big as the ocean. Bill Russell? Too overrated to describe. K.C. Jones? How can he be in the Naismith Hall? He only scored 10 ppg for his career.

It's a good thing modern players don't have to try hard when they're on the floor. Otherwise the guys who try the hardest would win by keeping their opponents from scoring and offensive statistics would be meaningless.

sam wrote:TJ,

I haven't gone out of my way to follow Lakers' news the way you're generous enough to do with Celtics' news. Do you think they'll stick with Fish and Blake at PG this season?

Hope you're enjoying the Tampa area.

Sam

Sam,

The thought of a Fisher/Blake tandem at point guard is a nightmare for Lakers fans.
I honestly do not believe any other teams have two worse #1 and 2 point guards as Fisher/Blake.
Their offensive and defensive deficiencies were pretty easily hidden through the triangle offense and the defensive schemes Phil instituted.
Now, with LA dropping the triangle offense and using a more traditional offense, LA's point guard will have to pull their own weight.
They do not have the size, speed or skill to do so.
There are so many fast, strong and athletic point guards in the league. Fisher and Blake will be dominated almost every night.
Kobe is also slowing down defensively. Statistically, when he was in games last year they were a worse defensive team.
I don't know who they can get as their starting point guard. I am hoping for maybe Ramon Sessions from Cleveland.
LA has superior talent but they are an older and slow team which was exposed by Dallas in the playoffs.
They will probably not bring back one or more of following slow players: Walton, World Peace and Caracter.
It will be an exciting 3 weeks leading up to opening day of the season.

Tampa is great, we LOVE living here.
Today it is 80 degrees with a breeze and bright sunshine.
Windows are open and we don't need the AC...

Hope everything is well with you and Mrs. Sam.
It feels good to be back here after taking some time off...

tjmakz wrote:

sam wrote:TJ,

I haven't gone out of my way to follow Lakers' news the way you're generous enough to do with Celtics' news. Do you think they'll stick with Fish and Blake at PG this season?

Hope you're enjoying the Tampa area.

Sam

Sam,

The thought of a Fisher/Blake tandem at point guard is a nightmare for Lakers fans.
I honestly do not believe any other teams have two worse #1 and 2 point guards as Fisher/Blake.
Their offensive and defensive deficiencies were pretty easily hidden through the triangle offense and the defensive schemes Phil instituted.
Now, with LA dropping the triangle offense and using a more traditional offense, LA's point guard will have to pull their own weight.
They do not have the size, speed or skill to do so.
There are so many fast, strong and athletic point guards in the league. Fisher and Blake will be dominated almost every night.
Kobe is also slowing down defensively. Statistically, when he was in games last year they were a worse defensive team.
I don't know who they can get as their starting point guard. I am hoping for maybe Ramon Sessions from Cleveland.
LA has superior talent but they are an older and slow team which was exposed by Dallas in the playoffs.
They will probably not bring back one or more of following slow players: Walton, World Peace and Caracter.
It will be an exciting 3 weeks leading up to opening day of the season.

Tampa is great, we LOVE living here.
Today it is 80 degrees with a breeze and bright sunshine.
Windows are open and we don't need the AC...

Hope everything is well with you and Mrs. Sam.
It feels good to be back here after taking some time off...

TJ,

I think this is a fair and accurate appraisal of your team.

The Triangle is all about plugging players into their appropriate roles. Fisher and Blake were perfect as the outside shooter in the "2" part of the Triangle. Now that the Triangle is no more...

I'm expecting a fair amount of confusion on the Lakers this season precisely because of this. Players who have played under the Triangle for years (and, in the case of Bynum and Brown, their entire careers) are going to have trouble throwing all that out of their heads and running new plays. I think you'll see them revert to the triangle under high pressure moments (since that is their comfort zone), much to the frustration of Mike Brown. Honestly, I don't see how that can be helped. If Doc left tomorrow and they brought in a coach with a completely different style and system, say, Mike D'Antoni (I just threw up a bit in my mouth) we'd be discombobulated too.

You can take amnesty on one player. If you use it on Walton, you own Metta (Christ in a bottle! Do we really have to call him that now?). I realize you said "one or more", so I'm not saying you made a mistake, what I'm saying is how do you cut more than one?

Throwing Bynum and another player at Orlando for D12 (which I'm sure has been considered) would eliminate your chronic injury problem at 5, but it won't make you faster, even if Metta or Caracter were to be thrown in, since you would have to replace Metta with starting speed (who?) and Caracter hardly played anyway.

Anyway, at least we're talking hoops, and that's a good thing.

bob

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Bob,

Shannon Brown didn't play under the triangle his whole career. But for the majority of it he has. I doubt Brown will be a Laker this year which I am not happy about.

LA has not yet picked up Caracter's contract for this season. Hoopshype says that he is under contract, but they are wrong. I doubt they will pick up his 2nd year contract. Walton might be amnestied or retire becaue of his back. Luke's dad (maybe you have heard of him) is hoping that Luke retires before he has permanent back problems. Maybe he and LA can work out a settlement. Even if LA has to waive him and pay him in full, I don't think he will be on the roster next year. As for Artest, I think he stays but he is now such an offensive liability. His game has deteriorated badly in 3 years. It would not surprise me in the least if Ron is the amnesty casualty if they bring in a new SF.

As for D12, I think it would take a package that would include Bynum and Odom. I think Orlando could do better with an LA Clippers package. If Dwight wants to come to the Lakers, he will probably be traded to them. NJ will probably lose Deron Williams and I can't see a team trading for D12 without a guarantee that he will re-sign a long term deal with them.

D12 would make LA much more athletic but not in the backcourt.

I can't see LA obsessing so much about money and the luxury tax with their alleged $150m/year TV contract kicking in next year.

Yes, good to talk hoops again!

TJ and Bob,

Thanks for the assessments.

Can either of you recall a point in time when fan of most teams in the NBA suffer from so much uncertainty about what's going to be happening in just about three weeks? I'm thinking that the changes in the CBA may separate the GM men from the boys much more than recent years when money could often compensate for marginal decisions.

Enjoy that heat, TJ, and enjoy....well just the whole area, Bob.

Sam

The latest in this sad, pathetic tale of unrequited love.

Celtics are, allegedly, offering New Orleans Rondo, Green, Avery Bradley and a top ten protected 1st round draft pick from the Clippers for CP3, and he doesn't even have to guarantee he'll sign with us. There's also talk about Davis somehow getting into this mix.

That's just plain mad-dog nuts.

Another rumor was Ainge offering Rondo for Stephen Curry of GSW. Straight up. Which GSW rejected. The idea here is that NO covets Curry and that by acquiring Curry Ainge could do a deal for CP3 more easily.

GSW turning down Rondo for Curry? WTF? Curry is a much better shooter (MUCH!) but Tim Kawakami, who covers the Warriors out here, has Curry on his All-NO defense team. Never been an all-star, never been all-defense, never has accomplished anything. It's all potential, with Curry so far and they turned down Rondo, who is an all-star and all-defense and a champion? Rondo has already achieved everything any player could ask for except the HOF.

Makes me wonder what NO and GSW think they're seeing in Rondo they don't like...

bob

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Regarding the Chris Paul rumors, that's ALL they are...rumors. Anything and everything can be said in a rumor, and I doubt the more outlandish trade schemes regarding Rondo are true.

Regarding Rondo's values as a point guard, he certainly earns his assists and is a pinpoint passer. His defense is better than most every other point guard in the NBA. The only valid knock against him is his shooting - sort of reminds me of the criticism against Tim Tebow. They say Tim can't throw, Rondo can't shoot. All they do is win.

Latest on Paul vis-a-vis Celtics:

He's not interested in them longterm because he thinks they're too old and they only have one year left.

Quite true, based upon the current roster, but Danny has been carefully structuring his contracts for a few years now in anticipation of the BIG free agent bonanza next year. LeBum was the big name last year, but there are more high-quality free agents coming available next season than last year and certainly this year.

Hard to sell Paul on a promise, when he has no history with you.

bob

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PAUL TO LA- ODOM AND BYNUM

It is gonna be Gasol and Odom to the Hornets it looks like.

I wonder where the Lakers are planning on finding some big men, they look awfully thin on bigs, only Bynum (and Caracter/Ebanks).

Lakers are looking at Josh McRoberts.
It looks like they might get an additional 9 days to utilize their Sasha Vujacic trade exception.
Maybe a sign and trade for Kris Humphries?

Obviously, this is a HUGE upgrade for the Lakers to their point guard corp. Considering their point guard corp was the worst in the league by far, that's not hard to do. Nevertheless, let's not diminish the impact that Paul could have on that team.

That's the good news (at least, for Laker fans).

The bad news is that one of the clear advantages the Lakers have had in recent years over every team in the league has been their height. On a lot more than a few occasions it was their Triple Towers crashing the offensive boards that won big games for them. Imagine Game 7 two years ago if they didn't have Gasol and Odom. Even without Perk, we would have clobbered them handily. They are sending two of their three towers to NO, leaving them with just the injury-prone Bynum.

If TJ is correct, and they are looking at Josh McRoberts, that does NOT fill the hole, not even the one left by Odom. McRoberts is a workman-like 6'10" forward with very limited offense.

The Lakers, in addition to having height over, well, just about everybody, also had two players that were very difficult to matchup with for just about every coach, Kobe and Odom. With Odom gone, that's gone. CP3 is a very difficult matchup, but you don't have to beat him, you just have to contain him. The only people that can contain Kobe and Odom are Kobe and Odom (granted, The Candy Man had his own disappearing act going at times).

If this deal had been Paul for Gasol or Odom, I'd be more upset, because they'd still have a formidable frontcourt and get the big backcourt upgrade.

Furthermore, did we really want to give up Rondo AND Green AND two 1st round picks for Paul, even if he wanted to sign with us longterm?

We still need a center. Or two. Let's focus on what we need and say good luck to the Lakers and their new look. For partisans that can't bring themselves to do that, then let's just focus on our needs.

bob

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tjmakz wrote:Lakers are looking at Josh McRoberts.
It looks like they might get an additional 9 days to utilize their Sasha Vujacic trade exception.
Maybe a sign and trade for Kris Humphries?

Just what Kris Humphries needs, a relo to LA. The Kardashians will put a hit out on him.

I am not so sure this is super for the Lakers either.

It might be good for the future but I do not see it being good for this season. Like you said their "thing" was their height and now they lost that.

Will be interesting to see what they find for bigs because they look to be scarce (dont the Celtics know it). Like someone pointed out before it is a league full of excellent point guard but excellent big men are scarce.

I would say the Celtics have a better match against the Lakers now than they did earlier in the season (before free agency). It would have been easier for the Lakers to find a decent point guard than it would be for the Celtics to match their (previous) front court.

If they do manage to trade Bynum for Howard though.... then it is pretty much game over.

Well I am happy that Paul will end up in LA.

I find it perplexing that DA would continue to pursue Paul after knowing that he did not want to come to Boston.

We will never get a straight answer out of Danny because he lies like a rug. Looking at the numbers, Paul average around 5 PPG more then Rondo so I guess we are suppose to believe that adding Paul would have given us a better chance to win the championship this year.

LA will be making a move to go after Howard now that Paul is coming on board and if that happens you can expect to see them in the championship particularly with Chandler bolting Dallas.

What to do what to do?

Is it possible that DA has already kept the big 3 together for one year too many?

Has Danny's pipe dream effected Jeff Green's desire to sign with Boston? What about baby?

And if one or both of those guys decides to play somewhere else for more money I cannot wait to hear Celtics fans ripping them apart as they do whenever a player goes soemwhere else or simply does not want to play for the Celtics. But we all know it is just business. There is no reason for any player on the Celtiocs to be loyal or give them a hometown discount because DA will trade them in a NY minute

What about the sometimes tempermental Rondo. How will he be effected by all of this? In the back of his mind he has to be thinking that DA is looking to move him

This could easily blow up in Danny's face.

I have no problem with DA trading anyone on the team but i sure hope he at least touched base with them (especially the big 4) before he went out their looking to wheel and deal.

One last thought. The lasting image that I have of Rondo is seeing him come back into the game after having his elbow bent the wrong way. Now that is something that no one has ever seen. For me it was a defining moment for who he is and how much he wants to help this team win. If DA was less than candid with Rondo after all that Rondo has given to the Celtics, there may be a lasting animosity from Rondo.

dboss

Still only one ball and 2 me ballers???

We shall see!

beat

Rumor has it that Okafor might be coming to LA in the Chris Paul trade.
That would give them another PF/C if that is true.

If that is true then the Hornets got gutted on all the talent they had.

The first deal with Odom/Gasol for Paul and then some switcharoo with Houston was a trade. If the Lakers get Paul AND Okafor then it is a steal.

Supposedly the deal is off, for now.

The other owners were supposedly irate about the "league owned" Hornets being allowed to trade away Paul and pushed Stern to do something about it.

This whole thing is a joke-they league has made a fool out of themselves, and the Lakers, Hornets, and even the Celtics. If they blocked the Lakers from making this trade, wouldn't the same thing have happened if Boston was making the trade?

Back to the drawing board.

I can certainly understand the concerns but if the trade meets fairness, then it should be made. Stern is an antiAmerican, control freak, dweeb and should be removed for the good of the game.