Durant Wins MVP

Well deserved.  Completely swamped LBJ in 1st place points.



Durant Beats LeBron, Blake For NBA MVP
May 06, 2014 11:28 AM EDT


Kevin Durant has been named 2013-14 NBA Most Valuable Player, with LeBron James and Blake Griffin finishing second and third.

Durant received 1,232 total points (119 of 124 first place votes), while James had 891 points (six first place votes) and Griffin had 434 total points.

Joakim Noah, James Harden, Stephen Curry, Al Jefferson, Paul George, LaMarcus Aldridge, Kevin Love, Tim Duncan, Tony Parker, Dirk Nowitzki, Carmelo Anthony, Goran Dragic and Mike Conley finished 4th through 17th.

Via RealGM Staff Report



bob



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I believe someone here last week referred to Blake Griffin as a role player. That's one pretty good role player to finish 3rd in the MVP voting and having a pretty dominate playoffs so far...

Congrats to Durant, he definitely deserved to win the MVP Award!

Hi,
I'm glad KD got it.
I don't get why people so fascinated with Griffin - there're quite a few players that bring much more value to their respective teams and the game of basketball in general?

AK

tjmakz wrote:I believe someone here last week referred to Blake Griffin as a role player. That's one pretty good role player to finish 3rd in the MVP voting and having a pretty dominate playoffs so far...

Congrats to Durant, he definitely deserved to win the MVP Award!

The NBA is a popularity contest the way they market the game. Griffin is flashy and fun to watch, but he's not a top-echelon player, plain and simple. Should we assume that because he came in 3rd place means he's the 3rd best player in the league?

In either case, Durant deserved it. He was carrying the team while Westbrook was out and he had a very impressive stretch of games.


KJ

sinus007 wrote:Hi,
I'm glad KD got it.
I don't get why people so fascinated with Griffin - there're quite a few players that bring much more value to their respective teams and the game of basketball in general?

AK

There are very few players in the league that are as dominant as Griffin on a nightly basis.
Maybe just Durant and James.
24.1 ppg, 9.5 rebs and 3.9 assists while playing very good defense on a top team is worthy of being voted high in the MVP voting.

k_j_88 wrote:

tjmakz wrote:I believe someone here last week referred to Blake Griffin as a role player. That's one pretty good role player to finish 3rd in the MVP voting and having a pretty dominate playoffs so far...

Congrats to Durant, he definitely deserved to win the MVP Award!

The NBA is a popularity contest the way they market the game. Griffin is flashy and fun to watch, but he's not a top-echelon player, plain and simple. Should we assume that because he came in 3rd place means he's the 3rd best player in the league?

In either case, Durant deserved it. He was carrying the team while Westbrook was out and he had a very impressive stretch of games.


KJ

Which player or players deserved to be ranked ahead of Griffin in MVP Voting besides Durant and LeBron?
If it was a popularity contest, Griffin would have points deducted because most people don't like his style of play.

TJ,

Quick, give me the official definition of "role player." You can't because there isn't one (at least to my knowledge). By my definition, Bill Russell was a role player, as was every member of his championship teams, because every player on those teams had a specialty (or role) on which he placed greatest emphasis in his play, while also making other contributions. Alternatively, by some definitions, a "role" player could mean the same thing as a "supporting" or "complementary" player. Still others think of non-starters as being "role players." Yet others would distinguish a team's all-stars from the rest of the team, who would be classified as "role players." And on and on.

Unfortunately, the term "role player" is one of those terms that can have so many different interpretations that the term itself is relatively useless in crystallizing the direction of a conversation. Some of our threads get sidetracked because of basic disagreements on what a "role player" is.

Sam

Based on Sam's latest post, I'd probably have to amend the term "role player" with "complimentary player," which is what I believe Griffin is, as opposed to Chris Paul being the main star.



KJ

k_j_88 wrote:Based on Sam's latest post, I'd probably have to amend the term "role player" with "complimentary player," which is what I believe Griffin is, as opposed to Chris Paul being the main star.



KJ  

KJ,

Chris Paul has been a superstar in the NBA.
Blake Griffin is now a star in the league and he had a superstar type season.

Kevin Durant is the main star on OKC but that doesn't mean Westbrook can't also be a star in the league.

So, what player deserved to jump Griffin in MVP Voting?

Sam, I was not the one that originally used the term role player.
I agree that all players should be considered role players.

TJ, I didn't see anyone else allude to a role player on this thread before you did. Sorry if I missed something.

Sam

tjmakz wrote:

k_j_88 wrote:Based on Sam's latest post, I'd probably have to amend the term "role player" with "complimentary player," which is what I believe Griffin is, as opposed to Chris Paul being the main star.



KJ  

KJ,

Chris Paul has been a superstar in the NBA.
Blake Griffin is now a star in the league and he had a superstar type season.

Kevin Durant is the main star on OKC but that doesn't mean Westbrook can't also be a star in the league.

So, what player deserved to jump Griffin in MVP Voting?

Sam, I was not the one that originally used the term role player.
I agree that all players should be considered role players.

False equivalency. No where did I say Griffin wasn't a star.

He's not a go-to guy, though.


KJ

k_j_88 wrote:

tjmakz wrote:

k_j_88 wrote:Based on Sam's latest post, I'd probably have to amend the term "role player" with "complimentary player," which is what I believe Griffin is, as opposed to Chris Paul being the main star.



KJ  

KJ,

Chris Paul has been a superstar in the NBA.
Blake Griffin is now a star in the league and he had a superstar type season.

Kevin Durant is the main star on OKC but that doesn't mean Westbrook can't also be a star in the league.

So, what player deserved to jump Griffin in MVP Voting?

Sam, I was not the one that originally used the term role player.
I agree that all players should be considered role players.

False equivalency. No where did I say Griffin wasn't a star.

He's not a go-to guy, though.


KJ

KJ,

There really are SO few "go to" guys in the league.  Pierce, LBJ, DWade, Kobe (when he can), Durant, George.  Who else?  Rose hasn't played in years, so who knows?  CP3 and Westbrook?  Maybe.  This is where Rondo falls down, he's a facilitator and not a go-to guy which means over the course of 47 he's your man but in last-minute do-or-die games at the buzzer, he's not.  Jeff Green could be, he has the talent, but he's an enigma.  DeRozan?  Maybe, in another year or two.

If Griffin isn't a go-to guy it's mostly because of his free throw shooting.  Also true of Rondo.


Griffin is averaging 24ppg.  He's shooting almost 53%.  He's even shooting 71.5% from the line.  If Rondo shot 72% from the line we'd be dancing.  He's averaging 9.5rpg.  Are these numbers good enough to beat Durant for MVP?  No, but they're still pretty damn good.

If Griffin's ft% crawls up over 80% it will be very hard to say he's not a go-to guy.

bob


.

BobH,

Good points. I think Griffin has made great strides to improving his overall game. He still has to become more mature, as well as broadening his skill set.


KJ

k_j_88 wrote:BobH,

Good points. I think Griffin has made great strides to improving his overall game. He still has to become more mature, as well as broadening his skill set.


KJ

KJ,

Agreed, he has work to do. He's only 25 though and has played in only 4 seasons.


bob



.

Griffen and DeAndre Jordan have made great strides that I didn't know they had in them to improve to this level, Doc really earned his money and totally outcoached Scott Brooks in game 1.

bobheckler wrote:

KJ,

Agreed, he has work to do.  He's only 25 though and has played in only 4 seasons.  


bob



.

Very true.

Side note, Lilliard is younger I think, but I have yet to see him act out in a way that is potentially detrimental to his team. Blake tossing his water on a fan (though described as "inadvertent") isn't exactly helpful, and it was an instance where the league would have had the latitude to inflict stiffer consequences. Again, it's not a huge deal, but it's problematic.

Some guys just grow out of that phase sooner than others. Blake will get there soon.


KJ

k_j_88 wrote:Side note, Lilliard is younger I think, but I have yet to see him act out in a way that is potentially detrimental to his team. Blake tossing his water on a fan (though described as "inadvertent") isn't exactly helpful, and it was an instance where the league would have had the latitude to inflict stiffer consequences. Again, it's not a huge deal, but it's problematic.

Some guys just grow out of that phase sooner than others. Blake will get there soon.

I think Griffin has already expanded his skills considerably -- his outside shooting is MUCH better, as is his free throw shooting, and his offense is far more diverse than when he first came into the league -- and I think he is becoming a go-to guy in the clutch, but I'm not sure about whether he'll outgrow these little "incidents" any time soon.

Case in point is the play where Ibaka got a technical in game 1.



Griffin falls to the ground, wraps his legs around Ibaka's leg, and won't let Ibaka pull his leg out. Ibaka inexplicably gets called for a technical for yanking his leg away, but this is just Griffin being a petty jerk, just like the cup incident. I don't see him getting better in this regard.

Hey, KJ,

For me, one of the benefits of being part of this forum is that, every so often, I read a term that is new and intriguing to me. You've used the term "false equivalency," and I have to say I've become fascinated by it. It's internal contradiction reminds me a little of the term, "benevolent dictator."

So lately, I've been stealing (from you) and using the term in my daily life. "Recent weather has had a sort of false equivalency quality, don't you think?" "Hey, honey, I have to take the trash to the false equivalency." I'm working on using it was every possible figure of speech, kind of like the "F" word.

The best yet was when I went to have my teeth cleaned yesterday, and I said to the dental hygienist, 'Don't forget my false equivalency."

Congratulations on becoming my English mentor.

Sam

Sam,

No problem, always happy to be helpful, be it deliberately or inadvertent.

I left out a few words on the prior post after looking back at it.



KJ

k_j_88 wrote:

tjmakz wrote:

k_j_88 wrote:Based on Sam's latest post, I'd probably have to amend the term "role player" with "complimentary player," which is what I believe Griffin is, as opposed to Chris Paul being the main star.



KJ  

KJ,

Chris Paul has been a superstar in the NBA.
Blake Griffin is now a star in the league and he had a superstar type season.

Kevin Durant is the main star on OKC but that doesn't mean Westbrook can't also be a star in the league.

So, what player deserved to jump Griffin in MVP Voting?

Sam, I was not the one that originally used the term role player.
I agree that all players should be considered role players.

False equivalency. No where did I say Griffin wasn't a star.

He's not a go-to guy, though.


KJ

You said last week he was a role player.

tjmakz wrote:
KJ,

You said last week he was a role player.

Indeed I did and I have stood by that statement. But as Sam alluded to, not everyone thinks of the term "role player" in the same light. And you seem to believe I'm implying it in a derogatory manner.

When I refer to someone as a role player, I am generally intending it as someone that is a complimentary player. To refer this to the Celtics, I believe Jeff Green is more a complimentary player, as opposed to being a first option on offense. Griffin fits that description, in my book. Chris Paul is the key piece to that team, not Griffin. Sure, Griffin is a star, an athletic freak of nature with endless highlight reels, but that doesn't make him a legit go-to guy to hit the big shots at the end, does it? And just the same, being a complimentary player is not any implication that he isn't a star player as well.



KJ

k_j_88 wrote:

tjmakz wrote:
KJ,

You said last week he was a role player.

Indeed I did and I have stood by that statement. But as Sam alluded to, not everyone thinks of the term "role player" in the same light. And you seem to believe I'm implying it in a derogatory manner.

When I refer to someone as a role player, I am generally intending it as someone that is a complimentary player. To refer this to the Celtics, I believe Jeff Green is more a complimentary player, as opposed to being a first option on offense. Griffin fits that description, in my book. Chris Paul is the key piece to that team, not Griffin. Sure, Griffin is a star, an athletic freak of nature with endless highlight reels, but that doesn't make him a legit go-to guy to hit the big shots at the end, does it? And just the same, being a complimentary player is not any implication that he isn't a star player as well.



KJ

You are constantly moving the goal posts.
Was Shaq a role player to Kobe or Kobe to Shaq?

You bashed Blake Griffin last week.
Now, since you received a lot of heat over that, you changed it up...

Blake is a star and deserved to be 3rd in MVP voting.
He actually had a much better and more effective season than Chris Paul had this season.

tjmakz wrote:
You are constantly moving the goal posts.
Was Shaq a role player to Kobe or Kobe to Shaq?

You bashed Blake Griffin last week.
Now, since you received a lot of heat over that, you changed it up...

Blake is a star and deserved to be 3rd in MVP voting.
He actually had a much better and more effective season than Chris Paul had this season.

I haven't moved any goal posts. I was compelled to clarify my previous statements because you obviously didn't interpret them properly. Again, you must think I meant role player with a negative connotation.

I didn't "bash" Blake Griffin. I just don't think he's an elite player at this point in his career. He is a very good complimentary player on a contending team, which is the situation he's in right now. Me saying that isn't an insult to him. He just hasn't shown me that he's arrived as a top of the league player. He's getting there, and perhaps in another year or two that'll come to fruition. But as of right now, I don't see it.

Was Kobe the role player? Well, I'd say that Shaq was the bigger centerpiece, more than figuratively speaking, but LA does not win those titles if Kobe isn't there. To further my point, Kobe was the perfect compliment to Shaq during their title runs.

What heat are you referring to? You making assumptions based on what you THINK I meant? I have not changed my stance on anything regarding this issue.



KJ