Travel call revised by NBA

Interesting article on NBA rule change.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4563546


Swish

Swish,

Thanks for that news. One of the best things about a message board, as opposed to a blog, is that the former tends to position ALL its members as vehicles for information-gathering and insights from a wide variety of sources. Your news tidbit is an example of the benefits of a forum COMMUNITY.

I guess the NBA is formalizing what has unofficially been sanctioned for years. Perhaps, if we all live long enough and the players grow to ten feet, it will be extended to three steps or measured in 10-yard increments. LOL.

I didn't know that Sid Borgia's son was the chief of referees. Sid, of course, was THE arch enemy of Red Auerbach back in the 50s and 60s. They'd go at one another hammer and tongs. And Sid wound up running, of all things, a flower shop in the old Barbizon Plaza Hotel on Central Park West in New York.

Thanks for the link.

Sam

Sam
I think that Borgia also ranked at the top of Johnny Most's "bad guy" list. I can still hear Most screaming " If the Celts just breath on Schayes, Borgia sends him to the free throw line". Of course, Schayes always ranked in the top 5 or so when it came to getting to the free throw line.
Swish

I think it'd be fair to say Red Auerbach would not be happy with this. Red was a purist. I wonder how'd he answer a question about Rondo palming the ball.

Red Auerbach was anti-flopping decades ago !!


Here's another one.

Red on Roundball Bill Russell

Nick, "Red on Roundball" was a great series. Your question is a good one, especially since Red had gone through the experience of winning championships (and becoming really friendly) with a PG whom he basically disliked at the outset.

I can almost hear Red saying in his Brooklynese, "I don't care if the guy stands on his head and spits nickels as long as we get to keep the nickels." Red cared very much about results rather than being worried about orthadox styles; and the Cousy situation had to have been very influential in shaping that philosophy.

Red also endured the jump shooting inconsistency of another hall-of-fame PG named K.C. Jones. But Red always focused on those aspects of a player's game that were special. He didn't expect all players to be stars at all phases of the game as long as their special contributions (roles) all fit together to produce an exceptional "whole."

But what Red never, never, never would have sat still for was a PG who was inconsistent from the foul line. Here comes Brooklyn again: "The guy's gonna have the ball in his hands at crunch time. Guys are gonna be foulin' him, testin' him. He's gotta hit those foul shots. End of story."

But, as you know, Red wouldn't just leave Rondo hanging out there with his problem. Red would find ways to motivate Rondo and to make Rondo internalize the urgency of solving that problem. More likely than not, Red would use the needs of the team as the motivating factor. Brooklyn again: "You see that guy over there? Had no clue about rebounding when he came here. He was this great scorer, and he thought that was enough. But we got plenny scoring. We needed rebounding. Now this guy knew he wasn't a great jumper and didn't have a lot of bulk. So he concentrated on helping his teammates become better rebounders by studying boxing out techniques and perfecting them. He found a way to fill our need. Now the need we need you to fill is to control the game. And, if you can't shoot free throws, you can't control the game at the end. So you damn well betta find a way to shoot free throws or you're gonna be 50% less useful all your basketball life. Easiest shot in the game, and you suck at it. Now, do you wanna go out on the court with me and learn how to do it, or do you wanna end up in some jerkwater place always lookin' over your shoulder?"

Something like that, anyway.

Sam

Sam:

What is your take on Bobby Knight?

I'm not Sam but my take on Bobby Knight begins with Red Auerbach as a template.

The best summary of Auerbach that I've come across comes form David Halberstam's book "The Breaks of the Game":

" He was brash and crafty and bullying, a man of equal parts character and con, high integrity and low craftiness. His ego was immense, but he used it as a force; he at once stepped on it, and stumbled over it, but he was never impaled by it."

Except for never getting impaled on his own ego, Halberstam could have been writing about Bobby Knight.

NickFaldo wrote:I think it'd be fair to say Red Auerbach would not be happy with this. Red was a purist. I wonder how'd he answer a question about Rondo palming the ball.

Red Auerbach was anti-flopping decades ago !!


Here's another one.

Red on Roundball Bill Russell

Cowens also hated flopping. I heard that he refused to teach it at his basketball camp.

Cowens graphically expressed his contempt for flopping against Mike Newlin, a pretty good shooting guard in his day. Newlin flopped and got the call on Cowens who howled to the refs in disbelief. So on the next possesion, Big Red puts his arms up like a football tackle blocking a pass rusher, runs at Newlin, and slams into him sending him sprawling off the court. Cowens then turned to the refs and said, "Now that's a f***kin' foul. The other one you called was a fake and you better f**kin' well call this one."

There's no place for cheating in sports. There's a big difference between pulling off the hidden ball trick with throwing a spit ball.

I could see Red maybe cutting Rondo some slack for palming based on the size of his hands. I gobbled up all the youtube videos I could find involving Red. That show Roundball was nice. On the Bill Russell one, Russ admitted to fouling I think MacAdoo. Red said never admit a foul. I'm not sure if he was playing around, but it didn't seem like it.

Just watching those few videos, it is obvious that Red was the best coach of all time, including Phil Jackson or anyone. John Wooden was great, but I am thinking of the NBA. He was telling Maravich that the fanciest pass in the world means nothing if it isn't caught. He went ove the science of blocking shots with Russell. That was incredible. Russell was a genius! Then we see in the Russell and Garnett interview how Russ told KG that he might have to put his arms around teammates' shoulders, not drag them, but bring them along. He said if KG played the way he should, that if he didn't win a title, he'd share one of his rings with him. He told KG he thought there would be two or three rings. Maybe that has something to do with KG predicting two straight titles are coming. I'm not sure I agree with KG, Sheed, and Pierce making brash predictions, but maybe what they are saying has been taken out of context. Or maybe it's not a bad thing if they deliver. Joe Namath got it done. Babe Ruth called that homerun to center and then got it done. Maybe the Laker trolls just have no knowledge of the Celtic's history. I admit they won the 80's war between Magic and Bird led teams. Maybe if the BDC had the kind of features this place and dslack's has along with real moderators, we'd all still be there. I also think at a certain point, there won't be much talk about what happened at the Globe. As Mooltrikon says, it looks like we are going to live happily ever after.

I almost forgot. In Red's last interview, he explained why certain people can't hit free throws. He said it was somewhat psychological. But then he put the emphasis on guys having big hands. Something like how it becomes like throwing a small ball into a small basket. In a similar vein, maybe Red would say Rondo doesn't necessarily palm the ball, but his hands make it look like it. Or maybe he'd have found a way to get Rondo to stop doing it without it hurting his ballhandling skills if the refs started calling him on it.

Carpecarpium- thanks for the Cowens' story. That sums this all up in a nutshell. It's not just about playing to win the game, it's about playing it the right way and having the refs in sync with that. Also in one of those Red videos, Auerbach talked about the concept of basketball clearly being a team game, and that's how Naismith must have envisioned it. Sorry if I've kind of now made a mish-mash of this post, but this is the kind of stuff I love reading about in a basketball forum.

Nick,

In one of the later Roundball segments (or it could have been another similar show), Red and Larry Bird were demonstatins something (I believe it was the pick and roll). (God, there goes Green-Ellis—sorry, off-topic).

Red made a point, and Larry flat-out disagreed with him. So they went back and forth on camera, and Red finally said, "Well, we always used to do it this way." And Larry responded with something like, "Well, now we do it that way."

So Red deferred to Larry. But he kept grumbling as Larry kept smiling. Maybe Red was just too frugal to waste any more film. But I think that little episode was evidence of Red's style. He was like a flex defense in football. He would bend on the little battles, but he would never break. And he would never lose the war.

Sam

Bob,

If it's "Red on Roundball," I have the entire series. I'll try to locate it.

Sam

mmm, strange that they would publicize it. soon, Lebron, Wade and co. will be getting away with 3 steps.

Rip,

During the game yesterday, Mike and Tommy were talking about four steps and then the possibility that a player could cover half the court without dribbling, passing or traveling. Somewhere, I saw a clip of Lebron taking a couple of steps, jump-stopping, then taking a couple more steps, and laying it in. Laughable.

Sam

The rule change to two steps is just going to lead players to take further license and liberty with as many given situations as are presented. If it's now legal to take two steps the average player will take three and the mega star will try to take four. I can see Lebron tucking the ball under his arm and plowing through the lane like a running back near the goal line. Who's going to take the charge? If Shaq's defender switches to double team Lebron, he just sends a wrap around or bounce pass, or lob to Shaq for the dunk. This will present a challenge for teams playing the Cavs. This sanctions Lebron's "Crab Dribble".-MD.

The thing that chaps my ass is there is one set of laws for the ghetto and another set entirely for the gated community.

There should be rules and laws enforced equally for everybody.

I almost quit watchnin hoop during Jordan because the games were called so laughably bad.

Game 6 of Lakers and Kings comes to mind.

The Kings were not going to win that game.

Ah well.

Jeb

Yet another example of when the rules don’t suit you, just get them changed. I am sure King James and his overlords at Nike petitioned the league for this change after the embarrassment of his “crab dribble” comments last seasons. Add to that Kobe, Dwayne Wade, CP3, Kevin Durant and the rest of the young bucks that never get traveling called on them, and you might as well make it 4 steps.

Sure the average player is more athletic than the players of yesteryear – but they also play by a completely different set of rules. No palming, now traveling, rarely get called for 3 seconds, they have 3 point shots, no more force outs and the list goes on and on.

I love basketball, and it is still my favorite sport to watch. But the game is becoming all about jump stops (which is a travel IMO), crossovers (a carry), and 3 step dunks. It doesn’t even resemble that game I played growing up.

mrkleen

I could not agree more.

Jeb