Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

by **k_j_88** Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:03 pm

http://www.celticsblog.com/2013/6/21/4453020/rumor-paul-pierce-to-cavs-for-2nd-round-picks-31-33

http://www.foxsportsohio.com/nba/cleveland-cavaliers/story/NBA-Report-Interest-strong-at-lottery-to?blockID=914065&feedID=3725
Moving Pierce would certainly make sense in a trade as opposed to cutting him.

by **worcester** Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:34 pm

I like it. Al ot. Paul will get to play an important role for a young team. We'll get two near to first round picks. We'll dump a big salary load. Danny will have negotiating chips and cap room. That's what he needs to make us a contender again.

by **mulcogiseng** Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:49 pm

finally some rumors about PP, bout time

by **bobheckler** Fri Jun 21, 2013 7:28 pm

Huh?

$15M worth of contract for $0?

Can you do that?

bob

.

by **swish** Fri Jun 21, 2013 7:48 pm

Bob,

The Cavs will be about 24 mil under the cap so 15 mil will fit easily.
Swish

by **NYCelt** Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:07 am

Interesting. That would probably clear KG off the books too, if he holds to his statement he would retire should Pierce go (if KG is still a Celtic).

by **worcester** Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:22 am

I'd offer KG a job as player/coach, but he probably would decline.

by **worcester** Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:34 am

I'd offer KG a job as player/coach, but he probably would decline.

by **mrkleen09** Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:02 am

when was the last time a second round draft pick made any impact at all with the Celtics?

Hell, when was the last time a team traded an 18/9 guy 0 ?

Pierce for Varejao maybe. But for two late picks? Not seeing this one

Sounds like a fire sale more than a calculated deal.

by **swish** Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:01 pm

mrkleen
Fire sale it is. Also known as discarding age and salary as part of a shift to a rebuild mode with youth and salary cap space the priority.

Swish

by **bobheckler** Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:09 pm

worcester wrote:I'd offer KG a job as player/coach, but he probably would decline.

worcester,

Player coaches are not allowed, per the CBA.

bob

.

by **worcester** Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:11 pm

Thanks for the info Bob.

by **KennCelt** Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:23 pm

This could be the week we find out if all this talk about trades of PP and KG is real. Are they really interested in moving to another team or will they retire? This may be the week where the Celtics start major renovations of their team or will they try to hold pat and just get into the playoffs. There are a lot of questions including how will Rondo and Jared recover from their injuries and how quickly? I'm looking forward to answers sooner rather than later, but these issues can't be choreographed.

by **bobheckler** Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:53 pm

KennCelt wrote:This could be the week we find out if all this talk about trades of PP and KG is real. Are they really interested in moving to another team or will they retire? This may be the week where the Celtics start major renovations of their team or will they try to hold pat and just get into the playoffs. There are a lot of questions including how will Rondo and Jared recover from their injuries and how quickly? I'm looking forward to answers sooner rather than later, but these issues can't be choreographed.

KennCelt,

Boy, are there EVER a lot of questions that need to be answered. Management is in a complete state of flux here, both on themselves as well as the players. I saw a comment on another blog that said "when did we turn into the Knicks?".

It could happen this week before the draft, it could happen at the draft, Ray Allen was traded on draft day, 2008 or it could happen soon afterwards. It could happen after 7/1, when free agents can be signed. Sign-and-trades or other combinations using the draft picks just selected. In other words, there are numerous reasons why it may or may not happen this week, but Danny almost definitely has stuff brewing. This is NOT a tenable status quo.

It's about to get very interesting here on Celtics Planet over the next few weeks.

bob

.

by **mrkleen09** Sat Jun 22, 2013 2:36 pm

Just to remind a few of you.

Paul Pierce averaged 18 ppg and 8 rpg last season. He is NOT going to retire.

by **bobheckler** Sat Jun 22, 2013 3:04 pm

Pierce for two 2nd rounders? Wow. That sounds like a fire sale.

The draft picks have no salary cap effect, and 2nd rounders do not have guaranteed contracts, so this would be a $15M trade exception for Boston, unless Danny finds some pearls among the 2nd round swine and signs them to meager 2nd round contracts. If this deal goes through, as is, then IMO Danny's bailing on this draft. Maybe he'll keep #16, maybe he'll trade it.

If that means what I think it means, it means that until next year we would have $15M dollars we could use without regard to what our status vis-a-vis the salary cap is. i.e. Our salary is currently $73,063,519 per Hoopshype. Getting Pierce's $15,333,334 off the books would take us down to $57,731,185. I believe that is slightly under the cap.

Consider that in 2014-2015, our salary will be $52,050,000 with Fab Melo's contract of $1,367,640 being a team option and Crawford to receive a qualifying offer of $3,206,866 (or NOT!). If the team does not pick up Melo's option and does not offer Crawford a qualifying offer, then our payroll (not including our 1st rounder's salary this year and next year) would be $47,475,494.

Now THAT is what I call "under the cap".

Big things brewing here, big things. I don't know about this coming year, but definitely the year after, when both the free agent market AND draft are considered to be exceptionally good.

bob

.

by **gyso** Sat Jun 22, 2013 4:40 pm

Here are some comments made by the folks over at CelticsBlog:

mmmmm & dslack wrote:

It doesn't really help.

Pierce’s contract comes off the books after this coming year anyway, so if it doesn’t get the Celtics under the cap this year it doesn’t help. And it doesn’t get the Celtics under the cap this year, at least not without another trade to get KG off the books for nothing in return or if he retires.

by dslack on Jun 22, 2013 | 12:12 PM



Except the TE can be used at any point before then

and is more flexible than trying to get an exact match trade.

And it doesn’t matter that the TE doesn’t get you under the cap regarding free agents. It does take salary off in regards to the luxury tax AND it can be used to bring someone in via trade without worrying about the cap.

by mmmmm on Jun 22, 2013 | 12:22 PM



Oh, I totally agree.
My point was just that it doesn’t get the Celtics cap room that they could use to sign a free agent. (Although it could help with a S/T.)

by dslack

mmmmm and others wrote:
The trade exception still counts against room under the cap.

It doesn’t count as ‘salary’ so if a team is over the luxury tax threshold it doesn’t hurt you.
But if you are salary cap, the trade exception (as well as others like the Disabled Player Exception) counts against your room under the cap.
This is avoid the obvious loophole of the team using that space to sign a free agent and then to use the exception to recieve a player in trade that puts them way over the cap.
The Trade Exception has a lot of value though. $15M can be enough to bring a very good player in via trade.

by mmmmm on Jun 21, 2013 | 6:08 PM

[url=http://www.sbnation.com/users/Banner 18][/url]

if that's the case then that's a very good deal

the club essentially gets a future, quality 15 Mil player plus 2 high second rounders that can be packaged in other trades
my question is, does the exception have to be one player for $15 mil or can it be a number of players equaling $15 mil? like a 10 mil and a 5 mil
also, what does that other team get (future C’s trading partner)? do they in turn get an exception of their own?
#BOSTONSTRONG
by [url=http://www.sbnation.com/users/Banner 18]Banner 18[/url] on Jun 21, 2013 |



It can be a number of players...

but it cannot exceed the total amount of the trade exception, even if we include additional players. I also believe the team we deal with gets a trade exception for the annual amount of the player coming back [although I could be wrong – I tried brushing up on my CBA rules a few weeks ago].
by jambr380 on Jun 21, 2013 | 7:40 PM



yes, it can be broken up to get multiple players from different teams

in different trades. Just cant send out players with the exception

meet me on the corner of walk and dont walk

by craziness@analltimehigh on Jun 21, 2013 | 7:42 PM



Right...

I worded that wrong [‘even if we include additional players’ should have probably read, ‘even if we wanted to include additional players to match salaries, as we wouldn’t be allowed to’]. Thank you for clarifying it for everybody else.
by jambr380 on Jun 21, 2013 | 7:45 PM up reply rec flag

[url=http://www.sbnation.com/users/Banner 18][/url]

still, that a pretty powerful chip

there’s lot of versatility there, if the C’s can find the right partners, they can bring in a huge haul for the rebuild
I know it’s still a rumor but I’ll be checking out player’s salaries now to explore possible trade scenarios with trading partners that make sense

by [url=http://www.sbnation.com/users/Banner 18]Banner 18[/url] on Jun 21, 2013 | 7:55 PM

dslack and others wrote:


That's a disappointing offer for Pierce.

He’s still extremely talented and can put up numbers across-the-board.
This isn’t even a deep draft with tons of unmistakeable talent. A first-round pick has to be thrown in, somehow.
by Wicklow on Jun 21, 2013 | 4:09 PM



+1

Yea a first round pick must be in the discussions at least for a player the caliber of Pierce.
Maybe the Cavs are starting with 2 2nd round picks, but when the bargaining is done they will yield to giving up a 1 st round pick somewhere in the deal?
by fordescort on Jun 21, 2013 | 4:11 PM



The destination is extremely disappointing

but it would be picks and a $15 million trade exception to go shopping with. That said, I’d like a first round pick.
by PLuscombe on Jun 21, 2013 | 4:16 PM

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Is there a trade exception? I forgot about that. That makes it slightly more appealing.

I’d still rather get a 2013 #2 and 2014 or 2015 #1. The #1 will probably be lottery-protected, but I guess that’d be acceptable.
by Wicklow on Jun 21, 2013 | 10:50 PM



Yes.

Any time a team gives up a player and takes no salary back (or takes much less salary back) a trade exception is generated, which can be filled for up to a year. It’s a non-simultaneous trade. It means the Celtics could accept a player who makes up to Pierce’s salary without having to give anyone up.

by dslack on Jun 22, 2013 | 1:10 PM

"It means the Celtics could accept a player who makes up to Pierce’s salary without having to give anyone up."

With the Trade Exception (TE), we can make a trade, be it a sign-and-trade or straight up trade, for anyone with a salary of $15 million or less? That sounds too good to be true. The two 2nd rounders may be needed as enticement to get a team to set up the sign-and-trade.

Now a question: Who out there would be available in a trade (or sign-and-trade) that makes $15 million or less that the Celtics may be interested in?

others wrote:
A trade exception would be enormous.

So enormous, it will probably never happen. So to anyone bashing this deal based off its merits, you’re wrong.
It essentially would turn any asset being paid $2 million a year and a draft pick into ANY high profile free agent who would like to come here when free agency rolls around. Once a team knows they are going to lose someone to free agency, they look to see if they can work a sign and trade. A rebuilding team wants to bring in as little salary commitment as possible attached to their assets. The celtics will automatically become the most attractive trade partner out there (meaning we have leverage over the compensation included.) I reckon the day we got the trade exception we’d have teams calling to celtics suggesting ways they should use it in a trade. WAKE UP PEOPLE.

by beantownboy171 on Jun 21, 2013 |

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snnoooooooze

I know all about the stuff you are saying and I still don’t buy it.
Loyalty, Tradition, Respect
PP=proven for another year.
Cap exemption???? hahahahhaha
by Duncan1 on Jun 21, 2013 | 10:34 PM

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As if the GM of the Celtics isnt a hard enough job

lets add the pressure to do great deals without hurting anyone’s feelings.

by [url=http://www.sbnation.com/users/P stoff]P stoff[/url] on Jun 21, 2013 | 10:39 PM





comment collapsed

So the Cs get two cost controlled high second round picks, a gigantic trade exception that can be used to lure a max contract guy from a team looking to dump salary or rebuild, and they save $5 million by not having to cut Pierce.

If the Cs have decided to rebuild, that’s a pretty good deal. Here are some players that could have been snagged with the 31st or 33rd pick the past few drafts: Draymond Green., Jae Crowder, Chandler Parsons, Lavoy Allen, Kyle Singler, Landry Fields, Lance Stephenson.
Of course, there have been more misses at the top of the second round than hits, but if DA scored with even one pick, a nd then could get someone useful with the trade exception, it’s a good deal. If they’re going to cut him anyways, it’s a good deal too.

My first choice would be to spin him to Dallas for Marion’s expiring deal and filler and their 13th pick.

by TripleOT on Jun 21, 2013 | 10:59 PM

"lets add the pressure to do great deals without hurting anyone’s feelings."

How true. Being a GM is must be very hard job in this regard. No matter what you do, someone is not going to like it.

"So the Cs get two cost controlled high second round picks, a gigantic trade exception that can be used to lure a max contract guy from a team looking to dump salary or rebuild, and they save $5 million by not having to cut Pierce."

Anyway, the trade is Pierce for a $15 million trade exception, good for a year and two EARLY 2nd round picks. Now . . . who can we get for $15 million? ? ?

http://www.celticsblog.com/2013/6/21/4453020/rumor-paul-pierce-to-cavs-for-2nd-round-picks-31-33

gyso

by **k_j_88** Sat Jun 22, 2013 8:37 pm

mrkleen09 wrote:when was the last time a second round draft pick made any impact at all with the Celtics?

Hell, when was the last time a team traded an 18/9 guy 0 ?

Pierce for Varejao maybe. But for two late picks? Not seeing this one

Sounds like a fire sale more than a calculated deal.

Mrkleen,

If I'm not mistaken, Glen "Baby" Davis was a 2nd rounder that was an integral part to this team's success until he was traded for Bass.

by **mrkleen09** Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:50 pm

k_j_88 wrote:
mrkleen09 wrote:when was the last time a second round draft pick made any impact at all with the Celtics?

Hell, when was the last time a team traded an 18/9 guy 0 ?

Pierce for Varejao maybe. But for two late picks? Not seeing this one

Sounds like a fire sale more than a calculated deal.

Mrkleen,

If I'm not mistaken, Glen "Baby" Davis was a 2nd rounder that was an integral part to this team's success until he was traded for Bass.

Guess we have a different interpretation of the word - integral. Big Baby was a minor contributor on the championship team. VERY minor. He averaged 4 points and 3 rebounds a game.

You would need 5 Glen Davis' to add up to the production of 1 Paul Pierce. No thanks.

by **bobheckler** Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:04 pm

2:00 pm EDT, 6/24

The Celtics have to make a decision before June 30 if they want to buy out the remaining $15 million on Paul Pierce’s contract for $5 million, but Boston is finding that scenario less and less likely, sources told Yahoo! Sports.
via Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo! Sports

bob

.

by **international** Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:43 pm

Emeka Okafor has one more year in his contract for 14 millions.

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Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

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Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

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Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

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Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)

Re: Trade Rumor: Pierce to Cavs for two 2nd rounders (31 and 33)