OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
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OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
WEEI 850AM
By Jerry Spar
Danny Ainge always will be invincible in his executive role for the Celtics, riding on the goodwill that he earned from serving as the architect of the 2007-08 championship team. Ainge is the man who effectively swapped Al Jefferson, Gerald Green, Ryan Gomes, Sebastian Telfair, Theo Ratliff, Delonte West, Wally Szczerbiak and three first-round draft picks for Kevin Garnett, Ray Allen and a second-round pick that turned into Glen “Big Baby” Davis.
Danny Ainge has kept the Celtics in contention since their 2008 championship, but he hasn't been able to assemble the complementary pieces to get another title. (AP)
Ainge earned the NBA’s Executive of the Year award for the 2007-08 season, and looking back, his acquisitions look just as good as they did when he received that distinction more than four years ago.
Ainge hit on just about every transaction that offseason. First, he made the trade for Allen on draft day for Jeff Green, West and Szczerbiak. The throw-in to the trade was Seattle’s second-round pick, Davis, who arguably has had a better career than Green.
Ainge’s entire offseason followed the same trend. He pulled off the Garnett trade on July 31, nearly depleting the C’s roster with the goal of building a team around Garnett, Allen, Paul Pierce and Rajon Rondo. Ainge began filling out the roster with complementary pieces such as Eddie House and James Posey that offseason. During the season, he acquired P.J. Brown and Sam Cassell, rounding out a championship roster from top to bottom.
Four-plus years after the Celtics’ championship run, Ainge has failed in repeating that feat with nearly the same exact core. Dissecting the president of basketball operations’ track record over the last four seasons, it is fair to say Ainge has missed more than he’s hit since the Celtics hoisted the championship trophy.
Let’s review.
2008-09 season: Ainge kicked off the Celtics’ bid to repeat as champions by drafting J.R. Giddens with the 30th pick of the 2008 draft. Giddens played 38 games in his NBA career, only six for the Celtics. Of course, picking at the bottom of the first round is never an exact science for an NBA general manager. That being said, Giddens was the 30th pick. The 31st pick was Nikola Pekovic, who is averaging 14.2 points and 7.5 rebounds for the Timberwolves this season. Picks 34 through 36 included Mario Chalmers by the Heat, DeAndre Jordan by the Clippers, and Omer Asik by the Trail Blazers. Chalmers was the starting point guard for the NBA champion Heat last season. Jordan is averaging 10.4 points, 10.6 rebounds and 2.5 blocks in his career. Asik is averaging 10.9 points and 12.1 rebounds this season for the Rockets.
That offseason, Ainge also re-signed Tony Allen, House and Cassell in an attempt to run it back with the same cast of characters. He did, however, let Posey walk when the forward accepted a four-year, $25 million offer from the Hornets. Finally, Ainge signed Darius Miles to a non-guaranteed contract and waived him before the start of the season.
After the trade deadline, Ainge acquired Stephon Marbury and Mikki Moore, hoping they’d provide a similar contribution to the one Brown made the previous season. Both players failed in that respect, and the Celtics fell to Orlando in the Eastern Conference semifinals.
The verdict: All in all, it was a below-average season for Ainge. Allen and House maintained their roles for the most part. Cassell didn’t make it through the season with the Celtics, getting traded to Sacramento. The good news for Ainge: Posey was overpaid by the Hornets, who later traded him to the Pacers, only to see him get amnestied by his new team.
2009-10 season: The offseason started with the Celtics drafting Lester Hudson with the 58th pick. Hudson didn’t pan out, but neither did any of the players drafted after him. The big offseason acquisition was Rasheed Wallace, who played an entire year out of shape for the C’s before making a positive contribution in the playoffs. Still, at the end of the year, Doc Rivers broke the news that Wallace was ready to retire, seemingly greasing the skids for the Celtics to get out from under the contract Ainge drafted for the big man. Wallace has since returned to the NBA, screaming “Ball don’t lie” in a Knicks uniform this season. Not the best use of Ainge’s mid-level exception. Ainge also signed Marquis Daniels to fill the James Posey role. We can all agree Daniels never filled that role.
That February, Ainge acquired Nate Robinson in a trade with the Knicks. Ainge’s post-deadline acquisition was Michael Finley. Neither Robinson nor Finley provided enough consistent support for a team that lost to the Lakers in the NBA finals.
The verdict: Ainge didn’t do enough to surround the Big Three in only their third season together. Wallace was a bust, Daniels wasn’t Posey, Robinson wasn’t House, and Finley wasn’t Brown.
2010-11 season: The offseason began for Ainge when he drafted Avery Bradley with the 19th pick in the 2010 draft. Ainge continued the offseason by choosing the direction for the long-term future by resigning Pierce to a four-year deal and Ray Allen to a two-year deal. Ainge also resigned Robinson and Daniels. In possibly the worst signing of the last five years, Ainge signed Jermaine O’Neal to the mid-level exception for two seasons. O’Neal played a total of 49 games in a Celtics uniform, never averaging more than 5.4 points per game. He earned his release before the playoffs in 2012 after expressing a desire to retire due to injuries. This year, he is back with the Suns, as a captain, averaging 8.2 points per game with a smile on his face.
Ainge also took a chance on Shaquille O’Neal at the age of 38, albeit for the short money of about $1.5 million per season. While you can’t criticize Ainge for taking a chance on Shaq for that money, you can rip him for trading his starting center, Kendrick Perkins, at the trade deadline, in hopes that Shaq would produce at the level of Perkins in a replacement role. To no one’s surprise, Shaq got hurt at midseason and played only 37 games for the Celtics before retiring.
Back to the Perkins trade: Ainge moved the team’s starting center and emotional leader for Green, who has yet to consistently demonstrate his value to the C’s. The Celtics had the best record in the NBA at the trade deadline when they moved Perkins for Green and Nenad Krstic. Even after acquiring non-factors Troy Murphy and Carlos Arroyo after the deadline, the Celtics lost to the Heat in the Eastern Conference semifinals.
The verdict: Ainge pushed his chips to the table before the season when he extended Pierce and Allen. He added to the pot when he signed aging veterans Shaquille O’Neal and Jermaine O’Neal. Then, for some reason, when his team was in the top spot in the NBA at the trade deadline, Ainge abandoned the short-term mission and traded Perkins for a long-term investment in Green. It’s a theme that has been consistent over the last five years: Ainge retains his greatest assets but fails in his attempt to surround his core players with quality complementary pieces. Drafting Bradley is arguably Ainge’s best acquisition since being promoted to president of basketball operations in 2008. However, the 2010-11 season is arguably Ainge’s worst in that role.
2011-12 season: The Celtics started the offseason by selecting MarShon Brooks and E’Twaun Moore in the draft. Ainge immediately moved Brooks to the Nets for JaJuan Johnson. Ainge then signed Marquis Daniels, Chris Wilcox and Greg Stiemsma to free agent contracts and traded for Keyon Dooling. Daniels was a bust last season, Wilcox was sidelined after a promising start due to a heart issue, and Stiemsma was a high-energy shot-blocker in limited minutes. Dooling was a reserve guard who retired at the end of the season.
Ainge also acquired Brandon Bass in a trade with Orlando for Glen Davis. The trade has worked for both sides. Bass is a starter in the frontcourt alongside Garnett. Davis is averaging 15.9 points and 8.4 rebounds for a struggling Magic team. Ainge also signed Mickael Pietrus to serve the James Posey role, although Pietrus never fully grasped the expectations of Ainge and Rivers.
The Celtics eventually lost to the Heat in the Eastern Conference finals.
The verdict: Ainge still didn’t do enough to complement the Big Three and his new best player, Rondo. His mission before the 2012-13 season was to add depth and scoring.
2012-13 season: Ainge had his most active draft in the new Big Three era, selecting Jared Sullinger, Fab Melo and Kris Joseph. Sullinger is the only one who has made a contribution this season, and the Ohio State product looks as if he could be a role player for years to come. Melo and Joseph are projects, and the odds are stacked against them in terms of making an impact while guys like Garnett and Pierce are still manning the floor. Ainge also re-signed Garnett, in a demonstration of his ability to maintain his biggest assets. Likewise, he also resigned Bass, who has continued to improve playing alongside Garnett, Pierce and Rondo. Ainge replaced Ray Allen with Jason Terry — a move that can’t be judged until the conclusion of this season. It appears as if Ainge could have signed both Allen and Terry if he made a harder push for Allen, but there is a question as to whether bringing back Allen would have been good for Rondo’s growth as a player and leader. Time will tell on that. There aren’t many early signs that Rondo is eager to take on more of a leadership role in the absence of Allen.
Ainge also traded for Courtney Lee, who should be a solid fourth guard in the rotation once Avery Bradley returns. Ainge retained Wilcox and signed Leandro Barbosa. Both players could fill roles late in the season. The biggest question mark in Ainge’s offseason is the four-year, $32 million contract he gave Jeff Green. After not playing basketball at all last season, Green is now the Celtics’ fourth-highest-paid player behind Pierce, Garnett and Rondo. Yet, on Wednesday night against Minnesota, when Green found himself in the fortunate position of being matched up against 5-foot-8 J.J. Barea on the offensive end, the well-paid Celtic struggled. The 6-foot-9 forward gathered the ball, recognized he was being guard by a player a foot smaller than him, put down a few dribbles, and tried to spin toward the basket by running through the smaller guard. Barea flopped and received the call for an offensive foul. Green could only salute Barea for outsmarting him, prompting Rivers to make a substitution for Green. You could almost see Rivers explain to Green that when he has a similar mismatch, there are two options: Shoot over the smaller player, or back him down to the basket until Green has a layup. As Rivers struggled to get through to Ainge’s biggest blind spot, all anyone could wonder is, “Is Danny Ainge getting in Doc’s way?”
112288
By Jerry Spar
Danny Ainge always will be invincible in his executive role for the Celtics, riding on the goodwill that he earned from serving as the architect of the 2007-08 championship team. Ainge is the man who effectively swapped Al Jefferson, Gerald Green, Ryan Gomes, Sebastian Telfair, Theo Ratliff, Delonte West, Wally Szczerbiak and three first-round draft picks for Kevin Garnett, Ray Allen and a second-round pick that turned into Glen “Big Baby” Davis.
Danny Ainge has kept the Celtics in contention since their 2008 championship, but he hasn't been able to assemble the complementary pieces to get another title. (AP)
Ainge earned the NBA’s Executive of the Year award for the 2007-08 season, and looking back, his acquisitions look just as good as they did when he received that distinction more than four years ago.
Ainge hit on just about every transaction that offseason. First, he made the trade for Allen on draft day for Jeff Green, West and Szczerbiak. The throw-in to the trade was Seattle’s second-round pick, Davis, who arguably has had a better career than Green.
Ainge’s entire offseason followed the same trend. He pulled off the Garnett trade on July 31, nearly depleting the C’s roster with the goal of building a team around Garnett, Allen, Paul Pierce and Rajon Rondo. Ainge began filling out the roster with complementary pieces such as Eddie House and James Posey that offseason. During the season, he acquired P.J. Brown and Sam Cassell, rounding out a championship roster from top to bottom.
Four-plus years after the Celtics’ championship run, Ainge has failed in repeating that feat with nearly the same exact core. Dissecting the president of basketball operations’ track record over the last four seasons, it is fair to say Ainge has missed more than he’s hit since the Celtics hoisted the championship trophy.
Let’s review.
2008-09 season: Ainge kicked off the Celtics’ bid to repeat as champions by drafting J.R. Giddens with the 30th pick of the 2008 draft. Giddens played 38 games in his NBA career, only six for the Celtics. Of course, picking at the bottom of the first round is never an exact science for an NBA general manager. That being said, Giddens was the 30th pick. The 31st pick was Nikola Pekovic, who is averaging 14.2 points and 7.5 rebounds for the Timberwolves this season. Picks 34 through 36 included Mario Chalmers by the Heat, DeAndre Jordan by the Clippers, and Omer Asik by the Trail Blazers. Chalmers was the starting point guard for the NBA champion Heat last season. Jordan is averaging 10.4 points, 10.6 rebounds and 2.5 blocks in his career. Asik is averaging 10.9 points and 12.1 rebounds this season for the Rockets.
That offseason, Ainge also re-signed Tony Allen, House and Cassell in an attempt to run it back with the same cast of characters. He did, however, let Posey walk when the forward accepted a four-year, $25 million offer from the Hornets. Finally, Ainge signed Darius Miles to a non-guaranteed contract and waived him before the start of the season.
After the trade deadline, Ainge acquired Stephon Marbury and Mikki Moore, hoping they’d provide a similar contribution to the one Brown made the previous season. Both players failed in that respect, and the Celtics fell to Orlando in the Eastern Conference semifinals.
The verdict: All in all, it was a below-average season for Ainge. Allen and House maintained their roles for the most part. Cassell didn’t make it through the season with the Celtics, getting traded to Sacramento. The good news for Ainge: Posey was overpaid by the Hornets, who later traded him to the Pacers, only to see him get amnestied by his new team.
2009-10 season: The offseason started with the Celtics drafting Lester Hudson with the 58th pick. Hudson didn’t pan out, but neither did any of the players drafted after him. The big offseason acquisition was Rasheed Wallace, who played an entire year out of shape for the C’s before making a positive contribution in the playoffs. Still, at the end of the year, Doc Rivers broke the news that Wallace was ready to retire, seemingly greasing the skids for the Celtics to get out from under the contract Ainge drafted for the big man. Wallace has since returned to the NBA, screaming “Ball don’t lie” in a Knicks uniform this season. Not the best use of Ainge’s mid-level exception. Ainge also signed Marquis Daniels to fill the James Posey role. We can all agree Daniels never filled that role.
That February, Ainge acquired Nate Robinson in a trade with the Knicks. Ainge’s post-deadline acquisition was Michael Finley. Neither Robinson nor Finley provided enough consistent support for a team that lost to the Lakers in the NBA finals.
The verdict: Ainge didn’t do enough to surround the Big Three in only their third season together. Wallace was a bust, Daniels wasn’t Posey, Robinson wasn’t House, and Finley wasn’t Brown.
2010-11 season: The offseason began for Ainge when he drafted Avery Bradley with the 19th pick in the 2010 draft. Ainge continued the offseason by choosing the direction for the long-term future by resigning Pierce to a four-year deal and Ray Allen to a two-year deal. Ainge also resigned Robinson and Daniels. In possibly the worst signing of the last five years, Ainge signed Jermaine O’Neal to the mid-level exception for two seasons. O’Neal played a total of 49 games in a Celtics uniform, never averaging more than 5.4 points per game. He earned his release before the playoffs in 2012 after expressing a desire to retire due to injuries. This year, he is back with the Suns, as a captain, averaging 8.2 points per game with a smile on his face.
Ainge also took a chance on Shaquille O’Neal at the age of 38, albeit for the short money of about $1.5 million per season. While you can’t criticize Ainge for taking a chance on Shaq for that money, you can rip him for trading his starting center, Kendrick Perkins, at the trade deadline, in hopes that Shaq would produce at the level of Perkins in a replacement role. To no one’s surprise, Shaq got hurt at midseason and played only 37 games for the Celtics before retiring.
Back to the Perkins trade: Ainge moved the team’s starting center and emotional leader for Green, who has yet to consistently demonstrate his value to the C’s. The Celtics had the best record in the NBA at the trade deadline when they moved Perkins for Green and Nenad Krstic. Even after acquiring non-factors Troy Murphy and Carlos Arroyo after the deadline, the Celtics lost to the Heat in the Eastern Conference semifinals.
The verdict: Ainge pushed his chips to the table before the season when he extended Pierce and Allen. He added to the pot when he signed aging veterans Shaquille O’Neal and Jermaine O’Neal. Then, for some reason, when his team was in the top spot in the NBA at the trade deadline, Ainge abandoned the short-term mission and traded Perkins for a long-term investment in Green. It’s a theme that has been consistent over the last five years: Ainge retains his greatest assets but fails in his attempt to surround his core players with quality complementary pieces. Drafting Bradley is arguably Ainge’s best acquisition since being promoted to president of basketball operations in 2008. However, the 2010-11 season is arguably Ainge’s worst in that role.
2011-12 season: The Celtics started the offseason by selecting MarShon Brooks and E’Twaun Moore in the draft. Ainge immediately moved Brooks to the Nets for JaJuan Johnson. Ainge then signed Marquis Daniels, Chris Wilcox and Greg Stiemsma to free agent contracts and traded for Keyon Dooling. Daniels was a bust last season, Wilcox was sidelined after a promising start due to a heart issue, and Stiemsma was a high-energy shot-blocker in limited minutes. Dooling was a reserve guard who retired at the end of the season.
Ainge also acquired Brandon Bass in a trade with Orlando for Glen Davis. The trade has worked for both sides. Bass is a starter in the frontcourt alongside Garnett. Davis is averaging 15.9 points and 8.4 rebounds for a struggling Magic team. Ainge also signed Mickael Pietrus to serve the James Posey role, although Pietrus never fully grasped the expectations of Ainge and Rivers.
The Celtics eventually lost to the Heat in the Eastern Conference finals.
The verdict: Ainge still didn’t do enough to complement the Big Three and his new best player, Rondo. His mission before the 2012-13 season was to add depth and scoring.
2012-13 season: Ainge had his most active draft in the new Big Three era, selecting Jared Sullinger, Fab Melo and Kris Joseph. Sullinger is the only one who has made a contribution this season, and the Ohio State product looks as if he could be a role player for years to come. Melo and Joseph are projects, and the odds are stacked against them in terms of making an impact while guys like Garnett and Pierce are still manning the floor. Ainge also re-signed Garnett, in a demonstration of his ability to maintain his biggest assets. Likewise, he also resigned Bass, who has continued to improve playing alongside Garnett, Pierce and Rondo. Ainge replaced Ray Allen with Jason Terry — a move that can’t be judged until the conclusion of this season. It appears as if Ainge could have signed both Allen and Terry if he made a harder push for Allen, but there is a question as to whether bringing back Allen would have been good for Rondo’s growth as a player and leader. Time will tell on that. There aren’t many early signs that Rondo is eager to take on more of a leadership role in the absence of Allen.
Ainge also traded for Courtney Lee, who should be a solid fourth guard in the rotation once Avery Bradley returns. Ainge retained Wilcox and signed Leandro Barbosa. Both players could fill roles late in the season. The biggest question mark in Ainge’s offseason is the four-year, $32 million contract he gave Jeff Green. After not playing basketball at all last season, Green is now the Celtics’ fourth-highest-paid player behind Pierce, Garnett and Rondo. Yet, on Wednesday night against Minnesota, when Green found himself in the fortunate position of being matched up against 5-foot-8 J.J. Barea on the offensive end, the well-paid Celtic struggled. The 6-foot-9 forward gathered the ball, recognized he was being guard by a player a foot smaller than him, put down a few dribbles, and tried to spin toward the basket by running through the smaller guard. Barea flopped and received the call for an offensive foul. Green could only salute Barea for outsmarting him, prompting Rivers to make a substitution for Green. You could almost see Rivers explain to Green that when he has a similar mismatch, there are two options: Shoot over the smaller player, or back him down to the basket until Green has a layup. As Rivers struggled to get through to Ainge’s biggest blind spot, all anyone could wonder is, “Is Danny Ainge getting in Doc’s way?”
112288
112288- Posts : 7855
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
Such a bunch of hogwash
we were 2 knee injuries away from 3 in a row. Yet no mention of that.
Harder push for allen??? really when Allen chose to take millions less??
beat
we were 2 knee injuries away from 3 in a row. Yet no mention of that.
Harder push for allen??? really when Allen chose to take millions less??
beat
beat- Posts : 7032
Join date : 2009-10-13
Age : 71
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
beat,
I agree on the hogwash comment. It looks like the author has an axe to grind. The season reviews are incomplete (by design?) and each "verdict" rings hollow because of said incompleteness.
One thing that he fails to mention (other than the knee injuries that you mentioned) is how much the lockout affected the Celtic roster. If it had been a normal off-season leading up to a normal regular season, would Nenad Krstic have left for Europe? Having Nenad under contract for multiple seasons would have helped fill a big hole on our roster. He was ours to sign and IMO, Danny would have signed him.
Another thing he fails to mention are the two heart surgeries that took two rotation players off our roster last season.
I'm not impressed with Jerry Spar.
gyso
I agree on the hogwash comment. It looks like the author has an axe to grind. The season reviews are incomplete (by design?) and each "verdict" rings hollow because of said incompleteness.
One thing that he fails to mention (other than the knee injuries that you mentioned) is how much the lockout affected the Celtic roster. If it had been a normal off-season leading up to a normal regular season, would Nenad Krstic have left for Europe? Having Nenad under contract for multiple seasons would have helped fill a big hole on our roster. He was ours to sign and IMO, Danny would have signed him.
Another thing he fails to mention are the two heart surgeries that took two rotation players off our roster last season.
I'm not impressed with Jerry Spar.
gyso
_________________
gyso- Posts : 23027
Join date : 2009-10-13
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
I agree with beat. This is crap.
Ignore the salary cap, it has no relevance in how a GM makes decisions and who they can acquire. Right? Crap.
JON played like crap and lost the respect of his own teammates because he couldn't/wouldn't play with any pain at all. So, now he's happy with the Suns? Not as happy I am he's with the Suns.
Did Danny pass on DeAndre Jordan etal? Sure, but how many other GMs did too? When was the last time we had a high draft pick, where we could be reasonably sure we were going to get our value's worth? Oh yeah, that would have been in the year he won Exec of the Year for trading that pick to Seattle as part of the Ray Allen trade. How about picking up Rondo for a song from Phoenix? How about picking Leon Powe for a cash from Denver? How about taking Sully instead of Perry Jones III or Andrew Nicholson? Crap.
It's Danny's fault Perk blew his knee out in game 6? It's Danny's fault that KG had a bone spur the size of a walnut under his kneecap? It's Danny's fault that Ray Allen didn't get along with Rondo and wanted to leave for less money? Why not blame Doc because he didn't take a more pro-active role in resolving the Rondo/Allen feud? Because that detracts from the crap he's flinging against the wall, that's why.
The only point that he makes that I can find some substance with is the Jeff Green contract. That contract puts a lot of pressure on the team because of its impact on the salary cap. We're only 18 games into the season. I've been on Jeff Green as much, or more, than anybody else on this board but even I realize that it's still early to start throwing dirt on his entire season. It's one thing to learn the plays and the system and even do skeletons, it's quite another to get out onto the floor and play it and Jeff Green didn't play at all last year. He's talking about Green's struggle against Barea? How about Rondo's struggle against Barea? Is Rondo another one of Danny's goofs? Green's problem isn't talent, it's consistency. He's had a few good games, the question is "can he sustain that level of effort and production?" Is the Perk trade looking bad right now, with Krstic in Moscow and Jeff Green struggling? Yeah, it does, but as Yogi said "it ain't over 'til it's over" and this maronsky's agitprop is nothing but a premature ejaculation. As Sam always says "see me in April" (my apologies to Sam for putting a Sam-ism in the same breath as a Yogi-ism, but I came to a prosaic fork in the road, so I took it).
This is why I love bar stools. They let you prop your feet up so the brown flow doesn't get all over your Nikes.
bob
.
Ignore the salary cap, it has no relevance in how a GM makes decisions and who they can acquire. Right? Crap.
JON played like crap and lost the respect of his own teammates because he couldn't/wouldn't play with any pain at all. So, now he's happy with the Suns? Not as happy I am he's with the Suns.
Did Danny pass on DeAndre Jordan etal? Sure, but how many other GMs did too? When was the last time we had a high draft pick, where we could be reasonably sure we were going to get our value's worth? Oh yeah, that would have been in the year he won Exec of the Year for trading that pick to Seattle as part of the Ray Allen trade. How about picking up Rondo for a song from Phoenix? How about picking Leon Powe for a cash from Denver? How about taking Sully instead of Perry Jones III or Andrew Nicholson? Crap.
It's Danny's fault Perk blew his knee out in game 6? It's Danny's fault that KG had a bone spur the size of a walnut under his kneecap? It's Danny's fault that Ray Allen didn't get along with Rondo and wanted to leave for less money? Why not blame Doc because he didn't take a more pro-active role in resolving the Rondo/Allen feud? Because that detracts from the crap he's flinging against the wall, that's why.
The only point that he makes that I can find some substance with is the Jeff Green contract. That contract puts a lot of pressure on the team because of its impact on the salary cap. We're only 18 games into the season. I've been on Jeff Green as much, or more, than anybody else on this board but even I realize that it's still early to start throwing dirt on his entire season. It's one thing to learn the plays and the system and even do skeletons, it's quite another to get out onto the floor and play it and Jeff Green didn't play at all last year. He's talking about Green's struggle against Barea? How about Rondo's struggle against Barea? Is Rondo another one of Danny's goofs? Green's problem isn't talent, it's consistency. He's had a few good games, the question is "can he sustain that level of effort and production?" Is the Perk trade looking bad right now, with Krstic in Moscow and Jeff Green struggling? Yeah, it does, but as Yogi said "it ain't over 'til it's over" and this maronsky's agitprop is nothing but a premature ejaculation. As Sam always says "see me in April" (my apologies to Sam for putting a Sam-ism in the same breath as a Yogi-ism, but I came to a prosaic fork in the road, so I took it).
This is why I love bar stools. They let you prop your feet up so the brown flow doesn't get all over your Nikes.
bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62620
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
bob too bad your so damn far away, you'd be a great guy to watch a game and have a few brews with, when you gonna visit Flushing again?
cowens/oldschool- Posts : 27706
Join date : 2009-10-18
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
i'm with ya'll.
yr 1- we win it all
yr 2- got close without KG, im satisfied with the parts we had, a non injured KG and its 2 in a row baby
yr 3.. only Perk's knee in game 6 cost us a title
yr 4- the team let itself down vs the heat- but the peices where there- trading Perk was a bad idea
yr 5- bad calls, lack of heart in game 6 (vs heat) cost us what could have been 4th title in 5 yrs
yr 6- I still think the right peices are there, but its a long way to june..
D/A aint been perfect in his draft picks, and he's signed a bum player or two as well, but is he a problem? any non Celtic Fan would be terribly pleased to have had their team the reigning division champs five yrs in a row, and having made it to the ecf's 3 times in the same period, twice going to the finals.. well most teams would be proud of that.
of course, we hold ourselves to a higher standard, but Danny has still proven himself to be a near genius as the C's GM.. injuries, not Decisions by a GM have cost us more titles- and thats just the nature of the game.
yr 1- we win it all
yr 2- got close without KG, im satisfied with the parts we had, a non injured KG and its 2 in a row baby
yr 3.. only Perk's knee in game 6 cost us a title
yr 4- the team let itself down vs the heat- but the peices where there- trading Perk was a bad idea
yr 5- bad calls, lack of heart in game 6 (vs heat) cost us what could have been 4th title in 5 yrs
yr 6- I still think the right peices are there, but its a long way to june..
D/A aint been perfect in his draft picks, and he's signed a bum player or two as well, but is he a problem? any non Celtic Fan would be terribly pleased to have had their team the reigning division champs five yrs in a row, and having made it to the ecf's 3 times in the same period, twice going to the finals.. well most teams would be proud of that.
of course, we hold ourselves to a higher standard, but Danny has still proven himself to be a near genius as the C's GM.. injuries, not Decisions by a GM have cost us more titles- and thats just the nature of the game.
Matty- Posts : 4562
Join date : 2009-10-18
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
cowens/oldschool wrote:bob too bad your so damn far away, you'd be a great guy to watch a game and have a few brews with, when you gonna visit Flushing again?
cow,
No immediate plans to head back to the tundra, but it may come up. We're trying to sell the family house and, if the deal happens, I might be popping back to help empty it out etc.
If that happens I will make a post on the board to let everybody know I'll be in the vicinity ("vicinity" defined as a 200 mile radius) and would be VERY happy to get to together with any or all for a brewski. It'd be great to see you again, cow.
On another note, is Teddy Bruschi (pronounced "Brewski") the best name for a football player ever, or what? How can you not love a player named "Brewski"? Great personal story too.
bob
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bobheckler- Posts : 62620
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
Yea lets blame danny. Ha...
Great posts particularly Bob's
Dboss
Great posts particularly Bob's
Dboss
dboss- Posts : 19220
Join date : 2009-11-01
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
Season 4 - Dwayne Wade cripples Rondo. That wasn't Danny's doing.
Big Al, Rondo, AB, Bass, KG, Ray Allen, Big Baby, JET, Lee - Seems like apretty good string of pickups to me.
Big Al, Rondo, AB, Bass, KG, Ray Allen, Big Baby, JET, Lee - Seems like apretty good string of pickups to me.
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
Who the hell is Jerry Spar? As nearly as I can determine, he's just a guy who reports brief news tidbits (without analysis) on a WEEI website.
This guy is as selective as it gets. Whether or not one liked the trade, how can one tell the Kendrick Perkins story without bringing up the fact that the Celtics stood a great chance of losing him for nothing at the end of that season.
He has a technique of damning any good move Danny made with faint praise For example, "Stiemsma was a high-energy shoot-blocker in limited minutes." Hey moron, Danny essentially made something out of nothing. That's a good thing, right, LUSA?
When I read this, it almost ruined my Aruba vacation. I had to have several stiff drinks to get me back in shape. I'm oklaye now.
Sam
This guy is as selective as it gets. Whether or not one liked the trade, how can one tell the Kendrick Perkins story without bringing up the fact that the Celtics stood a great chance of losing him for nothing at the end of that season.
He has a technique of damning any good move Danny made with faint praise For example, "Stiemsma was a high-energy shoot-blocker in limited minutes." Hey moron, Danny essentially made something out of nothing. That's a good thing, right, LUSA?
When I read this, it almost ruined my Aruba vacation. I had to have several stiff drinks to get me back in shape. I'm oklaye now.
Sam
Last edited by sam on Sun Dec 09, 2012 9:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
If Danny had drafted DeAndre Jordan then the Perk loss wouldn't have been so bad, in Shaqs book he says Danny simply didn't want to pay Perk all that money, then he gives the same amount to Jeff Green, how Green plays out this season will obviously determine who got the better deal, Perk is a valuable role player, he can defend that paint and neutralize any post up. I don't blame him for Thunders failure in Finals, refs gave every call to Heat and James Harden completely disappeared. I wish more people blamed Perk, if he ever got amnestied I'd love to get him back.
cowens/oldschool- Posts : 27706
Join date : 2009-10-18
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
Matty wrote:i'm with ya'll.
yr 1- we win it all
yr 2- got close without KG, im satisfied with the parts we had, a non injured KG and its 2 in a row baby
yr 3.. only Perk's knee in game 6 cost us a title
yr 4- the team let itself down vs the heat- but the peices where there- trading Perk was a bad idea
yr 5- bad calls, lack of heart in game 6 (vs heat) cost us what could have been 4th title in 5 yrs
yr 6- I still think the right peices are there, but its a long way to june..
D/A aint been perfect in his draft picks, and he's signed a bum player or two as well, but is he a problem? any non Celtic Fan would be terribly pleased to have had their team the reigning division champs five yrs in a row, and having made it to the ecf's 3 times in the same period, twice going to the finals.. well most teams would be proud of that.
of course, we hold ourselves to a higher standard, but Danny has still proven himself to be a near genius as the C's GM.. injuries, not Decisions by a GM have cost us more titles- and thats just the nature of the game.
I'll go with Matty here; he's got it right.
It's impossible to be perfect, and I'd even go as far as to say when it comes to the draft, Danny has been a bottom performer overall. Yet despite that he's managed to pick up the pieces to build a roster that has continuously contended, and better still managed to trade some of those awful picks for decent value. To be fair, and grateful, we haven't exactly had lottery picks since '07 either.
If the writer's real bone to pick is the current state of the team, that's hardly Ainge's fault. We've got the players, it's just a different makeup now and we still haven't figured out how to use it; as a matter of fact we could be using our marquee player differently and better. If anything blame Doc there, and I'm not about to fire him either. We need another big, preferably a high impact power forward. Let's blame Danny because those don't happen to be lying around by the dozen.
The article opens up a debate; just not a very strong one.
NYCelt- Posts : 10794
Join date : 2009-10-12
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
This guy is an idiot. Sure, lay the blame on Danny. Preseason they were lauding Danny and all of the moves he made, now this guy comes from out of no where and wants to nail him to the cross. I wish there was more intelligence in journalism than this guy shows or alot of the other naysayers.
I can't even finish the article it is so ridiculous.
Rosalie
I can't even finish the article it is so ridiculous.
Rosalie
RosalieTCeltics- Posts : 41267
Join date : 2009-10-17
Age : 77
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
Its a long season, Jeff Green is just hitting his stride, guy has skills and athleticism, Avery Bradley will be back, just his defense will make Rondo better. Sully just figuring it out on the fly too, he may be who we want him to be, Lee has athleticism to contribute more. Why someone would write such a negative article after just 20 games and with a key piece yet to step on the floor?
cowens/oldschool- Posts : 27706
Join date : 2009-10-18
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
I am really becoming a Jeff Green fan. As I have said before, I think the kid is so talented. Just everyone, take a breath, and give him a chance. I think we will all be pleasantly surprised.
cow-It is amazing, I truly believe there a bunch of guys just like this guy, waiting to pounce if the Celtics falter at all. For some reason, it appears they
have become the team these guys love to hate.
Rosalie
cow-It is amazing, I truly believe there a bunch of guys just like this guy, waiting to pounce if the Celtics falter at all. For some reason, it appears they
have become the team these guys love to hate.
Rosalie
RosalieTCeltics- Posts : 41267
Join date : 2009-10-17
Age : 77
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
Rosalie,
It's been that way ever since the Celtics joined the NBA. Envy and jealousy would be the most dominant emotions in the NBA except that greed probably edges them out. Why should anything change now?
Sam
It's been that way ever since the Celtics joined the NBA. Envy and jealousy would be the most dominant emotions in the NBA except that greed probably edges them out. Why should anything change now?
Sam
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
As Sam said, Jerry who?
There are 30 teams in the NBA, and at least 25 of them would love to have the results, including a championship, that the Celtics have had the last 5 years.
It is so easy to look at past drafts and determine how the order should have been. It is a tad tougher to determine the order ahead of time.
Jerry Spar's opinion isn't worth the crust on my underwear.
There are 30 teams in the NBA, and at least 25 of them would love to have the results, including a championship, that the Celtics have had the last 5 years.
It is so easy to look at past drafts and determine how the order should have been. It is a tad tougher to determine the order ahead of time.
Jerry Spar's opinion isn't worth the crust on my underwear.
_________________
Two in a row sounds good to me!
bobc33- Posts : 13892
Join date : 2009-10-16
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
RosalieTCeltics wrote:I am really becoming a Jeff Green fan. As I have said before, I think the kid is so talented. Just everyone, take a breath, and give him a chance. I think we will all be pleasantly surprised.
cow-It is amazing, I truly believe there a bunch of guys just like this guy, waiting to pounce if the Celtics falter at all. For some reason, it appears they
have become the team these guys love to hate.
Rosalie
yeah we've all got to be glad were starting to see some serious production out of Jeff Green, I can't imagine how painful it must be to go through open heart surgery, thank god hes still very young at an age where hes a fast healer. There are times I see him play and think he can do more than Danny Granger, more than Luol Deng and as much as Rudy Gay....thats the skill set that he has, then I'm befuddled that he lays an egg, passing up shots. I like him on the wing, just give him the ball, let him pop in the defenders face or use his talents and drive, hes got that kind of ability, he is super fast, just gotta get him the ball, let him get used to working and grinding. Hes making great strides in making his move and taking on the contact, if he can get this down, we've got a legit replacement for Pierce in the making....thats the one quality that makes Carmelo Anthony and Pierce a beast.
cowens/oldschool- Posts : 27706
Join date : 2009-10-18
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
To an extent, Danny's short term reputation rides with Jeff Green this year, and barring injury I think both are going to look good. We know what we had with Perk, a beast but with shortcomings he'll likely never overcome. So far, I like what I see from Green most nights, so much I'd like to see him start.
hawksnestbeach- Posts : 589
Join date : 2012-03-12
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
The Celtics have always been the poor relations in Boston sports. It wasn't until Bird came along that they started to sell tickets and get ratings. In fact, if Bird was the GM right now and not Danny, this guy would be falling all over himself with praise. It was 22 years of frustration until Danny came along. What about bringing Doc on board? He should get a little credit for that.
Last year's team stumbled out of the gate, but finished strong. It takes time to build a defensive juggernaut and one key ingredient is still a month away. It's a lot of pressure on Avery Bradley's slender, surgically-repaired shoulders, but his brand of defense is contagious to teammates and frightening to opponents.
These guys are slowly learning how to play together. Each game they get a little better. Doc is slowly learning who plays best with whom and who should get what minutes and when.
There hasn't been anything in the media, but Jeff Green's heart issue has been a concern this year. Doc mentioned it a couple of weeks ago and admitted that he was being very careful with both Green and Wilcox. He also said it's been on both their minds, too.
Until Green came here, he had to find a way to play in a system built around Kevin Durant. One of his most impressive skills, the ability to run the floor and finish on the break, is almost certainly what Danny drools over. He's also learning to play that frenetic, KG/AB-style defense, something that needs to be learned one mistake at a time, but anyone can see he's making strides.
This article is a good argument to chill out. Anyone criticizing this team now is going to seem like an idiot when it all comes together.
rickdavisakaspike- Posts : 400
Join date : 2010-08-30
Re: OPINION: IS DANNY AINGE THE PROBLEM?
If 3 or 4 years, when KG and Pierce are a memory - it will be this second core that DA built - Rondo, Green, Lee, Bradley, Joseph - who will bring the Celtics into the future.
mrkleen09- Posts : 3873
Join date : 2009-10-16
Age : 55
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