Around The League 2023-2024 Season
+12
Shamrock1000
willjr
worcester
RosalieTCeltics
steve3344
dboss
cowens/oldschool
NYCelt
dbrown4
bobc33
gyso
bobheckler
16 posters
Page 16 of 17
Page 16 of 17 • 1 ... 9 ... 15, 16, 17
Anyone else thinking about how the Celtics would counter the T-Wolves Defense?
Bob and all-
Not putting OKC on the NBA Title Contenders 2024 - Wild-a** Guess Edition” is, like you said, a good example of Reason #! For not buying. The hype.
The TimberPups aren’t there either.
I’m out here in denver now, and watching them absolutely destroy the NugNuts - twice - has gotten only a little attention. Compared with, say, what LBJ had for breakfast yesterday.
The T-Wolves defense has been absolutely terrifying. I’m a Celtics fan first and last, but the Nug’s have been fun to watch and easy to like for 3 years now. A Finals match-up between Boston and Denver seemed like - not like a sure bet, of course, but like it had a good chance of happening. It would have been a dream match-up (esp for me). Two teams really committed to playing The Right Way.
I wouldn’t bet a nickel on that outcome now. I’m too busy having bad dreams about how KP might get rolled over (or get his ankle or shoulder rolled over) by the TW’s swarming stifling buzzing (and communicating!) defense. He’s not our only option, course. Al would do what he does so well; Kornet has been sneaky-great; and with XT and the other guys, we have a lot. Of guys who can help up front.
But - it was Terrifying to watch see what their D can rise to these first two games in Denver.
Is anybody else thinking about our C’s facing these guys?
Not putting OKC on the NBA Title Contenders 2024 - Wild-a** Guess Edition” is, like you said, a good example of Reason #! For not buying. The hype.
The TimberPups aren’t there either.
I’m out here in denver now, and watching them absolutely destroy the NugNuts - twice - has gotten only a little attention. Compared with, say, what LBJ had for breakfast yesterday.
The T-Wolves defense has been absolutely terrifying. I’m a Celtics fan first and last, but the Nug’s have been fun to watch and easy to like for 3 years now. A Finals match-up between Boston and Denver seemed like - not like a sure bet, of course, but like it had a good chance of happening. It would have been a dream match-up (esp for me). Two teams really committed to playing The Right Way.
I wouldn’t bet a nickel on that outcome now. I’m too busy having bad dreams about how KP might get rolled over (or get his ankle or shoulder rolled over) by the TW’s swarming stifling buzzing (and communicating!) defense. He’s not our only option, course. Al would do what he does so well; Kornet has been sneaky-great; and with XT and the other guys, we have a lot. Of guys who can help up front.
But - it was Terrifying to watch see what their D can rise to these first two games in Denver.
Is anybody else thinking about our C’s facing these guys?
bobheckler wrote:Sean Grande
@SeanGrandePBP
The top ten favorites to win the 2023-24 NBA title at the start of the season.
Only the top two survive the first round.
Bob
MY NOTE: OKC, which was #1 in the WC and is still very much alive, isn't listed. That's why you don't believe the hype, or lack thereof...
.
bigpygme- Posts : 1202
Join date : 2009-10-18
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
https://hoopshype.com/2024/05/09/patrick-beverley-suspended-four-games-by-the-nba/?utm_medium=browser_notifications&utm_source=pushly&utm_campaign=4678387
Duane Rankin @DuaneRankin
Patrick Beverley gets 4-game suspension w/o pay for “forcefully throwing a basketball multiple times at spectators” during Bucks Game 6 loss at Pacers and “inappropriate interaction with a reporter during media availability” after the game.
Unrestricted free agent this summer. pic.twitter.com/7waiMbn3Hp – 3:50 PM
![Around The League 2023-2024 Season - Page 16 GNKWvC7aIAAg7jY](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GNKWvC7aIAAg7jY.jpg)
Bob
MY NOTE: Patrick Beverley will be 36 by the time next season starts. This might have finished his career for him. Who wants to take a chance on a 36 year old lunatic that makes the team and the league look bad? He played a total of 1462 minutes last season, that's solid rotation minutes but, with his baggage, is he a rotation player you want?
.
Duane Rankin @DuaneRankin
Patrick Beverley gets 4-game suspension w/o pay for “forcefully throwing a basketball multiple times at spectators” during Bucks Game 6 loss at Pacers and “inappropriate interaction with a reporter during media availability” after the game.
Unrestricted free agent this summer. pic.twitter.com/7waiMbn3Hp – 3:50 PM
![Around The League 2023-2024 Season - Page 16 GNKWvC7aIAAg7jY](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GNKWvC7aIAAg7jY.jpg)
Bob
MY NOTE: Patrick Beverley will be 36 by the time next season starts. This might have finished his career for him. Who wants to take a chance on a 36 year old lunatic that makes the team and the league look bad? He played a total of 1462 minutes last season, that's solid rotation minutes but, with his baggage, is he a rotation player you want?
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
Mike Budenholzer is the new head coach of the Phoenix Suns, per Sham Charania.
Bob
.
Bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
https://hoopshype.com/2024/05/14/lakers-expected-to-pursue-donovan-mitchell-if-he-declines-extension-with-cavs/?utm_medium=browser_notifications&utm_source=pushly&utm_campaign=4705615
Lakers expected to pursue Donovan Mitchell if he declines extension with Cavs
By HoopsHype | May 14, 2024
It’s complicated, but then so are the Cavs right now. They have their star to worry about in Mitchell, who has one season of team control left beyond this year. If Mitchell doesn’t sign an extension with Cleveland this summer, the Cavs will have to explore trade options — and one of the teams standing at the front of the line will be the Lakers. It’s possible, given Mitchell’s current condition with his calf, that he has already played his final game in a Cavs jersey.
Source: New York Times
Bob
.
Lakers expected to pursue Donovan Mitchell if he declines extension with Cavs
By HoopsHype | May 14, 2024
It’s complicated, but then so are the Cavs right now. They have their star to worry about in Mitchell, who has one season of team control left beyond this year. If Mitchell doesn’t sign an extension with Cleveland this summer, the Cavs will have to explore trade options — and one of the teams standing at the front of the line will be the Lakers. It’s possible, given Mitchell’s current condition with his calf, that he has already played his final game in a Cavs jersey.
Source: New York Times
Bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
https://hoopshype.com/2024/05/14/shams-on-lebron-james-family-sacrifices-influencing-decision-on-future/?utm_medium=browser_notifications&utm_source=pushly&utm_campaign=4703579
Shams on LeBron James: Family sacrifices influencing decision on future
By HoopsHype | May 14, 2024
“Could LeBron James say I want to play three years? It’s not out of the realm of possibility. It’s up to LeBron James. He said it like from a body perspective, from a perspective of how long his body could physically hold up… It might reach four or five years but mentally, emotionally where he’s at with his body and then the other factor is, and this is something else I’ve heard recently, is that he knows how much people around him have sacrificed – his wife, his kids, his close friends, his loved ones. They’ve sacrificed a lot for him over these 21 years, could end up being up to 23 years that he plays in the league… and so pouring that back to them at some point in the next one or two years I know that’s a priority as well.”
Bob
.
Shams on LeBron James: Family sacrifices influencing decision on future
By HoopsHype | May 14, 2024
“Could LeBron James say I want to play three years? It’s not out of the realm of possibility. It’s up to LeBron James. He said it like from a body perspective, from a perspective of how long his body could physically hold up… It might reach four or five years but mentally, emotionally where he’s at with his body and then the other factor is, and this is something else I’ve heard recently, is that he knows how much people around him have sacrificed – his wife, his kids, his close friends, his loved ones. They’ve sacrificed a lot for him over these 21 years, could end up being up to 23 years that he plays in the league… and so pouring that back to them at some point in the next one or two years I know that’s a priority as well.”
Bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
Evan Sidery: The Lakers and Nets already have offers prepared for Donovan Mitchell, if he requests a trade from the Cavaliers this offseason, per @Brian Windhorst on @GetUpESPN. If Mitchell declines an extension offer from Cleveland, all indications are he will be moved.
Bob
.
Bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
The NBA reportedly is on the verge of finalizing major television contracts that will significantly increase the league’s revenue beginning in the 2025-26 season. But it won’t result in an enormous one-year cap boost for the Heat and other teams. Under the terms of the new labor agreement, the salary cap can’t increase by more than 10 percent in any given year regardless of how much new revenue the league makes. If there is an excess, it will be tacked onto future seasons. The salary cap for next season is projected to be $141 million.
Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nba/miami-heat/article288506303.html#storylink=cpy
Bob
.
Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nba/miami-heat/article288506303.html#storylink=cpy
Bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
Stan Van Gundy reveals wife died by suicide in August: 'I just don't think I'll ever get over it'
Jack Baer·Staff writer
Updated Sat, May 25, 2024 at 2:59 PM PDT·5 min read
Former NBA head coach and current TNT broadcaster Stan Van Gundy's wife Kim died last August, with her obituary only saying she died "unexpectedly."
Eight months later, Van Gundy has revealed that she died by suicide in an appearance on Dan Le Batard's "South Beach Sessions" podcast. The ensuing discussion was a remarkably forthright examination of how Van Gundy has been dealing with the grief, as well as Le Batard, who lost his brother David to cancer that same month.
As Van Gundy explained it:
“She took her own life, Dan. I’ll never — I don’t care how long it goes, I can’t imagine that I’ll ever get over that... It was devastating. We’d been married for 35 years and had been together for close to 40 years, since I was 24 years old ... my entire adult life, I trace everything, job changes, kids, everything, I was with her and she was by my side.
"I never, ever, envisioned that I was gonna live another day in my life without Kim. Never envisioned that. I knew she was going through a tough time, but I still never envisioned that happening. Even now, it's been eight months and I struggle to come to grips with the fact that I'm never gonna see her again and I'm trying hard, you can relate to this I'm sure, to stay connected. I don't want to — my house is full of pictures of Kim. There's a montage of pictures above my bed that my kids did for me of Kim. I'm trying hard to remember her voice, to remember her smile, all of those things, but more than anything, to live her values, because her values were better than mine.
"She taught me a lot and I want to live her values and a life that she would be proud of. And my kids at times over the last eight months, at times, not often, but I think genuinely from their point I'll do something and they'll say, 'Mom would have really been proud of you for that one.' That above anything else really makes me feel good, because my wife was an incredible person and the loss is huge."
Van Gundy said he has been "doing as much therapy as I possibly can" and that he knows he will get better, but when it came to regret, he said "I just don't think I'll ever get over it."
A larger topic was how death has become an unavoidable part of Van Gundy's life, revealing that his brother Jeff's best friend had died a week ago due to cancer. He said one thing he's working on in therapy is how to process what clearly comes across as depression:
"I've had very little tragedy in my life until my wife died. Very little, I've just been blessed. But as you get older, man, it's just all around you and it becomes part of you life. It's one of the things I'm trying to deal with in therapy, besides the loss of my wife, how do I deal with this? Where's the joy in life? How do you go on day to day? How do you find stuff to do. I can function. I don't know about you but I can get up and function every day. I do what needs to be done. But I don't have much that I want to do right now and how do you have that when you're just seeing tragedy and death and sickness all around you? I know that's going to be a huge part of my life now."
Van Gundy said his kids still make him happy, saying they were "mainly" what kept him going. He's also tried to be honest about his mental state, including with his former players:
"For some reason in February, the six-month anniversary of my wife's death hit me. I don't know why, I'm not usually that much into the dates, but it hit me. I said that to my kids and I've had people willing to help me. I don't feel I'm hiding anything but at the same time, if you want people to be there for you — this is the way I feel anyway — and support you, you don't want to make that support be the most miserable damn thing in their life.
"I've had these players come down, which is one of the kindest acts for guys that I coached 40 years ago, to spend the weekend for me, and they all asked very genuinely 'How are you doing?' Well if I'm going to sit there and burden them the whole weekend, hell, I don't want it to be like that. I didn't lie to them, I said 'It's been rough, but you guys coming down here makes it a lit better.'"
Van Gundy spent four decades as a coach, working his way up from Division III to the NBA, where he worked as head coach for the Miami Heat, Orlando Magic, Detroit Pistons and New Orleans Pelicans. He last coached in 2021 with the Pelicans.
He continued to work at TNT after his wife's death once the NBA season began in October and is currently on the network's team for the Western Conference finals.
Bob
MY NOTE: This just goes to show that people are fighting battles we know nothing about. All we can do is be kind, always.
.
Jack Baer·Staff writer
Updated Sat, May 25, 2024 at 2:59 PM PDT·5 min read
Former NBA head coach and current TNT broadcaster Stan Van Gundy's wife Kim died last August, with her obituary only saying she died "unexpectedly."
Eight months later, Van Gundy has revealed that she died by suicide in an appearance on Dan Le Batard's "South Beach Sessions" podcast. The ensuing discussion was a remarkably forthright examination of how Van Gundy has been dealing with the grief, as well as Le Batard, who lost his brother David to cancer that same month.
As Van Gundy explained it:
“She took her own life, Dan. I’ll never — I don’t care how long it goes, I can’t imagine that I’ll ever get over that... It was devastating. We’d been married for 35 years and had been together for close to 40 years, since I was 24 years old ... my entire adult life, I trace everything, job changes, kids, everything, I was with her and she was by my side.
"I never, ever, envisioned that I was gonna live another day in my life without Kim. Never envisioned that. I knew she was going through a tough time, but I still never envisioned that happening. Even now, it's been eight months and I struggle to come to grips with the fact that I'm never gonna see her again and I'm trying hard, you can relate to this I'm sure, to stay connected. I don't want to — my house is full of pictures of Kim. There's a montage of pictures above my bed that my kids did for me of Kim. I'm trying hard to remember her voice, to remember her smile, all of those things, but more than anything, to live her values, because her values were better than mine.
"She taught me a lot and I want to live her values and a life that she would be proud of. And my kids at times over the last eight months, at times, not often, but I think genuinely from their point I'll do something and they'll say, 'Mom would have really been proud of you for that one.' That above anything else really makes me feel good, because my wife was an incredible person and the loss is huge."
Van Gundy said he has been "doing as much therapy as I possibly can" and that he knows he will get better, but when it came to regret, he said "I just don't think I'll ever get over it."
A larger topic was how death has become an unavoidable part of Van Gundy's life, revealing that his brother Jeff's best friend had died a week ago due to cancer. He said one thing he's working on in therapy is how to process what clearly comes across as depression:
"I've had very little tragedy in my life until my wife died. Very little, I've just been blessed. But as you get older, man, it's just all around you and it becomes part of you life. It's one of the things I'm trying to deal with in therapy, besides the loss of my wife, how do I deal with this? Where's the joy in life? How do you go on day to day? How do you find stuff to do. I can function. I don't know about you but I can get up and function every day. I do what needs to be done. But I don't have much that I want to do right now and how do you have that when you're just seeing tragedy and death and sickness all around you? I know that's going to be a huge part of my life now."
Van Gundy said his kids still make him happy, saying they were "mainly" what kept him going. He's also tried to be honest about his mental state, including with his former players:
"For some reason in February, the six-month anniversary of my wife's death hit me. I don't know why, I'm not usually that much into the dates, but it hit me. I said that to my kids and I've had people willing to help me. I don't feel I'm hiding anything but at the same time, if you want people to be there for you — this is the way I feel anyway — and support you, you don't want to make that support be the most miserable damn thing in their life.
"I've had these players come down, which is one of the kindest acts for guys that I coached 40 years ago, to spend the weekend for me, and they all asked very genuinely 'How are you doing?' Well if I'm going to sit there and burden them the whole weekend, hell, I don't want it to be like that. I didn't lie to them, I said 'It's been rough, but you guys coming down here makes it a lit better.'"
Van Gundy spent four decades as a coach, working his way up from Division III to the NBA, where he worked as head coach for the Miami Heat, Orlando Magic, Detroit Pistons and New Orleans Pelicans. He last coached in 2021 with the Pelicans.
He continued to work at TNT after his wife's death once the NBA season began in October and is currently on the network's team for the Western Conference finals.
Bob
MY NOTE: This just goes to show that people are fighting battles we know nothing about. All we can do is be kind, always.
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
For sure. You never know when you will walk a mile in their shoes. Grief is a hard thing to cope with. I wish him only peaceful times and wonderful memories, that may help him continue on
RosalieTCeltics- Posts : 40967
Join date : 2009-10-17
Age : 77
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
https://hoopshype.com/2024/05/29/tyronn-lue-new-contract-with-clippers-worth-nearly-70-million/?utm_medium=browser_notifications&utm_source=pushly&utm_campaign=4790837
Shams Charania: Tyronn Lue and the Los Angeles Clippers reached agreement on a five-year contract worth nearly $70 million, league sources tell me and @LawMurrayTheNU . Massive commitment to secure one of the NBA’s best head coaches.
Source: Twitter @ShamsCharania
Bob
MY NOTE: Life is good when your boss is Steve Ballmer, whose personal net worth is 127B. That's Billion, with a 'B'.
.
Shams Charania: Tyronn Lue and the Los Angeles Clippers reached agreement on a five-year contract worth nearly $70 million, league sources tell me and @LawMurrayTheNU . Massive commitment to secure one of the NBA’s best head coaches.
Source: Twitter @ShamsCharania
Bob
MY NOTE: Life is good when your boss is Steve Ballmer, whose personal net worth is 127B. That's Billion, with a 'B'.
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
I heard that the Lakers were also interested in signing him.
The Clippers have yet to win anything but having a single owner with no spending limit and a brand new stadium propels their brand into the future.
The Clippers have yet to win anything but having a single owner with no spending limit and a brand new stadium propels their brand into the future.
dboss- Posts : 19087
Join date : 2009-11-01
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5547735/2024/06/07/celtics-mavericks-nba-finals-game-1-kristaps-porzingis/?source=freedailyemail&campaign=601983&userId=13921316
The Celtics might have perfected the modern NBA offense: Unending 3s and midrange firepower
By David Aldridge
Jun 6, 2024
BOSTON — Twenty years after the Seven-Seconds-or-Less Phoenix Suns shook up the NBA with an offense the likes of which the league had never seen or tried to defend before, the Boston Celtics have taken things to the next level.
Behold the perfect modern NBA offense, matching 3-point volume and efficacy with ruthlessly efficient midrange shooting, with the occasional drives, dives and triples from the best forward tandem in the league in Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown crushing opponents’ will.
The Celtics did the same thing to the Dallas Mavericks in Game 1 of the NBA Finals on Thursday that they’ve done to opposing defenses all season. They stretched the Mavs to the breaking point, then broke them behind a barrage of first-half 3s and a sensational return to action from Kristaps Porziņģis. Even after Dallas cut a 29-point first-half deficit to 8 midway through the third quarter, Boston had plenty left in the tank to stretch its lead right back to 20 and put away Game 1, 107-89.
Like a great boxer, Boston just bludgeons you with punches from all angles and speeds. Thursday, it was Porziņģis — in his first action since straining his calf in Game 1 of the first round against the Miami Heat in April — who set the tone off the bench. Dallas threw everyone it could at the 7-foot-2 big man: Luka Dončić, Derrick Jones, Jaden Hardy, rookie Dereck Lively II. No one slowed him, much less stopped him; Porziņģis made 7 of 9 shots and scored 18 of his 20 points in the first half, raining jumpers from the elbows and nail. The Cs made 16 of 42 from deep, including three quick ones to end the third quarter and put the Mavericks right back in their place after getting within 72-64.
At the same time, Brown was turning the game back in Boston’s favor as well by drawing Lively’s fourth and fifth personal fouls within a minute, forcing Dallas to bench its big man, who defends best in space.
“When a team goes on a run, you got to manage it, you got to stay composed, and you got to keep playing basketball,” Brown said of that end-of-quarter stretch. “It’s almost like you just have short-term memory a little bit, like the team’s not even on a run. You got to play smart basketball and make great plays to get us on a (run), get our flow back, and I think in that third quarter, I got to the free-throw line. I think that helped us get going. Then we made some kick-outs to the corner. Al (Horford) got a 3. We was able to get some good offense going.”
Brown finished with 22 points and six rebounds. Tatum was just 6 of 16 from the floor but had 11 rebounds and five assists and made his bones against Dallas as a playmaker, piling up hockey assists all night. Jrue Holiday was a plus-20 in nearly 35 minutes on the floor. The Celtics’ relentless pressure on defenses over 48 minutes this season is why they’re now three games away from the franchise’s 18th NBA title. Pick your poison? It’s all poison when Boston is rolling. And it gets in opponents’ heads.
“We let the crowd get to us, we let the refs get to us, we let them making shots get to us,” Dallas forward P.J. Washington said.
This series isn’t over. Dallas almost always does its best work after a bad Game 1 in a seven-game series. But the Mavericks’ dilemma, again, is that what they’ve become great at defensively this season is what Boston is not dependent upon: scoring in the paint.
Dallas has been an outstanding defense since acquiring Daniel Gafford from the Washington Wizards and Washington from the Charlotte Hornets. Gafford and Lively shut down the lane. The Celtics were good this season at scoring in the paint, finishing tied for eighth in the league with the Milwaukee Bucks in paint points per game (43.7). But that’s not what Boston counts on to take out teams.
Boston has turbocharged what Phoenix did to the league 20 years ago, when the Suns found success playing small ball. The 2003-04 Suns had a brilliant point guard in two-time league MVP Steve Nash, who pushed the pace at every opportunity, never gave up his dribble and sliced up defenses all season. They had wings in Shawn Marion, Quentin Richardson and Joe Johnson, who could all shoot and finish downhill. And the Suns had a sledgehammer of a young power forward in Amare Stoudemire, who dove to the rim for lobs and pocket passes from Nash.
Since then, a lot of championship-caliber and championship-winning teams have leaned in on 3s: the Dwight Howard-era Orlando Magic, the Splash Brothers Golden State Warriors of Steph Curry and Klay Thompson, the James Harden heliocentric Houston Rockets. But Boston has taken things a step further.
The Suns led the NBA in 2003-04 in 3-point attempts and makes, with 2,026 3-point attempts and 796 makes. This season, Boston also led the NBA in 3-point attempts and makes, after finishing second in each category last season.
The Celtics had 3,482 3-point attempts this season and 1,351 makes. Boston finished just 12 3s short of the single-season team record set last season by the Warriors. And the Celtics are not doing it by playing small; they have massive size up front with Tatum, Brown, Horford and Porziņģis.
“I think we do our best to find what works and then keep doing it,” Holiday said. “I think that’s something that we kind of lock into. And then, at the same time, in NBA games, 20-point (leads) can mean nothing. I just think staying poised and being able to keep our heads helps us with that. I think being consistent and doing things that we feel work worked out tonight.”
The addition of Porziņģis from Washington last summer only adds to the Celtics’ offensive riches.
He gives Boston a dimension it didn’t have in previous years: a big man who can get his shot off, any time, against just about everyone. His development as a scorer at the elbows and nail makes it extremely difficult even if defenses sell out completely on closing out on Boston’s 3-point shooters. Now it doesn’t matter if Tatum or Brown has an off-night shooting. Boston just runs Porziņģis off a pick-and-roll with Derrick White or Holiday, and he squares up (always smaller) defenders and lets it fly.
That takes some pressure off Tatum. But make no mistake: Tatum remains the catalyst for everything that’s happened here over the past several seasons. Even on off-nights shooting like Thursday, his presence tilts the floor.
“For us, it starts with JT, and then it’s kind of a trickle-down effect,” Horford said. “And we’ve all kind of fallen in line because of it. And he is, I feel, a big part of why everybody else gets all these things. He opens up a lot of things for us. And this, tonight, was just another night of us being consistent in that regard.”
The Mavericks spoke afterward about how they have to defend the 3 better and how they’ll do better in Game 2. And they might. Kyrie Irving had an off-night; if he had made two or three wide-open shots, Dallas might have been able to withstand the Celtics’ offensive onslaught into the fourth quarter, when Dallas can close out tight games behind its two premier offensive talents.
But we’re into June now. No one has been able to stop Boston’s offense all season. It’s starting to feel like no one can and might not be able to for quite a while.
Bob
.
The Celtics might have perfected the modern NBA offense: Unending 3s and midrange firepower
By David Aldridge
Jun 6, 2024
BOSTON — Twenty years after the Seven-Seconds-or-Less Phoenix Suns shook up the NBA with an offense the likes of which the league had never seen or tried to defend before, the Boston Celtics have taken things to the next level.
Behold the perfect modern NBA offense, matching 3-point volume and efficacy with ruthlessly efficient midrange shooting, with the occasional drives, dives and triples from the best forward tandem in the league in Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown crushing opponents’ will.
The Celtics did the same thing to the Dallas Mavericks in Game 1 of the NBA Finals on Thursday that they’ve done to opposing defenses all season. They stretched the Mavs to the breaking point, then broke them behind a barrage of first-half 3s and a sensational return to action from Kristaps Porziņģis. Even after Dallas cut a 29-point first-half deficit to 8 midway through the third quarter, Boston had plenty left in the tank to stretch its lead right back to 20 and put away Game 1, 107-89.
Like a great boxer, Boston just bludgeons you with punches from all angles and speeds. Thursday, it was Porziņģis — in his first action since straining his calf in Game 1 of the first round against the Miami Heat in April — who set the tone off the bench. Dallas threw everyone it could at the 7-foot-2 big man: Luka Dončić, Derrick Jones, Jaden Hardy, rookie Dereck Lively II. No one slowed him, much less stopped him; Porziņģis made 7 of 9 shots and scored 18 of his 20 points in the first half, raining jumpers from the elbows and nail. The Cs made 16 of 42 from deep, including three quick ones to end the third quarter and put the Mavericks right back in their place after getting within 72-64.
At the same time, Brown was turning the game back in Boston’s favor as well by drawing Lively’s fourth and fifth personal fouls within a minute, forcing Dallas to bench its big man, who defends best in space.
“When a team goes on a run, you got to manage it, you got to stay composed, and you got to keep playing basketball,” Brown said of that end-of-quarter stretch. “It’s almost like you just have short-term memory a little bit, like the team’s not even on a run. You got to play smart basketball and make great plays to get us on a (run), get our flow back, and I think in that third quarter, I got to the free-throw line. I think that helped us get going. Then we made some kick-outs to the corner. Al (Horford) got a 3. We was able to get some good offense going.”
Brown finished with 22 points and six rebounds. Tatum was just 6 of 16 from the floor but had 11 rebounds and five assists and made his bones against Dallas as a playmaker, piling up hockey assists all night. Jrue Holiday was a plus-20 in nearly 35 minutes on the floor. The Celtics’ relentless pressure on defenses over 48 minutes this season is why they’re now three games away from the franchise’s 18th NBA title. Pick your poison? It’s all poison when Boston is rolling. And it gets in opponents’ heads.
“We let the crowd get to us, we let the refs get to us, we let them making shots get to us,” Dallas forward P.J. Washington said.
This series isn’t over. Dallas almost always does its best work after a bad Game 1 in a seven-game series. But the Mavericks’ dilemma, again, is that what they’ve become great at defensively this season is what Boston is not dependent upon: scoring in the paint.
Dallas has been an outstanding defense since acquiring Daniel Gafford from the Washington Wizards and Washington from the Charlotte Hornets. Gafford and Lively shut down the lane. The Celtics were good this season at scoring in the paint, finishing tied for eighth in the league with the Milwaukee Bucks in paint points per game (43.7). But that’s not what Boston counts on to take out teams.
Boston has turbocharged what Phoenix did to the league 20 years ago, when the Suns found success playing small ball. The 2003-04 Suns had a brilliant point guard in two-time league MVP Steve Nash, who pushed the pace at every opportunity, never gave up his dribble and sliced up defenses all season. They had wings in Shawn Marion, Quentin Richardson and Joe Johnson, who could all shoot and finish downhill. And the Suns had a sledgehammer of a young power forward in Amare Stoudemire, who dove to the rim for lobs and pocket passes from Nash.
Since then, a lot of championship-caliber and championship-winning teams have leaned in on 3s: the Dwight Howard-era Orlando Magic, the Splash Brothers Golden State Warriors of Steph Curry and Klay Thompson, the James Harden heliocentric Houston Rockets. But Boston has taken things a step further.
The Suns led the NBA in 2003-04 in 3-point attempts and makes, with 2,026 3-point attempts and 796 makes. This season, Boston also led the NBA in 3-point attempts and makes, after finishing second in each category last season.
The Celtics had 3,482 3-point attempts this season and 1,351 makes. Boston finished just 12 3s short of the single-season team record set last season by the Warriors. And the Celtics are not doing it by playing small; they have massive size up front with Tatum, Brown, Horford and Porziņģis.
“I think we do our best to find what works and then keep doing it,” Holiday said. “I think that’s something that we kind of lock into. And then, at the same time, in NBA games, 20-point (leads) can mean nothing. I just think staying poised and being able to keep our heads helps us with that. I think being consistent and doing things that we feel work worked out tonight.”
The addition of Porziņģis from Washington last summer only adds to the Celtics’ offensive riches.
He gives Boston a dimension it didn’t have in previous years: a big man who can get his shot off, any time, against just about everyone. His development as a scorer at the elbows and nail makes it extremely difficult even if defenses sell out completely on closing out on Boston’s 3-point shooters. Now it doesn’t matter if Tatum or Brown has an off-night shooting. Boston just runs Porziņģis off a pick-and-roll with Derrick White or Holiday, and he squares up (always smaller) defenders and lets it fly.
That takes some pressure off Tatum. But make no mistake: Tatum remains the catalyst for everything that’s happened here over the past several seasons. Even on off-nights shooting like Thursday, his presence tilts the floor.
“For us, it starts with JT, and then it’s kind of a trickle-down effect,” Horford said. “And we’ve all kind of fallen in line because of it. And he is, I feel, a big part of why everybody else gets all these things. He opens up a lot of things for us. And this, tonight, was just another night of us being consistent in that regard.”
The Mavericks spoke afterward about how they have to defend the 3 better and how they’ll do better in Game 2. And they might. Kyrie Irving had an off-night; if he had made two or three wide-open shots, Dallas might have been able to withstand the Celtics’ offensive onslaught into the fourth quarter, when Dallas can close out tight games behind its two premier offensive talents.
But we’re into June now. No one has been able to stop Boston’s offense all season. It’s starting to feel like no one can and might not be able to for quite a while.
Bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
Aldridge may be the best bb sportswriter in the country right now, and he's reporting on the best bball team in the world. What could be better reading?
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
so the mav's were complaining about ref's??? good God, these teams have got to stop this baloney. This includes Celtics. It is what it is? watch out, working the ref's before game 2, setting it up for a ridiculous situation. I laughed at Indy when Rick Carlisle complained after every game in all the series they played it, but this works. so beware
RosalieTCeltics- Posts : 40967
Join date : 2009-10-17
Age : 77
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
Worcester
Aldridge's evaluation of the impact of 3 point shooting reflects my thoughts as well. I have posted about it throughout this season and during the playoffs.
The amazing thing about the Celtics game 1 win was their ability to contain Doncic and Irving and reduce the impact of the Mavs supporting cast. The Celtics lost the PITP battle 46-38 but that did not matter because the sheer volume of the Celtics 3 point shooting and accuracy was like a tsunami washing away any hopes that the Mavs had for winning. They simply do not have the personnel to counter throughout an entire series.
On the defense side of the ball, our collection of defenders can switch which permits more one on one defensive coverages. That also means that the Mavs supporting cast will get fewer quality opportunities because we do not have to double team them.
The Mavs have made a priority to bring maximum defensive pressure to limit JT. In their minds he is the head of the snake. What they will come to realize is that Boston is a 7-headed snake.
Aldridge's evaluation of the impact of 3 point shooting reflects my thoughts as well. I have posted about it throughout this season and during the playoffs.
The amazing thing about the Celtics game 1 win was their ability to contain Doncic and Irving and reduce the impact of the Mavs supporting cast. The Celtics lost the PITP battle 46-38 but that did not matter because the sheer volume of the Celtics 3 point shooting and accuracy was like a tsunami washing away any hopes that the Mavs had for winning. They simply do not have the personnel to counter throughout an entire series.
On the defense side of the ball, our collection of defenders can switch which permits more one on one defensive coverages. That also means that the Mavs supporting cast will get fewer quality opportunities because we do not have to double team them.
The Mavs have made a priority to bring maximum defensive pressure to limit JT. In their minds he is the head of the snake. What they will come to realize is that Boston is a 7-headed snake.
dboss- Posts : 19087
Join date : 2009-11-01
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
https://hoopshype.com/2024/06/07/bradley-beal-had-surgery-after-suns-season-ended/?utm_medium=browser_notifications&utm_source=pushly&utm_campaign=4843606
Phoenix Suns guard Bradley Beal had a procedure done on his nose in Phoenix shortly after the Suns were eliminated from the playoffs this year. The Minnesota Timberwolves swept the Suns in April. The sixth-seeded Suns were the first team eliminated from the postseason. Beal suffered a broken nose taking an elbow from Pacers big Myles Turner in the second half of a Jan. 26 loss in Indianapolis. Wearing a mask for several games, Beal ditched it in March when returning from a hamstring injury. At the time, Beal still needed to have the septum realigned in his nose.
Source: Arizona Republic
Bob
MY NOTE: Turns out it wasn't just the noses of the pundits who anointed Phoenix a 'superteam' that were out of joint when they got swept.
.
Phoenix Suns guard Bradley Beal had a procedure done on his nose in Phoenix shortly after the Suns were eliminated from the playoffs this year. The Minnesota Timberwolves swept the Suns in April. The sixth-seeded Suns were the first team eliminated from the postseason. Beal suffered a broken nose taking an elbow from Pacers big Myles Turner in the second half of a Jan. 26 loss in Indianapolis. Wearing a mask for several games, Beal ditched it in March when returning from a hamstring injury. At the time, Beal still needed to have the septum realigned in his nose.
Source: Arizona Republic
Bob
MY NOTE: Turns out it wasn't just the noses of the pundits who anointed Phoenix a 'superteam' that were out of joint when they got swept.
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
Exactly dboss - "Boston is a 7-headed snake"
The Celtics ability to guard Luka and Kyrie one-on-one is depriving the Mavs' role players a chance to shine. Hell, it's even denying Kyrie a chance to shine, and we are wearing Luka OUT in the 4th quarter of these games. Are we wearing out? No, except maybe Z who still needs to get into basketball shape. I think the 23 minutes tonight were a bit much for him. Still, he contributed. They all did, except perhaps Sam.
Strange isn't it that the double-teamed Jayson nearly scores a triple double (18-12-9), and fans and the media are somehow disappointed with him. I hope Jayson's teammates express their gratitude for his unselfish play. I know Jrue did.
Meanwhile dboss, I thought my grandkids were cute. Yours is unbelievable.
The Celtics ability to guard Luka and Kyrie one-on-one is depriving the Mavs' role players a chance to shine. Hell, it's even denying Kyrie a chance to shine, and we are wearing Luka OUT in the 4th quarter of these games. Are we wearing out? No, except maybe Z who still needs to get into basketball shape. I think the 23 minutes tonight were a bit much for him. Still, he contributed. They all did, except perhaps Sam.
Strange isn't it that the double-teamed Jayson nearly scores a triple double (18-12-9), and fans and the media are somehow disappointed with him. I hope Jayson's teammates express their gratitude for his unselfish play. I know Jrue did.
Meanwhile dboss, I thought my grandkids were cute. Yours is unbelievable.
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/dan-hurley-turns-down-six-year-70-million-lakers-deal-to-stay-at-uconn-reports-174201638.html
Dan Hurley turns down six-year, $70 million Lakers deal to stay at UConn: Reports
Hurley, coming off of back-to-back NCAA championships, turned down a major payday to stay with the Huskies
Kari Anderson
Updated Mon, June 10, 2024 at 10:57 AM PDT·2 min read
After speculation about a move to the NBA, Dan Hurley is staying at UConn.
Hurley, who is coming off of back-to-back NCAA championships with UConn, is turning down a major payday from the Los Angeles Lakers to stay with the Huskies, per multiple reports.
Per ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski, Hurley turned down a six-year, $70 million offer in favor of chasing a third straight NCAA title with UConn. The deal would have made Hurley one of the top six highest-paid coaches in the NBA if he had accepted, per Wojnarowski.
The decision comes after reports last week that the Lakers were interested in pursuing Hurley for the job, with ESPN reporting that the Lakers were preparing a massive contract that would keep Hurley in Los Angeles long-term. The Lakers fired Darvin Ham in May after just two seasons with the team, and sought Hurley as a replacement in the hopes of a deep playoff run next season.
Hurley reportedly traveled to L.A. on Thursday and met with the Lakers on Friday to discuss a potential deal before returning to the East Coast on Saturday.
In weighing both sides, Hurley told ESPN that the Lakers made a "compelling case" and presented a "compelling vision," but that he is also proud of what he's built with the Huskies.
Per Wojnarowski, the Lakers now aim to interview other candidates with the hopes of hiring a new coach before the NBA Draft on June 26.
After stints at Wagner and Rhode Island, Hurley has thrived at UConn, especially in the past couple of years. Under Hurley’s purview, the Huskies rolled to an unexpected championship run in 2023, before dominating the 2023-2024 season. This past year, Hurley led the Huskies to a Big East regular season title and Big East tournament title before easing through the NCAA tournament — a progression that led him earning 2024 Naismith Coach of the Year.
Hurley has posted a 141-58 record in six seasons with UConn, and is 292-163 overall as a head coach.
Bob
MY NOTE: His choice was to stay with a program that has produced b2b Championships or manage an ego-driven dumpster fire that hinges upon a player that is 3 1/2 years older than Boston's head coach and has had 5 different head coaches in the last 10 years. Doesn't seem like it should have taken him long to decide, does it? He probably took the interview out of respect for the Lakers organization, but that's as far as it went.
.
Dan Hurley turns down six-year, $70 million Lakers deal to stay at UConn: Reports
Hurley, coming off of back-to-back NCAA championships, turned down a major payday to stay with the Huskies
Kari Anderson
Updated Mon, June 10, 2024 at 10:57 AM PDT·2 min read
After speculation about a move to the NBA, Dan Hurley is staying at UConn.
Hurley, who is coming off of back-to-back NCAA championships with UConn, is turning down a major payday from the Los Angeles Lakers to stay with the Huskies, per multiple reports.
Per ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski, Hurley turned down a six-year, $70 million offer in favor of chasing a third straight NCAA title with UConn. The deal would have made Hurley one of the top six highest-paid coaches in the NBA if he had accepted, per Wojnarowski.
The decision comes after reports last week that the Lakers were interested in pursuing Hurley for the job, with ESPN reporting that the Lakers were preparing a massive contract that would keep Hurley in Los Angeles long-term. The Lakers fired Darvin Ham in May after just two seasons with the team, and sought Hurley as a replacement in the hopes of a deep playoff run next season.
Hurley reportedly traveled to L.A. on Thursday and met with the Lakers on Friday to discuss a potential deal before returning to the East Coast on Saturday.
In weighing both sides, Hurley told ESPN that the Lakers made a "compelling case" and presented a "compelling vision," but that he is also proud of what he's built with the Huskies.
Per Wojnarowski, the Lakers now aim to interview other candidates with the hopes of hiring a new coach before the NBA Draft on June 26.
After stints at Wagner and Rhode Island, Hurley has thrived at UConn, especially in the past couple of years. Under Hurley’s purview, the Huskies rolled to an unexpected championship run in 2023, before dominating the 2023-2024 season. This past year, Hurley led the Huskies to a Big East regular season title and Big East tournament title before easing through the NCAA tournament — a progression that led him earning 2024 Naismith Coach of the Year.
Hurley has posted a 141-58 record in six seasons with UConn, and is 292-163 overall as a head coach.
Bob
MY NOTE: His choice was to stay with a program that has produced b2b Championships or manage an ego-driven dumpster fire that hinges upon a player that is 3 1/2 years older than Boston's head coach and has had 5 different head coaches in the last 10 years. Doesn't seem like it should have taken him long to decide, does it? He probably took the interview out of respect for the Lakers organization, but that's as far as it went.
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
bobheckler wrote:https://www.yahoo.com/sports/dan-hurley-turns-down-six-year-70-million-lakers-deal-to-stay-at-uconn-reports-174201638.html
Dan Hurley turns down six-year, $70 million Lakers deal to stay at UConn: Reports
Hurley, coming off of back-to-back NCAA championships, turned down a major payday to stay with the Huskies
Kari Anderson
Updated Mon, June 10, 2024 at 10:57 AM PDT·2 min read
After speculation about a move to the NBA, Dan Hurley is staying at UConn.
Hurley, who is coming off of back-to-back NCAA championships with UConn, is turning down a major payday from the Los Angeles Lakers to stay with the Huskies, per multiple reports.
Per ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski, Hurley turned down a six-year, $70 million offer in favor of chasing a third straight NCAA title with UConn. The deal would have made Hurley one of the top six highest-paid coaches in the NBA if he had accepted, per Wojnarowski.
The decision comes after reports last week that the Lakers were interested in pursuing Hurley for the job, with ESPN reporting that the Lakers were preparing a massive contract that would keep Hurley in Los Angeles long-term. The Lakers fired Darvin Ham in May after just two seasons with the team, and sought Hurley as a replacement in the hopes of a deep playoff run next season.
Hurley reportedly traveled to L.A. on Thursday and met with the Lakers on Friday to discuss a potential deal before returning to the East Coast on Saturday.
In weighing both sides, Hurley told ESPN that the Lakers made a "compelling case" and presented a "compelling vision," but that he is also proud of what he's built with the Huskies.
Per Wojnarowski, the Lakers now aim to interview other candidates with the hopes of hiring a new coach before the NBA Draft on June 26.
After stints at Wagner and Rhode Island, Hurley has thrived at UConn, especially in the past couple of years. Under Hurley’s purview, the Huskies rolled to an unexpected championship run in 2023, before dominating the 2023-2024 season. This past year, Hurley led the Huskies to a Big East regular season title and Big East tournament title before easing through the NCAA tournament — a progression that led him earning 2024 Naismith Coach of the Year.
Hurley has posted a 141-58 record in six seasons with UConn, and is 292-163 overall as a head coach.
Bob
MY NOTE: His choice was to stay with a program that has produced b2b Championships or manage an ego-driven dumpster fire that hinges upon a player that is 3 1/2 years older than Boston's head coach and has had 5 different head coaches in the last 10 years. Doesn't seem like it should have taken him long to decide, does it? He probably took the interview out of respect for the Lakers organization, but that's as far as it went.
.
poor poor LA
dboss- Posts : 19087
Join date : 2009-11-01
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
Lakers looking for the next Brad Stevens??? Too bad, Hurley is smart, stay where you are, they would probably fire you within 9 months anyway if LB wanted it So Ham signed with Milwaukee as lead assistant. What to do Sam Cassell?? sticking around, will they give you Lee's job????
RosalieTCeltics- Posts : 40967
Join date : 2009-10-17
Age : 77
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
CHARLES BARKLEY ANNOUNCES HIS RETIREMENT FROM TELEVISION
Bob
.
Bob
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
Charles has had a great career on that show alone. He's done a great job on that show and will be missed. He's had to put up a lot not having a championship, but he has handled it well. But that worked itself into the show. I guess looking back we should have seen the writing on the wall with all the guests recently. These guest spots were/are pre-interviews. I hope they got the message with Draymond. If TNT wants to end Inside the NBA faster than your life in Hiroshima/Nagasaki after Fat Man/Little Boy exited the bomb bay doors of the Enola Gay, go with Draymond upon his retirement which should be very soon. I'll be one of those ending my time recording and watching those shows if that is the case. I'd really miss that show as it is one of the very best in television.
db
db
dbrown4- Posts : 5527
Join date : 2009-10-29
Age : 60
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
https://us.yahoo.com/sports/insider-jj-redick-lakers-done-234124182.html
Insider: JJ Redick to the Lakers is done
Robert Marvi
Tue, June 18, 2024 at 4:41 PM PDT·1 min read
The NBA Finals ended on Monday night with the Boston Celtics winning their 18th world championship, breaking the tie they had with the Los Angeles Lakers for most league titles.
The Lakers’ search for a new head coach has dragged along for the last several weeks since they were knocked out of the first round of the playoffs, but through it all, JJ Redick has been the favorite to win the job.
They formally interviewed him over the weekend, and given Redick’s responsibilities as a member of ESPN’s NBA broadcast crew, most expected an announcement about his hiring to not come until after the end of the playoffs.
Lakers insider Anthony Irwin posted on X that according to his sources, Redick has been hired as the team’s head coach, even though there has been no official announcement.
On the other hand, Shams Charania, another insider, said on “The Pat McAfee Show” that nothing is done between the Lakers and Redick.
With the start of the NBA draft just eight days away, now is the time for the organization to make a decision on who its next head coach will be.
Bob
MY NOTE: The source of the "insider" Anthony irwin might be LeBron himself. LBJ and Redick do a podcast called "Mind The Game", so there is a very close personal and business relationship between them. LeBron may have leaked this to Irwin to try and move the needle in JJ's direction, to talk this into reality.
.
Insider: JJ Redick to the Lakers is done
Robert Marvi
Tue, June 18, 2024 at 4:41 PM PDT·1 min read
The NBA Finals ended on Monday night with the Boston Celtics winning their 18th world championship, breaking the tie they had with the Los Angeles Lakers for most league titles.
The Lakers’ search for a new head coach has dragged along for the last several weeks since they were knocked out of the first round of the playoffs, but through it all, JJ Redick has been the favorite to win the job.
They formally interviewed him over the weekend, and given Redick’s responsibilities as a member of ESPN’s NBA broadcast crew, most expected an announcement about his hiring to not come until after the end of the playoffs.
Lakers insider Anthony Irwin posted on X that according to his sources, Redick has been hired as the team’s head coach, even though there has been no official announcement.
On the other hand, Shams Charania, another insider, said on “The Pat McAfee Show” that nothing is done between the Lakers and Redick.
With the start of the NBA draft just eight days away, now is the time for the organization to make a decision on who its next head coach will be.
Bob
MY NOTE: The source of the "insider" Anthony irwin might be LeBron himself. LBJ and Redick do a podcast called "Mind The Game", so there is a very close personal and business relationship between them. LeBron may have leaked this to Irwin to try and move the needle in JJ's direction, to talk this into reality.
.
bobheckler- Posts : 62217
Join date : 2009-10-28
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
I'm fine with the Lakers hiring a head coach in Redick with no coaching experience who thinks he knows better than anyone what NBA talent is and was. I like unwarranted arrogance in a Lakers coach. Maybe that will help them lose even more games next season.
Re: Around The League 2023-2024 Season
worcester wrote:I'm fine with the Lakers hiring a head coach in Redick with no coaching experience who thinks he knows better than anyone what NBA talent is and was. I like unwarranted arrogance in a Lakers coach. Maybe that will help them lose even more games next season.
+1
_________________
![Around The League 2023-2024 Season - Page 16 Logo_f11](https://i.servimg.com/u/f65/14/45/19/39/logo_f11.jpg)
gyso- Posts : 22839
Join date : 2009-10-13
Page 16 of 17 • 1 ... 9 ... 15, 16, 17
![-](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif)
» Around The League 2023-2024
» Key Dates For 2023-2024 Season
» Around The League 2024-2025 Season
» Trade Talk, AND ACTUAL TRADES Post-Season 2023-2024
» Around The League 2022-2023 Season
» Key Dates For 2023-2024 Season
» Around The League 2024-2025 Season
» Trade Talk, AND ACTUAL TRADES Post-Season 2023-2024
» Around The League 2022-2023 Season
Page 16 of 17
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
|
|