Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away

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Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away Empty Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away

Post by bobheckler on Sat Apr 04, 2015 12:11 pm

I started this and then my browser crashed and I lost it all. I'm too frustrated to do this again right away, but I wanted to create the thread so others may provide their thoughts.


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Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away Empty Re: Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away

Post by Outside on Sat Apr 04, 2015 1:24 pm

The Celtics' performance vs. the Bucks was roughly equivalent in quality to your browser's performance.

Not a very detailed post-game report, but it seems a cosmically appropriate one.
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Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away Empty Re: Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away

Post by Sam on Sat Apr 04, 2015 4:04 pm

Bob,

Your browser is obviously a Celtics fan.  Frankly, as much as I always look forward to your summaries, it would have required at least a gallon of Butter Brickle ice cream to get me in the mood to join the conversation.

I guess we shouldn't be all that bummed.  Although many of us were hoping the Celtics could extend their March Magic through this game, as one commentator said, "They lost to a better team" and, as Brad said, "They were too long and too fast for us."

Certainly tough words to hear, especially since the Celtics teased us in the first quarter.  I print out the stats after each quarter, and the first one I looked at was the turnover stat.  When I saw only 10, I said, "No way."  And then I noticed I was looking at the Pacers game.

Against the Bucks, the Celtics had 17 turnover, which led to 19 Bucks points.  Not a disaster, as they've persevered through as many as 19 turnovers in winning past games.  And the Bucks had one more turnover than the Celts (although the Celts scored only 14 points off 19 Bucks turnovers).  But it makes a different WHO is committing the turnovers.

When centers or forwards commit turnovers, it's bad news because it can lead to enemy scores.  But, when guards commit turnovers, it's a double whammy because guards are also most typically the catalysts for creating scores.  The most prolific turnover bunnies last night: Thomas (5), Turner (3) and Smart (3).  I'm not including Bradley; but, to his great credit, he was very active in the scoring department without committing any turnovers.

That's 61% of the Celtics turnovers by guys who split the "1" position three ways (only 8 minutes between them playing other positions).  When you give up so many points through turnovers and forfeit so much of your own points potential, you're in deep doo doo.

Of course, the turnovers weren't nearly all the game.  The Bucks played the pick an roll game with great success practically all night long.  We can all lust after and intimidator, but the starting group (in particular) needs much better and consistent defense at other positions too.  The starting five can put up a good defensive front for a while; but, when the other team makes an adjustment, the Celtics starters are not defensively versatile to deviate successfully from the team plan.

For example, when it because obvious that Isaiah Thomas wasn't going to be able to stay with A.J. Mayo, Brad used Zeller to double Mayo.  The surprise factor worked for a couple of possessions.  Then Milwaukee reacted by swinging the ball and hitting either an open three from the corner or a rolling layup.

By the way, the starters were -11 for the evening, while the bench was +2.  I'm changing my game ball from Bradley (who had a good night) to Jerebko, who provided most of the energy mustered by the bench.  I thought Crowder had (for him) a very quiet game; and Isaiah was a trick (5 turnovers) or treater (23 points on 7-12 shooting, including some much-needed penetration)

Jonas, in 21 well-earned minutes, scored 17 on 7-10 shooting that included a wide variety of shots.  He also had 5 rebounds, two steals, only 1 turnover and 2 personal fouls.

The Bucks badly outmaneuvered the Celtics in terms of getting open shots, so that—although the Celts attempted three more field goals, they scored 6 fewer field goals.

I'll just mention that Sully played 3 minutes, an I won't make the observation that the team looked like it was playing in reverse while he was in there.  After all, he's got enough troubles reorienting himself to the team and getting back in shape.  Speaking of shape, his looks a little more slender, and some announcer mentioned that Jared had lost 20 pounds.  I didn't notice whether the 20 pounds consisted of his shooting arm.

Toronto tonight.  Let's hope the Celts can literally recover on the fly, eh?

Sam
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Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away Empty Re: Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away

Post by bobheckler on Sat Apr 04, 2015 6:35 pm

I can't believe I made my bones killing computers and now here they are killing me.  Karma's a bitch.

Hard to top a Post Game Sam post.  A few additional observations by me:

1.  I agree that Jerebko gets the game ball.  He was a whirling dervish last night.  He was everywhere.  He got a hand on a penetration in the middle of the paint and was still able to get out to the 3pt line to close out the shooter who got the kick out that happened because of his pressure.  Just everywhere.

2.  Nobody should be surprised that Sully got a cameo appearance and had nothing of note happen.  We should be more surprised he took to the court at all.  Bigger picture, though, he needs to drop weight.  Seriously.  Not because he looked fat last night or anything but because Brad's 'read and react' system requires movement of the ball and the players.  Sully's BBIQ is quite, quite high so the read part isn't a problem but you can only react as fast as your body lets you and Jerebko's body is MUCH livelier than his.  I love Sully.  I love my bigs to be physically punishing, bruising SOBs but the NBA is moving more towards giraffes and gazelles and away from elephants and hippos and Jerebko's game is more suited to Brad's system than Sully's is.  IF he doesn't show he can execute within Brad's system Sully will be gone because Brad is not.

3.  The refs sucked.  Smart gets dragged down by The Greek Freak and, when he tries to get up and Atenakumbo doesn't let him the ref, standing right there, calls a double foul.  The Freak palms the ball, OBVIOUSLY, no call.  Jerebko steals the ball and is going down court and as he is going up he is hacked across the elbow by MCW and it's just 'out of bounds'.  Not across the forearm, not the wrist, the elbow.

http://www.celticslife.com/2015/04/videos-unbelieveably-bad-no-foul-call.html


4.  We left a lot of balls on the rim.  A lot.  Can't blame anybody but our lack of focus on finishing for that. We gave up at least 8 points because of those misses.


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Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away Empty Re: Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away

Post by Sam on Sat Apr 04, 2015 7:27 pm

Bob, the ease with which the Bucks shot over both Thomas and Bradley last night makes me wonder whether the two of them could be a feasible tandem in the long run.  Despite their individual talents, their vulnerability to size could be a reason that one or the other might have to wind up elsewhere.

What's your opinion?

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Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away Empty Re: Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away

Post by bobheckler on Sat Apr 04, 2015 10:02 pm

sam wrote:Bob, the ease with which the Bucks shot over both Thomas and Bradley last night makes me wonder whether the two of them could be a feasible tandem in the long run.  Despite their individual talents, their vulnerability to size could be a reason that one or the other might have to wind up elsewhere.

What's your opinion?

Sam


sam,

I don't think they could start together.


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Post by Sam on Sun Apr 05, 2015 2:24 am

Bob,

I agree.  But a corollary question is whether they should finish together.  Or maybe a better question is under what circumstances should they ever play together?

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Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away Empty Re: Post-Game Thread, Bucks - Away

Post by bobheckler on Sun Apr 05, 2015 11:16 am

sam wrote:Bob,

I agree.  But a corollary question is whether they should finish together.  Or maybe a better question is under what circumstances should they ever play together?

Sam


sam,

You posed a question with a poll that I did not answer, that was the question "which 5 Celtics should finish?".  The reason why I didn't answer it is because, with a team with no all-stars, no players that can clearly dominate at their position against almost anybody, with a team that is so young and inconsistent, the answer has to be "it all depends upon matchups and the flow of the game".

When could they play or finish together?  The opposing guards would have to be on the smaller side since, like we saw in this Bucks game, a switch will put Thomas on someone like Mayo and that just isn't a recipe for success.  

vs Miami - Chalmers and DWade
vs Indy - George Hill and Rodney Stuckey or CJ Watson
vs Wizards - John Wall and Bradley Beal
vs Cavs - Kyrie Irving and JR Smith
vs Spurs -  Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili (their problem wouldn't be with matchups, it would be with Spurs overall offensive team movement)
vs Rockets - JET or Prigioni and James Harden

There are 6 teams, 5 of which are playoff teams, they might match up well against.  Teams with BIG guards like Toronto (e.g. DeMar DeRozan at 6'7", Klay Thompson at 6'7", Kyle Korver at 6'7") might need Smart in there instead (or maybe even Turner or Jae), but could Smart keep up with Stuckey?  If there was a switch and he was on Parker or Wall, could Smart keep up with them?  And if he's in there for his size and defense, what happens to our offense?  Bradley has turned into quite the versatile scorer, Smart isn't there yet.  He has driven to the hoop a few times in recent games but offensively he has been mostly a one-trick pony, the 3-ball, and not a very good trick either.


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