Post-game Thread: Celtics 86 vs. Wizards 83, 3/7/10

[Sam]

Here's the post-game thread for the Wiz game. I have to watch my tape before posting.

Sam

[swedeinestonia]

We all know what 90% of the game looked like..

What I liked about the game was at some point 2/3 into the 4th I could really see how Pierce started putting a lot of effort into things.

I like how they set their minds and effort to it and it paid off. Maybe it was not really deserved but I think it will be good for confidence.

[mrkleen09]

4 in a row.

[dbrown4]

Haven't seen the 1st half. Thought the Celtics once again played to the level of the competition. Really liked the last 6 minutes though. Crowd goin' nuts, Ray doin' the the chest jump bump, defense doing what it should be doing. I'm taking it he has put all the trading block bs behind him. Danny owes him a beer and a nice contract extension.

Wasn't it Red (or was it Bill) that said there are only three minutes in a game where you win it. The rest of the way is just fluff? (Sam, please help out with the real quote. But I'm in the ball park! You get the picture.) That's what this game appeared to be. Although Red wouldn't have liked the first 40 minutes, his theory is true for this game.

Once again, another marque game on the horizon come Sunday. I honestly cannot say who is going to win. I'm afraid if CLE wins, then not only do the Cav's have our number, they THINK they can beat us, which is about 99% of the game. The C's will have to play more than the 6 minutes they played last night, but I liked their intensity. If the C's win that one, it creates doubt in CLE's mind. Come playoff time, it would be nice if CLE had to open with Charlotte.

Rondo's And 1 was great. Ray's 3's like knives in the heart. It shows how quickly an opponent can fall apart if you just play a little D and evidently talk a little trash! I'm hesitant to demand victory again since I'm now only 1-1. May just let that game play out, expecting victory. Not looking for any moral victories or glimmers any more. I think they have it. Have what it takes to win it all. Time to put the answers on the test. Four and counting...

[Sam]

Dbrown,

That quote may have become a little altered over the years. I googled" auerbach last three minutes" and found an article on a Russell interview in which he quoted Red. (I'll go back after I post this to find the link.) Russ discusses Auerbach's quote which basically said you often only had to beat the other team for three minutes a game BUT those three minutes could come at any time...even the first quarter.

Here's Russ' quote about Red's opinion:

One thing that my coach did was he did a remarkable job of
contingencies, so that whatever comes up, his goal was no surprises.
Especially when the game comes down to the last minute -- although
sometimes that's not the key part of the game, a lot of people think
that (it's) the last three minutes. The game may be won in the first
quarter, because I know we used to talk sometimes, and he'd say,
"Basically, you only have to outplay the other team three minutes out
of 48. If you outplay them those three minutes and play even the rest
of the time, you win the game."

Link to the interview: http://www.achievement.org/autodoc/page/rus0int-2

Sam

[sinus007]

Hi,
It was a strange game that produced more questions than answers. At least for me.
What Celtics have been thinking/doing for the first 42 min of the game?
What was the actual spark that got them to play?
Was it done by design? If yes, I surely hope they will not try it in Cleveland.
On the positive side: BBD is great on O boards; now he has to learn to realize that he can't overpower 3-4 opponents by himself. KG continues to rebound, and it was a smart move to put him on Blatche. RA being RA.
Bottom line - win is a win.

AK

[mrkleen09]

Loved Tommy’s comment late in the 4th about Blatche and Thornton…..ok, now that it is crunch time, lets see who wants to take the big shot.

As is usually the case, he was right. Blatche and Thornton DISAPPEARED and Pierce, Rondo, and Ray showed up and cemented the win.

[bigpygme]

Haven't seen the 1st half. Thought the Celtics once again played to the level of the competition. Really liked the last 6 minutes though. Crowd goin' nuts, Ray doin' the the chest jump bump, defense doing what it should be doing. I'm taking it he has put all the trading block bs behind him. Danny owes him a beer and a nice contract extension.

Wasn't it Red (or was it Bill) that said there are only three minutes in a game where you win it. The rest of the way is just fluff? (Sam, please help out with the real quote. But I'm in the ball park! You get the picture.) That's what this game appeared to be. Although Red wouldn't have liked the first 40 minutes, his theory is true for this game.

Once again, another marque game on the horizon come Sunday. I honestly cannot say who is going to win. I'm afraid if CLE wins, then not only do the Cav's have our number, they THINK they can beat us, which is about 99% of the game. The C's will have to play more than the 6 minutes they played last night, but I liked their intensity. If the C's win that one, it creates doubt in CLE's mind. Come playoff time, it would be nice if CLE had to open with Charlotte.

Rondo's And 1 was great. Ray's 3's like knives in the heart. It shows how quickly an opponent can fall apart if you just play a little D and evidently talk a little trash! I'm hesitant to demand victory again since I'm now only 1-1. May just let that game play out, expecting victory. Not looking for any moral victories or glimmers any more. I think they have it. Have what it takes to win it all. Time to put the answers on the test. Four and counting...

before the game i posted "Hoping they don't play down to their level of competition!" and they did, except for those last 6 minutes with the game on the nearest verge of slipping out of reach.
unlike Red's quote (which makes loads of sense to me), we needed more than three minutes to pull this one out of the fire. but we/they did it, and to their great credit !!!

Sam, where is the thread on posting policy you mentioned last night? i want to be sure i do not, in my irritation, mess up. i love the Game On thread but hate to see it going the way it's going ... it's getting distasteful and pretty ugly.

Go Celtics


Michael

[Jerry Tarkanian]

Hi All,

I also enjoy the Game On threads, generally great source of insight even if, as I did last evening, one missed the game. Did watch a replay at 6 AM and the sentiments expressed were right on by gyso, jeb & cow.

Seemed I did enter a lion's den when I awoke from my nap too late to 'see' the game and entered the thread to 'see' it through the forum's eyes. I hope I offended no one, certainly did not intend to............it was a little spicy in the thread.

I believe divergent opinion is a good thing, and absent such, forums (as well as life) can be boring. I hope we can all agree to disagree when necessary, and rejoice as a group as we endeavor to watch C's successes.

My best to all,

Tark

[Sam]

I sincerely regret the circumstances surrounding last night's game-on thread. I've just posted on a new thread entitled, "Important Clarification of Board Policy on Posting Behavior." I look forward to future game-on and other threads on which differences of opinion need not lead to contentiousness.

And here's a tip for whatever it's worth. I personally dislike the "quote" feature on this forum. We sometimes wind up with quotes within quotes within quotes, which sometimes results in confusion as to whom was addressed by the most recent message. I've never once used the quote function to avoid such confusion.

If I'm addressing an individual, I prefer to specify the name of that person so as to be specific. And, if I want to quote something that person has said, I copy and paste only the most relevant portion of the quote so as not to take up excess room on the thread.

This is not an admonition not to use the quotes feature. Everyone should feel free to use it. It's just a plea to be selective in its use.

Sam

[jeb]

Tark

Again...sorry I have such a hard time with the english language. I like divergent viewpoints and I think we are all pretty honest about the team.

Sky and MG integrate seamlessly because they know their hoop and have manners. Two huge Laker fans.

We're square no? You kinda walked into a bullet that was not pointed at you.

Best

Jeb

[beat]

Sam

Totally agree about the quote feature. I rarely use it anyway, and as you mention, as it can get confusing when being used beyond the first reply.

beat

[Jerry Tarkanian]

We're square no? You kinda walked into a bullet that was not pointed at you.

Best

Jeb

Morning, Jeb,

We're square, of course, you let me know last evening your true target.

While I personally do not agree with the opinions one poster was representing, I did feel he had a right to voice them. However if the precedent is, and I am unaware of past behavior, for that poster to choose to make only incendiary comments, I might have responded in a like manner.

Hope all is well and getting better daily for you, Jeb, and always enjoy your keen insights colorfully written.

Regards,

Tark

[bobheckler]

I'm glad I didn't write this last night right after the game, it would have been a very different post. I needed 12 hours to let it marinate in my head.

My take last night was that we played without energy, down to the level of our poor competition and got very, very lucky. Thinking back, now, I'm not sure I see it that way (ok, we were still lucky). Sure, we were facing an energy deficit in the first half (especially the second half of the first quarter, which let them go from 6 down early to 6 up after one), but that wasn't the story of the game to me after I had a chance to think about it. I now think this was a good gritty win, with more than a small amount of cooperation by our opponents in the last half of the fourth quarter, overcoming a night in which nothing we tried to do worked.

1. I don't ever remembering a professional team shooting as poorly as we did last night. I'm not even looking at our fg%, I'm just talking about stone cold. What I realized this morning, though, is that it wasn't because we weren't trying or because we weren't executing or because we were taking bad shots or low percentage shots that didn't drop. Other than that energy dip in the first half, we were working hard. We just couldn't find the hole. We got a lot of shots that were good shots, shots that we'd be very happy to get any other night. Shots that would either go in or collect a foul on any other night but they weren't going in or were getting blocked yesterday. Some of the credit has to go to Washington's energy level and some of it just goes to "WTF?".

2. KG worked hard last night, he just didn't do much right. Other than that great block on him, he couldn't have thrown a pingpong ball in a urinal if he was standing right in front of it. I don't believe I've ever seen him less effective and that includes when he was playing with a bone spur the size of a walnut under his knee cap. He hit his free throws (although only 1 of 2 during crunch) and dove on the floor for that steal and timeout at the end. Ok, ok, I found some nice things to say about KG's play last night. More good news is that he didn't play "old", he just played like nothing worked. His man Blatche, though, had a career night.

3. Great energy by Davis. Six of his 8 rebounds were offensive rebounds (and you all know how I love offensive rebounding!). Not effective after he got the ball, though. I made an observation on another thread that Davis appears to be more effective when he throws his body around (especially at angles) and less when he goes straight up in the tall timber. I saw absolutely nothing last night that would make me consider re-evaluating that position. Still, it's hard to fault somebody who works hard for the offensive board, even if he wasn't able to do anything with it after he got it.

4. Once again, we had the privilege of watching Uber Ray play in green. On a night where buckets were as rare as hens teeth, The Energizer Bunny and consummate professional just went efficiently about his business. 10-15 from the field, 4-6 from 3, the game ball obviously has to go to Ray Walter Allen. It didn't matter if he was dunking on a fastbreak or reversing direction off a screen for backdoor layups or breaking Sam Cassell's heart from 3 he did it all (btw, did you see the look on Cassell's face after Ray hit that final 3? I fell off my barstool I was laughing so hard!).

5. McGee looked pretty good on his weakside defense last night, didn't he? That block he had on Pierce's dunk was a thing of beauty. All ball, no body. 9 of McGees 13 points came from his 10 fta. A 7' player playing a physical position (center) who can hit free throws. What a concept. In fairness to Perk, he hit both of his fts last night, but we know what a rarity that is. Perk had a quietly effective night, though. McGee's weakside defense was outstanding, but his man-to-man was iffy.

6. Al Thornton also got some snapshots for his facebook page versus Paul Pierce. Pierce's on-off, inconsistent performances are starting to irk me a bit.

7. In 77 player minutes (32% of total player minutes) our bench:
shot 3-17 from the field for a total of 9 points, which include 3 points from fts;
had 5 turnovers, out of a team total 16.

Yuck. Putting in one more plug for offensive rebounding, the bench did get 6 of the Celtics total 8 offensive rebounds, courtesy of Senor UnoUno.

Lucky for us we were able to pull this chestnut out of the fire because the Orlando Magic beat KoME Bryant and his posse of cardboard cut-outs. The announcer last night talked about how the Magic "survived Kobe Bryant's 34 points", completely overlooking the fact that KoME was 12-30 (40%) and the Lakers as a team shot 37.5%. Oh well, this isn't a Laker post-game thread, it's a Celtic post-game thread and what's relevant with that game is that we are now still 2 games behind Orlando (because they own the tie-breaker) in the race for #2 in the east. If we lost yesterday, we'd be 3 games behind them AND 1 game behind Atlanta (because we'd be tied and they own the tie-breaker on us too) with only 21 games left.

A few days off before another home game against Memphis gives Doc and Thib time with Finley. Things are looking up for us.

bob

[Jerry Tarkanian]

If nothing else controversy does appear to spur interest.....seems more poster present of late and I view that as a 'glimmer' as well.

That said, future C's victories will keep the 'seats' full in the forum.

Off to some appointments and will 'see' you all later............unless they make me wait in which case the trusty Blackberry may get a workout !

A wonderful day to all,

Tark

[gyso]

I regularly use the quote function. I understand how it works and I actually "repair" many posts where another poster inadvertantly deleted the last bracket ( ] ) before typing in their response.

The Quote function puts brackets and the word "quote" at the front and end of the previous post. The end adds a slash ( / ) to signify the end. It also indicates who the quote is attributed to.

If you use this function, you should type your message after the end quote brackets (preferred or standard method) or before the start quote brackets (alternate or latest on top method) and leave the bracketed text intact.

If you use this function, you should NEVER type your response between the start quotes and end quotes. That leads to confusion and can have negative consecuences.

gyso

[beat]

I regularly use the quote function. I understand how it works and I actually "repair" many posts where another poster inadvertantly deleted the last bracket ( ] ) before typing in their response.

The Quote function puts brackets and the word "quote" at the front and end of the previous post. The end adds a slash ( / ) to signify the end. It also indicates who the quote is attributed to.

If you use this function, you should type your message after the end quote brackets (preferred or standard method) or before the start quote brackets (alternate or latest on top method) and leave the bracketed text intact.

If you use this function, you should NEVER type your response between the start quotes and end quotes. That leads to confusion and can have negative consecuences.

you mean like this?

beat

gyso

[beat]

I regularly use the quote function. I understand how it works and I actually "repair" many posts where another poster inadvertantly deleted the last bracket ( ] ) before typing in their response.

The Quote function puts brackets and the word "quote" at the front and end of the previous post. The end adds a slash ( / ) to signify the end. It also indicates who the quote is attributed to.

If you use this function, you should type your message after the end quote brackets (preferred or standard method) or before the start quote brackets (alternate or latest on top method) and leave the bracketed text intact.

If you use this function, you should NEVER type your response between the start quotes and end quotes. That leads to confusion and can have negative consecuences.

gyso

or like this

beat

[bobheckler]

I regularly use the quote function. I understand how it works and I actually "repair" many posts where another poster inadvertantly deleted the last bracket ( ] ) before typing in their response.

The Quote function puts brackets and the word "quote" at the front and end of the previous post. The end adds a slash ( / ) to signify the end. It also indicates who the quote is attributed to.

If you use this function, you should type your message after the end quote brackets (preferred or standard method) or before the start quote brackets (alternate or latest on top method) and leave the bracketed text intact.

If you use this function, you should NEVER type your response between the start quotes and end quotes. That leads to confusion and can have negative consecuences.

gyso

or like this

beat

beat,

That is a really disturbing avatar. That isn't Marcus getting posterized, is it?

bob

[beat]

Bob

Naw that LBJ prior to leading prayers for the kid that filmed him getting posterized!

I'll change it in a bit!

beat

Actually Bron established position...........but was inside the arc!

[spike]

Dbrown & Sam:

Just a little further down the page of the achievement.org interview, there is the "take the heart out of them" quote. That was Bill's major thing: demoralize the opponent, destroy the opponent's will. I don't recall seeing this idea expressed in one of Red's books or interviews, but Bill clearly attributes it to him.

"You might be behind, and in these three minutes you might catch up. But these are the three that determine basically the whole outcome. So he said to me sometimes, "This is the time we need to do it, when you lock them down for three minutes and execute our offense. And if that's not working, then we should go to the basket to get pretty close on lay-ups." Fortunately we had players that could do that. So all we had to do was set the stage for them, put them in a place where they could do their best. But make sure that they only did one shot, and hopefully that's not a good shot, and if they miss: no offensive rebounds. That's a no-no! Now if you're there for three minutes, if we do it correctly, we will take the heart out of them. It may not manifest itself right then, but after we've taken their heart, it may take in the last quarter if they are afraid."

spike

[jeb]

bobheck

The way I saw the game was that nothing and I mean nothing we did was working. After the albeit terrible first quarter I thought the results on the floor had nothing to do with a lack of energy. Nobody could score. Bunny after bunny...clank. The can do attitude in the 4th was moving to me. Ray just rose up and took that game. We moss def should have lost as we could not have played worse. It really got my blood up to see the team just stick with it and never quit. I could see by their body language that they were not rattled it was more disbelief at the lack of made shots.

Uno uno flat handled the action and made me scream for good when he dove into the stands and just plain messed with the wizards on the offensive glass.

The end of that game is why you never count a talented veteran team out. No way we should have won that game!

jeb

[bobheckler]

bobheck

The way I saw the game was that nothing and I mean nothing we did was working. After the albeit terrible first quarter I thought the results on the floor had nothing to do with a lack of energy. Nobody could score. Bunny after bunny...clank. The can do attitude in the 4th was moving to me. Ray just rose up and took that game. We moss def should have lost as we could not have played worse. It really got my blood up to see the team just stick with it and never quit. I could see by their body language that they were not rattled it was more disbelief at the lack of made shots.

Uno uno flat handled the action and made me scream for good when he dove into the stands and just plain messed with the wizards on the offensive glass.

The end of that game is why you never count a talented veteran team out. No way we should have won that game!

jeb

jeb,

That is exactly how I saw it. When I said we missed good shots we'd be happy to get on another night I was referring to those bunnies that you mentioned we missed. Getting the layup is the result of good execution and hustle. Missing the layup is something different (could be nerves, good defense, rushing your shot...).

If the NJ loss costs us a valuable playoff seeding that's not good, but the silver lining (glimmer!!) is that it looks like it woke us up individually and as a team. We're seeing the old mojo again now and we'll need that in the playoffs going against teams that beat us during the season.

bob

[Pumpsie Green]

We all know what 90% of the game looked like..

What I liked about the game was at some point 2/3 into the 4th I could really see how Pierce started putting a lot of effort into things.

I like how they set their minds and effort to it and it paid off. Maybe it was not really deserved but I think it will be good for confidence.

The fact of the matter is that somehow the Celtics won yesterday and played just six minutes and thirteen seconds of great basketball. At that point they were 13 points down. There is really no excuse for that; these guys are supposed to be professionals. I realize that you guys did not like some (or all) of the comments I made during the game thread, but they were, in fact, right on factually, for the most part. The only comment I made that was not factually accurate was that the "game was over"...and even that appeared to be true at the time.
I understand that perhaps the way I conveyed my disgust with the team was perhaps a little over the top for some of you; I do understand that and should have no trouble toning it down a bit.
HOWEVER: I AM NOT GOING TO CALL A PILE OF POOP A ROSE OR VICE VERSA. If they stink, I will say so, though less "abrasively"; and if they are great, I will say that too, as I always do.
I hope that works for you guys.

[bobc33]

We all know what 90% of the game looked like..

What I liked about the game was at some point 2/3 into the 4th I could really see how Pierce started putting a lot of effort into things.

I like how they set their minds and effort to it and it paid off. Maybe it was not really deserved but I think it will be good for confidence.

The fact of the matter is that somehow the Celtics won yesterday and played just six minutes and thirteen seconds of great basketball. At that point they were 13 points down. There is really no excuse for that; these guys are supposed to be professionals. I realize that you guys did not like some (or all) of the comments I made during the game thread, but they were, in fact, right on factually, for the most part. The only comment I made that was not factually accurate was that the "game was over"...and even that appeared to be true at the time.
I understand that perhaps the way I conveyed my disgust with the team was perhaps a little over the top for some of you; I do understand that and should have no trouble toning it down a bit.
HOWEVER: I AM NOT GOING TO CALL A PILE OF POOP A ROSE OR VICE VERSA. If they stink, I will say so, though less "abrasively"; and if they are great, I will say that too, as I always do.
I hope that works for you guys.

Hi Pumpsie,

My feeling is conveying disgust is fine, I actually felt and posted during the game the Cs looked old and out of synch. If you "tone it down a bit" I think you'll get a good reaction from fellow posters even if we have much different viewpoints than yours.

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