Celtics Post-Game Thread (Collection of past threads)

[Sam]

Rather than start a new post-game observations thread for every game, it seems more efficient to place all of the in one very long thread, which will be updated after each Celtics game.

CELTICS @ CAVS—OPENING NIGHT 11/28/09

What a great opening night win for the Celtics! Forget all the caveats…this has to be considered a “statement game.” In regular season and playoff competition, the home team had won 16 consecutive games in this competition. And added to the impressiveness of the statement was the flow of the game:

• The Cavs came out jacked up, while the Celtics looked tentative (and that’s being kind). The Cavs had something like a 14-point lead after just a few minutes. The crowd was really into the game. Exactly the opposite of what I had hoped for.

• But the Celtics bench came in and started chipping away at the lead, and the Celtics trailed by only 7 at the end of the first quarter. The bench kept up the pressure, and the starters came back and kept the pressure on, and the Celts actually led by 6 at halftime. So long crowd.

• Now the Celts had the Cavs playing catchup, as the C’s led by as many as 15 in the second half. And, each time Cleveland made an incursion (Lebron became a driving dervish), the Celts bent but never broke. Bolstered by a couple of MAJOR Pierce hoops near the end, the Boys from Boston held on for a 6-point win. (Pierce was my MVP.)

Scoring for the Celtics went pretty true to form, led by Pierce (23), Ray (16), KG (13) and Sheed (12). Only Ray played more minutes (42) than I’d hope for on a regular basis, as the Celts had a tendency to get cold hands and Doc opted to play him a number of minutes with the bench. The Celtics were hot from three-point land (9 for 19), and there were periods when Doc had three floor-spacers in there together (Ray, Sheed and Eddie).

If you’ll go to the thread “Celtics Advanced Stats 018,” you’ll see some non-traditional stats that we have derived from scoreboard stats. In a nutshell, they indicate that two influences on the win were the more effective use of the three-ball and transition basketball (both of Ray’s threes were on fast-break kickouts).

Holding the Cavs to 41% field goal shooting was also a must, since the Celts shot only 44% themselves. The Cavs went stretches of (I believe) five and seven minutes without scoring a field goal. This is shaping up as a Celtics team that will excel in spurts at both ends of the floor (which, by the way, was a characteristic of the Russell Celtics).

Forgetting the stats for a moment, there are two guys who seem linked to good things happening when they’re on the floor: Sheed and Daniels. Thank you Danny, thank you Danny, thank you Danny. They may not be the highest scorers, but they’re timely scorers. Sheed simply drove the Cavs nuts with bombs at critical moments, (3 or 6 in total) , and Daniels even got in on the three-ball action with a big one late in the game. I don’t expect that on a regular basis from ‘Quis; in fact, I cringe when he shoots from more than seven feet. But next time, he’ll find some other way to help. By the way, Sheed and Daniels ranked second and third among the Celts on a points-per-minute basis (behind Pierce).

Rondo scored eight points (including a nice jumper to help stem the early Cavs tide), but he dropped 10 dimes on Cleveland while committing only two turnovers in 34 minutes of a pretty frenetic game. The Celtics had two quarters in which they didn’t protect the ball well, but they finished with only 14 turnovers, which is not bad for them (Cleveland had 13). And at least two of the Celts’ miscues were actually offensive fouls by Paul.

It may be noteworthy that the starters accounted for 11 of the 14 turnovers (three each for Perk and Ray). That’s a major reason why the +/- stats for the bench players ranged from +6 to +11, as compared with -4 to +4 among the starters. This was definitely a triumph for the Celtics bench (with a little help from Ray in particular). Sheldon Williams had four freebies and three rebounds in his 12 minutes. Eddie never got untracked in this one (with one three-pointer accounting for all his scoring), although he was a buzz saw on defense and had two assists in just a few minutes at the point.

KG looked tentative at times and monstrous at others. He missed a driving dunk when he just didn’t sky high enough, and he looked a bit wobbly when landing a couple of times. But he also stuffed some Cav point-blank, twice in about three seconds, when Cleveland was making their early run. And he found ways to score, including a beautiful turnaround jumper over Shaq in crunch time.

Perk scored nine (including a nice jumper from about 10 feet), but his main job was to deny the Diesel. In the first quarter, it looked as though Shaq might accumulate Wilt-like numbers; but, after that, he was pretty much of a non-factor. And Perk committed only three fouls, which means he’ll have nine fouls available for tonight’s game. (That’s how it works, isn’t it?)

In case anyone has the misfortune to communicate with the trolls, they should know how important the poise of veteran experience is when facing an elite team that goes off in the first quarter. I think that, plus sheer will, is the story of this game, rather than the stats.

On to the Charlotte game.

Go Celtics!

Sam

[Schlep2010]

Oh I will probably let ALL the trolls know, sam. I have the day off....

Something tells me they will not be around.

That second unit is gonna be a pain for a lot of teams. With the exception of the first quarter it was a fun game to watch.

[Hoopdeedoo]

I think I heard the trolls late last night out in my backyard marsh (swamp as I call it) down here in Florida. They said Nevermind!!! Or was that the frogs?

I was concerned about the absence of BB early in the game but thought Williams did a good job on defense and held his own. Maybe this will a good thing with Davis out. Kind of like BB getting his chance to develop a bit after KG went out.

In the championship year the bench was asked to hold on. This year they can be scary good and actually push leads or like last night, take the lead.

Sheed is as advertised and Quis is ever better than advertised. This is going to be a great year!

Go C's
Hoop

[international]

I told you boys,this second unit is special.And is going to be better with Big Baby,Scal,Tony Allen and Bill Walker.Sam did you know that rasheed Wallace knew all the celtics sistem only by playing against them,this player has a great IQ .

[beat]

If I had a crystal ball this game would have been scriped just this way for the C's.

Sluggish start and the Cavs hitting everything inside and out and combined with the emotion of getting their rings................dang I keep forgetting they lost. Well the emotion of playing at home against a top contender carried them well for the first 1/2 of the quarter, driving the lead up to 21-7 at one point.

Varejao had 8 points during this first quarter flurry.........he finished the game with 9!

Same with Shaq.....2 pts after halftime and although he finished with a double double (as low as you can and still have one) 10 & 10. He did nothing to help down the stretch. He clanked 2 foul shots in the 4th when Cleveland was trying to mount a comeback. Hack a Shaq could/should have been employed a bit more perhaps than letting Bron do his thing.
At one point during this time they showed Ainge crossing his arms in front of him in a hack motion, yelling out to the team. You could read his lips foul Shaq.

Although they did not have to in the end it would have made Cleveland do something and I'm sure as games go on with them leaving Shaq on the floor late in tight games will be an issue. ( and we worry about Rondo)

Coupl eof other observations. After cleveland came out 6-7 from the field their % continued to decline to nearly 40% at the end meaning they only shot about 30-32% the remainder of the game. While the C's were terrible their % climbed to over 50% most of the time but a poor stretch in the final quarter when we seemed stuck on 80 points brough that back down a bit.

Our bench absolutely killed theirs at one point it was 17-2 bench points.
That assisted in getting the Celtic's not only back into the game but it forged a small lead that was never lost after the half.

Fouls shooting was great of course our problem shooters Rondo and Perk only took 1 between them and Perk made it.

Loved Perk taking the baseline 10-12 footer. He can hit that shot and did.

PP with those final 2 jumpers and the foul shots sealed the deal.

Doc managed the minutes OK for the first game and obviously played a couple starters perhaps more than he wanted but seeings how the game flowed the way it did only Ray's minutes were a bit much. A little concern about him too but we'll see.

Statement game? Sure, when you beat a contender on their floor what else you gonna call it.

As for Shaq he came out with the line about Cleveland having 100 games to go

“We’d like to start off 1-0, but there are 100 games left,” said O’Neal, who was just 1 of 5 from the floor in the second half and missed his only two free throws.

No rest as we go home tonight! Hopefully extended minutes for PP and RA will be lessened and we can see a bit of the kids.

beat

[House for 3]

Not a perfect game, by a long stretch, but definitely a nice way to start out.

- The Cavs are awfully thin at the guard spots. I've never been a Mo Williams fan, and Parker, while a good complementary player, only does certain things. After that its Boobie Gibson and maybe Jamario Moon, who is not a guard. Losing DWest from the front of their rotation really hurts them.

- Shaq looks enormous, but also remains remarkably agile for a guy his size. He doesn't like to run, though. Perk did an admirable job. I would guess that he was giving up somewhere around 80 pounds to Shaq last night. I refuse to believe Shaq is an ounce less than 340. He is also at least 4 inches taller than Perk. But Perk just stayed in front of him and tried to keep him from getting too close to the hoop, which is all you can do. I also liked to see Perk shoot that baseline J, as a way to pull Shaq away from the basket.

- KG was solid, but well off his best form in a Cs uniform. He looks awkward at times and you can't tell if he is still rounding into shape or in pain. I'm not worried about it, but I also feel like he will never be the same player from 07-08 or earlier.

- Bench was fantastic. I expected Rasheed and Marquis to be valuable, and they certainly were. Shelden did a very capable job filling Baby's minutes. He isn't going to make some of the active contributions Baby will make, but he is looking solid on D and in the pick-and-pop game. He is more of a facilitator and will mesh well with the 2d unit, allowing Rasheed, Marquis and Starter X to be the alpha dogs.

- Pierce was huge down the stretch. He just keeps doing it. Hopefully his improved conditioning will allow him to maintain this level closing games through the season and the playoffs.

A little wobbly out of the gate, but great thereafter. It's just one win, but a very nice one to have under their belt.

Hf3

[cowens/oldschool]

Our bench was great,Sheed is a seemless fit,looks like hes been playing with these guys for years,no hesitation,great team and individual D,hes gonna make sure KG and Perk are fresh for playoff run.SW fit in well,all he has to do is bang and defend.Rondo was Rondo,Pierce was Pierce,thought his defense was great on Lebron......with his talent and amount of shots he takes nobody really stops him.
Game changed when Bron went to bench in 2nd quarter,Cavs have no one to iniate offense when Bron is out,Mo Williams can't do it,can anybody create there own shot if Lebron is out?I don't see Cavs repeating as many wins as last year,other than Bron they don't get enough easy baskets.Bron still needs a Pippen and those kind of players are not easy to come by.

[carpecarpium]

Rasheed did what he is capable of. Marquis Daniels played really well . But I was very impressed by Shelden Williams. He brought great energy in the 2nd quarter.

When Baby comes back, the team will have the luxary of an expendable big. Williams can do the kamakaize thing and just bang and annihilate during his stints.

[jeb]

The Cavs to me are very slow inre team defense among their bigs. Our guys looked quick ...in shape and crisp. Shaq and Z looked like cold molasses.

I thought we played well except for turnovers and a lack of scoring when it felt like we were stuck on 80 for 5 minutes.

Dont leave your feet in traffic unless you are going to shoot.

To beat those guys on their floor to start the season is priceless. I didnt like their gloating and disco dancing on the sidelines last year.

PP was PP Ray was Ray and kg was about 80 per. The bench looked like they have been playing together for years. They are going to EXTEND leads all year. It's one thing to rest and watch the lead you fought so hard for slip away. It's another to rest while the bench stretches the lead.

All in all high marks.

Jeb

[Sam]

CELTICS v CHARLOTTE 10/29/09

Wow, this is getting serious. Still only two games, and granted that the opponent was a Charlotte Bobcats team that could best be described as hapless and was missing key players (including Felton with a head injury that required 15 stitches and removed him from the game for a considerable time). But the fact is that the Celtics played only a mediocre game and yet won going away by 33 points (92-59).

This seems to be a team with so many options and weapons that it finds a different way to win every night. In the first game, the bench basically bailed out the starters. While the issue was being decided in the Charlotte game, the starters were in double “plus” figures, while the entire bench was showing minus stats. Of course, the issue wasn’t in doubt much beyond halftime, as the Celtics “won” the third quarter 25-10.

The emerging pattern is that the Celtics can be depended on to play killer defense and throw up a lot of threes. (Perhaps it’s no coincidence that Sheed excels in both categories.) They were 11-29 in threes last night, while the Bobcats could not connect on a single bomb. Personally, I don’t like to see the Celtics taking 38% of their shots from behind the arc. But, as Doc said, they had open looks, and they were connecting.

If you look at our “Celtics advanced stats” thread, you’ll see that several factors won this game:

• The aforementioned contributions from three-point land

• Sharing the ball (There were five Celtics and just one Bobcat in double figures.)

• Offensive chemistry (Get this…85% !!!!! of the Celtics field goals came off assists.)

• Opportunism (The teams were about even in field goals taken, while the Bobcats took a lot more free throws but missed half of them while shooting 31% from the field.)

• Defensive alertness (Charlotte had 18 turnovers, and the Celts had 8 blocks—4 by Perk)

• Transitional effectiveness (The Celtics were twice as effective as the Bobcats in transition)

There are areas in which the Celtics still need to improve. The three-points won’t be so readily available against some teams, and their inability to be more productive in the paint will bite them—especially down the stretch. It’s a good sign that Rondo seems to be increasing the number of interior assists among his now-nightly distribution of at least 10 dimes. Rajon was my MVP for this factor (along with his 10 points). He seemed to infuse the entire team with a pass-first mentality. Pierce and ‘Quis each had 4 assists along with Rondo’s 11 and 3 by Sheldon Williams, who played a great garbage time with 12 points and 9 boards.

The bench didn’t bludgeon the competition this time; but it more than held its own while only Ray Allen among the starters logged more than 30 minutes. Ray was in there for 38 minutes—many with the bench—and scores 18 with four three-pointers despite shooting only 35%. Perhaps Doc’s giving Ray extra minutes to try to get him into a better shooting groove; and Ray seems to tolerate the minutes well. But one can’t help but be a little concerned that Ray’s averaging about 40 when one of their two games has been an extreme blowout. Paul and KG rounded out the double-digit scoring with 15 and 10 respectively.

Perhaps the best word for KG so far is “efficient.” He’s shooting well and has been quite active defensively, with three blocks in each of the two games to date. He just seems to be picking his spots a little more than his previous reckless abandon approach. And so far it seems to be working, as all he needs to be is a very good and heady player with this exceptionally deep team. He took a bad spill last night but seemed fine after the game.

So they’re 2-0 with Da Bulls coming to town on Friday. Early in the season, but the only thing that matters is that they win their very last game of the year…and they’ve definitely made a very promising start.

Sam

[MDCelticFan]

Sam: I like how you expressed that: Win the last game of the year, not the calendar year, but the season, and not JUST the regular season, specifically the POST (not cereal) season. That would allow us to hang another of what Pierce said we needed in the rafters, an 18th banner!-MD.

[jeb]

Sam

I think we are going to see 20+ games like last night this year. Lester and Giddens and the boys. This team D is goin to be somethin to behold.

Did you see what happened on the bay bridge?

Jeb

[Sam]

Jeb,

I hadn't seen that, but I just looked it up. Scary. I recall the collapse during the earthquake (I think it was on 280). Any negative happening in SFO is like a dagger for me because I love that city so much.

St. Mary's Church, corner of California and Grant in Chinatown, was the first cathedral in California. It miraculously survived the 1906 quake only to be gutted by fire a day later. It was restored and now houses an amazing collection of photos of that earthquake and fire...including one taken by priests looking back on the church as they fled up the hill to escape. It's quite a place to visit, followed by a meal at the Far East Restaurant across the street. The restaurant still has private enclosed booths that make for a very romantic and tasty Chinese meal.

I'm not much of a walker, but my wife's crazy about the shopping in SFO's chinatown. So I follow her in the car, considering every hydrant and illegal space my own private property for live parking while she uses the care for a sort of "shopping central." That, and driving through the eucalyptus trees in the Presidio on the way to Fort Point and then the Cliff House, are among our most prized rituals in San Fran.

I LOVE San Fran and can't wait to get there again next spring. (We were there this past spring too.)

Sam

[jeb]

Sam

I lived there 10 years and am lucky enough to get out there to work prolly 4 months out of every year.

It is a very special place.

They had closed the bridge about three weeks ago to install the cable that wound up breaking the other day. They are adding a couple of entire sections to the bridge. A MASSIVE engineering project. To hear the bridge is closed indefinitely is quite a shock and will have a big effect on the Sf area.

Luckily nobody got hurt when cable snapped. 3 cars got hit and it happened during rush hour.

Best to you Sam. The site is just a jewell.

Jeb

[LACELTFAN]

Sam,
FYI-The collapse was on 880 about a mile from where I was living at the time...the so called Cypress structure...and, of course, the Bay Bridge which made my commute to SF much more interesting.... LACELTFAN

[RosalieTCeltics]

I was impressed last night by the entire team. Sure, there are improvements to be made, but the way they play together really excites me. I had almost bought tickets to the game, but put it off for two weeks and am going to see Atlanta when they come into town. That way the second team will be a little more used to playing together. I can't wait to go.

I listened to Bob Ryan say that he felt that Garnett was only at 80 percent, but I think he is wrong. He seemed to be basing his theory on the blown dunk in Cleveland. Give me a break. He is playing with great energy. His timing is a bit off, but that will come in due time. God knows the enthusiasm is there! This is going to be a fun team to watch grow and grow. I think Daniels has yet to find his niche, but he is going to be so valuable! Williams is surprising everyone right now, let's see if it continues.
His ability around the basket was impressive.

So, what are the predictions for Friday night's game. Chicago coming out firing? I say a ten point win. I am still waiting for Cleveland to give me something to worry about.

[KellyGreen17]

I expect the C's to win tomorrow (they better, I'll be at the game!) but I'm not sure about the margin of victory. Tonight will be the Bulls first game of the season, so we really don't have much to judge from so far. I believe Rose has been injured and hasn't played this pre-season. Can anyone verify that? The loss of Gordon could have an effect on them as well. I don't expect a complete blow-out like we witnessed last night, but I wouldn't complain if that's what happens!

[jeb]

Rosalie

It's increasingly clear bob ryan is a choad. He has done gone hollywood.

Jeb

[RosalieTCeltics]

There is no doubt about it. In fact, Donnie Marshall even said that he felt that KG was much further along than Ryan said. I think he really likes to hear himself talk, and believes he is a true analyzer. Years ago, I would have believed it, but now???? These guys really like to criticize players. If you are from around here, just listen to Michael Felger on Comcast. He hates the Celtics and would truly love to rip them apart. KG ticks him off. Like I think KG would care!! Anyway, all one has to do is watch. If you are a true fan of the game, you will be able to pick up things yourself. Sure, he is not all the way back, but it is more timing than anything. With the help of having Rasheed around, and the way Perkins has grown into his position,
am I really worried? No. But, that is the true Celtic fan coming out in me.

How many games will they win this year? The sky is the limit. What do you all think?????

[jeb]

Rosalie

67 comfortably. Doc has to protect them from the big head. I dont see anyone in the association that can beat them inna seven game series. Lakers are very good but Perk can handle Bynum and KG will punk a weak willed Gasol. Magic are scary good as well but lack mean streak.

Jeb

[David14]

Rosalie, I listen to Felger because we're stuck with him if want to watch "Sports Tonight". If I am not mistaken I think he is from Minnesota and was critical of Kevin McHale and for KG for leaving. He also is the same guy that said Schilling's socks were planted, and that Big Papi was washed up before the season was two weeks old. I'm surprised that Brent Favre or Arod have allowed him to go off on them to the extent he does. His comments about both are unbelievable. You are right, he really is anti-Celtics.

I'm going with Sheed's prediction of 72!! Maybe to optimistic, however I admit I lose my objectivity with our beloved Celtics.

David

[RosalieTCeltics]

I will never buy into the fact that Vince Carter is going to be better defensively than Turkelou (sp?) I can't understand why they gave him up.
Carter is an offensive specialist, period. Time will tell, wait until they have to deal with a Celtic team with KG pumped up and Sheed. I just can't seem to fear them. I guess it is wrong to take them lightly, they are a good team.

[RosalieTCeltics]

I thought that Felger was from Milwaukee. But you may be right, he did rake McHale over the coals over the KG trade, and he hates KG. Can you imagine what he would have said about Russell when Russ had hardly anything to do with the press during his playing years? He picked and chose who he would be interviewed by. He would have eaten Felger apart. I guess it is the controversy that keeps him on that station. I still say that some day it will backfire on them. You notice he doesn't interview anyone of real value. I think no one will talk to him. Last year I thought Mike Vrabel was going to punch him out one day on tv. It really would have been fun to watch!!!

I hate to say it and I know I shouldn't, but you are right, this team could go over 70 wins this year if everyone (baby?) stays healthy. Just think, Ray
really hasn't found his real shot yet! Wait until he does, it will be such fun
to watch!!

[David14]

Rosalie, I think you are right. Felger did come from Milwaukee. I just assumed it was Minnesota when, as you say, he blasted McHale and pretty much tried to convince the world that KG was overated. Tonight Felger said he wouldn't get on the Celtics' "bus" because there were too many people already on the bus. I had to make sure I was watching the New England station. Russ definitely would have avoided Felger. One can only guess that he works cheaply and/or he has a relative in Comcast's exec team. I agree that most of the guys avoid any interviews with him. Very strange, Comcast gives us Felger, but wouldn't Couz the few games to offer color commentary.

I know its early, however what I see in the team is the "ease" and confidence that the team is displaying. They really do remind me of the confidence and unity that we found with Red's group. Even with KG's recovery and Ray's eye issue, that is probably causing his shot to be a bit off, they really look like they are in control at all times. Even when they were down to Cleveland, there was an "air" of confidence. It's also great to see the "fun" they are having on the bench. KG was having a lot of fun getting on Shelden for some of moves last night. With a little bit of luck and some good health, I really believe 70 plus is not out of the question.

[jeb]

D14

I don't want too much mugging on the bench. Fun is good but dont gloat and showboat. I think it's up to Doc to quell that crap and to keep a very very good team's feet on the ground.

Jeb

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