Post-game Thread: Celtics @ Lakers, 1/30/11

[Sam]

Usually someone beats me to the punch in starting a post-game thread. Given the huge number of story lines in this game, I'm shocked that it's about midnight and that hasn't yet happened. I can only hope that all board members are having a great time doing something else.

• As I stated on the game-on thread, I felt the pivotal point in the game was when the Lakers were forced by Pierce's barrage of points to put Kobe on Paul. It didn't affect Paul materially and let Rondo out of jail (15 assists in the second half).

• Another important adjustment came when Doc switched Paul onto Kobe. Paul played some great defense on Kobe. Then, when Paul got his fourth foul, Doc switched Ray back onto Kobe, and Ray was fresh enough to slow him down slightly—which was enough. I think Steve said Kobe was something like 5-11 in the 4th quarter.

• In the "Straight from Sam's Shoulder" thread, I've addressed yet another major factor which I think contains implications for the rest of the season. Our lumbering centers are essential for banging and softening up opponents while the game is seesawing back and forth. But, during that pivotal stretch when either Russ or Red said each game is won, I want Davis in there at center with KG, Paul, Ray and Rondo. The team is simply more dynamic at both ends with Glen in there.

• Nate was just great while being used exactly as he should be—an energy spark at the "2" off the bench who can be replaced if he's misfiring by Wafer. This strategy will, of course, be much more feasible when Delonte returns to play the "1" off the bench so as to give Rondo sufficient rest.

• I thought Doc was a bit outcoached in the first half. Loved Phil's move of taking out Kobe in the last minute to avoid his getting a third foul and then reinserting him on offense to score some more. Too bad Phil couldn't also have sent in a substitute head for Odom, who committed what might be an historically stupid last-instant foul.

• But I thought Doc more than redeemed himself in the second half with his aforementioned coverages changes, substitutions and play-calling down the stretch. And he was rewarded on nearly every possession, which wouldn't happen every time—but I'm glad it happened today.

• I want to make it clear that, in promoting Glen for the center position during "pivotal" sequences, I'm not dissing Perk or Shaq. Without scoring, they made contributions by grabbing 5 offensive (Lakers won that battle by only 1 despite the fact that they had far more missed shot opportunities) and 7 defensive rebounds (34-20 Celtics overall). And the stats don't tell the whole story. They deterred the Lakers from taking the ball to the hoop more often (a favorite ploy of Celtics opponents).

• Ray is just a phenomenon. Pretty much indescribable. Why do I almost always have confidence his next shot is going in, even if he's just missed six in a row? He's just a dagger personified.

• Last year, at least one of the Three Amigos seemed off in a load of games. This year, all three of them are cooking more often that not. That, plus the fact that all three can score inside or outside, creates a simply impossible defensive challenge for most opponents.

• My game ball would have to be split between Paul (an amazing display of both offense and defense, even when in foul trouble) and KG (an amazing display of rebounding and some of the most timely shooting I've seen in a while—curtailing the Lakers' momentum more than once). (For a more expert opinion on split balls, write to Channing Frye, Soprano c/o Phoenix Suns). Geez, KG got whacked on the cranium, returned with his kerchief, and immediately swished a jumper at a critical moment. (I heard that Kevin's scalp was stretched so tight they had to ship him to a micro-seamstress in Denmark.)

• While everyone (especially Bill Walton) seemed to feel Rondo was a "no show" in the first half, Doc disagreed after the game. He felt Rondo orchestrated things beautifully (I think Doc used the word "perfectly"), getting everyone in their right places, etc. I think Kobe just did a great job of denying Rondo the way he wanted to operate. Of course, I didn't notice anyone crediting Rondo with forcing the Lakers to put Fish on Ray, who had a very good shooting game. I think I might have said once or twice before that it's not about the individual: it's all about the team.

• Give the Lakers credit. For the most part, I think most of their starters worked their butts off in playing excellent defense. But they seemed short of offensive options. I expected more out of Pau. Bynum showed signs of how valuable he can be to the Lakers, but his impact wasn't really sustained. I almost keeled over when Phil said on tv, around the beginning of the 4th quarter, that he didn't know what the problem was but Ron just wasn't doing anything out there. I mean, it was true, but does a coach say that to millions of people DURING THE GAME? I would have tried to motivate Artest so that he'd do a better job on Paul, leaving Kobe to guard Rondo. Maybe I shortchanged Doc earlier in terms of how much he outcoached Mr. Buss. I'll be shocked if the Lakers don't at least try to shop Artest before the deadline; but right now, who would give anyone good for him at his salary level?

• They said there are plans to honor Kobe by putting his handprints in cement at Grauman's Chinese Theatre. I wonder if there's any chance he might get stuck in butt-up position. I've seen some interesting looking vagrants out there. Sorry, TJ, Mustang, Sky...I just can't stand Smirkola as a person (and I hope he'd hate me too). What does it say that they're doing this? (1) Yup, pro basketball is now officially just another entertainment form. (2) Jerry, Elgin, Kareem, and Magic were just bums. (3) The Kinks now have to rewrite "Celluloid Heroes." (Maybe they can include Kobe and Elmer Fudd in the same verse. Wascawwy Wabbit!)

Sam

[Outside]

Obviously a nice win for the Celts.

I could point to the fact that it seemed like everyone in green was hot, but to me the determining factor was that the Celtics were clearly the hungrier team. The play when Garnett ran down the floor for a layup while the Laker bigs lagged behind was a perfect example. Perhaps the Lakers will get that hunger come playoff time, but I'm not certain they will, or that even if they do, that it will translate immediately into the peak efficiency they will need to prevail. It's so hard to repeat as champion, to maintain that hunger when you've already won. The Lakers haven't shown that yet against elite competition.

Besides that, what I saw on the Lakers' side is that Artest is dragging them down, Bynum still looks slow and heavy, they miss Barnes, and Pau needs to make quicker decisions. With Pau, one time he got the ball at the high post and immediately made a quick, strong move to the basket, drawing a foul (on Shaq, if I remember correctly). Most times, however, he held the ball way too long and either passed it out with little time on the clock or eventually made a move that didn't end well. Once he decides he's going to take a shot, he needs to do it more quickly.

On the Celtics' side, darn near everyone looked great. That's about as good as Pierce gets, Ray and Garnett were great, Nate was hitting, Davis was excellent, and they rebounded well as a team, even at the offensive end. About the only negative things that come to mind are Rondo's shooting, Shaq's fouls, and the free-throw shooting early. But they were amped up, wanted it more, and it showed in their excellent play. The Lakers were actually pretty good to keep up with them until the last few minutes, but the Lakers couldn't sustain it like the Celtics did.

Outside

[Sam]

Outside,

I actually think Shaq's fouls may have had a major role in the Celtics 'victory. Coupled with Perk's minutes "restriction, those fouls has a lot to do with Glen Davis being on the floor with the starters at crunch time.

There was some talk about Artest being injured. (I think it may have been among the tv crew, so that probably means nothing.) To be that lethargic is really strange, even to a Celtics fan.

More and more, I think I'll be happy with this Celtics team once Delonte provides the most obviously missing piece. Anyway, no Tums last night, so that's a good thing.

Take care,

Sam

[jeb]

meester sam

Two things i like are that we have risen up in big games against marquee teams and I really love the way we have taken care of home court. Two things we did not do all last year that clearly left a bad taste in these proud vets mouths.

What a great win.

[cowens/oldschool]

I've read alot about Pau not playing well,well it had alot to do with KG,hes an all-time defensive great with all the credentials and his defense on Pau was textbook.KG has been pineing for this game for a while now and he and Pierce and Ray were all playing inspired ball.The Celtics definitely wanted this game more and were more intense to send a statement.Shaq contributed by rebounding and defending,his 15 or so minutes still helps keep Perk and Baby fresh.

I think putting Kobe on Rondo is the best match up to maximize Kobes effectiveness,it takes alot of energy to chase Ray through the maze,ask Dwayne Wade,so to keep his game fresh for offense they need to put him on Rondo.Derek Fisher is the most annoying piece of shit I've ever seen,screaming and waving his arms when he gets near Perk,pathetic,hes a woman.Could somebody let him play in the WNBA?

[bobheckler]

What a great game. It had it all. Captain vs. Captain man-a-mano. Seesawing offensive runs. Drama-R-Us. I opined on the "What's wrong with the Lakers" thread that there was nothing wrong with them that the playoffs couldn't fix, that they were just bored. Well, anybody who tries to claim that this game didn't mean anything to every player on both teams is wrong. If anything, both teams looked past their previous opponents, to both of their chagrins, to prematurely focus on this one. Playing lethargically doesn't necessarily mean you don't care, it might just be that you're not able to do some of the stuff you want to and normally can do and that forces you out of your efficiency zone.

Outside pointed out that everybody in green was hot. True. That's what player and ball movement will do for you. Players are executing plays. They are energized and going to where they know they are most likely to get the ball and a good shot. One-on-one only gets one player energized and while one great player can beat 5 really good players that's not where the smart money goes.

1. Kobe and Paul were awesome. Kobe hoisted 29 fga, but he shot a high percentage (55%). His teammates weren't helping him much, but which came first, the chicken or the egg? If everybody knows Kobe's shooting, why move? If nobody's moving, why wouldn't Kobe try to carry the team? The Lakers were up by 4 at the half so whatever they were doing was fine. Paul shot 61%. One difference between their games was that Paul had 3 assists and Kobe had none. Considering how much the ball is in Kobe's hands, that would infer that NOBODY was open or moving for the entire game OR, he just didn't want to give up the rock. At one point, Kobe took 10 consecutive shots. Phil said "Nobody else seemed to want the ball". NOT a good playoff-level perspective, and how do you fix that? Which brings us to...

2. The Lakers only had 10 assists on 36fgm (for an execrabale SamStat of 27%). Total. For the whole game. Our bench had 7, for Pete's Sake. Then again, the Lakers bench had 6. That means that the entire Laker starting unit combined for only 4 assists. Considering how much Kobe plays with the starters... That is NOT team play. Was that the chicken's fault, or the egg's? Either way, it makes for a more easily defensed offense. If you know who has the ball isn't going to pass it, you know who you have to stop, don't you? For us, we had 34 assists, significantly overachieving our already league-leading average of 24 and a SamStat of 77%. I can't remember a game where the Celtics' SamStat has been that high. Do you, Sam?

3. When you overplay shooters, however, you tend to give up a lot of offensive rebounds. The Lakers only had one more offensive rebound than the Celtics. Overall, we killed them on the boards. We are, I think, the second worst rebounding team in the league, #29 out of 30, and the Lakers are the #3 best rebounding team in the league at home and we killed them on the boards. We need more of this every game.

4. Ron Artest did not have a good game. From what I've heard, he hasn't had a good season, in general, but he didn't do his primary job yesterday and that is to shut Pierce down. His 1-10 shooting really hurt them.

5. Derek Fisher had a good defensive game, with 4 steals. His shooting was verging on Artest-esque at 1-6. His acting skills, though, are par excellence. As Mark Jackson repeatedly pointed out D-Fish "sold" the foul to the officials. That's french for "acting". Their other point guard, Steve Blake, barely showed up.

6. Pau went back to being Gasoft. I don't know what's the matter with him this year. KG owned him yesterday. KG's +/- was +9, Gasol's was -20!! KG took him inside and out. The only time Pau showed any effectiveness was when Shaq was on him. Laker fans disagree with me on this, but I think Pau is the Lakers' MVP, not Kobe. So goes Pau, so goes the Lakers. Yesterday was a good example. Kobe had a great game, a truly great game, yet they lost by 13.

7. I agree with Sam on Davis. The Laker twin towers couldn't handle him in the 4th quarter. Apparently, his hamstring wasn't as big an issue as we feared. They would have Hacked-a-Shaq black-and-blue. Same with Perk.

8. We shot 60%. Wow. We shot 53% from 3. Wow. Can we bottle this?

Now on to face the surging Sacramento Kings. They beat the Lakers in LA and just beat the NO Hornets at home.

A great day to be green!!

bob

.

[dbrown4]

My two cents for what it's worth:

1) Just loved the stark differences between Kobe/LAL and Pierce/BOS in the latter stages of the game. I remember for just a momemt thinking this was going to turn into mano-a-mano, who's going to score the most points battle. But it didn't because Paul knows better. And we've seen this many times before thanks to LeBron and CLE. Paul backed off and let his team win the game while Kobe is still into putting the team on his back and carrying them to victory.

2) At least temporarily, Danny and Doc can feel really good they have solved the rebounding problem we have 7 months ago. And strangely enough they did it with Shaq not even scoring a point and only 6 rebounds.

3) I'm not going to see Adam Sandler's new movie simply because he and that inane reporter wasted about 5 minutes of real game time play with completely stupid banter. I hate the split screen in general even when Doc is talking. I hate it even more when they don't even have the game up and all you are watching is the side interview. Your brain is incapable of doing two things at the same time. Please someone inform the idiots that broadcast these games of this simple fact.

4) LAL assists = 10, BOS assists = 34. That just about tells you everything about the major differences between the two teams at this stage.

5) I love the way the press thinks having one guy score all the points is the way to win basketball games. Team basketball is so boring and passe to them. Keep thinking that while we're hanging #18.

6) Can't wait for Delonte to return. Still after All-Star break? Come on Doc(s), cut him loose early like you did Perk! We want to see our fully operational death star in action!

7) The boys and I are on RA record-breaking full alert! Next few games should be real fun. I'm in the DiMaggio camp. With RA going for at least another year or two, this one will be around forever. They will remember this for the rest of their lives.

KG keeps scaring a 3D. He'll have at least one by the end of the season.

Watch out for tigers lurking in the weeds tomorrow. Just ask LAL. Please don't have a let down. Finish strong. Also, LAL comes to Boston in less than two weeks. Tough two week stretch.

[mrkleen09]

Kobe, Phil, Arest, Pau - et al

[Outside]

I actually think Shaq's fouls may have had a major role in the Celtics 'victory. Coupled with Perk's minutes "restriction, those fouls has a lot to do with Glen Davis being on the floor with the starters at crunch time.

If I read you correctly, you're having a little fun at Shaq's expense. My guess (and I think you'd agree) is that Davis would have been on the court regardless. He was clearly their best post player offensively.

I second what the group has said about Davis on the SSS thread. He's made himself into a tremendous player.

Outside pointed out that everybody in green was hot. True. That's what player and ball movement will do for you. Players are executing plays. They are energized and going to where they know they are most likely to get the ball and a good shot. One-on-one only gets one player energized and while one great player can beat 5 really good players that's not where the smart money goes.

I think that's what focus and energy from elite players working within the team system does for you. That's what hunger does for you. I'm not saying at all that the Celtics were lucky because they happened to be hot; I'm saying that the Celtics were hot because they came in hungry and translated that hunger into energy, focus, and execution. It's the best I've seen any team play this year.

I have to disagree with many of the characterizations people have posted about the Lakers. If the Lakers were that bad while the Celtics were playing absolutely great, how was it a four-point game (91-87) with five minutes to go? The Lakers had deficiencies, to be sure, but they played well enough to be in a position to win the game with five minutes left, so I don't think they were epically awful. The Celtics played great and were not to be denied, and the Lakers did not rise to that challenge for most of the second half and for the last five minutes in particular.

Realistically, if the Lakers were truly awful yesterday yet were able to compete for most of the game when the Celtics were playing as well as they can play, that wouldn't bode well for the Celtics, because that would mean the Lakers could beat the Celtics at their best if they would just do a little better job of rebounding, using their post advantage, and moving the ball. Personally, I don't believe that. The Celtics played great and beat a Laker team that was good on a day when good wasn't enough.

Outside

[jeb]

welll said outside.

They hung very close til the very end and it WAS a great game. The Lakers are still a very dangerous team and that's why it is so exciting to beat them.

Cheers

Jeb

[beat]

Actually Outside I did not think we played all that great. We blew leads at or near the end of the first 2 quarters and really aside from some rebounds got nothing offensively from our bigs ( Perk and Shaq ).

LA out ran us by a lot on the fast break points 17-5. And even though we were outrebounding them they were leading at the half.

But we hung in there and played better in the second half.

A Rondo that is free to roam and make decisions was able to put the ball where it needed to be for much of the second half.

In the end we continued to make them work and even though it was still sort of close with 3-4 minutes to go they had about cashed in the chips.
Sort of like a python squezzing the lifeblood and breath out of their prey and then devouring them. We came out on top this time.

We played hard for 48 minutes. They didn't. Perhaps it was nothing more than we wanted it more than most of them did.

Really hope this game starts us off on a nice winning streak. Tough games ahead for sure but as Perk gets back into the rotation and with West's return looming just a couple weeks away we might be in the best shape any Celtic team has been at this point in a season in a while, even better than the 08 team. Time will tell, always does.

beat

[LACELTFAN]

For my two cents worth...I don't see either team as having a clear advantage on the other yet with the exception that the C's may have more overall balance and are more likely to have a smaller winning and losing margin than the Lakers, game to game, because of the D...I think either can win on the other's floor and both teams will be different than they are during the regular season...more focused.

[babyskyhook]

In the end we continued to make them work and even though it was still sort of close with 3-4 minutes to go they had about cashed in the chips.
Sort of like a python squezzing the lifeblood and breath out of their prey and then devouring them. We came out on top this time.

We played hard for 48 minutes. They didn't. Perhaps it was nothing more than we wanted it more than most of them did.

beat

beat-

I was going to sum up the game fro my view, but you totally nailed it.

The Cs played hard the entire game. Every played in green came to play.
They wanted it more and it was really plain to see the difference in energy and passion. Gasol and Bynum looked like they were at a pre-seaosn game, while KG, Perk and Baby were playing for real. And I could go on an on, but you nailed it. Cs wanted it and played hard. Lakers (outside of Kobe) were half-assed throughout.


Kobe was the only Laker who brought his A game in terms of effort, focus and execution. No one else showed up ready to play. So as Kobe started to run out of gas the last few minutes, it definitely felt like a python gaining final control over its prey, as the Cs had controlled most of the game, and when the Cs went on that run after the Lakers cut it to a four point game, it was over. One player is never going to beat five- especially when those five include three HOFers playing at a very, very high level and two of the best young players in the game at the two toughest positions to fill (1 and 5).

[LACELTFAN]

baby...It's tough for me to see the Lakers playing that way when the chips are down come playoff time. My convoluted theory for the Lakers and C's but especially the Lakers is that during the regular season focus is tougher than during the playoffs...

[babyskyhook]

Some other thoughts-



Difference between Lakers complete lack of player and ball movement and the Cs great player and ball movement was night and day.

As BobH alluded to, there is a chicken/egg dynamic when Kobe goes into takeover mode. Yesterday, the bigs were passive and no one was moving. Kobe takes over, and then that lack of movement and passing became even worse for the rest of the game. The Cs movement and passing got better as the game went along, and once Kobe switched onto Pierce, Rondo's passing really took over to put the game away.

No real surprise- as is almost always the case, well-executed team ball beat stagnant one on five ball, even when that one is playing phenomenally well.




KG looked great. moving really well and getting good elevation again. I would never know he's had knee surgery from watching him now.



Big Baby was in my eyes the player of the game.

His hustle, energy and determination really broke the Lakers' backs in the second half. He had so many small plays that were important, and his defense vs Bynum to wrestle with him in the post kept Bynum passive when he should have been attacking him.




The crowd was as half-assed as the players. Spoiled by back to back titles and by Games 6 and 7 last year, the energy just wasn't there as you would expect it to be for a game vs the Cs. This wasn't a Tues night vs the TWolves. This was the Cs. The rematch. The return of Shaq. Didn't matter. Crowd was almost as flat as the team. Came alive when the team did, but as opposed to game 7, where the team was floundering but the crowd kept urging them on, this crowd went quiet when the team was floundering.

So with the fans in sleepwalk mode, I can certainly understand why the players are. I wouldn't be surprised to see LA end up as a 4 seed in the West, with a lot of ugly games to go in the reg season before these guys dial their intensity up.


I'm not worried, as I saw the same movie last year (and saw the Cs version as well), but man it makes the reg season painful to watch.



Congrats to the Cs for a hard-fought, well-deserved win. They wanted it more and they got it.

Hopefully the Lakers will at least bring a full effort for 48 min in Boston in ten days so we can see a better game that goes down to the wire.

[mrkleen09]

The Celtics are a completely different team than the team that lost in the finals last year.

-KG is healthy
-Big Baby is much better
-Shaq and (eventually JON) give their inside game an entirely different look
-They have more consistent depth off the bench (Marquis is playing 100% better / Wafer is solid / Nate can catch fire at anytime / Delonte is coming back soon)

A lot can happen between now and June – but with both teams at full strength and playing at the top of their games – the Celtics are head and shoulders above the Lakers.

[babyskyhook]

baby...It's tough for me to see the Lakers playing that way when the chips are down come playoff time. My convoluted theory for the Lakers and C's but especially the Lakers is that during the regular season focus is tougher than during the playoffs...

LAC-

I think you're exactly right. They are simply not focused at all this season. They remind me of last year's team post AS break and of last year's C's team.

I fully expect them to bring it full-steam in the playoffs, but not a moment before then.


I still think that if healthy, they will win it all, but it won't be an easy feat without HCA. Especially against the Cs. But that's what makes it exciting in the end, and that might be what this team needs in the postseason- A challenge to really make them raise their game mentally and physically to a level it hasn't been since Game 7.


PS- I might be in complete denial, but I'd rather find out in June that I was wrong and be disappointed at that time then spend the next five months worrying about a situation I have absolutely no control over. I'm going to grin and bare it through the reg season, not taking any of the gams too seriously, then get revved up for an awesome playoff ride. Can't really do anything more than that.

If the Lakers aren't going to take the reg season seriously why should I ?

[babyskyhook]

The Celtics are a completely different team than the team that lost in the finals last year.

-KG is healthy
-Big Baby is much better
-Shaq and (eventually JON) give their inside game an entirely different look
-They have more consistent depth off the bench (Marquis is playing 100% better / Wafer is solid / Nate can catch fire at anytime / Delonte is coming back soon)

A lot can happen between now and June – but with both teams at full strength and playing at the top of their games – the Celtics are head and shoulders above the Lakers.

I agree about KG and Baby.

I would add that Pierce seems to have lost weight and looks to be in better shape than I've seen for quite a while.

Shaq should help, although he was the only C who didn't perform well yesterday, which surprised me. He did not look good. But he'll help in May and June.

I don't think JON will give you anything, but you've not going to need him with Perk, Shaq and Davis. Put it this way, if JON is playing in the playoffs, the Cs have a much bigger problem than whatever Jerm has/doesn't have left in the tank because it means Perk or Davis is out.


Nate is the same player as last year- sometimes good, sometimes not, and Daniels still doesn't look good, but I think West will be a big help, and definitely (along with Shaq's addition and Baby's improvement) gives the Cs a better bench than last year.



Having said all that, the Cs aren't head and shoulders above the lakers with both teams healthy and at the top of their games.

A healthy Bynum, addition of Barnes and Blake, Brown's improvement (which was not on display at all yesterday unfortunately) all make the Lakers a better team than they were in the Finals last year. Substantially better.


With both teams healthy and at the top of their games, I think we would get another seven game series. Big questions are can both teams stay healthy and can the lakers turn it on in the postseason the way they and the Cs did last year ?

I think the second answer will be yes. I hope the first answer is yes.


As you said, a lot of bball to be played between now and June, but I think a Finals rematch is the most likely outcome. And if it happens, it will be one for the ages.

[beat]

Babysky

I doubt either team will be completely healthy at playoff time. And I'm not counting JO as part of that. Hopefully no major key injuries but there will no doubt be nagging small ones to any number of players unfortunately.

You also mentioned that Daniels doesn;t look good. He actually has done extreemly well over the course of the last 15-20 games. Don't let yesterday fool you.

beat

[beat]

Babysky

I doubt either team will be completely healthy at playoff time. And I'm not counting JO as part of that. Hopefully no major key injuries but there will no doubt be nagging small ones to any number of players unfortunately.

You also mentioned that Daniels doesn;t look good. He actually has done extreemly well over the course of the last 15-20 games. Don't let yesterday fool you.

beat

[babyskyhook]

Babysky

I doubt either team will be completely healthy at playoff time. And I'm not counting JO as part of that. Hopefully no major key injuries but there will no doubt be nagging small ones to any number of players unfortunately.

You also mentioned that Daniels doesn;t look good. He actually has done extreemly well over the course of the last 15-20 games. Don't let yesterday fool you.

beat

Agreed. Hopefully nothing major injury-wise. The nagging ones that we don't hear about are a given. (Unless Lebron needs another excuse for why his team fails in the playoffs, in which case we'll be hearing all about that nagging elbow again. )



As for Daniels, I will take your word for it, then, as I have only seen a few Cs games. The two vs Miami, a bit of early season games vs Mil and Chi and yesterday's game.

all of which (except yesterday) were before the 15-20 game stretch you mentioned. So fair enough.

[mrkleen09]

Having said all that, the Cs aren't head and shoulders above the lakers with both teams healthy and at the top of their games.

A healthy Bynum, addition of Barnes and Blake, Brown's improvement (which was not on display at all yesterday unfortunately) all make the Lakers a better team than they were in the Finals last year. Substantially better.

With both teams healthy and at the top of their games, I think we would get another seven game series. Big questions are can both teams stay healthy and can the lakers turn it on in the postseason the way they and the Cs did last year ?

I think the second answer will be yes. I hope the first answer is yes.

As you said, a lot of bball to be played between now and June, but I think a Finals rematch is the most likely outcome. And if it happens, it will be one for the ages.

A healthy Bynum is like the Lockness Monster or a beautiful Mermaid – no matter how much you wish for it, it simply does not exist.

As for Blake, Barnes and Brown making the Lakers a better team…that is not only debatable, but really of no consequence. The Celtics are built to bang down low – the Lakers have no answer for that, and in the grind of a 7 game series – unless the refs give LA 20+ FT advantages on a nightly basis, the Celtics will win the war of attrition down low. That is where the game will be won, and where the Cs will earn #18.

Celtics are a deeper, stronger, better team than the Lakers. Sorry.

[bobheckler]

I, for one, have little optimism that JON will be any more than window dressing this year. A combination of his ancient knees and newness with the team will limit his effectiveness. I hope I'm wrong.

Delonte West, on the other hand, will be a big difference maker IMO. He's coming into his prime now at 27 and was the starting guard on the team that had the best regular season record in the NBA two years ago and he played well in the playoffs that year. He can play 1 and 2. He played for Doc for a few years and already knows the playbook even though he's newly back and has been injured. I think the best thing to happen to Nate Robinson's game will be for West to come back. No more of those pesky point guard duties to worry his little head about, just shoot, shoot, shoot.

As far as who is the bigger, deeper, better team come playoffs; who knows?

We were until Perk went down. Suppose Bynum blows out a knee in the Finals. Will it matter, on paper, where they would be if...?


bob


.

[sinus007]

Bob,
Agree about JON = window dressing. I don't know what went behind that window but I believe that Doc will not risk putting him into rotation come playoffs.

AK

[Sam]

Mrkleen,

I'm not really disagreeing—just wondering whether we sometimes place a bit too much emphasis on our size/toughness advantage. Technically, we have such an advantage. But it comes with a price—lack of agility—that can be a problem against the right (or shown I say wrong?) team.

I'm not sure Perk is so far back yet that we know exactly what we've got in him. He seems a little lighter—somewhat more agile (as we saw when he chased some little guy around the perimeter recently). But, against Howard or Bynum or Bogut or other tough, reasonably mobile centers, Perk may be foul-prone—another element of the price I mentioned.

I'm delighted to have him back. I'm delighted he looks so good. I just don't want to overestimate his abilities without also considering the downside.

Sam

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