Will Howard end up back with the Lakers

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27416033/sources-howard-okd-talk-lakers-others

With Cousins likely gone for most if not all of the season, LAL are looking to sure up the center position.

Howard can be had at the veteran minimum rate.  If he is willing to come off of the bench I think it would be a good fit.

This however does not address the underlying flaw with their roster.  They lack depth at PG and they do not have enough quality 3 point shooters.

Think about this.  If the starting frontcourt includes James, Davis and Kuzma none of those guys are reliable shooters from deep.  It also looks to me like they will struggle to defend as a team.

I guess I could also mention their rivals the Clippers.  Like LAL they now have 2 elite players but they are still thin in the middle and at the guard position.

The bottom line is that every team has flaws and many cannot be overcome if rosters are constructed poorly.

The Bucks and Sixers both have flawed rosters.  Toronto has no top of the line go-to guy and Siakum will see more double teams this year.  Indiana was 22nd in PPG.  Have they addressed that?

Celtics fans should be more than happy with where we are after having parted ways with 5 players that were  top 8 rotation guys.  We no longer have multiple allstars but our overall positional depth up and down the roster looks pretty damn good to me.

dboss wrote:https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27416033/sources-howard-okd-talk-lakers-others

With Cousins likely gone for most if not all of the season, LAL are looking to sure up the center position.

Howard can be had at the veteran minimum rate.  If he is willing to come off of the bench I think it would be a good fit.

This however does not address the underlying flaw with their roster.  They lack depth at PG and they do not have enough quality 3 point shooters.

Think about this.  If the starting frontcourt includes James, Davis and Kuzma none of those guys are reliable shooters from deep.  It also looks to me like they will struggle to defend as a team.

I guess I could also mention their rivals the Clippers.  Like LAL they now have 2 elite players but they are still thin in the middle and at the guard position.

The bottom line is that every team has flaws and many cannot be overcome if rosters are constructed poorly.

The Bucks and Sixers both have flawed rosters.  Toronto has no top of the line go-to guy and Siakum will see more double teams this year.  Indiana was 22nd in PPG.  Have they addressed that?

Celtics fans should be more than happy with where we are after having parted ways with 5 players that were  top 8 rotation guys.  We no longer have multiple allstars but our overall positional depth up and down the roster looks pretty damn good to me.

It's highly doubtful that Davis will be the Lakers starting center.
McGee did an excellent job as the starting center for most of last season.
McGee and Dwight (if he's healthy) would do more than a serviceable job at center, especially on rebounding and rim protecting.
Having elite rim protection and the ability to switch on defense from Davis, McGee and possibly Howard will take a lot of pressure off of their wing players.
I don't think the Lakers are concerned about point guard.
I think it will be a battle to win the starting pg between Bradley, Rondo and Caruso.
I would not be surprised if Caruso wins the starting.
He's a very good defender, but not as great as Avery Bradley.
But Caruso is probably the best all-around pg on the roster when you look at defense, 3 point shooting and as a play maker.
The Lakers did pretty much the best they could adding 3 point shooters.
Daniels, Dudley, Cook and Green are new players to the Lakers.
They all shoot near or at 40% from the 3 point line.

I think the Lakers should sign Dwight if he's bought out by Memphis.
If not Dwight, Noah or Faried are probably the next best options.

TJ

I cannot find much here to agree with except signing Howard.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but Mcgee sucks.  Do not be fooled by his 2 block per game.  He had one of the worst defensive rating on a horrible defensive team last year.

Caruso is listed as a SG not a PG.  Someone would have to be smoking weed to think that he will compete for the starting PG job.  He's has played a total of 62 games in his NBA career of two years and has averaged 2.5 assists.  

Every Celtics fan knows that Avery Bradly cannot run the point.  That is an established fact.

Rajon Rondo is the likely starter at PG because he can distribute the ball and has already played with AD,  However he is absolutely HORRIBLE on defense.

I stand by my observation that LA lacks depth at PG.

As far as 3 point shooting is concerned, other than Green none of those other guys are starters and even though Green can make the deep ball he is still very limited offensively.  Guys like Dudley, Cook, Daniels etc are all rotation guys.  You have no 3 and d guys on the roster.

None of  the big minute guys can throw the ball in the ocean in  terms of making the 3 pointers.

The overall talent surrounding James and Davis is really poor.

dboss wrote:TJ

I cannot find much here to agree with except signing Howard.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but Mcgee sucks.  Do not be fooled by his 2 block per game.  He had one of the worst defensive rating on a horrible defensive team last year.

Caruso is listed as a SG not a PG.  Someone would have to be smoking weed to think that he will compete for the starting PG job.  He's has played a total of 62 games in his NBA career of two years and has averaged 2.5 assists.  

Every Celtics fan knows that Avery Bradly cannot run the point.  That is an established fact.

Rajon Rondo is the likely starter at PG because he can distribute the ball and has already played with AD,  However he is absolutely HORRIBLE on defense.

I stand by my observation that LA lacks depth at PG.

As far as 3 point shooting is concerned, other than Green none of those other guys are starters and even though Green can make the deep ball he is still very limited offensively.  Guys like Dudley, Cook, Daniels etc are all rotation guys.  You have no 3 and d guys on the roster.

All the big minute guys can not throw the ball in the ocean in  terms of making the 3 pointers.

The overall talent surrounding James and Davis is really poor.

You must not have watched the Lakers or McGee play often last season.
McGee was a defensive presence every time he was in games.
He was also effective on offense.
McGee averaged 12ppg, 7.5 rpg and 2bpg while playing only 22 mpg.

Have you ever seen Caruso play or some of the other new Lakers?
Caruso is a point guard.
Being 6’5” and being a solid defender, he can also play SG, but he’s a point guard.
If Bradley starts, he obviously won’t play pg on offense.
LeBron would be the pg when Bradley is in.

The Lakers have very good depth, some excellent defensive players and two of maybe the top 5 players in the game.
The Lakers will be fine.

Adding a possibly healthy could help the Lakers.
He’s a double double machine when healthy.

TJ  The Lakers were a worse team with McGee on the floor.  (At  Both ends)
The team net offensive/defensive rating was 107.4/108.9

McGee was 106.7/111.1

The very notion of a frontline made up of Davis/McGee/James is laughable.  McGee is a classic garbage player.  

There is no way you can convince me that Caruso is a PG.  I have seen him play enough times to know that he is no starting quality PG.  

Lebron will be playing point forward like he always has.  

The only guy they added that can play defense at a high level is Green.  Dudley is good but not great

Bradley  110.2
Cook  112.1
Dudley 108.6
Green 104.3
Daniel 110.8
Jackson 118.2

Adding players to the roster does give you depth but quality depth is a different story.  

If we were discussing the Clippers and discussing adding defense I would have no argument.  

The Lakers will mostly rely on a two man game between Davis and James and hope Kuzma is ready to take the next step.   

The Lakers do not have enough quality starters.

dboss wrote:TJ  The Lakers were a worse team with McGee on the floor.  (At  Both ends)
The team net offensive/defensive rating was 107.4/108.9

McGee was 106.7/111.1

The very notion of a frontline made up of Davis/McGee/James is laughable.  McGee is a classic garbage player.  

There is no way you can convince me that Caruso is a PG.  I have seen him play enough times to know that he is no starting quality PG.  

Lebron will be playing point forward like he always has.  

The only guy they added that can play defense at a high level is Green.  Dudley is good but not great

Bradley  110.2
Cook  112.1
Dudley 108.6
Green 104.3
Daniel 110.8
Jackson 118.2

Adding players to the roster does give you depth but quality depth is a different story.  

If we were discussing the Clippers and discussing adding defense I would have no argument.  

The Lakers will mostly rely on a two man game between Davis and James and hope Kuzma is ready to take the next step.   

The Lakers do not have enough quality starters.

Defensive rating factors in a lot of things including how others you are playing with are performing.
Do you know that LeBron James had a better defensive rating than Kawhi Leonard last year and that Isaac Bonga led the league in defensive rating for players that played at least 20 games?
Also, Marcus Smart had a worse defensive rating last year than Terrence Ross, JJ Barea and the Curry brothers.
Do you see how silly and shortsighted it is to judge players by their defensive ratings?

McGee is not just a good or very good defensive player. He’s an excellent defensive player.
On basketballreference.com McGee had the 12th best defensive rating in the league last year.
He was behind Whiteside, Giannis, Gobert, Drummond Turner and some others.
He was ahead of Embiid, PG13 and Kawhi.

Caruso is 100% a point guard. If you argue he’s not, then you’ve never watched him play.
Will he be a starting pg for the Lakers? Maybe. He’s better than Rondo.
Bradley might start at pg because he is still one of the top on the ball defenders from the guard position in the league.

I think we have another point of agreement.

Defensive ratings and offensive ratings for an individual player is impacted by other players.  However, if a player is below the team ratings on both offense and defense as is the case with McGee that should tell you something.

That means that when he is on the court with 4 other guys the Lakers scored less points and when he is on the court with 4 other guys they also gave up more points than the overall team offensive/defensive ratings.    

McGee is a limited defensive player.  Is he a rim protector?  Absolutely but he is very limited outside of the paint.

How McGee fit with AD is unknown.  

Simply saying Caruso is 100% a point guard does not make it so.  He is a 6' 5" shooting guard that can handle the basketball but he will never be a starting PG.  Forget about it.

LAL has more questions than answers.  No one really knows how everything will fit together or if it will fit together.  

AD is going to have to play a lot of minutes at 5 if they expect to win.

Really some number has him ranked higher than Kawhi?

More proof whatever stats they are measuring is bullshit, anyone notice how that whole series changed when Kawhi was first primary defender on Giannis...??? Guess those interactions couldn’t be quantified by stats....

dboss wrote:I think we have another point of agreement.

Defensive ratings and offensive ratings for an individual player is impacted by other players.  However, if a player is below the team ratings on both offense and defense as is the case with McGee that should tell you something.

That means that when he is on the court with 4 other guys the Lakers scored less points and when he is on the court with 4 other guys they also gave up more points than the overall team offensive/defensive ratings.    

McGee is a limited defensive player.  Is he a rim protector?  Absolutely but he is very limited outside of the paint.

How McGee fit with AD is unknown.  

Simply saying Caruso is 100% a point guard does not make it so.  He is a 6' 5" shooting guard that can handle the basketball but he will never be a starting PG.  Forget about it.

LAL has more questions than answers.  No one really knows how everything will fit together or if it will fit together.  

AD is going to have to play a lot of minutes at 5 if they expect to win.

How many Lakers games did you watch last year?
Your analysis about McGee and Caruso could not be more inaccurate.
McGee is not at all limited outside of the paint.
He and AD can and will be able to guard the paint and the perimeter.
I haven't looked very hard, but I can't think of a better starting defensive 4/5 in the league over AD and McGee.
If you have never seen Caruso play, google him and watch his youtube highlights.
Just because ESPN incorrectly lists him as a SG, he is a PG.
There is not even a reasonable discussion about what position Caruso plays.
Below is a link to a story about Caruso and his chance of being the Lakers starting point guard.
Other news agencies including The Athletic have written stories about Caruso possibly winning the starting PG position.

https://www.lakersnation.com/dont-sleep-on-alex-caruso-for-2019-20-nba-season-with-lakers/2019/08/01/

Supposedly the Lakers are having Dwight, Noah, Speights and Gortat in for workouts this week.
I would expect this search for a back-up big man will be over soon.

Cow

Anytime you have a lot of changes to a team the issue of chemistry comes into play because you really do not know how certain guys will play with other guys.

Several teams have managed to pair up 2 allstars together.  That does not give them an automatic ticket into the finals.  Every team out there has flaws including the ones that made big splashes in this off season.  Great coaching can sometimes coverup these blemishes to some degree.

The standings are 0-0 with every team in both 1st and last place.

tjmakz wrote:Supposedly the Lakers are having Dwight, Noah, Speights and Gortat in for workouts today.
I would expect this search for a back-up big man will be over soon.

That's great. 

They will be a team of Backup centers as all of them including the great McGee are backup centers.

Before long the Lakers will come to the realization that their best option is to play AD at center.

Starting 5: AD, James, Kuzma, Green and Rondo.

dboss wrote:

tjmakz wrote:Supposedly the Lakers are having Dwight, Noah, Speights and Gortat in for workouts today.
I would expect this search for a back-up big man will be over soon.

That's great. 

They will be a team of Backup centers as all of them including the great McGee are backup centers.

Before long the Lakers will come to the realization that their best option is to play AD at center.

Starting 5: AD, James, Kuzma, Green and Rondo.

AD will probably play center for the last few minutes of games, but it's doubtful he logs a lot of minutes at center.


https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nba/news/demarcus-cousins-injury-should-push-anthony-davis-to-center-but-dont-expect-lakers-to-make-that-move/x6a2hgscsuzd1o5ki21dq5rqz


Jared Greenberg

@JaredSGreenberg
In the wake of the DeMarcus Cousins news a high ranking member of the Lakers tells me that they do not expect nor do they want Anthony Davis to play “big minutes” at center this season @NBATV

676
11:56 PM - Aug 15, 2019

dboss,

If you want to find a bad defensive center, here's the leader.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2822874-metrics-101-exposing-the-nbas-worst-defender-at-every-position#slide2

As I said sooner or later the Lakers will realize that AD has to play a lot of minutes at 5.

If Cousins was not hurt he and AD could work well together because Cousins can play away from the basket. AD and Bron need room to operate.

An entire frontline of questionable outside shooters is the biggest flaw for your guys. At least Kuzma can run the floor and get to the rim.

As long as Mr. Ainge has ZERO interest in Dwight Howard it really does not matter to me where he ends up.

There is no spot for this guy in Boston. Give me Fall for any minutes that anyone could see Howard playing in Boston for the Celtics.

wideclyde wrote:As long as Mr. Ainge has ZERO interest in Dwight Howard it really does not matter to me where he ends up.

There is no spot for this guy in Boston.  Give me Fall for any minutes that anyone could see Howard playing in Boston for the Celtics.

+1

TJ

Thanks for reminding us what a bad defender Kanter is. I figure our team defense should skew his numbers in a positive direction.

dboss wrote:TJ

Thanks for reminding us what a bad defender Kanter is.  I figure our team defense should skew his numbers in a positive direction.  

dboss,

Maybe true, or maybe the opposite that he will hurt the team as he has done in previous stops.
Of course, his rebounding and offense is a plus.
Here's an example of Kanter's severe poor defense.
Probably 15 examples in one game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTSsK34iISk

TJ

Can I get some salt? Just go head and rub a little on the wound.

cowens/oldschool wrote:Really some number has him ranked higher than Kawhi?

More proof whatever stats they are measuring is bullshit, anyone notice how that whole series changed when Kawhi was first primary defender on Giannis...??? Guess those interactions couldn’t be quantified by stats....

I remember, and yes, those stats must be bullshit if they rank McGee over Kawhi. You know what stat is really usually the most accurate? The salary a player gets. Discount the silly salaries Hornets players get!

The answer to this thread is YES.  Howard was waived by Memphis on Saturday and will join the Lakers.  It is a non-guaranteed deal so they have him on a short leash.

I think this move strengthens the Lakers center position defensively and on the glass however the glaring deficiency with their front line has not been addressed.  Kyle Kuzma was bad last year on his 3 point shooting but was really good his first year.  I think he is a guy that can help them stretch the floor.

None of their centers can shoot from deep and both Davis and Lebron are well below average.

It is strange that a team can add 2 of the top 5 elite players and still have a glaring weakness.

I believe that Howard's contract becomes guaranteed sometime in January.

If he reverts to a clown, he's gone.

If he takes it seriously and keeps in shape, he stays.

This could be his last chance at a fine romance (staying in the league on the Lakers).

dboss wrote:The answer to this thread is YES.  Howard was waived by Memphis on Saturday and will join the Lakers.  It is a non-guaranteed deal so they have him on a short leash.

I think this move strengthens the Lakers center position defensively and on the glass however the glaring deficiency with their front line has not been addressed.  Kyle Kuzma was bad last year on his 3 point shooting but was really good his first year.  I think he is a guy that can help them stretch the floor.

None of their centers can shoot from deep and both Davis and Lebron are well below average.

It is strange that a team can add 2 of the top 5 elite players and still have a glaring weakness.

Only 5 centers last year shot 31% in 3 pt fg%.
Only 9 power forwards shot league average for 3 pt fg%.
Davis shot 2.2% below league average last year but if he played enough games, he would have been 6th for centers.
Cousins would have probably helped with 3% FG % from the Lakers bigs, but injuries happen.
If Cousins played like he did in last years Finals, Dwight will probably be a better fit for the Lakers because of his defense and rebounding.
Lebron shot 1.4% below league average last year.
Because Lebron and Davis are so great at other areas, missing one or two 3 pointers out of 100 compared to other players is not going to derail the Lakers season.
The shooting for the Lakers PG, SG and SF positions should greatly increase this year.

Here's the 3 pt shooting for who the Lakers had last year and signed this year.

Chandler 0%
Bonga 0%
Zubac 0%
J. Williams 0%
Beasley 17.6%
Wagner 28.6%
Mykhailiuk 31.8%
Ball 32.9%
Ingram 33%
Hart 33.6%
Stephenson 37.1%

Howard 0%
Davis 33.1%
Dudley 35.1%
Daniels 38.1%
Bradley 38.4%
Cook 40.5%
Green 45.5%

The Lakers did a great job of bringing in very good 3 pt shooters and defensive players to play with Lebron and Davis.

Well TJ from what i can see you probably have 2 SG's on the team that are starting quality players who are good 3 point shooters.  I should mention that the 38.4% for Bradley came was for 14 games with Memphis.  He also started 49 games with the Clippers and shot only 33.7%  He's a solid 36% career shooter from deep.

Bradley and Danny Green both SG's are the best players added.  LA probably cannot start both of them together because they still need a PG.  I could see some rotational lineups with Lebron on the ball and AB and DG playing the wings.  Dudley is not a starter.  Cook and Daniels are not starters either.

Basically LAL will be hard press to put two legit shooters in the lineup.  That was the point I was trying to make although I did not do a very good job of it.  Since the great Anthony Davis does not want to play center it limits the starting unit.   LAL only has 2 open starting slots for someone that can make a 3 point shot.  (Assuming a frontline combination of Lebron/Davis and McGee or Howard play.  

To me the configuration lacks balance but it could be fixed maybe.

Davis needs to play center so that you can get Kyle Kuzma in the lineup.  Kuzma struggled shooting the 3 in year 2 but was very good his first year.  He looked really smooth with team USA before he hurt the ankle.