Fixing Kanter

I'm no analyst. I never played organized ball. But Kanter's defensive liabilities seem to be as advertised. Can he be fixed? He seems like an intelligent fellow and he obviously has good size and some good skills. Does he simply lack the right physical talents? Or coaching? Can he be fixed or must we just consider him job temp until RW is fully developed? Can the experts here pontificate on this one for me?

AT,

Knowing the personalities on this board, by calling on the "experts" to "pontificate" you probably dampened the response.  We have a pretty modest crew here, especially considering we have some fairly high BB IQ members.

While attempting to minimize my pontificating, I would say 'no', I don't think he can be fixed.  His defensive instincts, at least from my lofty, high perch (time to wake up and smell the sarcasm), are virtually non-existent. Can't fix what doesn't exist in the first place.


bob


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first off, I am closer to idiot than ANY type of expert ( many here would agree I think!).

but my OPINION is that a 27 YO who has played for about 8 NBA seasons...kinda is what he is.

if we expect him to be a good defender, we will likely be disappointed.

bobheckler wrote:AT,

Knowing the personalities on this board, by calling on the "experts" to "pontificate" you probably dampened the response.  We have a pretty modest crew here, especially considering we have some fairly high BB IQ members.

While attempting to minimize my pontificating, I would say 'no', I don't think he can be fixed.  His defensive instincts, at least from my lofty, high perch (time to wake up and smell the sarcasm), are virtually non-existent.  Can't fix what doesn't exist in the first place.


bob


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I should explain that my tongue is almost always firmly planted in my cheek. So you're saying that good defenders must have at least an instinct for defence, it can't be taught? Or is it something that can be taught but must be taught early on?

I'm going to go with one of my favorite phrases here...It's hard to teach an old dog new tricks.  Not impossible, just hard.
Enjoy his double double potential off the bench he brings. Also his timely ability to get an offensive rebound. It's fun to watch. The ball literally finds his hands and no one is around him. I've never seen anyone in the right place at the right time since Rodman. And he couldn't score to save his life. Always remember the winner is solely determined by the team that has more points than the other at the end of the game. We can outscore all the other 29 teams in the NBA and play pretty good defense. I like our chances.

db

In defense of Rodman, an all time great, Rick Mahorn says he was a fine point shot scorer but subordinated that ability to serve the role his teams needed, and for Detroit, Chicago, and SA that was to rebound and defend. Btw, his first 6 years on the Pistons he averaged 9.2 ppg on a team loaded with scorers. The Bulls were even more loaded with great scorers.

Re Kanter, the man for whom baselines do not exist, no. He will never learn to defend.

Good question. And I'll add myself to the no expert list as I give my 2 cents worth.

I think Kanter is a finished product. Can score in the low post and board.

I think he's OK as a situational player right now, as Theis seems to have emerged as the starter. Theis is no offensive wiz, but provides better defense than Kanter. Theis does stymie the offensive flow somewhat, so having Kanter provides a change-up when needed. If R Williams can discover consistency, Kanter and/or Theis could see minutes shrink substantially.

I have looked back at some Kanter games from last season after getting interested in this thread, and he seems to be playing poorer defense now than last year for some unknown reason.

There is a lot to be said for the idea that old dogs cannot be taught new tricks, but as also mentioned, this guy is pretty smart. So, if he wants to be able to play much longer in the NBA, he will need to play better defense this year for the Cs. His next contract will depend upon his becoming better on defense.

Williams is not too far from being able to handle his own minutes and some of Kanter's as well within the current roster. Tacko Fall may also not be too far away from taking some of Kanter's minutes either. Poirier, not so much.
Perhaps his WWE career is not so far away?

I'm no expert either, but I'm with you fellers.

I do not know how you fix his defense. His reaction time is slow. If he rotated as quickly as he positions and goes for rebounds he would be one heck of a player. But he remains a day late and a dollar short. Basically he is mentally slow on defense.

Could Moses Malone play in this era?

I think people over focus on his weaknesses and under focus on his strengths. Dude's not an allstar, never will be. He has a PER over 20 this year and last several years. It's an imperfect stat and over favors offense, but for a guy getting 5 million a year, that's a bargain.

Shamrock1000 wrote:I think people over focus on his weaknesses and under focus on his strengths. Dude's not an allstar, never will be. He has a PER over 20 this year and last several years. It's an imperfect stat and over favors offense, but for a guy getting 5 million a year, that's a bargain.

I think he made a good case for that tonight. Stevens is renowned for putting guys in a position to succeed. He may be finding that position for Kanter.

cowens/oldschool wrote:Could Moses Malone play in this era?

100%. As you know, Moses was an absolute beast. He would wear out nearly any big man in the current game, and while he didnt seem to have a jumper from outside 10-15 feet, he still wouldnt need it. Can you imagine even Anthony Davis or KAT dealing with Moses on the block? Nope.

mrkleen09 wrote:

cowens/oldschool wrote:Could Moses Malone play in this era?

100%.  As you know, Moses was an absolute beast.  He would wear out nearly any big man in the current game, and while he didnt seem to have a jumper from outside 10-15 feet, he still wouldnt need it.  Can you imagine even Anthony Davis or KAT dealing with Moses on the block?  Nope.

Big Moses fan from afar, was great watching him pummel Lakers in 83, my question was more on the defensive end? I know he could bang with any big, could he cover in space, defend the multiple pnr’s in today’s game...??? The best big defender that I ever saw was Keven Garnett.

cowens/oldschool wrote:

Big Moses fan from afar, was great watching him pummel Lakers in 83, my question was more on the defensive end? I know he could bang with any big, could he cover in space, defend the multiple pnr’s in today’s game...??? The best big defender that I ever saw was Keven Garnett.

I guess I would say - can Jokic or Lemarcus Aldridge or Embiid defend in space? There is still a place in the NBA for big, strong, dominant players. I have no doubt any star from the past would be a star today.

mrkleen09 wrote:

cowens/oldschool wrote:  

Big Moses fan from afar, was great watching him pummel Lakers in 83, my question was more on the defensive end? I know he could bang with any big, could he cover in space, defend the multiple pnr’s in today’s game...??? The best big defender that I ever saw was Keven Garnett.

I guess I would say - can Jokic or Lemarcus Aldridge or Embiid defend in space?  There is still a place in the NBA for big, strong, dominant players.  I have no doubt any star from the past would be a star today.

Right especially first ballot HoFers that can do 30-20 and even 40-20 in thick of playoffs....

wideclyde wrote:I have looked back at some Kanter games from last season after getting interested in this thread, and he seems to be playing poorer defense now than last year for some unknown reason.

There is a lot to be said for the idea that old dogs cannot be taught new tricks, but as also mentioned, this guy is pretty smart. So, if he wants to be able to play much longer in the NBA, he will need to play better defense this year for the Cs.  His next contract will depend upon his becoming better on defense.

I have the same observation - I also watched some of the Portland playoff games even before the season started. Perhaps he is just less motivated during the regular season to give extra effort on defense... which does not bode well for him really as he is at best average when he does make the extra effort...

Defense is a lot of extra effort and the main component WANT TO

By his size and the space he takes up ALONE, he should be a defensive threat. Hell, get out there and foul out in the first 3 minutes you're on the floor. But at least start to scare the crap out of people bounding down the lane for dunks or driving baseline. I can do that. Trust me, Brad's not going to be pissed.

db

Don't get me wrong, though. I'll take a double/double any day for one player with no D. More points than your opponent win games. Period.

db

dbrown4 wrote:Don't get me wrong, though.  I'll take a double/double any day for one player with no D.  More points than your opponent win games.  Period.

db

The perception about Kanter on defense may be less than accurate.

There are times when someone just blows by him for a layup or he is a step slow in defending the pick and role.  However when he is on the court his net rating is best among our centers.

That is an important and usefull observation.

When I first saw the title of this thread, for a short sick moment, I thought it was asking about the prospect of neutering him.

Time to go on another adventure. My brain is toast.


bob


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Warped but still funny Bob.