Boston Celtics draft pick watch: But hey, at least the Brooklyn Nets stink

http://www.masslive.com/celtics/index.ssf/2015/11/boston_celtics_draft_pick_watc.html




Boston Celtics draft pick watch: But hey, at least the Brooklyn Nets stink






The Brooklyn Nets could give their first-round picks to the Boston Celtics for the next three years. (AP Photo/John Bazemore)


Jay King | mjking@masslive.com By Jay King | mjking@masslive.com

on November 05, 2015 at 12:30 PM




The Boston Celtics are frustrated with their own start, sure. But as they try to figure out a complicated rotation, the Brooklyn Nets -- who owe Boston a first-round pick -- look like one of the NBA's worst teams.

The Nets are winless through five games, and losing by an average of 14.6 points per contest. Only one of their games has been decided by single digits. They have the 29th-rated offense, the 28th-rated defense, and a worse net rating (-16.2) than every team except the New Orleans Pelicans (-16.4), who have been decimated by injuries and two doses of Stephen Curry.

Brooklyn has played all quality opponents, but if the first win doesn't come Friday against the Los Angeles Lakers...


devin kharpertian @uuords
The Nets are 0-5, worst start since 0-18. Here’s their next 13 games. Friday vs. Lakers their best shot.
7:31 PM - 4 Nov 2015
 2 2 Retweets   5 5 likes





If Celtics fans want to lift themselves into a state of giddiness, they should head over to read the great Devin Kharpertian at The Brooklyn Game. His most recent piece will inspire dreams of possible No. 1 pick Ben Simmons.

Kharpertian noted how Brooklyn is knocking down fewer than four 3-pointers per game (less than Curry by himself) while allowing opponents to hit a league-best 41.5 percent from behind the arc.

"It's not time to panic," Kharpertian wrote. "Panic implies that there's something horribly wrong in the plan. This is the plan.
"These five games haven't told us anything we didn't expect. The Brooklyn Nets aren't playing well above or below expectation. Brook Lopez is still putting up numbers; Thaddeus Young is still putting up solid performances, Jarrett Jack is still putting up shots. Their young players aren't slogging through minutes; of their veterans, only Joe Johnson is experiencing an out-of-the-blue drop-off.

"The panic time was June, when they waived Deron Williams to get under the luxury tax. Or the previous offseason, when they unloaded Paul Pierce. Or two offseasons ago, when they traded three first-round picks for Pierce and Kevin Garnett. This isn't time to panic, this is the result of panic. This is what happens when the plan fails, and the team needs to start anew with few seeds to plant."

It would be nice for the Nets if one of those seeds could be a first-round pick. But Boston owns Brooklyn's picks in 2016 and 2018, and holds the right to swap places with the Nets in 2017.


devin kharpertian @uuords
Only 323 games left until the Nets control a draft pick.
7:58 PM - 4 Nov 2015
 51 51 Retweets   43 43 likes



Rod Boone ✔ @rodboone
Lionel Hollins on Nets: "We are moving forward. It doesn’t look like it because we are still losing. But I think that we are moving forward"
7:45 PM - 4 Nov 2015
 5 5 Retweets   5 5 likes



bob
MY NOTE:  This is a topic we will be hitting on all year, obviously.  It is amazing that we own their unprotected picks for the next 3 years.  It's the gift that keeps on giving.  When Len Bias died, Red said that it wasn't the loss of Bias the next year that hurt the Celtics, it was the loss of Len Bias for the next 10 years that hurt the Celtics.  That's what the Pierce/KG/JT trade to Brooklyn could be, in reverse, for us.  It could set us up with talent and assets for the next 10 years. Lionel Hollins says they are making progress. Really? They've gone from the 30th ranked offense to only the 29th? From the 29th ranke defense to only the 28th? That's like a waiter on the Titanic asking a customer, as they get into the lifeboats, if they'd like some ice with their to-go cup. All we need now is a key injury and not even Sam Hinkie will be able to keep up with their powerdive.


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a word of caution about the nets.

while I think it VERY likely we will get a top 5 or better draft pick this year. I wouldn't count on the 2017 pick swap or the 2018 ipck being that high.

The nets have only about $56M in salarys cap numbers on thier boooks for next year with 10 players. So they WILL be able to sign a max player next year to replace the ghost of Joe Johnson (who's contract will gone).

SO I won;t be surprised if the Nets start to improve next season and those draft picks are not top 10 type picks

kdp59 wrote:a word of caution about the nets.

while I think it VERY likely we will get a top 5 or better draft pick this year. I wouldn't count on the 2017 pick swap or the 2018 ipck being that high.

The nets have only about $56M in salarys cap numbers on thier boooks for next year with 10 players. So they WILL be able to sign a max player next year to replace the ghost of Joe Johnson (who's contract will gone).

SO I won;t be surprised if the Nets start to improve next season and those draft picks are not top 10 type picks

Good point.  The hope, at least for me, is that the later Nets' picks will at least be better than our own.  That is guaranteed in 2017.

gyso

Mike Conley is a free agent next summer and has a good relationship with coach Hollins.

Evan Roberts on WFAN this morning said, "If the Nets don't beat the Lakers tonight they could be 0 and 40.  Or at least 0 and 12."

Pretty funny.  Roberts is a terrific sports commentator and a huge Nets fan.  And tells it like he sees it.

By the way, that 0-12 prediction by Roberts if they don't win tonight takes them to a home and home vs Boston. Outside of tonight he sees those as the next winnable games for Brooklyn. Guess he doesn't hold the Celtics in very high regard.

steve3344 wrote:Evan Roberts on WFAN this morning said, "If the Nets don't beat the Lakers tonight they could be 0 and 40.  Or at least 0 and 12."

Pretty funny.  Roberts is a terrific sports commentator and a huge Nets fan.  And tells it like he sees it.

By the way, that 0-12 prediction by Roberts if they don't win tonight takes them to a home and home vs Boston.  Outside of tonight he sees those as the next winnable games for Brooklyn.  Guess he doesn't hold the Celtics in very high regard.

steve,

Dare I say it?

"GO LAKERS!"


bob


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bobheckler wrote:

steve3344 wrote:Evan Roberts on WFAN this morning said, "If the Nets don't beat the Lakers tonight they could be 0 and 40.  Or at least 0 and 12."

Pretty funny.  Roberts is a terrific sports commentator and a huge Nets fan.  And tells it like he sees it.

By the way, that 0-12 prediction by Roberts if they don't win tonight takes them to a home and home vs Boston.  Outside of tonight he sees those as the next winnable games for Brooklyn.  Guess he doesn't hold the Celtics in very high regard.

steve,

Dare I say it?

"GO LAKERS!"


bob


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Bob - Absoeffinlutely

Another Net loss.

dboss

"Go lakers?"

Really Bob? Really?

I bet Philly is rooting for the Lakers to win also. The Lakers number one draft pick goes to Philly as long as the Lakers don't end up with one of the 3 worst records.

swish

Matty wrote:"Go lakers?"

Really Bob? Really?

When "Go Lakers" works out to the same as "Go Celtics"? Absolutely. My two favorite teams this season are the Celtics and everybody playing the Nets, including the Lakers.


bob


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Sooner or later the Celtics will get some luck in the draft.  We have been close but have not had a home run for a long time.

It's a game of odds.  With each Nets loss the value of that pick continues to increase.  Some team out there is going to want that pick.  If this turns into a top 3 pick it is a keeper IMO.

dboss

dboss wrote:Sooner or later the Celtics will get some luck in the draft.  We have been close but have not had a home run for a long time.

It's a game of odds.  With each Nets loss the value of that pick continues to increase.  Some team out there is going to want that pick.  If this turns into a top 3 pick it is a keeper IMO.

dboss

Just wait until draft week/day. When Frank Kaminsky is worth more than 4 first round picks, you can imagine what a top 3 pick will be worth in the frenzy of draft day once these GMs get a hopeless man-crush on one of these top picks.

Even by Dec/Jan/Feb that pick is going to have great value, not that we should necessarily trade it. It's just that Boston is a contender this season as long as we have that and the other picks, as long as the losses don't pile up too much.

Like, in January the Celtics could probably trade that Nets pick for Jusuf Nurkic and Danillo Gallinari if they wanted to. Or Marc Gasol. Or Nerlens Noel. Or Embiid.

Offers like that are going to start popping up in the next 3 months.

Personally I'm leaning towards wanting to keep the pick, but it's not an awesome draft for big man defenders. Skal would be the closest thing to that, but he's more of a PF.

There's no Nurkic style physical specimens that I can see.

But Skal, Bender, Ingram, and Jamal Brown all look like great two way players, and Ben Simmons a great offensive star like Blake Griffin.

rambone wrote:

dboss wrote:Sooner or later the Celtics will get some luck in the draft.  We have been close but have not had a home run for a long time.

It's a game of odds.  With each Nets loss the value of that pick continues to increase.  Some team out there is going to want that pick.  If this turns into a top 3 pick it is a keeper IMO.

dboss

Just wait until draft week/day. When Frank Kaminsky is worth more than 4 first round picks, you can imagine what a top 3 pick will be worth in the frenzy of draft day once these GMs get a hopeless man-crush on one of these top picks.

Even by Dec/Jan/Feb that pick is going to have great value, not that we should necessarily trade it. It's just that Boston is a contender this season as long as we have that and the other picks, as long as the losses don't pile up too much.

Like, in January the Celtics could probably trade that Nets pick for Jusuf Nurkic and Danillo Gallinari if they wanted to. Or Marc Gasol. Or Nerlens Noel. Or Embiid.

Offers like that are going to start popping up in the next 3 months.

Personally I'm leaning towards wanting to keep the pick, but it's not an awesome draft for big man defenders. Skal would be the closest thing to that, but he's more of a PF.

There's no Nurkic style physical specimens that I can see.

But Skal, Bender, Ingram, and Jamal Brown all look like great two way players, and Ben Simmons a great offensive star like Blake Griffin.

Frank Kaminsky is not worth more than 4 first round picks any more than a 1968 VW Microbus is worth more than all four of a 1968 Mustang (like Rozier) and a 1968 Camaro (like Hunter) and a 1968 El Camino with a long bed rear (like Mickey) and a 1968 clunker that can be donated for the tax write-off (like Thornton).  The owner of the VW might prefer it, like the way MJ preferred Kaminsky over those picks, but that doesn't make it so except in his mind.  A top 3 pick is worth a lot, to someone who likes/needs whatever talent is featured at the top of the draft board, but that doesn't have anything to do with MJ's ultra-odd obsession with Kaminsky.

btw, the object of MJ's man-crush is averaging 3.7 points, 1.2 rebounds on 41% fg% in 10mpg over 6 games.  Kelly's first year, which absolutely sucked until the last month or so, was better than that.



bob



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Kaminsky was worth more than 4 first round picks to Jordan, and that's all that matters.

The same irrationality that had Ainge all gaga over Winslow, and MJordan all gaga over Kaminsky, will happen again on draft day next year.

Just like KG and PP were worth 3 unprotected first round picks, because that's what Danny got for them.

Draft pick value goes in cycles. In the summer of 2013, those future first rounders in '16, '17, alund '18 had limited value, especially when Billy King and Prokhovic developed man crushes on KG and PP and lost all rationality.

Danny showed the exact same irrationality on draft day this year, and it's a predictable occurrence every year for most GMs.

And fans too.

The same foot that Lopez has had three surgeries on is acting up. Maybe it's nothing major, but that's a huge red flag. Lopez has been playing pretty well for them, leading them in points (20.4) and blocks (1.7) and second in rebounds (7.7 vs. 7.9 for Thaddeus Young).

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14078746/brook-lopez-brooklyn-nets-exits-game-vs-milwaukee-bucks-sore-right-foot

Brooklyn Nets center Brook Lopez left Saturday night's 94-86 loss in Milwaukee with a sore right foot. X-rays were negative, according to the team.

Lopez will not require further testing on his foot, a source confirmed.

Lopez has undergone three surgeries on his right foot in an 18-month span. Last season, he suffered a right mid-foot sprain that caused him to miss the first two games of the 2014-15 campaign.

Lopez played 39 minutes on Friday night, then played 29 minutes on Saturday before checking out of the game with 40 seconds left in the third quarter. He appeared frustrated on the bench before heading to the locker room. He finished with 20 points.

Outside wrote:The same foot that Lopez has had three surgeries on is acting up. Maybe it's nothing major, but that's a huge red flag. Lopez has been playing pretty well for them, leading them in points (20.4) and blocks (1.7) and second in rebounds (7.7 vs. 7.9 for Thaddeus Young).

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14078746/brook-lopez-brooklyn-nets-exits-game-vs-milwaukee-bucks-sore-right-foot

Brooklyn Nets center Brook Lopez left Saturday night's 94-86 loss in Milwaukee with a sore right foot. X-rays were negative, according to the team.

Lopez will not require further testing on his foot, a source confirmed.

Lopez has undergone three surgeries on his right foot in an 18-month span. Last season, he suffered a right mid-foot sprain that caused him to miss the first two games of the 2014-15 campaign.

Lopez played 39 minutes on Friday night, then played 29 minutes on Saturday before checking out of the game with 40 seconds left in the third quarter. He appeared frustrated on the bench before heading to the locker room. He finished with 20 points.

outside,

At the minimum this should cut way down on his minutes, if not sitting him out games.

That means either Barf-nani playing a lot more minutes at center, which he is completely incapable of, or a lot of small ball (or both).

If there are people who are not comfortable with Kelly Olynyk playing a lot of minutes at center, when he was drafted to play PF, Net fans should be white-knuckled with fear at the prospect of Barf-nani doing the same. The Barfer's game makes Kelly look like Gorilla Monsoon.

And for small ball, who do they have? 34 year old Joe Johnson? Thaddeus Young. Ok, he's a winner. Bogdanovic is not that effetive and Rondae-Jefferson is a rookie. Jarrett Jack and Shane Larkin are ok but not great and not great depth. Thomas Robinson is El Busto.

Danny is looking like a genius right now.



bob


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The Nets are in trouble. A major fleecing...So bad that other GM's are afraid to cut a deal for fear of being taken advantage of even when it would be a good deal for them.

But sometimes deals should not be made and in this case 4 first rounders for the right to draft Winslow was way too high. Sure glad MJ is not the smartest pencil in the box when it comes to evaluating trade value.

dboss

dboss,

For a chance at getting Winslow, four such picks may have not been too bad depending upon which four number one picks were in the deal.  If they trade had included picks like Minnesota's pick this year or the C's pick in 2018 then getting a very athletic kid at a spot of need would have been OK with me.  The Minnesota pick may turn into two second rounders and the Cs 2018 pick could be in the high twenties if all goes well in the next few years.

Winslow may have made things go well in those next few years even if he was not automatically a starting player averaging 15 points and 7 boards per game this year.

There is a lot to be said for the Cs having too many draft picks right now and for the next three years, in my opinion.  Some of them will be needed, but many will never see the inside of the practice facility or ever where a Cs shirt that they did not purchase themselves.  Their own picks are going to diminish in value to both them and potential trade partners as the team gets better and the picks get higher and higher in the first round.  Of course, the better the team is their second rounders will also have less value as time goes on.

Now if any of the Nets picks were to be used for Winslow, I would have had a fit because all three of these picks could well be first round picks for the next three years into the top ten picks.

For this who favor tanking, take a look at this recent Bill Simmons tweet:

Bill Simmons ‏@BillSimmons Nov 6
Sac Kings had the 4th, 5th, 7th, 5th, 7th, 8th and 6th overall picks heading into the last 7 drafts... and they're gonna suck again.

Shamrock1000 wrote:For this who favor tanking, take a look at this recent Bill Simmons tweet:

Bill Simmons ‏@BillSimmons  Nov 6
Sac Kings had the 4th, 5th, 7th, 5th, 7th, 8th and 6th overall picks heading into the last 7 drafts... and they're gonna suck again.

God Bless You, Shamrock (oh yeah, and you too Simmons)!  

Everyone wants to talk about Anthony Davis and Wiggins and how the agony of tanking can get you them but nobody wants to talk about Robinson and Bennett.  If tanking for higher draft picks was the path to a championship then the Finals every year would be Charlotte vs either Minny or Sacto.


bob


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