Would the current roster be able to win the next championship with rookie Russell?

Ok so the idea is this...

In some magical way the current make-up of the Celtics managed to draft rookie Russell (as he was when he first entered the league) with the "50s knowledge of basketball". He would have had from draft day to start learning whatever needs to be learned (how much would be needed to be learned is obviously up for debate).

Would they be able to win the championship this season with whatever we currently have on the roster + 50s rookie Russell? We are counting on a regular 82 games season happening on the "usual dates".

Discuss!

I'm sure the Celtics would improve defensively, along with this the team would get a lot smarter. Pierce and Garnett are smart guys on the court, perhaps Garnett has the higher basketball IQ. However neither have in my mind the same level of Basketball IQ that Russell has.

However, Russell would physically have to get into better shape to play against the current players. With Russell being Russell I don't think this would take too long. But it would be hard to see him completely dominating from the defensive end from the get go. He may well be playing power forward as well if he was playing today? Not sure how much difference this positional change would make.

I do think that if a 50's Russell played for the current Celtics team that he'd win championships. That's a given based on his accomplishments. I just don't know if it would happen right away, the only thing holding me back from saying that he would not win a title in his first year is that we're talking about Bill Russell. The man just knew how to win.

Sara welcome aboard, did you see Russell play?

cowens/oldschool wrote:Sara welcome aboard, did you see Russell play?

No, way too young for that. Only a little bit of footage. One complete game '63 finals game 6 which was a download, also the 4th quarter of game 7 from '69 finals.

Mainly learned about him just from reading his book, a Celtics book called Evergreen? and looking at his statistics. Major one of those that stands out is titles won. Both at college/the Olympics and NBA.

Sara

Agree with all but this.

your quote

However, Russell would physically have to get into better shape to play against the current players.

With all due respect Russell, at that age, was in tremendous shape.

Per his bio....

Besides basketball, Russell represented USF in track and field events. He competed in the 440 yard (402 m) race, which he could complete in 49.6 seconds.[15] He also participated in the high jump; Track & Field News ranked him as the seventh-best high jumper in the world in 1956. That year, Russell won high jump titles at the Central California AAU meet, the Pacific AAU meet, and the West Coast Relays. One of his highest jumps occurred at the West Coast Relays, where he achieved a mark of 6 feet 9¼ inches (2.06 m).[16]

He stated to that if he was snubbed by the selection committee on basketball he would have competed in the high jump at the olympics. Nearly seven feet, remember the world record in 1956 was only 7' 1/2 inch. Taking off on a hard cinder base and landing on a glorified sawdust pit to boot.

I have no doubt he could run the floor with any of today's bigs.........any of them. He did average 35 minutes per game his rookie year and no doubt could have played more.

What centers out there today get up and down the floor like him? answer none.

As far as winning a title with todays current squad......well just what is the current squad? But put him with the bunch that we had last season I would think we would have enough to get out of the east and then take out the Mavs.

Just my opinion.

beat

Hi Beat!

Never knew that about that in regards to the high jump. Or if I read it, it was long forgotten.

Getting up and down the court wouldn't be too much of a problem. I was thinking that he may have trouble with the fitness and conditioning of the current players. That's really the only question mark I have.

Russell did compete against the likes of Chamberlain and Nate Thurmond who are comparative in size to the current players. The question is how much difference would modern training techniques make in regards to Russell against today's athletes.

Diet, conditioning, weight work etc. That's the intangibles, once Russell applied those to his game in today's league I don't see anyone stopping him from dominating games.

Really does make for a interesting debate on players from different eras. In my mind a champion is a champion.

Hi,
With all due respect to Russell's greatness, there's a factor of chemistry.
Also, don't forget that the starters of the current squad can't play 48 min. Which brings us to the bench... as everybody knows that was our weakest link.
So, IMHO, no matter who'd be playing, even Russell himself, even if he clicked with the others, no bench - no title.

AK

remember, he played against Chamberlain, one of the largest guys who ever played the game, and he held his own, and then some. He was quick, smart,
and agile. These guys today would have their hands full playing against him.

Rosalie

My question would be based on all the advantages of today pampered atheletes would they be able to physically handle Russell from the 50's? We know that there are no bigs today that could touch him on the mental aspect of the game.

As for Wilt there hasn't been another like him as far as size and strength with the possible exception of Shaq. But even then Wilt was perhaps a bit more moble. And they both were equally effective from the foul line too.

beat

Sara, it's going to be a blast to have you here.

Regarding Bill Russell, he averaged 42.3 minutes per game during his career, all of which was played with arguably the most prolific fast-breaking team of all-time. And he averaged slightly more than that (42.7 MPG) in his FINAL season at age 34.

In the 1962 playoffs (playing, remember, with a racehorse team), he averaged 48.0 minutes per game. It doesn't get much higher than that. In the 1966 playoffs, he averaged 47.9 minutes per game. In the 1963 playoffs, he averaged 47.5 minutes per game.

In the final season of his career, though saddled with a number of injuries, he played 42.7 minutes per game over 77 games at age 34. In the playoffs that last season, he averaged 46.3 minutes per game, including 48 minutes in the final game of his career.

I would submit that Russ was the best-conditioned pro basketball player of all-time because of the minutes he played, the physicality and domination with which he played, and the incredible speed with which he played. It's quite possible that only John Havlicek would come close. In terms of conditioning, I believe both of them (even without having the conditioning advantages of today's players) would squash today's players like bugs. Give Russ and John the same conditioning advantages as today's players, and it would be a runaway—which would be only fitting.

Love those Russell questions. Keep 'em coming.

Sam

Would there be a lot of adjustments that would have to be made when it comes to how you are allowed to play defense/offense, what would be a foul and not?

Beat - ever watch the replay of Russ running full court and blocking the shot during the playoffs? I have no doubt in my mind that Russ would handle these
young "conditioned" athletes of this era with no problem. As Sam says, he was probably the fastest pm the team besides Havlicek, who never stopped running, period!



Rosalie

Rosalie,

Actually, while Russ and John were (I believe) the best conditioned, Sam Jones was tied with Larry Costello for the fastest man in the league. John wasn't whippet fast like Sam, but he had all the endurance in the world. And Russ wasn't a sprinter; but, when he got into the open court, he'd eat up the court in three or four strides.

I think I've told about the prelude to that last 1969 game in L.A., when we arrived at LAX , picked up our luggage, and set out for the taxi line. There was one of those people-moving conveyers, and most of the players got on it. as did I. With their long strides, I was practically running full tilt to try to keep up.

And along comes Russell, not bothering with the conveyer but just walking past all of us as though we were standing still.

And Sam was no conditioning slouch either. That's why, in his Celtics heyday, he was also the #4 (I think it was #4) ranked tennis player in New England. But, when endurance time kicked in, Russ and John had gears that would have made Henry Ford envious.

Sam

Sam - That is why I feel that these young players today couldn't hold a candle to Russell or Havlicek. They may have had endurance, but what they really had was heart. As far as Sam is concerned, he always seemed to beat his man to his sweet spots and fire off those shots before anyone could touch him! I may live in the past at times, but these guys made it so easy to be a devoted Celtic fan.

Rosalie, it was easy, wasn't it? I just wish more people had gotten "the word" during those times. It was also too easy to get a seat except in playoff games.

Sam

Sam Rosalie

here is a you tube video of Russell and some of his former teamates and oposition (and Red) and others talking about him and Russ himself too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWFsL4Y8RVA

I consider this a good 5 minute investment to anyone who did not see Russell play in person and wants to get a feel for what he brought to the game every single time he steped on the court.

beat

You know, during the time I had my season ticket, at playoff time, when you went to pick up your tickets, it was easy to pick up another ticket. You were offered the option of buying two tickets. I sure had alot of friends back then!

When I stood in line for some of those games after I gave my seats up, there was a guy at the window who remembered me and always saved me tickets.
I'll tell you, those were the days. Today....I sit on line trying to buy tickets only to be told after an hour plus, that they are sold out. What really gets to me is
when they tell me that after 5 minutes. It's a scalper's market out there.
I have been lucky, my husband has alot of friends with season tickets and I have someone in my family who offers us seats every now and then.
But..let me tell you, the games I really wanted I had to stand in line for. Not any more, it's a computer world! Prices are so high, I just call it legalized
scalping now. Those ticket companies who have so many tickets charge triple the price of the ticket or more.

Oh well, it gets me no where to rant about it, I go when I can, thank God
for television and I still love my radio. Any nationally televised game, the voices go off and I turn on Sean Grande and Cedric Maxwell on the radio!

Ah Sam.....the old days!!!!

No doubt that the greatest basketball player of all time would lead a team of PP, RA, KG and the latter day BC to championship after championship, just like he did when I was watching (actually I was listening, thank you Johnny!) and falling in love with this game. People these dayz just don't understand how great of a player he was. They think somehow he couldn't compete. The real question is would Tommy still win ROY? ROFLMAO