POST GAME ROCKETS

ROCKETS 93 BOSTON 77

No Tommy Points tonight. When the going got tough ...........we spit the bit!!!!!! Sorry but we walked away after getting our nose bloodied! Push Baby like that which could have caused him a knee injury and you don't come back with a hard...hard foul!!!!!!! That is not Celtic Basketball....more like D League ball!

I am now beginning to think that despite the good intention on Danny's part to improve the wing and add youth
yda ..........yda.......yda the move was too much at this late stage of the season to disrupt the chemistry of the team. The way the schedule is playing out there are no real formal workouts on off days like yesterday and the team is trying to find it self on the fly in real game situations that count. No...sorry don't buy the strategy by Danny. This could also affect Doc next year. Why come back?

112288

Perk sure was helping Thunder tonite, he with Ibaka and Durant have the best frontline in the league, Danny turned them into title contenders.....and they're going to be around for years.

Bob Ryan in the Globe said this....I have been around basketball for 42 years and I know one thing.......baring any physical problems which Rondo does not appear to have......there is something going on in his personal life that we don't know about and which is affecting him mentally. You know I don't often buy what Ryan is selling but it makes sense! He said it is classical behavior which he has seen in other athletes that in the past have had personal issues.

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Perkins wasn't going to sign with us next year unless the owner's wallets opened much wider. Good luck to him!
The problem I have with this is that Ainge lied to us IMO about the move being made to help us THIS year. Guess what. It ruined the team chemistry. I am not sure we would have won a ring anyway, but with Perk back and playing we would not be losing to bad team....no...getting BLOWN OUT by bad teams like the Clippers and the Rockets.
No effort at all tonite. Just pathetic.

And by the way, for those of you counting on Shaq to come back and save the day, this does not exactly sound encouraging. He's been out for nearly seven weeks and it still isn't "right"

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/extras/celtics_blog/2011/03/shaq_ill_be_bac.html

check out Rondos stat line, hes got to sit, if hes healthy sit him for terrible play, he can't do anything right now, if hes injured give him some time off......he needs something

Pumpsie, I like when they all start using the same phrase "We're Getting Close"
over and over and over........they have been getting close for 4 weeks and counting.

Management did not want to pay Perk even though they had a work horse who played cheap for years! They knew they were never going to sign him so they protected themselves down the road by acquiring a good ball player who, if they don't sign next year is a restricted player and the Celtics would get major compensation for him.

LET THE REBUILDING BEGIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BUT JUST LET THE FANS KNOW!
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In the nba you do not get compensated by the signing team when you lose a restricted free agent. You can keep the player by simply matching any offer that he receives. Failure to match and he's gonzo. No compensation.
swish

cowens/oldschool wrote:check out Rondos stat line, hes got to sit, if hes healthy sit him for terrible play, he can't do anything right now, if hes injured give him some time off......he needs something

4 for 29 his last three games. For a guy who's shot over 50% combined for the past four years that's a pretty severe (although short) shooting slump. He just doesn't look right. Doesn't look right on defense either.

Pumpsie Green wrote:And by the way, for those of you counting on Shaq to come back and save the day, this does not exactly sound encouraging. He's been out for nearly seven weeks and it still isn't "right"

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/extras/celtics_blog/2011/03/shaq_ill_be_bac.html

have to agree with you, the way Pierce, KG and especially Rondo are playing if they don't pick it up Shaq won't make a difference.

Looks like this run is over-Team is lifeless, listless no spark, no drive, no focus, no intensity-If McHale doesn't give Garnett to Danny he is a complete bust as both a GM and VP of basketball operations! Wyc better wake up and smell the coffee and see Ainge for the cheap bumbling idiot he is. If Wyc is tightening his hands on the check book then Wyc needs to sell the team to someone with pockets as deep as Buss and Cuban combined. Perk deserved the contract he got from OKC, but should have gotten it from the C's. This team isn't even fun to watch anymore. They say the opera ain't over 'til the Fat Lady sings. Well the Weather Girls are wailing, "It's Raining Men" Congrats to Thibs and the Bulls apparent 2011 Eastern Conference Champs. Thibs should have been compensated by management to take over for Doc. Celtic defense is disintegrating. Who gets the reigns now? Lawrence Frank? May as well be franks and beans!-MD

Instead of playing out his contract and trying free agency, Rondo re-upped at what turned out to be a big discount. Is it possible that partly he was thinking that he had friends on the Celtics, like Kendrick Perkins, whom he enjoyed playing with, and who were supposedly going to be around for a long time? If he's blaming the Celtics for the trade, he should really blame Perk, because he's the one who decided to look toward free agency.

That's the trade theory. The other theory is that he has never been the same since the injury back in November/December. There've been flashes of the old Rondo but he hasn't put it together for an entire game. Who would know better if he is injured - KG or Doc? Or, if he is hurt, would Doc it admit to the media?

Maybe it's a combination of the two. At least, Delonte came back just in time. When Shaq returns, we'll see how bad Rondo is. If he doesn't go back to feeding Shaq the way he did earlier in the season, then the problem is in his head and he needs to sit.

Look for the team to get on a roll soon. They all know exactly how many games are left and they are biding their time. They haven't forgotten the 1969 team, when even the great Bill Russell dogged it (although he did have a really bad knee) until about two weeks before the playoffs. They all have little injuries, but make no mistake: as Tommy said, this team has tremendous determination.

As for Pumpsie Green and the rest o' yas, take it easy, baby. There's no crying in basketball, except in Miami.

swish, correct. I wanted to keep it short but they can sign and trade and get value there.

112288

Hi,
Sam, I think you have to start "glimmer" thread ASAP to avert mass suiside on this forum.

Now to the sunny side.
It's only one game.
Everybody lost focus, didn't have drive which doesn't happen for more than a game or two or in playoffs.
Despite all the doom and gloom, NK and JG are progressing on D-end, IMO.
Chi lost as well.

AK

I couldn't watch the game last night.

I must admit I'm a bit worried about Rondo................on the other hand I'm not going to panic until he and the rest of them play this way in the playoffs!

I think we'll see another team at that time, so I'm just going to sit back and relax until then.
(No "Chicken Little" the sky is not falling - at least not for me, not yet anyway)

To be fair. This is to explain why some of us walk on the "cloudy side of the street" (that includes me). You may want to tell us to chill...but at some point, for those on the sunny side of the street, you need to start to explain the mounting losses and the direction of the team. It getting to a point that it's not just
"One loss" ...........now there are several with 4 losses in the last 6 games and no energy!

Let's look at reality for a moment:

1) The C's have only have 15 ......... count them 15 games left to get their act together, and we have seen little or none of that. It takes about 20 games to get your timing down including lots of practice time which we will have very little of down the stretch. Doc is not holding practice on off days, just some informal get together's with the new comers.

2) Every sports writer in the Boston papers and sports guy's on WEEI 850 all agree that Krstic is a nice complement coming off the bench but he is no front line starting center. Sooooooooooo.....................

3) We are putting all our chips on a 39 year old, 325 pound guy who's playing hurt the whole year as our main center to go into playoff battle with?

OK, forgot to mention the other O'Neil that could help us...the one with only one good leg who could retire at the end of the year.

4) Doc said in the papers this week when asked, would he rethink the Perkins trade if he knew now what was to be with Shaq or if Shaq does not come back...his answer was yes! To be fair...he said they still could win without Shaq but it would be extremely difficult. Doc...your being so kind!

So, Yes Us "Cloudy Side of The Street" Fans have legitimate concerns going into the playoff more so as the window to win #18 is closing quickly with the present Big 3!

112288

Rondo's pre and post Perk trade stats becoming even more startling:

Pre trade (44 games)

Pts: 11.05
FG %: .510
Assists: 12.25
Rebs: 4.5

Post trade (12 games):

Pts: 7.17
FG %: .374
Assists: 9.1
Rebs: 3.7

We lost. A game.

As far as "no defense" goes, we only gave up 93 points. The Rockets are averaging 105ppg. That makes them the #3 highest scoring team in the league. Our defense held them to 12 points below their average and just 2 points above our defensive average gives up. If Perk was here and we gave up 93 points to a team that usually scores 105 and lost because we only scored 77 we'd be bitching about our offense, not our defense, and so it should be here.

1. The Rockets shot 44% for the game. The Rockets average 45%, so we're still in the ballpark. The Rockets are averaging 85 fga/game, they only took 73 last night. That's pretty good defense. That's good tempo control for us. The problem is that we only shot 42% when we usually shoot 49%. We average 76+ fga/game, last night we only took 71. Our offense wasn't efficient.

2. I agree with everything everybody has said about Rondo. He's in a funk. I wish I could say it's the Perk trade, but he was in a slump before that too. SOMEBODY needs to have a chat with the lad and find out what's cooking. His performance last night was underwhelming, to be kind. If there was anything positive to be gleaned from last night it's that he only played 27 minutes, so if his problem is fatigue, that might help.

3. Jeff Green had a good night. He's surprising me with his postup game. Everytime I saw him with OKC it seemed he was extending our defense by draining jumpshots. He's obviously getting more comfortable with his role here. The score in this game was upside down, but Green's consistent progress since the trade has been steadily positive.

4. Krstic started off great and then disappeared. A couple of quick fouls and a game that got away quickly sat him down. Still, if you look at the starters, he has the best +/- of them. Our starters didn't get the job done last night.

5. We shot 1-10 from 3. What does that have to do with our defense? Ray Allen took just one 3pter and missed. If you're Rick Adelman, do you want to count on that in a 7-game series? Yes, I know we're not going to face them in a 7 game series, barring an NBA tsunami, but that's what all this board member angst is about, isn't it? It's about whether we're a "championship team". Well, ask yourself this, "will the Celtics shoot 10% from 3, as a team, during a playoff game?". If your answer is "damn unlikely", then this is a FLUKE.

6. Paul Pierce shot 2-10 last night. This isn't the first time he has shot this poorly, but I'm comfortable playing the averages here too. Over a 7 game series games like this are FLUKES.

7. Ray Allen only took 6fga. He averages almost 13. As goes Rondo, so often goes Ray, since Ray is a major recipient of Rondo's largesses. Rondo stunk last night.

Are you starting to see a pattern in my thoughts here? I'm pointing out one anomaly after another after another as to why we lost this game while pointing out positive multi-game trends (like Krstic and Green) that will help us every game later. A lot of games we have Pierce being off and Ray being hot. Other games it'll be reversed and in other games Rondo or Davis will go crazy. In this game none of them did (except for Green). It happens, it happened but it's not normal, not over time.

We still have 15 games left in the regular season, folks, and we're still tied for 1st place in the east. We're struggling and we're still tied for 1st place in the east. We're integrating 5 new players and bringing back West after a long injury outage and we're still tied for 1st place in the east. Our only center is new and our two stalwarts haven't played in a while and we're still tied for 1st place in the east. A point was made about how "Chicago is peaking at the right time and we're not" last night. Well, if Chicago gets into a slump and we win 12 of the next 15 to finish out the season, who's peaking at the right time then? Pace yourself, boys and girls, there'll be plenty of opportunity to panic later. Primal screams now are nothing but premature ejaculations.

(e·jac·u·late (-jky-lt)
v. e·jac·u·lat·ed, e·jac·u·lat·ing, e·jac·u·lates
v.tr.
To utter suddenly and passionately; exclaim.

(That was for you, Rosalie)

There was something made last night on the Game On thread to the effect of about how Chicago valiantly fought their way back to OT while we "gave up" and that's why they're champs and we're chumps. That's one way to look at it. It's the "glass-half-empty, going on 3/4 empty due to predicted future evaporation, distillation, leakage and no presumptions or credit given for making adjustments to offset those" way of looking at things, but it is a way. It's predicting doom, without a willingness to predict improvements, despite having seen a track record of improvements in comparable situations in the past. Another way to look at it is Chicago had a chance to start fresh with 5 minutes of game clock to put away the reeling, demoralized, significantly inferior Indiana Pacers (worse than the Rockets!) and they failed to do so in grand style in OT (they only scored 6 points in OT). Chicago got 42fta, 21 of them by Rose, and they still couldn't win. They had a chance to pick up a game on us by beating a team that's even worse than the Rockets and they didn't despite getting a second lease on life, in part, due to some very UN-homie ref calls that would have ended it in regulation and they still didn't win.

Yet a third way to look at it is that BOTH teams losing to these inferior teams are "flukes" and to not make such a big deal about them.

bob

.

I sum it up to make it simple:


WE ARE REGRESSING NOT PROGRESSING!

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Bob, if the Rockets game was an isolated incident where we were TOTALLY BLOWN OUT by an inferior team I would buy into everything you wrote.
Unfortunately, its not. In fact, its a pattern now. The Clippers blew us out at home because the Celtics didn't arrive mentally ready to play basketball. In that case we nearly came back and won it anyway, but we got too far behind. We also lost to the Sixers and the Nets recently. We are not playing well and there is no reason to believe that that will change any time soon. And there are ONLY 15 games left for that metamorphasis to occur. Thats really not much time. Finally, Shaq is still not healed and there is no reason to believe that he will be healed in time to help. That is a fact. I posted the link elsewhere. He is thinking about injections now...not a good sign.

Swish,

Thanks for the suggestion about starting a glimmer thread. I started one last year, when I also used the tag line, "See me in April" and spent a couple of months feeling as though I was carrying a large portion of the board on my back.

I'm not now claiming that, just because so many people turned out to be so wrong then, it'll automatically happen again. But I have to admit to some rather extreme disappointment at how so many people haven't learned the lesson that the present does not equal the future. And I'm not just talking about this board. Apparently the Lakers boards went through the same thing earlier in the season. When in doubt, panic.

I believe there are two choices as to what kind of fan to be. One choice is to follow the example set by the team. Try to think as the team is thinking. Of course the players and coaches are concerned about what is happening. They wouldn't be human if they didn't. But they're not running around wringing their hands in panic and reinforcing the notion that disaster is right around the corner. They're focusing on what to do about it, just as they focused last season. And they're very experienced in knowing how to make such focus pay off. As fans, we don't have the opportunity to do anything about it. But we do have the opportunity to be the fan's version of "professional": reasonably calm, analytical and constructive, rather than emotional, hip-shooting trouble-borrowers.

I won't go to deeply into the other choice because I wouldn't know how to do so without ruffling the feathers of some very fine people. But I will say it's ironic that a message board I started (along with some other great people) is proving to be a vehicle for the other choice to fester and gain momentum. That makes me extremely sad.

Anyway, I have no intention of starting another glimmer thread. I don't have confidence that there is sufficiently widespread vision to realize and believe in the potential implications of the glimmers.

• It doesn't matter that Glen Davis has hit the ground running upon his return and has become a double-double machine.

• It doesn't matter that Kristic has shown to be a major asset on offense (including the area of offensive rebounding, about which so many were sobbing a couple of months ago) and has displayed defensive improvement.

• It doesn't matter that Jeff Green represents a dimension the Celtics bench has never had—from his ability as a quality sub for Paul Pierce to his emerging skills as a post up player taking advantage of matchups and as a bench player who can create his own shot.

• It doesn't matter that Delonte and Arroyo represent a dramatic upgrade over Nate and Wafer at backup SG and PG.

• It doesn't matter that the new guys are slowly but surely catching on to the defense scheme, which is admittedly a work in progress. It doesn't matter that even the negativity of last night's game represents a virtual tutorial in how to improve on the "lunge and recover" tactic so as not to leave the perimeter so vulnerable.

• It doesn't matter that, as so many of the new and returning players are gradually finding their niches as individual contributors, what remains is to translate them into the team context....and that's what the remaining games can accomplish.

• It doesn't matter that this small period of time is virtually another training camp, replete with the integration of half a team, experimentation with various player combinations, and formation of a new team identity.

None of these things really matters enough for me to start a glimmer thread because I now understand that it's widely regarded as a transitory illusion and, even if it eventuates in something good, it's all to easy to write it off as an anomaly.

I realize that it takes a certain amount of vision to look beyond the present and see how glimmers can come together to effect dramatic change. And it is far too easy for that vision to fall prey to the attraction of an instant gratification ethic—however superficial that ethic may be.

I encourage all to keep posting, regardless of your viewpoints. It's certainly a free country, and it is interesting to keep tabs on where everyone stands.

Go Celtics!

Sam

Too many people are making Bob and Sam work overtime to point out that we're just in a slump and although we got beat pretty good last night we didn't lose anything to Chicago in the standings.

To say there is any huge and lasting problem at this point is way premature.

As far as Rondo, try a baseball comparison. Players go into hitting slumps. It happens to basketball players too, just without the Louisville Slugger.

Bob,

Great explanation on the premature part.

You know Sam, unfortunately you are right: none of those positives matter. The ONLY thing that matters is winning. Even with all that good stuff, we are still losing and losing badly to bad teams. If that does not change, then we are going nowhere this year.

Pumps

I think it would be well to understand that winning is difficult. Particularly for a team in the middle stages of significant roster changes.

I have to thank Sam for reminding us of the many positive things about this team. These are the things that will ultimately determine winning. I think it all comes down to perception. I see this team as a contender for the championship. From what I have seen, they have all the pieces. It will take another 10 to 12 games for them to get on the same page. At the very least they deserve a chance to work things out.

I for one would not bet against them.

Dboss

I would not bet against them either; the Celtics are my team too. Thats different than coming to the conclusion that they can win it all this year. I just don't think they have it in them. Strange, because they do have the talent to do it IMO. Something is missing.