Post-Game Thread - vs Bucks, Away

[bobheckler]

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/stars-studs-and-duds-turner-does-lot-things-well



Stars, studs and duds: Turner 'does a lot of things well'

November 10, 2015, 11:45 pm






SHERROD BLAKELY




Evan Turner’s heave from beyond half court that went in after he was fouled in the first half was yet another basket for the Boston Celtics that didn’t count.

But that was OK.

Turner made more than enough plays that actually counted in Boston’s 99-83 win over Milwaukee.

The 6-foot-6 Turner came off the bench and scored 13 points, 10 of which came in the second half when Avery Bradley (left leg injury) was unable to return.

It was yet another game in which Turner’s play proved why head coach Brad Stevens has such a tremendous amount of confidence in his game and ability to impact the Celtics positively.

“He can do so many things,” Stevens told reporters after the game. “A lot of people focus on the things people can’t do; he can do a lot of things. He does a lot of things well.”

Especially when he’s given the opportunity to be the primary ball-handler akin to the role he had last season.

But those opportunities have been fewer and farther between with the emergence of Marcus Smart who has missed the last three games with a left big toe injury.

Turner’s role might continue to be expanded when the Celtics host the Indiana Pacers Wednesday night at the TD Garden, a game in which both Smart and Bradley are questionable.

“He’s a good player,” Stevens said.

The Celtics had quite a few good players in Tuesday’s win which snapped the Bucks’ four-game winning streak.

Here are the Stars, Studs and Duds from Tuesday night’s game.


STARS

Evan Turner

He continues to play whatever role he’s asked to play, at a relatively high level. He had 13 points, five rebounds, six assists and four steals with most coming in the second half when Avery Bradley (left leg) was lost for the night. And while he only played 29 minutes, he had an unreal plus-minus of plus-32 which was tops among all players.

Kelly Olynyk

He only had 11 points, but there was no denying Olynyk’s impact on the game. Like Turner, the Celtics were a better – much better – team when he was in the game. His plus-minus on the night was an impressive plus-24.



STUDS

Jared Sullinger

He’s still not playing major minutes, but Sullinger continues to make the most of the time he’s on the floor. Sullinger’s play was instrumental in the first half when the Celtics erased a double-digit first quarter deficit to eventually take control of the game. He had a double-double of 11 points and 10 rebounds, doing so in just 20 minutes.

R.J. Hunter

Celtics head coach Brad Stevens wisely gambled on Hunter’s length being able to help Boston against a Milwaukee team whose length is their strength. The 6-foot-6 guard had a career-high seven points in addition to grabbing seven rebounds which was also a career best mark.

Jonas Jerebko

The numbers weren’t great, but Jerebko did a lot of nice things – especially defensively – that don’t show up in the usual post-game stats. He had six points and three assists, in addition to a defensive rating of 82.5.


DUDS

Isaiah Thomas

He led the Celtics in scoring with 20 points, but he shot just 6-for-20 from the field and had a number of blown defensive assignments. Thomas also had a team-worst plus-minus of minus-12.

Khris Middleton

The Bucks look to him to help space the floor with his perimeter shooting. He was getting shots, for sure. But making them was an entirely different story. Middleton finished with 13 points on 3-for-12 shooting.



bob



.

[bobheckler]

It started off looking ugly.  We look confused and they were generating a lot of turnovers because we were making the obvious pass which they anticipated.  We fell behind 18-6 with more than half the first quarter gone.  Then we went on an 18-6 run of our own to tie it up at 24 after one.  Halfway through the first it looked like the game might get away from us early.  I forgot this was a Brad Stevens team.

1.  Greg Monroe was the big reason for that big first quarter lead.  He was eating Sully alive.  Sully didn't box Monroe off the offensive board, 2 points.  Sully loses Monroe in transition, 2 points.  He put a spin move on Kelly for 2 (he had that spin move in Detroit too).  He was owning the boards.  He had 10 points on 5-5 and 6 rebounds, 2 offensive in the first quarter.  He's really crafty on offense.  One move he was cruising baseline and then stepped back into the middle just to create a little contact, not much, to pick up the foul and still get the easly little 3' shot over the rim. At halftime he had 14 and 11.  A double-double at halftime.  In the second half he sorta disappeared.  He ended up with 17 and 14, 2 O-boards.  So, that's 3 points and 3 rebounds, none of them offensive, in the 15 minutes he played in the second half.  Why?

2.  Well, for one thing, Sully finally got revved up.  He started putting a body on Monroe.  His energy level, which was always a safe way to end a joke last year, picked up.  He was chasing down loose rebounds, throwing his body around and just getting the ball out to someone if he couldn't corral it himself.  4 rebounds at the half turned into 10 by the end of the game with only 8 more minutes of play and 4 of those 6 2nd half rebounds were offensive.  That's efficient.  His energy level cranked up some other players too, like

3.  David Lee.  One of the Buck announcers said he talked to Lee before the game and he said that "I have no rhythm.  New team, new system, I have no rhythm".  Well, he found some last night.  The best game by Lee yet this year.  5 rebounds in 21 minutes with 4 of them offensive.  He got two offensive boards in one possession, not easy ones neither, that he passed out for an offensive reset, taking time off the clock, and then sank the mid-range jumper to seal the deal.  This is the David Lee I saw last year.  13 points on 5-7 and 3 assists with only 1 TO is nice offensive production too.  Hopefully, this is the game that 'unsticks' him.

4.  Another good game by Kelly.  After the last game, where he played well, and all the column inches published and discussions on this board about that game and others, I made a point of watching him specifically.  Not a great boxscore, but I use stats to validate my eyeballs, not the other way around, and my eyeballs saw him playing well on both ends.  He played good straight up defense on 6'11" John Henson, he of the 7'5" wingspan and 9'4" standing reach, from 1'.  He defended another jump shot of Henson's from 7' and made it miss.  He took a charge from The Greek Freak on a full court run by the Freak.  That was really impressive, since Giannis Atetokounmpo (hereafter forever referred to as The Freak, so that I never, ever have to keep going back and forth to the boxscore 5x to fix my spelling like I just did) is ridiculously long and quite an agile dribbler for 6'11".  On defense, Kelly did almost everything right.  Yeah, he gave up a baseline spin move to Monroe, but who hasn't?  He was the Celtic high scorer at the half with 7.  On offense, he showed me two things.  One, he showed me a new stutter step move to the hoop.  He dribbles into the lane and then pulls up and rocks back but still keeps the dribble alive.  The defender, who has seen his Dirk-LIKE wrong-foot fadeaway on film, has to either step up to contest the 12'er or he keeps falling back.  Last night, when the defender stepped up, Kelly just leaned forward and kept moving to the rim.  One of the marks of a veteran is change of pace.  The game slows down for them.  They know it's not all about being the fastest, it's about getting your defender where you want him and then taking your "go to shot".  The wrong foot fadeaway is Kelly's go to shot and now he's using that to bait the defender into committing.  Whichever way he commits, Kelly takes it.  If he assumes the drive, Kelly takes the fadeaway.  If he defends the fadeaway, Kelly now has a live dribble he is using.  This, to me, is a big deal.  It is a big developmental milestone in a young player.  It's what turned Paul Pierce from a really good player into a future HOFer (NO, I am NOT saying Kelly is Paul Pierce, I'm saying that Pierce elevated his game another level or two once the game slowed down for him and this new move suggests that the game may be slowing down for Kelly).  The second thing he showed me last night was that he wanted the ball in a clutch situation.  With one possession left in the 1st quarter, Kelly took the ball with the clock running down, drove down to the rim and, with two Bucks draped on him, he hit the layup with <1 second left.  It's not even that he hit it with two defenders on him, it's that he wanted it and took it that I liked.  For a guy who has spent the first two years of his career a bit overwhelmed by the size, speed and athleticism of the NBA having the confidence to take on the squad and be "the man" is what I have been calling for all along.  Shoot, Kelly, take the shot.  You're a shooter, you need to shoot, you need to want the ball.  I said on another thread the biggest difference between Sully and Kelly, other than style of game, is that Sully exhibits clear ganas while Kelly doesn't.  Sully showed his ganas with his rebounding and rugged inside scoring last night and Kelly showed his with that drive.  This the second game in a row that Kelly has played as if the lightbulb has finally turned on.  We are also on a 2 game winning streak.  Coincidence?  Only if you believe in them.  Basketball is a team sport, so of course it isn't just because of Kelly, but he did play very well on both ends last night.  His defense, in particular, stood out.  Yeah, I know, it makes me shake my head and smile at the same time too.  And I'm just fine with doing that.

5.  Evan Turner was another one whose boxscore is nothing to write home about but was a game changer.  13 points on 6-12, 5 boards, 6 assists with only 1 TO and 4 steals for Mr. Average.  I love not having to refer to him as "Evan Turnover".  He just did a good damn job just about everywhere on the court.  His defense was good, his shooting was good (but he was 1-4 from 3.  He needs to stop taking those!  But that means he was 5-8 from 2) and he just ran a good offense.

6.  Thomas was slipping and sliding around the floor the whole first quarter.  Does Milwaukee have an NHL team that plays on that floor?  7 points on 2-8 at halftime and his usual highly questionable defense.  20 points on 6-20 (1-10 from 3?  Really, Isaiah?  Grow a conscience!) will make Sportcenter but not my highlight film.  We need another offensive sparkplug.  I'm not saying we should ditch Thomas but it would be nice to have someone else who could provide that offensive punch he does, someone more reliable and perhaps a little better on defense?  He gave up a two on an inbounds pass and curl because he couldn't be bothered to follow his man around the pick.  You want to stay a starter, Isaiah?  Well then you cannot keep having poor shooting, poor floor general game like the last two.

7.  With the injury to Smart and Bradley only playing 18 minutes with a lower leg bruise, RJ Hunter got some early and meaningful minutes.  He racked up 7 rebounds in 19 minutes.  Not bad for someone who looks like they were made out of pipe cleaners.  7 points on 3-5 with a 3.  He was called for a blocking foul on the Freak but it's a rookie call.  That same play, 2 years from now, will be a charge.  The nice thing about Hunter is that he looks like he belongs out there.  He does not have a deer-in-the-headlights look about him.  Depending upon Smart's availability only one day later and the severity of Bradley's leg bruise he might be looking at a lot of minutes tonight vs Indy.  Lucky dog, he'll get to defend Monta Ellis and Rodney Stuckey.  Be careful for what you ask for, RJ.

8.  Crowder with a lot of muscle applied to Khris Middleton, who had 13 points on 3-12 shooting in 37 minutes.  That's a win for us because Jae was 13 points on 3-12 in 37 minutes too.  If you can neutralize Middleton, you've done a good job because he can really impact a game if he gets a groove going.  The biggest difference between their boxscores is that Jae had 4 steals while Middleton had 0.  Crowder's shooting this year overall, though, sucks.  He's shooting 35%, 26% from 3.  Ugh.  

9.  Amir made his big noise last night with rebounds.  9, 3 offensive in 23 minutes.

10.  Stat roundup:  17 TOs for them vs 12 for us.  As long as you shoot 44% for the game like we did that's a big stat since that's worth at least 4 points.  21 assists aren't that many, well below our average.  Turner with 6 and Sully, Lee and Jonas with 3 each.  Our starting point guard, Isaiah Thomas, had 1.  40 points in the paint vs 38 for them.  Considering their height advantage over us, and Monroe was ripping us up inside, that's pretty good.  15 fast break points vs 11 for them.  We are 5th in the league in fast break points, with 16.7/game, behind GSW (25.1/gm), Washington (21.4/game), Sacto (18.4/game) and Cleveland (18.2/game).  I like this.  We lead the league, #1, in creating TOs/game with 20.3.  The next closest team is Atlanta with 18.2.  If I like the fast break point stat I LOVE this one.  We are completely disruptive on defense.  Creating a turnover is better than blocking a shot since blocked shots often, if not usually, just hand the ball back to them.  Turnovers, by definition, give the ball to us.  Here's another stat I like:  we are #1 in steals/game with 11.7.  Just like with TOs steals, by definition, give the ball to us.  Our steals/defensive play is 10%.  So, for every 10 offensive possessions by our opponents, we steal the ball once.  We are 3rd in giving up assisted fgm.  We have the 5th best fg% defense in the league.  No shot blockers to speak of, and we have the 5th best fg% defense.  If you want to have some fun, like I've just been having, here's the link to go play with.  Click on the type of stat you want to look at, then pick your particular way of looking at it.   https://www.teamrankings.com/nba/team-stats/

Crowder played 37 minutes and Thomas played 34.  Other than that, no Celtic played over 30 minutes last night although Turner came close with 29.  Our injury situation, with Smart and Bradley both questionable for tonight, at best, might leave us a bit thin.  Still, we made a game of it in Indy last week, so this should be good.  One difference is that we couldn't throw the ball in the ocean vs Indy and the Spurs, we are now starting to hit our shots now.

I predicted we could only win 5 or 6 games through November, total, because of our schedule.  7 or 8 wins through November would make me very happy and going a .500 9-9 would make me positively giddy.  We are now 3-3.  We are entering a tough part of the schedule, playing 5 games in 7 days (so much for minimizing back-to-backs, we have two back-to-backs in this 7 game stretch).  Nevertheless, we are already halfway to that win total and it's just the 2nd week of November and we have 2 games against Brooklyn and one more against Philly to go.  We are lookin' good.  


bob



.

[bobc33]

BobH serious question here. Have you ever been contacted by the Boston Herald or Globe or another publication to write for them?

If not, you should be. (As long as you continue with us!)

Absolutely love your post game analysis. A. Sherrod is decent, you are gifted and we are fortunate.

[dboss]

3 and 3 is a good place to be.

The Bucks came out like a real good team in the first QTR.  IT and Johnson gave us their best impression of Mutt & Jeff.  But once again the depth of the Celtics bench righted all wrongs.  

That is two games in a row where Boston has displayed tremendous poise during the 3rd QTR as they outscored the Bucks 30-17.  Can you imagine how good the Celtics would be if they shot the 3 ball better.  last night they managed to stink the place up with a 7 for 30 showing 23.3%.  The big offenders continue to be the same offenders  as IT was an ungodly 1-10 and Crowder went 2-7.  That's a combined 3 for 17.  For the year Thomas is at 26% and Crowder is also at 26% (rounding up)

Sully continues to prove all of the doubters wrong as he has gone back to the basics.  He is not launching a lot of 3 pointers either and he is shooting a very respectable 46.7% from behind the arc.

Crowder is a really good defender but this guy cannot make shots.  IT has always been trigger happy when it comes to shooting the 3 ball.

Shoot this way against a good team and the Celtics will lose games.

Jonas played sparingly but again provided the energy factor.

Turner really has looked good the last few games.

Hunter is playing very good defense despite his lack of physical strength.  He's quick and does an outstanding job anticipating what the opposition is trying to do.  

Lee also played well and was very aggressive.

Zeller had a DNP - How does he get minutes on this team?

Crooklyn plays the Rockets tonight.  Mark it down they lose their 8th straight game.

dboss

[dboss]

How could I have missed KO's performance. Him and Turner were the main reason why they got back into and stayed in the game.

Ko played really good. Even my wife had to admit that KO looks a lot better. She thiks he is soft and has been firm that he got NO game. The eye test does tell the story. Forget about that stats.

dboss

[bobheckler]

BobH serious question here.  Have you ever been contacted by the Boston Herald or Globe or another publication to write for them?

If not, you should be. (As long as you continue with us!)

Absolutely love your post game analysis.  A. Sherrod is decent, you are gifted and we are fortunate.

bob,

Thanks, but no, nobody has contacted me. One problem might be the fact that I live out on the left coast. Of course, I would be very happy to blog from here for them if they can get me press seats at Warrior games (hehehe) but other than that? I just started wearing long pants and shirts this week, that'd be hard to give up. :-)

I like being in this community. Aside from the generally high BBIQ our board members have it is also a friendly place, with only occasional lapses in conviviality and decorum. That easy, non-confrontational way of this board, strictly enforced by Sam, has allowed many of us to meet and become personal friends, as you well know.

Glad you enjoy my posts. I appreciate having you, and others, on the Game On thread. Sometimes your posts make me pay attention to things I was overlooking.


bob


.

[cowens/oldschool]

KO did play good as did Turner, Lee and Sully, RJ's defense was astounding, he may be getting more of AB's minutes. Stevens is doing masterful job of covering alot of players weakness and using them, playing to their strengths....and bob is the best in the business, he calls it all accurately with great insight and Thank God without the +/- stat. Yeah baby!!!!

[cowens/oldschool]

How could I have missed KO's performance.  Him and Turner were the main reason why they got back into and stayed in the game.

Ko played really good.  Even my wife had to admit that KO looks a lot better.  She thiks he is soft and has been firm that he got NO game.  The eye test does tell the story.  Forget about that stats.

dboss

your wife knows the game

[rambone]

Bob, great write up, and glad you paid attention to KO.

While he's clearly better defensively than last year, he was actually sneakily decent defensively last year in the same way. Last year opponents shot 55% from within 8 feet of the rim against KO, which is right around where Marc Gasol, Anthony Davis, Chris Bosh, and other bigger names.
http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/oppshooting/?Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&DistanceRange=8ft%20Range&sort=Less%20Than%208%20ft.%20FG%20PCT&dir=-1&CF=Less%20Than%208%20ft.%20FGA*GE*7&PlayerPosition=C

Now he's looking like a weaker, but quicker poor man's version of Marc Gasol defensively. I'll take that any day, even if he can't defend Okafor or Cousins or Brook Lopez as a starter.

As a PF/C who excels defensively in the Marc Gasol style of being in the right place and contesting everything in man and help defense, that's a great player to have off the bench.

Scal mentioned how good it is for KO to get a couple layups to heat up, rather than trying to come in and heat up just by shooting 3s first thing. I agree with that, and I don't mind if KO passes up open 3s if he's not feeling it, especially right after checking into the game.

It seems like he can almost always get his shot off when he attacks off the dribble, now that he is seeking out contact to create space or set up the fake like you said.

I also hope Olynyk gets more plays called for him in the post. I think he has tons of untapped potential there, especially when going against smaller PFs.

Our bench is so good right now we could have 2-3 6th man of the year contenders, though they'd steal votes from each other and some other guy on another team would get it. I'm more than happy getting Best Bench Award, even if I have to give it out myself.

Guys who together can play like the Warriors against benches for 20 mpg are the next best thing to having a starting 5 that plays like the Warriors for 30-35 minutes.

And now we even have a real Warrior in David Lee to oversee our Bench Warriors (as opposed to bench warmers) of Olynyk, Turner, Jerebko, and Hunter.

I'm getting ahead of myself, but what else is new, lol.

[rambone]

RJ Hunter Highlights vs Milwauke Bucks (7 points, 7 rebounds)

[rambone]

BobH, I think I only praised your post game reports once, but every single time I think they're great.

[bobheckler]

Bob, great write up, and glad you paid attention to KO.

While he's clearly better defensively than last year, he was actually sneakily decent defensively last year in the same way. Last year opponents shot 55% from within 8 feet of the rim against KO, which is right around where Marc Gasol, Anthony Davis, Chris Bosh, and other bigger names.
http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/oppshooting/?Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&DistanceRange=8ft%20Range&sort=Less%20Than%208%20ft.%20FG%20PCT&dir=-1&CF=Less%20Than%208%20ft.%20FGA*GE*7&PlayerPosition=C

Now he's looking like a weaker, but quicker poor man's version of Marc Gasol defensively. I'll take that any day, even if he can't defend Okafor or Cousins or Brook Lopez as a starter.

As a PF/C who excels defensively in the Marc Gasol style of being in the right place and contesting everything in man and help defense, that's a great player to have off the bench.

Scal mentioned how good it is for KO to get a couple layups to heat up, rather than trying to come in and heat up just by shooting 3s first thing. I agree with that, and I don't mind if KO passes up open 3s if he's not feeling it, especially right after checking into the game.

It seems like he can almost always get his shot off when he attacks off the dribble, now that he is seeking out contact to create space or set up the fake like you said.

I also hope Olynyk gets more plays called for him in the post. I think he has tons of untapped potential there, especially when going against smaller PFs.

Our bench is so good right now we could have 2-3 6th man of the year contenders, though they'd steal votes from each other and some other guy on another team would get it. I'm more than happy getting Best Bench Award, even if I have to give it out myself.

Guys who together can play like the Warriors against benches for 20 mpg are the next best thing to having a starting 5 that plays like the Warriors for 30-35 minutes.

And now we even have a real Warrior in David Lee to oversee our Bench Warriors (as opposed to bench warmers) of Olynyk, Turner, Jerebko, and Hunter.

I'm getting ahead of myself, but what else is new, lol.

rambone,

I think every player plays better when their first bucket or two are bunnies, KO is no different.

That play at the end of the 1st might make me reconsider, but so far I think Kelly's best chance of being an effective low post player would be with a clear out. He would need to have the centers out away from the basket so he could take a smaller PF. The good news is that, with his court vision and passing, he would make any double-team pay.

Let's see if he can do it again tonight against Luis Scola and Miles Turner.


bob


.

[rambone]

I agree, clear-outs would be great to see for KO, especially when he's already made a couple shots and is feeling it.

[rambone]

Game Highlights


Extended game highlights, en espanol

[bobheckler]

Here's Brad showing a rare display of emotion, coming out onto the court after calling a time out to chew Thomas out for missing a defensive assignment which gave Middleton a 3pter.  Thomas' defense has been particularly execrable lately. Trying to read Brad's lips, it looked like he was telling Isaiah to "do your job".


Adam Himmelsbach @AdamHimmelsbach
Brad Stevens is furious at Isaiah Thomas after that Bucks 3-pointer. Called timeout and stomped onto the floor to yell at him.
5:48 PM - 10 Nov 2015
 12 12 Retweets   23 23 likes


https://vine.co/v/elDB92pJ2vn


bob


.

[sinus007]

Bobh,
Thanks, as always, for a great game summary.
And Brad's yelling at IT was very unusual - never seen it before.
Speaking about IT, I still think he needs less iso plays - it stagnates their offense.
Overall it's a good win considering that Celtics coasted to the final buzzer.

AK

[dboss]

Brad always had some fire in his gut and now and then it seeps to the surface. I saw him scolding IT. It was a good thing.

There is a reason why IT has been a backup PG in this league. I never thought he was a good PG but he is just an undersized offensive player that can score. I like him coming off the bench. I think he should not shoot as many 3 point shots as he does. His defense is never going to be that good. He is just not big enough to check the average PG's in this league. But he is tough as nails and is definitely a nice change of pace guy coming off he bench. he is well suited for an uptempo offense.

dboss

[rambone]

Celtics players' 3 point defense, by region (above the break, L,R corner)
http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/oppshooting/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&DistanceRange=By%20Zone&sort=Above%20the%20Break%203%20FG%20PCT&dir=1&TeamID=1610612738&PerMode=Totals

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