Boston Celtics Center Solutions: Marcin Gortat

kdp59 wrote:just one final point on this thread ,as I think it's run it course.

I used the 36min per game on blocks because someone else had used it in this thread. I am fully aware that neither Joel or Fav (at least currently) is anywhere near being an option as a starting NBA center.

I also strongly disagree that paying Gortat $10-12M per year for 3 -4 years is a good move for the Celtics. though I DO think he is probably one of the bets option we may have along with Asik in this off-season.
Contract and cost is everything though.

my choices in order:

1) we draft Embiid and his back is fine (he'll need 2-3 years to become a top NBA player though)

2) Gortat- yep he's my number option and I think I may have been one of the first people on this board talking about him a few months back.....But only at a $6-8M per/ 3 year deal.

3) Asik- Bass and a future mid round first for the trade and a contract similar to Gortat's above (maybe one more years as he is younger)

we all think similar, we'll find out if Stevens and Ainge do soon enough.

cowens/oldschool wrote:I'm watching Gortat and I am not impressed, he has the size and seems to have some big man skills and ability, but he doesn't use his body enough. I'm not a stat guy and I know Gortat puts up decent stats, but I'd take Perk's consistent persistent always lay a body on someone defense over Gortat anyday. Perk adds much more of a physical hard nature to a team defense that I don't see in Gortat.

sam wrote:kdp,

All good observations.  Here are some of my thoughts:

• IF they fill only one spot (which I don't necessarily feel must be the case with the assets Danny has), filling the center position can set the tone for the next few years while scorers may not be a dime a dozen but they're plentiful.

• While it may look nice on paper, the fact that Anthony and Faverani can block shots occasionally doesn't mean a thing if they hardly ever play.  The Celtics need a mainstay center, who will play most of the center minutes.  I don't see either of them as more than occasional subs.  Maybe I'll be proven wrong, but I've seen nothing yet to change my mind about either one.

• Let's do some quick and realistic math.  You use per-36-minute figures to compare Anthony and Vitor with other players in the league.  That's fair on a relative basis.  But, in terms of measuring their impact on a given game, it's fairer to use per-game averages because those averages also factor in the amount of time they were on the floor.  For Anthony, the figure in his seven minutes per game was 0.4 blocks.  Vitor, in his 13 minutes per game, averaged 0.7 points per game.  Thus, in a game in which each of them played his average number of minutes (very unlikely because more minutes for one often meant fewer minutes for the other) the two of them hypothetically combined for only 1.1 block per game.  And that figure doesn't take into account their numerous DNP games in which they contributed nothing but splinters.

• Unless a player is in the Russell-Chamberlain league, blocks are actually a minor element in being a rim protector.  Swatting away a shot a game impacts just one of roughly 100 possessions an opponent will have per game.  But being a truly tough intimidator represents a constant threat to opponents, to say nothing of how solid picks by the same person can influence his team's offense.  (I don't believe I've seen Favorani make anything except a slip pick yet.)

• Team defense has a nice sound to it.  But we saw this past season what can happen to team defense when there's a gaping hole in the middle.  The essence of team defense involves guys switching, rotating, and recovering.  The Celtics weren't very effective at it.  And a big reason was that they too often had to double the opponent being guarded by the Celtics' center of the moment.  Even poor-passing opposing centers couldn't miss the opportunity to pass to the open man for a clear shot that ranged in distance from layups to the perimeter.

• I don't see any convincing evidence that getting an intimidator like Asik would necessarily "kill our long-term chances."  In the first place, I believe that—since he and Sully have been playing out of position for their respective teams, moving both to their more appropriate positions would turn them loose to maximize their skills and minimize their shortcomings (no pun intended).  For another thing, the lack of lateral movement that some people criticize Asik for would not be as apparent if he were covering centers rather than power forwards.  For another thing, while none of us expects the Celtics to contend next season (although I'll root like crazy for it), the very least they should be able to do is to establish a defensive mentality—which was certainly not the case last season.  Offense almost always follows defense, especially if the defense can trigger a lot of uptempo possessions.  Adopting a more effective defensive system begins in the middle and moves outward; just as establishing an offensive mentality begins with the point guard and moves inward.  They don't need a center who can make an occasional block.  (I dislike the term "rim protector" because so many people feel it means only blocked shots.)  They need an intimidator.

• In citing several instances in which teams have been able to procure top centers, I was NOT speaking of anything EXCEPT how they were able to make those acquisitions.  I was not attempting to factor in other moves that those same teams also made (good or bad), the chemistry on those teams, whether those teams had the right coaches to work with the incoming center, or any of the myriad other factors that can affect ascension to a championship.  My simple point was that it's not impossible to acquire a top center.  Especially given the assets Danny has been stockpiling.

Sam